Before I get into Eyeglass Gate, I have to mention the shizz that went down on twitter last night.   ONTD started it all–it’s pretty much explained here.   And, indeed, ONTD’s call-to-arms to make #gokeyisadouche trend on twitter, had peeps twittering til it trended to #1–until twitter got wind of the campaign and yanked it off.

Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s relatives werenà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t part of the showà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’I could give a ratà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s ass about them. And, hacking into a strangerà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s account in order to post their private business on the internet is pretty low.   Ok, so I’m hearing that it may or may not have been hacked.    And I realize peeps are pissed about his clueless remarks on Comcast.net:

Yes. I accept gay people, but people have to accept my beliefs,” Danny said. “We have to accept their beliefs, but they have to accept my beliefs. We agree to disagree. I don’t judge people, but at the same time, if they believe in what they believe, they have to accept me and what I believe. But I accept anybody as they come. That’s my character and my personality.

What?

Anyway, it’s still kind of ridiculous–Gokey’s relatives aren’t celebrities.   But yes. I’ll admit it. I watched and I giggled. The commotion on twitter last night was totally a lawnchair-and-popcorn worthy eventà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦

***

FramesDirect.com, the online eyeglass retailers who entered into a dubious partnership with fansite Danny Gokey Gear to peddle “Danny Gokey Eyewear worn by Danny Gokey on American Idol” (more on that here and here) with part of the proceeds supposedly going to Danny Gokey’s charity, Sophia’s Heart Foundation has just issued a press release.   A little damage control maybe?

The founder of FramesDirect.com, a doctor, has a little backstory of his own:

Avid “American Idol” fan Dr. Guy Hodgson and his wife had 14-week premature triplets in March 2008, leading to heart operations for two of the babies, one a seven-hour open-heart surgery. The baby’s heart actually had to be stopped and he was put on a bypass machine. Fortunately, the heart defect was repaired and all of the babies are now thriving. You can view the story of Dr. Hodgson’s triplets including pictures and video at http://www.totsites.com/tot/hodgson3.

Dr. Hodgson was very touched when watching the story of “American Idol” finalist Danny Gokey and the love he had for his late wife, who also had a heart condition and died in July 2008, four weeks prior to Mr. Gokey’s “Idol” audition.

*SOB*

FramesDirect.com agreed to split the gross profits with the fan site, because DannyGokeyGear.com will be donating a portion of the profits to Sophia’s Heart Foundation. When there appeared to be some confusion in the social media over the campaign’s intentions, Dr. Hodgson decided he would also make contributions directly to the foundation himself. His first hand experience of his own children undergoing heart operations made this fund raising effort very personal to him. To emphasize his personal commitment to the cause, Hodgson also pledged to give 50% of the remaining FramesDirect.com profit from all sales of these frames between May 24, 2009 and July 21, 2009, regardless of whether the purchase is made by a fan, to Sophia’s Heart Foundation. Dr. Hodgson has contacted Sophia’s Heart Foundation to inform them of the pending donation.

As of June 12, 2009, sixty-two frames have been sold. FramesDirect.com and DannyGokeyGear.com will continue to monitor sales and make their final donations on July 22nd 2009.

The press release claims that TV Guide was somehow mixed up in all this:

The Fashion Team on TV Guide’s “Idol Wrap Up” show wanted to feature the eyewear worn by Gokey during his performances on “American Idol” and direct the public to the fan web site, DannyGokeyGear.com, for more information on the various frames. DannyGokeyGear.com contacted FramesDirect.com, to arrange for an easy way for fans to purchase the eyewear.

Huh?

“It appears there may have been some confusion among Danny’s fans and perhaps even Danny himself about this project,” Dr. Hodgson said. “Hopefully, this information will clarify the situation and my personal involvement and also increase the awareness among the public of Sophia’s Heart Foundation,” he added.

Nope. Not clarified. I’d still like to know why FramesDirect.com was selling eyeglasses using Danny’s likeness and the American Idol logo without permission.   And why they’re still selling them despite Danny calling them out as a scam.   Perhaps I (or you) should drop the good Dr. and email.

Please feel free to contact Dr. Guy Hodgson at gwhodgson (at) framesdirect (dot) com

 
  • BlissTheAssassin

    The account wasn’t hacked it was a public account that anyone could have access to. Dannys cousin only made it private last night after everyone saw what she had posted.

  • snuffles

    From what I heard, Danny’s cousin’s Facebook page was NOT “hacked” it was open to the public for people to look at. People actively looking for all things Idol (or Adam possibly) found her page and thus the Twitter-mania began.

    So the cousin was mainly a victim of her own ignorance rather than of a computer hacking.

  • alxsavage

    A lot of the #gokeyisadouche involved complaints about Danny’s clumsy comments about his views on sexuality on the Comcast chat, people didn’t like the fact that he talked about sexuality as a belief. Personally, I couldn’t disagree more, but I’m not offended by that. I just think it was another clueless comment from someone who was sheltered on an gay-unfriendly environment his whole life. I really couldn’t care less.

  • Natasha

    I watched this explode last night. It was truly something to behold. Never seen anything like it. I can’t believe how big it’s gotten and I don’t know whether to laugh or cry. MTV just did an article on it.

    Between this, his comments on comcast and his “right and Godly” love for Sarver I’ve pretty much had it with Danny. I flat out don’t like the guy and his family doesn’t seem to be the most tolerant bunch around. My only fear is that this is going to cause problems and create awkward moments on tour. MTV already tried to get a comment on this from Gokey.

  • agathe.hb

    I have been reading the tweets (twits?) and OMG this stuff is wild!!! But to see Adam’s sad face, made me really upset!
    Gokey, being what he is, has just been blocking all the negative posts, not responding at all….
    well, I hope these are the last moments we will hear from and about him. To think that I actually felt sorry for the guy. NOT ANYMORE.

  • wand3rful

    yipppe, you are back on…sorry you had to deal w. this weird shyt

    anyhoo…back to Gokey. man, why is it that stories like this always have him in the mix? talk about bad luck. obviously he is not to blame for his relatives/friends and their actions…and given the hectic nature of the show, he probably didn’t know about the facebook posting/replies.

    however, you would think someone who posts such ignorant comments on facebook also makes it known to their close inner circle. thus, i wonder if danny was aware of the inappropriate talk from his family about adam and just didn’t say anything …. based on his “i have my beliefs, people have to respect my views” comments (from the comcast.net interview).

    and yes, its pretty low to hack into anyone’s private page…but it is also pretty shitty to ask someone for their photo and autograph only to use it against them. i cannot believe these folks had the nerve to photograph w. adam if they cannot “understand him”, find him “weird”, think he was “faking” his politeness, etc. wtf. guess karma is a bytch.

  • LisaE

    Having said that, the commotion on twitter last night was totally a lawnchair-and-popcorn worthy eventà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦

    This is normally not my thing, and I didn’t get involved, but I absolutely agree. It was abso-freakin’-lutely hysterical. Most people approached it with humor – the best tweets were the funniest. And the ones with photoshopped pics? LMAO.

    MTV posted about it:
    http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1614260/20090618/story.jhtml

    (check out the “generally” comment at the bottom; good summation of the intent)

  • Victoria

    Yay, this site is back up!

    I’m so lost on the Eyeglass Gate thing, I’m not even trying to understand it anymore.

    As for the facebook, I hate that Danny is getting the blame for what his relatives did. Yeah, he’s said other things, but I tend to think he’s ust socially awkward. He’s entitled to his ow beliefs, whether or not he can express them well.

  • wolfsbane813

    haha… i’m a member of ontd and i was waiting for this to be reported on here. i even mentioned it in the post on ontd about the whole ordeal….

    but yeah… def a lawnchair/popcorn event indeed.

  • born2bevil

    The gokeyisadouche campaign is ridiculously entertaining. :clap_tb: You cannot really blame danny for being a douche while he was raised and surrounded by such ignorant people.

  • alaadam

    Yes, definitely a popcorn moment. It was hilarious. Some people didn’t even know why they were twittering the phrase. Some didn’t even know who he was. It just caught on like wildfire.

  • alxsavage

    Between this, his comments on comcast and his à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“right and Godlyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  love for Sarver Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve pretty much had it with Danny.

    On a side note, being gay myself, I did found that “right and Godly” comment very offensive. That’s why I don’t care anymore about anything that he has to say. The whole “tolerate my intolerance” vibe that I get from his clumsy excuses is more than I can stand.

    Having said that, people shouldn’t give that much importance to that intolerance. Unfortunately, when something like Prop 8 passes, you release that he’s not alone out there. The world is not gonna be changed by calling people like him or Sarver douches 10,000 times. Hate and intolerance are not defeated by more hate.

    And I agree with you, I’m afraid that this might cause some tension around the tour, among the guys themselves, their families, and of course, their fans.

  • snuffles

    RE: Eyeglass Gate

    This is just another example of why Gokey needs to KEEP HIS MOUTH SHUT on his foundation until he’s properly set everything up and put an organized system in place for handling foundation business. First up, learning exactly what a foundation does.

    Danny’s ignorance (on just about everything) knows no bounds. He NEVER thinks before he acts; and no matter how many times things come back and bites him in the butt he apparently continues to be incapable of learning from his mistakes.

    In his mind it’s either he’s “misunderstood” or it’s someone else’s fault. BUY A CLUE, DANNY!!

  • Stormy

    Actually, unfortunately, Danny isn’t innocent in this. He printed out the picture of Adam in green body paint (and apparently Adam didn’t even know yet that some of his personal pictures were still floating online) and Danny brought it to the dinner in order to humiliate Adam.

  • xuziqueue

    When Danny asked Adam to sign that picture, he was totally baiting Adam and that’s just self-serving and inconsiderate. Adam was nice enough to sign it and then pose with Danny’s relatives. Adam is very tolerant of such ignorance. What a fiasco this has turned into for Danny, a well-deserved one if you ask me. Selfishness like this is not regarded kindly and has a way of sticking with people. I wouldn’t be surprised if Danny gets booed on tour in places for such thoughtlessness.

  • brie200

    Nevermind. Not worth getting involved.

  • agathe.hb

    wand3rful, from what I understand about the entire commotion, was that it WAS DANNY who gave the photo of Adam in green glitter to Adam to have it autographed. HE KNEW VERY WELL what he was doing, he cannot hide behind being clueless or brought up “the godly” way. I will say that again, before this I kind of felt sorry for him, BUT NOT ANYMORE.

  • http://myspace.com/girlgeek mj

    Danny isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t innocent in this. He printed out the picture of Adam in green body paint (and apparently Adam didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t even know yet that some of his personal pictures were still floating online) and Danny brought it to the dinner in order to humiliate Adam.

    But, we really don’t know that. Danny seems to be socially inept. It could very well be there was no malicious intent there at all. Just cluelessness.

  • Jx223

    Most of the attacks on Danny are him giving Adam the picture to sign. However, I heard that the picture that he gave Adam to sign was for an Adam fan. I heard that a friend of his cousin is an Adam fan, who asked his cousin to get the picture.

    His cousin asked Danny to get Adam to sign the picture, and that is what Danny did. If you look at the autograph on the picture it is not made out to his cousin but to someone else.

    I think that someone else is the Adam fan. I don’t think that Danny printed out the picture to try and humiliate and embarrased Adam.

    I believe that it was given to him by his cousin via her Adam fan friend. And Danny was trying to do a favor for that fan. I feel sorry for Danny, because I think that once again he is getting a lot of hate that he doesn’t deserve. That Twitter thing is just insane and ridiculous IMHO.

  • dyg

    I hate that Danny is getting the blame for what his relatives did.

    I barely read some comments last night, but according to these comments, it was Danny who asked Adam to sign the photo. So, he is involved in the affair, and he made Adam feel sad (to say the least) – I would have been furious.

    Btw, what is ONTD?

    I never paid any positive or negative attention to any of the contestants, all my WOW attention was for Adam. However, Danny has got my negative attention now.

  • brie200

    I love that the way to fight intolerance is through bullying. Fantastic tactic. What exactly is accomplished by getting the message as a trending topic on Twitter?

    I’m also with MJ on this one, at least for now.

  • BestAI

    With all due respect, there are thousands more stuff out there about Adam than Danny. Adam’s family and friends kept him abreast of things he should know. You would think that someone would have told Danny about his own cousin’s Facebook, especially since they were all there at dinner. You can’t tell me Danny didn’t know what was going on especially since he was in on it from the beginning. To think Adam has to travel with him for over two months.

  • Winks8

    I go back and forth on whether I think Danny is evil (not really) or just socially awkward. I’m with a previous poster who said — I’ve just had enough of him.

    What really does make my skin crawl though is the whole, let’s dine together, will you please sign this picture, will you please pose with us for more pictures…. and then the disprespect the cousin (and family) show by posting, criticizing and mocking. It’s so ugly. I understand Danny MAY not have had any knowledge of the Facebook stuff, but I doubt he was oblivious to their dislike and criticizms.

    I don’t know what he can really do about that. I would hope he’s handling it with Adam. And I would hope he’s giving his cousin a raking over the coals over what she did to his (Danny’s) “friend.” But I doubt it.

  • sabby_rina

    Oh gosh there’s even a website about it and t-shirts being made about this. Yikes.

  • xuziqueue

    Several of the comments under the photos are very disturbing! Even if Danny was doing a favor for a friend getting Adam’s autograph, the captions are not innocent at all. Neither are several the other comments made on fb in “conversation” with the gokey cousin. Those comments show a certain lack of integrity and character on their authors’ part.

  • wand3rful

    will say that again, before this I kind of felt sorry for him, BUT NOT ANYMORE

    i think what bothers me is that danny must have heard one of his relatives say something snarky about adam’s photo or adam in general…and for him to let it happen, he’s fking 29yrs old. when does the “socially clueless” excuse end? ya know

    im with ya, not sure if i can feel “sorry” for him anymore. his comcast comment still makes me uncomfortable and gives me the impression he is allowing those around him to think like this about adam bc that its “their belief”.

  • Stormy

    dyg: ONTD is Oh No They Didn’t.

    But, we really donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know that. Danny seems to be socially inept. It could very well be there was no malicious intent there at all. Just cluelessness.

    I’ll admit that it’s difficult for me to give Danny the benefit of the doubt, given his quotes on Comcast and his “godly way” comment. But the fact that, of all the pictures of Adam floating around, this is the one he gave Adam to sign … sorry, it just doesn’t sit right with me.

    A longer analysis at Movieline:

    http://www.movieline.com/2009/06/how-a-photo-of-adam-lambert-dressed-as-the-ferosh-hulk-ignited-a-gokey-hating-revolution.php

  • born2bevil

    sabby_rina
    “Oh gosh thereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s even a website about it and t-shirts being made about this. Yikes.”

    :lol_tb: :lol_tb: :lol_tb: :lol_tb: :lol_tb:

  • karenw

    Whilst I’m looking forward to seeing all the tour footage on youtube (I’m in the UK so can’t attend one of the concerts unfortunately) .. I’ll be kind of happy when it’s all over so that Adam can move on and away from some of the people connected to Idol and do his own thing without having to put up with the ignorant sh*t that some of them come out with.

    There will of course be others along the way who he’ll encounter and have to work with who have similar views but I can’t think what it must be like having the prospect of spending a summer touring with some of these plonkers.

    At least he has the likes of Kris, Alison, Lil and Anoop to hang out with.

  • BestAI

    FWIW, while Danny might not have responded a few of his Idol friends did and they were not pleased. Closet Boy went off a little last night and he defended Danny.

    So they are taking Danny’s side. Of course Sarver would, but Giraud surprises me.

    Now you have to wonder when Kris made his little speech about everyone should get along in spite of differences, if he was talking about Danny and Adam.

  • Victoria

    I barely read some comments last night, but according to these comments, it was Danny who asked Adam to sign the photo. So, he is involved in the affair, and he made Adam feel sad (to say the least) – I would have been furious.

    I thought Danny’s cousin asked him to get Adam to sign it? Danny was stupid enough to do it. I don’t think he meant any harm, he’s just clueless. Yes, he’s 29 and he should be able to figure these things out, but some people just can’t. I know a few people who are older than Danny and even more socially awkward than he is.

    Adam has said multiple times that even though he and Danny don’t agree on some things, they still get along very well. It seems like whatever Adam says is taken as truth, unless it involves him getting along with Danny.

  • Jx223

    But, we really donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know that. Danny seems to be socially inept. It could very well be there was no malicious intent there at all. Just cluelessness.

    I don’t think that there was any malicous intent on Danny’s part. I do think that he should have thought things through better before he asked Adam to sign that particular picture. But from what I understand he was trying to help out an Adam fan, by getting the picture signed by Adam.

    I believe that the picture itself came from the Adam fan, who was a friend of his cousin. I heard that she passed it onto his cousin, to see if she could get Adam’s autograph. I heard that Danny agreed to ask Adam to sign the picture and that is what he did.

    In the picture Adam makes the autograph out to a girl named Stefanie. I believe that Danny’s cousin is named Talea. Also, Danny has sent out autographs of Adam and Kris(regular ones), along of an autograph of him with their approval to one of his fans before. And during the night that he asked Adam for the autograph, he was going around asking everyone to sign autographs for fans. I know that he all of the other idols to sign stuff for his cousin.

    I don’t think that Danny was being malicious, he was trying to help out an Adam fan. However, it backfired on him.

  • auntieaimee

    I also think Danny is socially inept. I don’t know if he was trying to humiliate Adam with the picture. Sometimes guys (all right, socially inept, immature, buffoonish guys) attempt to bond with one another by busting eachother’s balls. Hopefully his housemates called him out on that, though. That just wasn’t cool.

  • apaze1

    The look on Adam’s face says it all. He looks so sad…

  • hardkandy

    Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s ignorance (on just about everything) knows no bounds

    Pretty much sums up everything that needs to be said about Mr. Danny Gokey

  • Natasha

    Having said that, people shouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t give that much importance to that intolerance. Unfortunately, when something like Prop 8 passes, you release that heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s not alone out there. The world is not gonna be changed by calling people like him or Sarver douches 10,000 times. Hate and intolerance are not defeated by more hate.

    I think people just got upset. I got upset myself when I saw the photo of Adam’s face when Danny put the picture in front of him. It’s one thing to read about intolerance but when you see the effect it has on someone in a photo it triggers a strong reaction. Then add the cousin’s comments along with Danny’s previous comments and you had a recipe for something like this.

    I agree that twittering gokeyisadouche isn’t going to solve the problems of the world but it was an understandable knee jerk reaction, all things considered.

  • Kirsten

    I’m sorry, but I cannot find this amusing. Actually, I find this entire thing slightly horrifying. The way the mob whipped up last night was something ugly.

    I don’t know what this cousin said, but hacking her account and then harrassing Danny because of what his cousin did is all kinds of obnoxious in my book.

    At some point I think it reaches levels of bullying.

    Totally. This reminds me of how people hounded Chris Sligh back in Season 6. Sure, he did some dumb things, but it got so he couldn’t do a single thing without being attacked on-line and on his blog. Now, Danny is getting trashed for something his cousin did/said? IDK. I’d hate to be judged by my cousins. Most of them are amazing, but a few of them are total a$$hats.

    I just can’t laugh at this stuff. It’s too creepy. And I just know these kinds of wilding attacks are going to happen to others in the future and some of those others won’t be strong enough mentally to survive it. And people not even knowing what it was about and deciding to just joining in to harrass for the fun of it? Jeeze. I guess human society is always falling back on it’s worst traits.

    Gokey, being what he is, has just been blocking all the negative posts, not responding at allà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦.

    I wouldn’t respond to cyber-bullies either. Good for Gokey. It’s not like responding would do anything anyway.

    And I don’t even like Gokey. This kind of crap makes me ill.

  • Victoria

    The look on Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s face says it all. He looks so sadà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦

    To me it just looks like he’s looking down. :unsure_tb:

    I agree with those who think it’s bullying. Unfortunately, it’s a lot easier to be rude to someone from behind a compuer screen. I’m glad Danny is blocking the rude people (and I’m not a fan or anything, either.)

    What really bothers me is that the bullies are hating on Danny for supposedly hating on Adam.

  • weese

    How much benefit of the doubt can a non-fan give this guy. I believe this is my limit.

  • LisaE

    Hate and intolerance are not defeated by more hate.

    True that. I absolutely agree. I think I only enjoyed last night because it was done somewhat humorously and occasionally cluelessly. If it has been malicious, that would have been upsetting.

    I also think fan wars are lame (and only paid attention to by people who follow AI), but I don’t think last night was about Adam or even Danny really. It was about attacking a certain mindset that young people who use Twitter and ONTD have decided not to tolerate. That alone is cheer worthy.

    However, I’m REALLY hoping that those who attend the tour are respectful of everyone…

  • Natasha

    I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that there was any malicous intent on Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s part. I do think that he should have thought things through better before he asked Adam to sign that particular picture.

    I don’t know what Gokey thought but once he saw Adam was upset he should have backed off instead of insisting that Adam sign it.

  • ewan

    Here is the link to whoever missed last night’s debacle: http://community.livejournal.com/ohnotheydidnt/36343258.html?page=55#comments

    Check out all the hateful comments Danny’s family and friends left there.
    MJ, I have to disagree with you on this, Danny’s behavior was not simple clueless. He was in it for the prank.
    I felt so bad for Adam. Just think all these sh*t he had to deal with off the AI stage. Yet, every week he put on a brave face and gave us a brilliant show!

  • Natasha

    To me it just looks like heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s looking down.

    Danny’s cousin said in her comments that Adam was upset. It amused her.

  • brie200

    Closet Boy isn’t Giraud. It’s Alex Trugman. He also said nothing bad about Adam, just rather that he is friends with Danny and he knows Danny isn’t homophobic and he was just fine if people were going to stop following him on Twitter over it.

    But considering Giraud and Anoop are Danny’s closest Idol fans, I expect them to stand by Danny. They don’t have to condone his behavior to stand beside their friend.

  • kijico3

    think what bothers me is that danny must have heard one of his relatives say something snarky about adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s photo or adam in generalà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦and for him to let it happen, heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s fking 29yrs old. when does the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“socially cluelessà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  excuse end? ya know

    im with ya, not sure if i can feel à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“sorryà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  for him anymore. his comcast comment still makes me uncomfortable and gives me the impression he is allowing those around him to think like this about adam bc that its à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“their beliefà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ .

    This…and my heart just hurts for Adam in that pic :-(

  • Victoria

    However, Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m REALLY hoping that those who attend the tour are respectful of everyoneà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦

    Me too, but I doubt it. Has there ever been a drama-free tour?!

    Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin said in her comments that Adam was upset. It amused her.

    I don’t tend to believe random people I’ve never heard of, much less met. I’m taking all of this with a grain of salt.

  • butte009

    I wonder how those negotiations with 19 are going?

  • Sunn

    Yep, it was an epic pop-corn night. Better than the new Star Trek. I parked myself in front of twitter and watched the mayhem as it ensued. contrasting #gokeyisadouche gate with what has been happening with #iranelection on twitter over the past few days led me to marvel at the power of the twitter age; The full splendorous spectrum of it from the destructive to the sublime. The force of the masses, the power of the plebs, has never been so immediately evident. Whether it’s by toppling governments and defying tyranny or destroying individuals in the name fighting prejudice and intolerance.

    I felt old last night. I’m only 35, but felt completely out of my depth. The past week on twitter has been exhilarating. Last night was confusing, I was amused and frightened at the same time.
    The world changed all of a sudden over the past week and I can’t tell anymore what it’s changing into.

    Yep. It was quite a night for so many reasons. Some of the comments were also completely Lolz worthy.

  • soamused

    I watched it last night and thought it was hilarious. Most of the ontd kids weren’t even Adam fans – they were protesting against homophobia. The whole twitter show was a marvel to behold. I couldn’t help enjoying the unexpected call to arms to battle homophobia, even if it’s merely online and anonymous. I see that as a surprising sign of progress. I hope the ontd gang remain vigilant. And the bonus – more fun for me as a spectator.

  • wellhesback

    Someone upthread asked if there has ever been a drama-free AI tour:
    The Season 7 tour was relatively drama-free. (It’s the only season I’m familiar with). Some rumblings about Stage Dad, some crazies stalking Idol hotels, and management trying to keep Mavid from dancing. BUT the important thing is that all the performers sure seemed to get along. That may be harder on this tour.

  • ruskimom

    LOL MJ!

    No lawnchair for me…I put on VanHalen’s “Right Now,” and rode the wave on my virtual surfboard!!

  • agathe.hb

    I usually don’t give in to trends or whatever, I am too old for this shizz anyway :)
    but I got my motherly instinct going about Adam with this thing… He is the nice guy, he didn’t want to say “whom he didn’t like on AI, because it wouldn’t be nice”, and this is what he gets in return…. I often wondered, what I would do if my child were gay, and NOW I KNOW – I would fight the f….g war for her!!!

  • brie200

    But how is it what happened on ONTD battling homophobia? That’s the part I don’t get. Sticking up for Adam and taking a stand against intolerance is one thing. Posting #Gokeyisadouche ad nauseum is not really going to do anything in the battle against homophobia. Seems like a wasted effort.

    Don’t get me wrong. I’m a member of ONTD and have been for years. I love it for all it’s snark, but the motives on these type of campaigns are usually not all that altruistic.

  • Tara

    In another thread someone called Danny a PR nightmare. It becomes truer every week doesn’t it. So much smoke, must be a fire. AI must be about ready to hang him.

    I had the worst feeling in my stomach seeing the look on Adam’s face in that photo. Man. It is hard not to get my momma bear up. I hope the photo was out of context. And I am hoping the comment about the father staying as far away as possible is about something else?And why did they laugh all night? I have a bad feeling about it as I try desperately to get those rose colored glasses on.

  • screamingisgood

    I can stomach no more of Danny and his homophobia. Douche is too good of a word. I am clean out of benefit-of-the-doubt. When the AI tour comes to my city, I will quietly stand up when he is introduced and leave the room, returning only when I am sure he is finished. What class Adam has shown, what tolerance.

  • lola

    Ok, danny. I’m still having a headache with your response at the comcast as stated in the MTV article:

    “Yes. I accept gay people, but people have to accept my beliefs. We have to accept their beliefs, but they have to accept my beliefs. We agree to disagree. I don’t judge people, but at the same time, if they believe in what they believe, they have to accept me and what I believe. But I accept anybody as they come. That’s my character and my personality.”

    It’s either I’m too lazy to comprehend or he needs an interpreter.

  • Jx223

    Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m sorry, but I cannot find this amusing. Actually, I find this entire thing slightly horrifying. The way the mob whipped up last night was something ugly.

    I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know what this cousin said, but hacking her account and then harrassing Danny because of what his cousin did is all kinds of obnoxious in my book.

    At some point I think it reaches levels of bullying.

    Totally. This reminds me of how people hounded Chris Sligh back in Season 6. Sure, he did some dumb things, but it got so he couldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t do a single thing without being attacked on-line and on his blog. Now, Danny is getting trashed for something his cousin did/said? IDK. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢d hate to be judged by my cousins. Most of them are amazing, but a few of them are total a$$hats.

    I just canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t laugh at this stuff. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s too creepy. And I just know these kinds of wilding attacks are going to happen to others in the future and some of those others wonà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t be strong enough mentally to survive it. And people not even knowing what it was about and deciding to just joining in to harrass for the fun of it? Jeeze. I guess human society is always falling back on ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s worst traits.

    Gokey, being what he is, has just been blocking all the negative posts, not responding at allà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦.

    I wouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t respond to cyber-bullies either. Good for Gokey. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s not like responding would do anything anyway.

    And I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t even like Gokey. This kind of crap makes me ill.

    It’s very,very creepy. A lot these people are crazy, IMO. Far, Far, Far, Far, Far worse than any level of fandom/hate I have ever seen. I have been creeped out by some of the stuff that a lot of Danny’s haters have said before.

    But this takes it to a whole other level of creepy. People told him he’s going to burn in hell on Twitter, people have attacked his family members, people have attacked and harassed his fans on Twitter, it’s insane.

    I am concerned that one of these days someone might try to do bodily harm to him or something, that’s how extreme the hate for him is. I hope that he has a strong bodyguard for tour.

    I don’t blame him for blocking the cyberbullies either. I hope that he blocks as many of them as he possibly can.

    I wish that someone would come out and confirm that he was doing it for an Adam fan. I don’t think that he went about things in the best manner, but

    I don’t think that in anyway was he being homophobic, when he tried to get Adam to sign that picture for an Adam fan. And I don’t hold him responsible for what his cousin’s friends say.

    Imagine all of the bad that would happen if we were all held accountable for the actions of our family members and their friends. I think that Danny can only be held responsible for his actions not his family and their friends actions.

  • Sunn

    I’d like to add; Will everyone who’s saying that Danny’s just clueless please remind me to use that excuse next time I humiliate a colleague in public. It seems to work a charm.

    No grown man, or woman, in full possession of his, or her faculties is that clueless.

  • Chicagolaw

    Danny may have been clueless, but his cousin, from her own comments, clearly had an agenda with the picture. And she seemed to take great delight in making Adam feel uncomfortable.

    You know, Danny never seems to “know” anything that goes on in his camp. The pastor tweets, the wife picture, that there were any social statements being made by the media in the final weeks of Idol (perhaps the most entertaining moment in the Idolatry interview). Whether he is clueless or just playing the clueless card, we will never know.

    In terms of what went down with twitter, I have no sympathy for Danny. Perhaps this would be a good time for him to just take a “twitter vacation.” Twitter is doing him no favors ( I overslept and missed 3 interviews…).

  • AC

    Haha.. it was pretty funny to watch it all go down. I’m just amazed that it got to number 1 on twitter trends (well.. before it got removed. hehe). I think they need to put Danny through some better PR training! I think he tries to keep everything PC but he always ends up putting it the wrong way. That, and he should let his family know to not put anything like that out there! You would think they would have learned after that one guy put up a picture of him with his dead wife! Also, I saw that the cousin also put up a picture of her with Matt and said that he was stand-offish! I don’t know if she was trying to put the others down to bring Danny up?

    Also, I wonder if this will affect his plans with 19? hmm. I know it seems like a small matter but now there are articles being written about this now!

  • Dr. Tracey

    So apparently Danny Gokey isn’t the only ignoramus in the family then.

  • karenw

    I just hope that this doesn’t cause too much trouble on the tour amongst fans … and that Adam fans don’t waste their money on Dannyisadouchebag t-shirts (lol) … or their energy on booing him … and that this just makes them more determined to cover themselves in even more glitter and clap and cheer even louder for Adam to show him how much people support him and care for him.

    … and perhaps sprinkle a bit of glitter on Danny at the meet and greet .. I’m sure he’ll love that ….lol

  • LaTasha

    ^ It’s letting people know that homophobia’s not OK. And anyone who b*****s at me about how this wasn’t homophobia is wrong. What Danny did to Adam is exactly what my brother went through in school; subtle embarrasment, public humiliation, then laughing it off in a corner all by themselves. To many people it doesn’t seem like much, but to my brother, and, I suspect to Adam too, it’s worse than getting beat up. It’s knowing that people are laughing behind your back and in your face, and there’s nothing you can do about it so you just bear it and hide your face and wait for it to end, while putting out the image that you’re OK with it. But believe me, it’s not OK. Now, my brother is a successful business entrepreneur, but whenever anyone whispers around him he tenses up and has to excuse himself; it still hurts. I suspect it’s the same for Adam; no matter how successful you become or how many people love you, or even how tough you have built up your skin to be, the memory of highschool is still ingrained in your memory. And it hurts. Like hell.

  • undercooked

    I agree that twittering gokeyisadouche isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t going to solve the problems of the world but it was an understandable knee jerk reaction, all things considered

    I am glad it happened. Gokey and his family seem to surround themselves with people who think just like they do and seem to be clueless that many, many people see the world differently than they do. So if the tweeting backlash is a learning experience for Gokey and his family, I’m happy.

    I also don’t buy that the tweeters were bullying anyone. From my understanding, the Facebook account was NOT hacked, but the cousin posted those photos to mock Adam and left them open for the public to view. Well, the public did and responded. Again, she thought everyone would think she was clever and funny, and guess what, alot of people didn’t.

  • lola

    “Actually, unfortunately, Danny isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t innocent in this. He printed out the picture of Adam in green body paint (and apparently Adam didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t even know yet that some of his personal pictures were still floating online) and Danny brought it to the dinner in order to humiliate Adam.”

    - Actually, I have the same insight, too. Remember, Danny said that he is extremely competetive. I’ve known people who are like him and will do anything to put a person down to reach their goal. Then after realizing that he can’t put a good man down, he just let go of the attitude and learn to live with the truth. I just hope I am wrong.

  • undercooked

    Why do I think Lil is going to rip Danny a new one after this.

  • agathe.hb

    When I was a university student, we had a guy in our group, who we had suspected of being gay, we wanted a clean slate and we asked him about it the nice way and he was soooo happy to “come out” to us and just get it over with. I am still friends with him, it’s been 20 years. He is a wonderful person and I love him. Why can’t people just GET OVER this stuff, it’s beyond my comprehension.

  • hardkandy

    As far as I know – the cousin’s account wasn’t hacked. It was PUBLIC, she made it private after the whole shebang. I think that needs to be cleared up… no one made an effort of hacking an account just to find a reason to bash Danny. She put it out there for the world to see and now she’s dealing with the consequences. Sucks for Danny that he gets dragged into his family’s stupid actions but I just can’t feel sorry for this guy and his enduring ignorance about everything.

  • LaTasha

    Oh, and ONTD_AI isn’t an Adam fan site. Many of them (in fact, most of them) are Matt, Anoop, Kris, and Allison fans. But if there’s one thing that people at ONTD don’t like, it’s homophobia.

    Here’s the statement from ONTD_AI:

    The celebrity gossip blog OhNoTheyDidnt has recently been named as the breeding ground for the #gokeyisadouche trending topic. This statement is to clarify our stance and make sure the correct information is used when relaying the story. ONTD has several subsidiaries, one of which deals exclusively with American Idol content. As evidence continued to be revealed which exposed Season 8 contestant Danny Gokey’s alarming and disturbing prejudice against homosexuals, the members of these communities banded together to make #gokeyisadouche a Twitter trending topic. Whether or not we are fans of Adam or American Idol is irrelevant. Though our opinions differ, we share a common disdain for overt ignorance and hatred. We reject the notion that those who are “different” should have to resign themselves to being the constant butt of humorless and often malicious jokes. We chose Twitter, one of the largest social networking sites in the world, as the platform for our protest. While Twitter gives celebrities the ability to express themselves, it also provides the everyday user with an unprecedented opportunity to hold these public figures accountable for their words. In the late evening and early morning of June 18, 2009, we used Twitter to stand united in our message: #gokeyisadouche. Danny’s comments on the Comcast Idol chat, his insistence that he only loves men “in a right and Godly way”, and the subsequent leak of his behavior during an Idol outing, have consistently offended and outraged both our community and users across the internet. When Danny not only displayed, but also encouraged and enabled this homophobia in others, we refused to suffer the hatred in silence. The result of our actions has permeated the web culture and hopefully ignited a new sense of responsibility in those who wish to further their hateful agendas. ONTD, ONTD_AI subsidiary, Twitter supporters http://community.livejournal.com/ontd_ai/545077.html

  • auntieaimee

    Also, I saw that the cousin also put up a picture of her with Matt and said that he was stand-offish! I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know if she was trying to put the others down to bring Danny up?

    Probably. These guys were Danny’s competition at the time and the cousin wanted Danny to win, presumably so that she could glom onto him when he became famous.

  • JosieX

    But how is it what happened on ONTD battling homophobia?

    Exactly. If they want to battle homophobia, I have some suggestions. They should do some research to see which politicians support gay rights, and convince their moms and dads to vote for them. They should write to politicians who represent them to express their views. They should speak up for the “different” kids at school who get bullied and harassed. (Yes, I assume most of them are kids, too sad if not).

    I think that both Adam and Danny became symbols to some people and it doesn’t seem to really matter much at this point what they themselves actually say and do and think about each other. That could not be more obvious.

  • dyg

    IMO, Danny should speak up and say how he stands in this matter. In this way there will be no more speculation, and of course, he should condemn the behavior of his relatives. A gentleman would do that.

  • Chicagolaw

    If the picture/autograph was truly and sincerely meant for an Adam fan, then why did Danny’s cousin choose to include it with her photos on the net? Especially after seeing how upset Adam was to see it in the first place. I’m not buying it.

  • Tara

    Gosh Latasha, you are tearing me up….. so true. So sad, but true. People can really suck sometimes. That is why my gut hurt for Adam. Most people can sense a room. Adam definately can.

  • Jx223

    ^ Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s letting people know that homophobiaà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s not OK. And anyone who b*****s at me about how this wasnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t homophobia is wrong. What Danny did to Adam is exactly what my brother went through in school; subtle embarrasment, public humiliation, then laughing it off in a corner all by themselves. To many people it doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t seem like much, but to my brother, and, I suspect to Adam too, ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s worse than getting beat up. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s knowing that people are laughing behind your back and in your face, and thereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s nothing you can do about it so you just bear it and hide your face and wait for it to end, while putting out the image that youà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢re OK with it.

    Danny’s not the one that displayed the homophobia. I don’t think that he should have to suffer for what his relative and her friends do. He did not ask Adam to sign the picture because he’s homophobic. He did it to get an autograph for an Adam fan. He was going around that night asking all of the Idols to sign stuff for fans.

    What his cousin and her friends, say on her facebook is not his fault.

    If tomorrow it was discovered that Adam’s dad is a racist and people discover he made racist comments. Do you think it would be right for people to spam, Adam’s Twitter page, with insults and trash him and his family and friends. For something that his dad did?

    I also donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t buy that the tweeters were bullying anyone

    It was bullying IMO. His page was constantly being spammed with comments like “burn in hell” comments that trashed his family, comments that trashed his fans. Some of his fans were being harrassed for supporting him. I definitley think that is bullying. And disgusting to boot IMHO.

  • jpfan

    The whole Danny/Adam thing is getting very disturbing. I’m with Kirsten on this 100%.

    It’s one thing to leave comments for him. Spamming his friends, fans is just too much. I think Twitter needs to deal with this issue because I could see it really getting out of control very quickly. I can just imagine what some high school kids could do to someone they consider an “outcast” for example. Scary.

  • Sunn

    He did it to get an autograph for an Adam fan.

    Which Adam fan? And If so, how did his cousin get her hands on it? She obviously is not an Adam fan. And why print out that particular picture when there are official AI photos available for fans signings?

    Sorry that boat wont float.

  • BestAI

    Closet Boy isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t Giraud. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Alex Trugman. He also said nothing bad about Adam, just rather that he is friends with Danny and he knows Danny isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t homophobic and he was just fine if people were going to stop following him on Twitter over it.

    But considering Giraud and Anoop are Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s closest Idol fans, I expect them to stand by Danny. They donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t have to condone his behavior to stand beside their friend.

    Oh, I didn’t know about Trugman. I don’t think Anoop is that close to Danny. I think he and Adam are closer. In his chat, they asked who he was closest to, and he didn’t mention Danny (even tho they were roommates). In another interview, Anoop mentioned that Adam had helped him alot. I do believe there is a Danny/Sarver/Giraud clique, with Adam/Kris/Allison clique and Lil also mentioned she and Adam were tight. Sounds like high school, doesn’t it.

  • screamingisgood

    Danny knows his cousin (and the rest of his family), and he knows how they think. He knows Adam. Danny knew exactly what he was doing when he handed that picture to Adam.

  • lola

    Actually, it’s not the homophobe thing that got me. All people are entitled to their own opinion and views on the gay issue. It’s the humiliating aspect of the story…so sad.

  • Jx223

    If the picture/autograph was truly and sincerely meant for an Adam fan, then why did Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin choose to include it with her photos on the net? Especially after seeing how upset Adam was to see it in the first place. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not buying it.

    The autograph that Adam signed on the picture was made out to someone who has a different name than Danny’s cousin does. Why would she ask Adam to sign an autograph of a made up person’s name?

    Because she wants to humilate Adam that much, that she would lie to both her cousin and Adam to get him to sign an autograph of a made up friend? I don’t think that is what she did. Maybe she got the autograph and posted the picture on the facebook page, before she gave it to her friend. Maybe she posted that picture with her friend’s approval. I’m not sure.

    But I don’t believe that she would go way out of her way to lie to Danny and Adam and make up another person’s name, so that she could get a picture an autograph of Adam to humilate him. Or even that she used her friend’s name to do that. I do think that the Adam fan thing is legitimate, I just wish that someone Danny/Adam would come out and confirm it. I hate seeing Danny get ripped to shreds for this when I think that he was trying to help out an album fan.

  • LaTasha

    I’m not condoning the so-called ‘bullying’, but what Danny himself did, while it may not seem like homophobia, certainly is. The printing out of the picture, the embarassment in front of everyone, the immature giggling, talking; that’s homophobia. And I really admire Adam for his reaction; I would have slapped Gokey in the face. It’s not the ‘gays burn in hell’ part of it, it’s the ‘they’re different from us, they don’t have feelings’ part of it. And it f***ing sucks.

  • Susan M.

    Wow! The things I learn on MJ’s! “Oh No They Didn’t” à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ INDEED! I was online last night and had NO CLUE any of this was going down (hadn’t even heard of ONTD until I read this blog post). In a quick recap read through of most of the links, I am incensed at Danny’s cousin’s sickening set-up of someone she met, posed for pictures with and even asked a favor of. Then turns around and gratuitously humiliates him online? Even after she said he was nice? Why? Just because she couldn’t pass up the opportunity to debase someone for their sexuality?

    Talk about cyber bullying. That is indefensible. And these are “Christians” figuratively stoning someone else because they are not worthy of their “Christian” beliefs? Talk about hypocrisy! It makes my skin crawl.

    What Danny did or didn’t know, I have no idea and I do not advocate the reverse cyber bullying that took place with this. As someone said upthread, (paraphrasing) responding to harassment by harassing back is not the answer.

    But after reading Danny’s ComCast quote, I am sooooo glad Kris and Adam were the Final Two (not that I wasn’t already ecstatic). I said many times that if Adam were to “not win” (I don’t use the “L” word) I am glad it was to Kris. If he were to come second to Danny as Simon originally predicted, I would have been on suicide watch.

    Also, the CRAP would be going down now more than ever if Danny had won. YE-OUCH!!

  • Tara

    I don’t think Adam rattles easily. The fact that she says he was pissed or angry indicates to me that Adam was feeling something negative coming his way. Something was happening that made him uncomfortable.

  • saga

    We don’t see any black nailpolish on Dannys thumb, do we?

    Seriously, judging someone without them being heard is never a good thing, makes for irrevocable mistakes being made.

  • undercooked

    It was bullying IMO. His page was constantly being spammed with comments like à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“burn in hellà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  comments that trashed his family, comments that trashed his fans.

    Where is the outrage about what Danny’s cousin did? She posted pictures on a public site that mocked Adam?

    We will probably go in a circle on the bullying opinion, so we will agree to disagree. This tweeting campaign probably lasted less than 24 hours and has since been removed so I don’t think it will have any real long term emotional effect on the Gokeys.

    Again, if the end result of the tweeting is that Gokey’s family gets a bit of an education, than it served its purpose. I doubt that Gokey, or his family, have ever dealt with any real prejudice so perhaps they just don’t see the big picture. Maybe it will open their eyes. If they feel misunderstood, than maybe in the future they will be more understanding themselves.

  • agathe.hb

    LaTasha;
    you brought tears in my eyes!
    I remember the times in highschool, when my mother made me wear “strange” clothes and all the kids were laughing. One time they surrounded me and started poking fingers at my shoes, for crying out loud! Nobody should be subject to this! Be it being fat, gay, red hair, too tall, too short or else! The list is endless…

  • sidewalkstory

    People told him heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s going to burn in hell on Twitter

    Way back mid-season Danny’s Church and fans did a blitzkrieg on a few sites for an hour one night knocking Adam. They warned us in advance and followed through. This was an unprovoked attack. Mostly there were religious comments such as “Adam has the blood of Satan”.

  • Jeter021992

    I have a question for those people saying they don’t think Danny’s actions are homophobic, are you gay?

    Because if you aren’t I don’t really think you can say what does and doesn’t hurt a person if you never had to feel it.

    For example, I find it very offensive when people use the term ‘gay’ to describe something dumb or stupid. But I know lots of other gay people who don’t mind it.

    All I can say is if I was in the same position that Adam was put in by Danny and his picture and his family I would have felt uncomfortable and hurt by their actions. I know there is some debate about who the picture was for and if Danny was just trying to get it signed for a fan, but when he saw Adam’s reaction to the picture (as described by his cousin) he should have backed off and apologized.

    Socially awkward is one thing, common human decency is another, and I don’t feel like Danny has ever really showed that by his actions or comments toward Adam.

  • Calliope

    Okay, I admit that I was popcorn-watching last night and really amused by it (it was fast and the comments were insane!), but at the source of it there is something unsettling, and I am just going to say that it’s not the tweeters, in my opinion. It may have been immature, but it’s ohnotheydidnt — the people who coined the term “RPattz” and call everyone bb.

    There is actually a lot of fascinating stuff here, how they managed to get enough people to FORCE a trend. Twitter is an interesting network in its own right, with what is going on in Iran, how the rumblings of bird flu apparently first appeared on Twitter. If you can bear to read the thread, the ontd posters had calculations on how many people needed to post and how often. It was quite a lot of people, and they managed to.

    Anyway, this isn’t fanbase stuff when you look at it. And I do not feel bad for the cousin, especially since she posted it and apparently had to learn the hard way that the internet is not a void where you can post without consequences. Also, I have given Danny the benefit of the doubt over and over again, never really bashed him, but seriously — how many of these things can he fall into? I’m kind of over giving him the benefit of the doubt. I’m not going to be a “hater” and bash him, but I just don’t care to see how he is “misunderstood” anymore.

  • LaTasha

    Sidewalkstory, you’re right. It’s the prayer threads created for Adam, praying for him to either ‘change his ways’ or ‘burn in hell’ or ‘be burdened with bodily harm so that he knows it’s wrong’ : what ONTD_AI did was TAME. Incredibly tame.

  • Niall

    Gotta admit, I don’t think Adam was sad in that pic. Maybe annoyed but I really think we need to give him credit for having a thicker skin. Danny in his cluelessness probably figured it would be funny and Adam, who by now knows Danny’s behavior, probably found it annoying but par for the course. But the Gokey family overall does not come across in a good light, from his cousin to his Dad to anybody else who posted rotten stuff on that Facebook wall.

  • al2009atw

    Most of Adam’s fans are disgusted but didn’t act crazy. Those on Twitters yesterday are not fans, at least most of them aren’t.

    I don’t think Danny knew what his cousin was going to do with the pic. But just the fact that he made Adam sign that pic in front of everybody is very disturbing. I wouldn’t do that to my friend at all. That to me was quite mean spirited.

  • jpfan

    I guess as long as you have enough people you can create a trend. This stuff gets really hazy because calling someone on the phone with nasty comments, threats, etc. would be considered harassment. But I guess Twitter is protected as free speech. I don’t have any answers. I just think eventually some rules will have to be established to deal with this.

  • Tara

    I hope you are right Niall. So often anger/being pissed, stems from hurt.

  • Chipmunk

    Seriously hilarious, the whole thing.To me anyways….

    Tour is gonna be very interesting to follow on youtube this summer. Crikey!

  • Stormy

    To dyg, Jx223, Saga, et al

    IMO, Danny should speak up and say how he stands in this matter. In this way there will be no more speculation, and of course, he should condemn the behavior of his relatives. A gentleman would do that.

    Seriously, judging someone without them being heard is never a good thing, makes for irrevocable mistakes being made.

    If tomorrow it was discovered that Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s dad is a racist and people discover he made racist comments. Do you think it would be right for people to spam, Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Twitter page, with insults and trash him and his family and friends. For something that his dad did?

    We’ve heard from Danny. His non-answer answer in Comcast, his “right and godly way” comment … It’s not that he’s being bashed just for what his family said. It’s his complicity. Read the ONTD statement again.

    I have homophobic family members and acquaintances. They know (from my behavior at family gatherings, my Facebook page, and the Safe Zone poster in my office) that I am in 100% support of equal rights under the law. And Danny, much as he hems and haws for PR purposes, has also made it clear just where he stands.

  • undercooked

    But I guess Twitter is protected as free speech. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t have any answers. I just think eventually some rules will have to be established to deal with this.

    Let’s face it, horrible comments are found everywhere. Just check out some of Adam’s Youtube performances if you want to see some really vile comments written. And of course, what about a public Facebook photo page?

    I do agree that many hateful people hide behind the shield of the first ammendment to post hateful things. I’m not sure what the answer is. How do you make people decent and loving?

  • Calliope

    But I guess Twitter is protected as free speech. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t have any answers. I just think eventually some rules will have to be established to deal with this.

    You know, this is where I am not sympathetic to any celeb (or person in general) on Twitter. The way Twitter is set up is people can tweet at anybody, follow anyone (unless you block them), and it’s really, really interactive when comparing it to other social networks. So if the Idols want to go on Twitter as a “public figure” and have people pay attention to them, adore them, etc. then they can deal with the other side of it. It may not be nice, it may be immature, but it’s the way Twitter works. They signed up for it. It may be a harsh and unpopular opinion, but that is how I feel. I think Kris is really smart to stay out of it.

    ETA: Exactly, undercooked. You go on youtube and there is some really, really nasty stuff in comments. Most social networking sites have that side, it’s just Twitter is VERY direct.

  • Ellie2

    I can understand that maybe it was simply ignorance and/or social ineptness that caused Danny to bring the picture of Adam to dinner and ask Adam to sign it even after Adam showed his discomfort. But that still doesn’t excuse the behavior. Pleading ignorance only gets you so far in my book. And when you’ve reached the age of 28, you’ve pretty much outgrown that sorry excuse. It was obvious to Danny’s cousin that Adam was uncomfortable. It should have been obvious to Danny as well. I’m sure Adam would laugh it off now and decline to discuss it, but Adam’s genuine good nature and endless patience doesn’t negate the hurtful behavior of Danny and his family. They should have known better.

  • dyg

    To Stormy

    I am not defending Danny at all. I just think he should face the comments made by his family and the photo event.

    Btw, I have just been wondering if that night was the moment when Adam realized that he had left some pictures on the web, as he mentioned. If so, that must have been a very difficult moment for him.

    Adam gets closer to my heart every hour.

  • saga

    And Danny, much as he hems and haws for PR purposes, has also made it clear just where he stands.

    Didn’t we already know way back what his stand was on the gay issue was? If he was intentionally trying to bully someone for not being in a way he thinks is right, that we can’t say for sure. I clearly think there is some akwardness between Danny and Adam since there hasn’t been any show of friendship, no nailpolish II.

    If Adam really wanted he could comment and save Danny, but we don’t see that happening do we?

  • Jx223

    I think Twitter needs to deal with this issue because I could see it really getting out of control very quickly. I can just imagine what some high school kids could do to someone they consider an à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“outcastà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  for example. Scary.

    I read that on another site that some Adam fans are currently planning à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“revengeà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  on Danny. Scary indeed.

    Which Adam fan? And If so, how did his cousin get her hands on it? She obviously is not an Adam fan. And why print out that particular picture when there are official AI photos available for fans signings?

    Someone on another forum mentioned that his cousin is a friends with an Adam fan who wanted Adam to sign that particular picture. And asked Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin to help her make that happen. Then reportedly the cousin asked Danny to get Adam to sign the picture for her friend. If I can get some sort of proof for that I will post it here. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m working on trying to get that now.

    Where is the outrage about what Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin did? She posted pictures on a public site that mocked Adam?

    All over the internet, and on Danny’s Twitter. I think that a lot of the stuff that was said on the face book, was wrong, but I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that Danny should be blamed for it. And I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t like how a whole gang of people have taken it upon themselves to try and punish him for that.

    I don’t think that’s it’s right that people took it upon themselves to punish Danny for the stuff said by other people on his cousin’s facebook page. It’s a lynch mob mentality and IMO, it’s very disgusting. I don’t think that there is anything right about that.

    I don’t think that Adam would approve of that at all. I think that the stuff said about Adam on the facebook page was wrong, but IMO so was harassing and attacking Danny, and his fans on Twitter.

    We will definitely have to agree to disagree on the cyber bullying. Because I consider constantly harassing him as well as attacking his some of his fans and harassing them bullying. His fans are innocent, IMO they donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t deserve to be attacked and harassed on Twitter, just because they are fans of his and are trying to support him.

    Way back mid-season Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Church and fans did a blitzkrieg on a few sites for an hour one night knocking Adam. They warned us in advance and followed through. This was an unprovoked attack. Mostly there were religious comments such as à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Adam has the blood of Satanà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ .

    Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s awful. People shouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t have done that to Adam just like they shouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t have attacked Danny the way they did on Twitter, IMO

  • Jx223

    double post.

  • Stormy

    Adam gets closer to my heart every hour.

    Mine too.

  • Rusalka

    I have to admit, I was eating popcorn and watching from my lawnchair as well. It was pretty fascinating.

    For me, the most astonishing thing was seeing the level of organization at ONTD. They really came together as a group, regardless of whether they’d ever seen an episode of Idol. And ok, maybe someday they should point their efforts at world peace, but that’s never been the point of this particular community.

  • elephant1212

    ok danny gokey is like what 28-29? how in the hell does he think hes gonna make it in the entertainment/music industry if people know hes homophobic and expressing behavior like this?…(and yes he is…regardless of what others may say…he may be trying to save his ass)…i mean even if he goes country all of the hair/makeup people and actually more people than you think are gay so thats going to be a huge problem……also for someone who is 28/29 however old he is…….im sick of people making excuses for him bc hes socially awkward or ignorant or whatever……HES FREAKING OLD ENOUGH TO UNDERSTAND TO LEARN TO SHUT YOUR MOUTH. i bet fuller wants nothing to do with him, and if he does get signed, it wont last at all

  • elephant1212

    i mean danny’s being treated like a little kid becaue “he is surrounded by ignorant people”..to me that just isnt enough of an excuse…hes lived on this planet long enough to know to shut his mouth

  • selena

    Gotta admit- I haven’t laughed so hard as I did last night in a long time. The creativeness
    was total awesomeness X 1000.

    Adam has ignited a more tolerant worldview. Thank God.

  • Stormy

    I read that on another site that some Adam fans are currently planning à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“revengeà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  on Danny. Scary indeed.

    Got a link for us? I can’t speak for “some Adam fans”, and I don’t feel sorry for Danny, but I’d like to see this end before it goes any further.

    If Adam really wanted he could comment and save Danny, but we donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t see that happening do we?

    Why in the hell should Adam “save” Danny? Adam was perfectly diplomatic about Danny in his RS interview, and he refrained from retaliating after this fiasco. He’s done enough.

  • agathe.hb

    Well, Jx223, since you are trying to defend Danny citing Adam’s “we agree to disagree”, let me put my 3 cents in this discussion. I am an adult person with a lot of experience gained travelling around the world and meeting different people and gaining respect for other religions/points of view/lifestyles, etc. And I am trying to teach my daughter that same respect for all the human beings. But I DO believe that we are all growing and developing throughout our lives. There is NO excuse in my opinion for people that stay the same and are resistant to learning and growing. To me, Danny is such a person. He just refuses to grow, and I do not choose to excuse him for that.

  • lola

    “If Adam really wanted he could comment and save Danny, but we donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t see that happening do we?”

    - I think Adam is involved in too many controversies already. He didn’t start this. Having to meddle with the issue might bring more damage than good. I got the feeling that he is just shrugging everything off. But Danny need to comment on this and save himself.

  • suebrody

    Adam owes Danny NOTHING. Danny owes Adam AN APOLOGY.

    Good luck with that album-to-be-or-not-to-be, Danny.

  • Ellie2

    I agree with those who are saying that some of the tweets last night were over the line, personally attacking Danny and his cousin, etc. But at some point, we are all responsible for our actions and those actions have consequences, some of them not so great. You put up a mean-spirited, homophobia-laced post about someone who is beloved by many people and you are in for a shit storm. Gokey’s cousin should know better than most that sometimes you reap what you sow.

  • dyg

    Adam owes Danny NOTHING. Danny owes Adam AN APOLOGY

    Standing ovation!

  • Natasha

    Pleading ignorance only gets you so far in my book. And when youà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve reached the age of 28, youà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve pretty much outgrown that sorry excuse. It was obvious to Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin that Adam was uncomfortable. It should have been obvious to Danny as well.

    I was thinking the best thing I could say for Danny is that he’s ignorant and was raised by ignorant people but I don’t think I can say that anymore. I agree with you that by the time you get to 28 you have to start taking responsibility for yourself and your actions. The whole “I was raised in an ignorant bubble” thing doesn’t cut it anymore.

    I read that on another site that some Adam fans are currently planning à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“revengeà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  on Danny. Scary indeed.

    Link? This incident didn’t come from Adam’s fans. It came from people at ONTD who were taking a stand against homophobia. You can debate whether this is an effective way to go about that but you can’t debate who they are and why they did it. They told you who they are and why they did it.

  • Ellie2

    And what if the cousin’s posts had been about Lil’s race instead of Adam’s sexuality? I somehow doubt that people would be quite so protective of Danny and his family.

  • saga

    I think Adam is involved in too many controversies already. He didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t start this. Having to meddle with the issue might bring more damage than good. I got the feeling that he is just shrugging everything off. But Danny need to comment on this and save himself.

    I agree with this, I totally don’t think he should meddle with the story. All I am saying is that if he wanted to meddle in it he could.

  • Kirsten

    Letà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s face it, horrible comments are found everywhere. Just check out some of Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Youtube performances if you want to see some really vile comments written. And of course, what about a public Facebook photo page?

    Yes, there are a lot of obnoxious people out there. But it is one thing to stand around in a hallway and say “I think that person is a [insert insult]” (still very obnoxious) and another thing than to phone that person up 100 times in a row and tell them they are a [insert insult]. And still another thing to then to get all your friends to do the same thing (calling a 100 times). Or at least the law seems to think so.

    Look, it sounds like Danny’s cousin is a piece of work. I’d tell her off if I knew her. But she is not a public figure and she is not the topic of this board. Nor does she appear to have been the primary target of this cyber-attack.

    I had to roll my eyes when I read ONTD justification for their behaviour. Wave that banner high. Like I haven’t read super-homophobic comments on that site. Get real. If they want to stop homophobia, attacking a reality TV star who hasn’t been openly homophobic does not seem the logical place to start, IMO. I could give them a laundry list of people that have much more power and influence who have been much more open about their homophobia. There are lots of other ways to be truly effective. Hell, write a letter to congress in favour of gay rights. What was done last night was possibly the least effective thing to do, IMO. I don’t usually respond well to people who mob me. Plus, this seems more like “punishment” or “go get him” than, let’s educate this dude.

    I do not in anyway condone homophobia. I just can’t applaud group attacks. I just cannot accept bombing somebody with “burn in hell” comments. At least tell him what you object to. “Go burn in hell” is instructive, but it’s not helpful. It’s kind of scary. And I think people need to step away from that sentiment before it gets scarier. Most of the people who post “burn in hell” may be sane, but who knows what kind of insane person they are egging on. Mobs get ugly fast.

  • jpfan

    “Adam has ignited a more tolerant worldview. Thank God”

    You realize that spamming someone with go to hell posts because you don’t agree with their beliefs is not a great example of tolerance, right? But I think I get what you’re saying.

  • Natasha

    Adam owes Danny NOTHING. Danny owes Adam AN APOLOGY

    Standing ovation!

    Second standing ovation. Adam doesn’t owe Danny anything. Geez, he even signed the damn picture.

  • Sunn

    Someone on another forum mentioned that his cousin is a friends with an Adam fan who wanted Adam to sign that particular picture. And asked Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin to help her make that happen. Then reportedly the cousin asked Danny to get Adam to sign the picture for her friend. If I can get some sort of concrete proof on that I will post it here. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m working on trying to get that now.

    Even if that is true, although it seems a rather convoluted explanation to me as a believer in Occam’s razor, why that picture? Why did Danny print out that particular picture? And he did print it out himself as per his cousin’s comment. Why not a publicity photo? Why not any other of the hundreds of normal pics available at the time?

    Again sorry, but I don’t buy it. Too many things get in the way, most of which are comments from Gokey that have nothing to do with this incident, like his Comcast answer, and his godly crack.
    Benefit of the doubt runs out at some point when picture begin to form. It has run out for Gokey.

  • Tara

    I agree. Adam owes danny & family nothing. Jeesh, revenge now. my goodness. I don’t know what can stop this train now. Nothing Adam could say will stop it. Especially since it has been stated that this isn’t a strictly Adam fan campaign.

  • Truthiness

    Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s ignorance (on just about everything) knows no bounds

    So you’re saying that Danny has No Boundaries? Sorry, couldn’t resist.

  • weareallinnocent

    Wow. That’s low. Even for Danny (& family). Color me surprised, and a little pissed. :-(

    Adam gets closer to my heart every hour.

    Mine too.

    He always had my empathy, but yup, me too.

    Hang in there Adam. Karma….

  • undercooked

    We will definitely have to agree to disagree on the cyber bullying. Because I consider constantly harassing him as well as attacking his some of his fans and harassing them bullying. His fans are innocent, IMO they donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t deserve to be attacked and harassed on Twitter, just because they are fans of his and are trying to support him.

    I guess my viewpoint is this. Would I want the tweeting to continue on? No. Although I did not participate in the tweeting I think it did serve a purpose. Not all of Danny’s fans are innocent. As another poster said,

    Way back mid-season Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Church and fans did a blitzkrieg on a few sites for an hour one night knocking Adam. They warned us in advance and followed through. This was an unprovoked attack. Mostly there were religious comments such as à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Adam has the blood of Satanà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ .

    As I recall, before the finale, Pastor Rolex tweeted for people to vote for Kris because he was a good Christian. There does seem to have been a campaign from a militant Gokey group to discredit Adam, via the blitzkrieg, tweeting or Facebook. But perhaps this is the norm for each AI season? This is the first time I have actually followed a season all the way through, so I have no idea.

    I also have another question. Is this the first time Gokey’s family and militant fans ever been on the end of a blitz of any sort? I don’t really know because I don’t get involved in fan sites.

  • AC

    by the way, Danny himself is not bombarded by these tweets because unless he’s following the the person, he doesn’t see it. The only way he can see it is if he ends up searching for it himself so no, he is not being “cyber bullied”. Matt saw it because it was a trending topic for a few hours, as did Alex Trugman. They both tried to stick up for their friend but they never condoned what Danny said. He had his chance to clear up the “misconceptions” about him but he didnt- by ignoring the question on his thoughts of Adam being gay. He could have easily said something nice about Adam without having to say that he does/doesn’t support him being gay.

    Also, if Danny’s family feels okay with making fun of someone, they should realize that people can make fun of them just the same.

  • leome

    Bullying and harassing are the words that come my mind… much like what people do at idletard for the most part. Apparently this is what’s cool these days on the web and when others find this funny and acceptable it will just grow… till it’s them on the other side one day.
    People at ONTD_AI have not only attacked Danny but his fans too in the past.

    If Danny and Adam have any problem that’s with them to resolve it.

  • Tess

    Two things….For those who think that the anti-Gokey comments are bad and distasteful they should have lived thru all the Adam bashing on comment sites like EW. Anytime, anything came up on Adam a whole slew of comments were anti-gay and not written in any kind of civilized language. Even today there are comments on You-tube videos concerning Adam that are some of the most hateful I have ever read.

    Second….Danny should never have given that picture to Adam to sign. A typical Idol publicity photo would have been more than enough. As soon as he gave Adam a photo that wasn’t in anyway AI connected he became duplicitous in any further actions that were taken by anybody concerning that photo.

    OK…my two things are finished but I also wanted to say that no matter how miserable all of “this” stuff is for all those concerned, Adam and Danny and the rest of the Idols gave up any kind of normalcy the day they became part of the top 13 (if not a bit earlier) and good or bad their lives are intertwined with fandom for as long as they stay in the public eye. It’s sad but true and none of us can control what is said or implied about any celebrity even lowly AI finalists.

  • Sunn

    leome
    Jun 18th, 2009 at 6:13 pm
    Bullying and harassing are the words that come my mind

    What happened at that dinner with Adam was clear bullying IMO, I said the same in a thread here yesterday. “Karma is a bitch”.

  • Tara

    I looked into my crystal ball and I saw, a picture, yes a picture. two American Idol contestants standing around laughing with each other…yes, they looked like good friends. The picture, yes, it was on the internet. yes, it is two men, laughing together. Friends, good friends. The picture is on the internet, yes, put out by TPTB. My vision is fading… yes, a picture.

  • linsav

    I do not condone the Twitter campaign last night but I also do not condone Danny giving a picture to Adam to sign in front of a room full of family and friends and continued to insist that Adam sign the picture after Adam was visibly shocked and surprised. And Danny’s cousin is indeed a piece of work.

    A poster further back said that when Danny’s set is announced on the tour she would quietly get up and leave the concert area. If I do go I too would just leave and go walk in the hallway until Danny’s set was finished. To me, if you want to let Danny know what you think about the homophobia issue that would be a non-bullying way to get your point across.

  • Kirsten

    by the way, Danny himself is not bombarded by these tweets because unless heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s following the the person, he doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t see it.

    People actually tweeted at him. That’s one of the features of Twitter. You can tweet at somebody (@username) and that person might answer back to you. You don’t have to be following somebody to see a tweet directed specifically to you. You’ll sometimes see people responding to those questions. The hate-tweets arrived just like any normal non-hate tweet.

    Tweets can either be solicited (when you follow somebody) or unsolocited (when you send them directly to somebody).

  • msdog

    Distasteful things just surround Danny. It just seems like there is always something to cringe about. And 19E thinks that Country music is going to embrace this kind of stuff?

  • Sunn

    Tara
    Jun 18th, 2009 at 6:22 pm
    I looked into my crystal ball and I saw, a picture, yes a picture. two American Idol contestants standing around laughing with each otherà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦yes, they looked like good friends. The picture, yes, it was on the internet. yes, it is two men, laughing together. Friends, good friends. The picture is on the internet, yes, put out by TPTB. My vision is fadingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦ yes, a picture.

    Lol! Tara, can I borrow your crystal ball my stock portfolio is in dire straits.

    I think something will be done about this, if not by TPB then By Adam and Danny, if Danny cooperates. It may happen on opening night of the tour, may be a hug or something.

  • http://www.f3-properties.com Animated

    We come from conservative Catholic Christians. Raised in private schools run by strict German nuns where Madonna was not an accepted music. But the most important teaching we were raised on was compassion to all in spite of their difference in belief .We were taught the lessons of Mother Teresa who took care of the sick and dying in India, those who were not Christians.

    We learned that being a Christian means enveloping others with dignity by being compassionate.

    It is when we lack compassion that we help sow the seeds of hate and aggressive malaise.

    Someone sent me the link to all this issue of what D.Gokeyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s family commented. I thought it was a joke but since it was published with text and pictures, in a open social networking system, it was meant to be read by the public and meant to show the public how they perceive other people . The fodder of that transcript was Adam. It was meant to ridicule. If you openly publish , it is intentional.

    I do not see it as playful and having fun when you have fun on the expense of ridiculing someone else. Even if you think that you are doing it based on your own interpretation of what your religious teachings are.

    Human kindness and compassion has only one meaning.

    Otherwise, all the terrorists in the world have a justification for harming others in the name of religion.

    I hope there is a life lesson in this somewhere for all concerned. Something that will create kinder persons, better lives, a better world. Someday.

  • smartcookie

    You put up a mean-spirited, homophobia-laced post about someone who is beloved by many people and you are in for a shit storm. Gokeyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin should know better than most that sometimes you reap what you sow.

    You said a world of truth right there.

    Plus Danny should know his cousin well enough not to participate in getting autographs (AKA playing pranks) for this person. Even if he was stupid enough to try to be a big wheel (oooh, I can get autographs from all the Idols — just ask me!), he should’ve seen the Facebook nonsense and asked them to knock it off. He may not be responsible for his relatives or supporters, but he doesn’t have to enable them, either. When his pastor made nasty comments about voting for Danny as a vote for Jesus (or whatever the hell he said), Danny could’ve distanced himself. When Danny and Sarver had their godly moment, he could’ve made a point of coming out with an apology or an explanation of what he meant to say that wouldn’t sound so ridiculous. When Danny made the comment above (the one about other people needing to accept his beliefs), he could’ve blogged or tweeted to explain why that wasn’t as creepy as it sounds at first pass.

    And, yes, I do think that was creepy, as well as a really superficial and shallow approach to the world in general. If I was raised by some bizarre cult who think gays, blacks, women, and anybody who isn’t their religion should be kept in the basement with duct tape across their mouths, and they say, well, that’s what our religion says, here, I can show you the scripture and verse in the Great Book of Idiots, that doesn’t mean other people have to respect what I or my cult believes. At some point, if you come into contact with other people who think differently and live their lives differently, you need to open your eyes and take responsibility for what you think. It’s not “agree to disagree” or “respect my beliefs.” It’s being a fully functioning human being.

    I kind of wonder if Matt and the others who really like Danny feel sorry for him because he is emotionally and functionally illiterate. Anoop strikes me as a stand-up guy with a brain, and I can see him and Kris taking Danny aside and explaining just why this is all so uncool. Or trying, anyway.

    Oh, and I’m not even an Adam fan. I’m just very intolerant of intolerance and I HATE the idea that unthinking morons try to make other people feel small or unworthy just because they’re different. I mean, that’s the whole idea from Danny’s cousin and pals, isn’t it? To make sure that the Adams of the world know that the “right,” “godly,” “superior” people hate them and won’t accept them.

  • Tara

    Sunn, first we must wait, yes wait to see if I truly am gifted. We must be patient, yes patient to see, is her ball filled with the future.

  • jz

    Pass the popcorn please.
    Karma’s a bitch, ain’t she?

    ETA: <3s to ONTD.

  • papercut

    I usually just ignore Danny’s news but I can’t stay silent on this one. The simple fact that pissed me off was the fact that Danny printed out the picture of Adam in green body paint and brought it to the dinner in order to humiliate Adam. He even asked him to sign it for his parents who later laughed all night and made fun of Adam (According to Danny’s cousin) If it was just his family members doing the humiliating, I would just ignore them because they don’t work with Adam but Danny is basically Adam’s co-worker. To be humiliated in front of everyone during a dinner is really low and mean spirited.

    I didn’t participated in the ONTD event but I had fun reading it. It’s nice to see that mean people get what they deserve – KARMA.

  • lakhesis

    Sidewalkstory, youà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢re right. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s the prayer threads created for Adam, praying for him to either à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹change his waysà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ or à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹burn in hellà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ or à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹be burdened with bodily harm so that he knows ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s wrongà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ : what ONTD_AI did was TAME. Incredibly tame.

    It’s partly the reason why I was so emotionally wrought after the finale. The people who said “pray for the sinner!” basically won… I saw those comments throughout the season and it was a pain to read because the attacks on Adam was centered around the fact that he was Gay.

    If anyone really read the messages on facebook they were all regarding Adam’s sexuality, him being gay.
    They don’t even give themselves a chance to know Adam, because they would rather stay at the opposite end of the room than be with Adam. Yet they will pose for pictures to mock him.

    I HIGHLY HIGHLY DOUBT an Adam fan asked for the picture from Danny.
    1) Why would an Adam fan choose such an obscure picture so specifically? It’s not a shameful picture – but it is a strange choice, no??
    2) Adam was visibly upset. Danny said something like “Just sign it dude”? without further explanation.
    3) This cousin posted it up to humiliate, mock, to hate bait. . Would an Adam fan give it to her to do so?

    The homophobia demonstrated among Danny’s family, his church, and his peers are so prominent that I think it’s impossible to deny… I don’t know how close Danny is with his family :) but I would think he more or less have the same conceptions as them. You can’t “accept” something but condemn it at the same time.

  • AIfan7488

    This entire situation is just really bad. I do not condone homophobia in any way but I do not think that Danny should be ridiculed for the things that someone else says. He can’t control what members of his family say. The comments by his cousin were completely disgusting and I wish that she had left her page as public so that she could feel the full blast of anger that deserves to go her way.

    But that anger should be targeted at HER not at danny. people wanna pinpoint his comments on the comcast.net chat as a validation of his homphobia but that’s absolutely ridiculous. he said that he and adam disagreed on their beliefs. which could mean a number of things, all of which have nothing to do with adam’s sexuality. Honestly, people just need to calm down because this entire thing is getting really scary. I think we all just need to remember that WE DO NOT KNOW ANY OF THE CONTESTANTS PERSONALLY even if we feel like we do.

    What’s worse, is that people who have nothing to do with any of this like Matt and Alex are being sucked in. There were some people who were calling Matt a homophobe just because he stuck up for Danny! that’s ridiculous and I for one am very proud of Matt for speaking his mind and sticking up for his friend. It shows alot about him IMO.

  • Sunn

    Tara
    Jun 18th, 2009 at 6:31 pm
    Sunn, first we must wait, yes wait to see if I truly am gifted. We must be patient, yes patient to see, is her ball filled with the future.

    I can wait, my stocks unfortunately can’t, they seem intent on a suicidal dive. Lol! This is actually true I’m not kidding Lol!

  • Tara

    On a more serious note…uh hummmm.

    I think Mother Teresa had the right idea. She was being interviewed and asked about joining protests. She understood completely the effects of negative energy and said that she is never against something, but for something else. I am not quoting her, just summing up her insightful message.

    An absolutely current thinker she was. She actually read The Eye of The Eye, by Hawkins.

  • AC

    People actually tweeted at him. Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s one of the features of Twitter. You can tweet at somebody (@username) and that person might answer back to you. You donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t have to be following somebody to see a tweet directed specifically to you. Youà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ll sometimes see people responding to those questions. The hate-tweets arrived just like any normal non-hate tweet.

    Tweets can either be solicited (when you follow somebody) or unsolocited (when you send them directly to somebody).

    not to start an argument about tweeting.. hehe.. but when you do @username, that person still does not see it on their personal tweeting home page if they are not following that person. If they want to look up some fan/non-fan questions, they can do a search under their username to see what people are directing to them. For the most part, if he were smart, he would not go seek out these messages.

    Also, I’m sure that Danny and Adam get along fine.. may not be good friends or anything but they’re adults and I’m sure they would know how to ignore each other.. hehe.. I just want to know if 19 is really seriously considering him! Because Danny is somewhat of a PR nightmare! unless they just teach him to answer in 5 words or less

  • Tara

    Sunn, I applaud you for your ability to lol…my husband has absolutely no lol about ours.

  • saga

    Danny is a walking PR nightmare, that much is true. I so wish they would consider signing Matt instead. Getting a contract will not ensure success but it feels like Matt is capable of doing so much more with a contract opportunity, that he has the possibility to grow into a great artist. I can’t really see Danny changing much from how he is now, both musically and personally.

  • Kirsten

    not to start an argument about tweeting.. hehe.. but when you do @username, that person still does not see it on their personal tweeting home page if they are not following that person. If they want to look up some fan/non-fan questions, they can do a search under their username to see what people are directing to them.

    Yes, I’m sorry I wasn’t clear. It won’t appear on his homepage, but if he wanted to look at for things tweeted at him (he does have some fans and he does respond to some of them) he’d have to look at all the hate-tweets too. It’s not as if he has to go trolling the internet to find the hate messages.

    BTW do hate-tweets have a nickname yet? If not, it probably will soon. I sense that this will be a growing trend.

  • Sunn

    not to start an argument about tweeting.. hehe.. but when you do @username, that person still does not see it on their personal tweeting home page if they are not following that person.

    They do actually. I have people tweeting me that I don’t follow all the time. They just reply to my public tweet.

    They also tweeted his cousin and one of her friends who commented on Facebook. It wasn’t just Danny who faced the wrath last night.

    ETA:

    Tara
    Jun 18th, 2009 at 6:44 pm
    Sunn, I applaud you for your ability to lolà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦my husband has absolutely no lol about ours.

    What else am I gonna do? Crying will only make me miserable, so I Lol.

  • oceana

    You cannot really blame danny for being a douche while he was raised and surrounded by such ignorant people.

    If that were the case, then nobody could ever be blamed for anything. We could all just blame our families and that would excuse us.

    When we become adults we have to rise above the things we were taught that were wrong. We are responsible for our own actions and words when we grow up. We can’t blame our families for what we do.

    “Socially awkward” has also run its course. That euphenism needs to be retired. The guy’s a jerk. So what if his family are jerks too. It doesn’t change the fact that he is one. I have thought so all along and his actions since leaving the show are not changing my mind.

  • birchtree

    Self-centered/ignorant or creepy/mean? I have an image stuck in my head. Danny taking the picture of Adam up to him in front of a group of people. A picture that was not, so to speak, in the public domain. In the midst of a national reality TV show. He either never gave a thought of how Adam might feel about the situation (a definition of self-centeredness, or utter ignorance, take your pick), or he had a sense that it might embarrass Adam and somehow, somewhere inside, found that an appealing thought (which is creepy and mean). At the very least, Danny enabled a hurtful situation by taking that picture, in that context, up to Adam. I apologize for being so snarky, but I do feel snarky. If my 9 year-old child behaved in that way I would be mortified, would want to address those choices/lack-of-awareness. I can only hope that Danny gains some insight from this.

  • Mom in the Suburbs

    He did it to get an autograph for an Adam fan.

    Which Adam fan? And If so, how did his cousin get her hands on it…why print out that particular picture when there are official AI photos available for fans signings?

    Sorry that boat wont float.

    One possibility is there was no Adam fan, and the cousin made it up (I can imagine someone pulling a stunt like that but I’ve taught high school). If the Gokey clan are uber-competitive, they could have wanted Adam to verify that he is really the one in the “fierce” green make-up–what better way than to have him sign it???

    Another possibility is that the cousin does have a friend who is an Adam fan BUT the cousin did take the time to first scan the pic and make snarky homophobic remarks which then encouraged other family members to post such remarks. This whole act is extremely unethical, especially given that the cousin (and clearly Danny) laughed it up at the dinner and pretended to be nice but later stabbed Adam in the back. It disgusts me.

    I don’t quite understand how the hundreds, or thousands, of tweets is necessarily bullying, but I do wish they hadn’t used that opportunity to name-call (douche, burn in hell, etc.) Isn’t there another way they or anyone could have communicated to the Gokey clan that their homophobic remarks were a disgrace? Anyway, I don’t get the term “bullying” here because they could just choose to stay off the internet until the storm dies down. The cousin, and hopefully Danny, now know those comments were unacceptable.

  • Pixie Baker

    Quite simple for me………..

    The only thing clear to me is that Danny did give Adam that pic to sign (saw the photo)….and that, right there, says a lot. What person, even a *supposed* friend (like the idols say they are) would take one look at the pic and say…. no…hell no….. I am not giving that to Adam to sign. Even a socially inept person would know that is the wrong thing to do…….IMHO.

    All the rest seems like pure speculation……..none-the-less….the picture signing was sad and disappointing!

  • Sunn

    Mom in the Suburbs
    Jun 18th, 2009 at 6:57 pm

    If the Gokey clan are uber-competitive, they could have wanted Adam to verify that he is really the one in the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“fierceà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  green make-upà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’what better way than to have him sign it???

    Danny printed out that picture not his clan. There is no possible explanation that can extricate him from that. If he did want to verify that it is Adam due to competitiveness then the question arises .. why? What were they/he gonna do with the picture to help his competitive run on AI?

    Again, I see no explanation by which Danny can be innocent of complicity to humiliate.

  • terfra

    edit: now you’re banned. take your self-rightous ranting elsewhere

  • sidewalkstory

    People actually tweeted at him.

    Very few tweets were addressed soley to Gokey. They were addressed to #dannyisadouche. The hash mark (#) designates a topic rather than a person. It can be searched in the same way and you can set up a temporary column in your Tweetdeck to show all posts with that topic.

    If the tweets went to Danny, he would have been the trending topic, not #dannyisadouche, which was the trending topic.

    ———

    Also, Danny not only embarrassed Adam in front of the other Idols that night, he embarrassed Adam in front of one of Adam’s personal friends.

  • gingerly

    Honestly, I don’t find this to be, by far, the douchebagednest (should I double the g in bag?) thing Danny has done. I don’t even know that he was truely complicit in this. I do, however, know that cyber bullying isn’t the answer.

  • undercooked

    I do, however, know that cyber bullying isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t the answer.

    I would call the Facebook public posting of the photos with mean captions cyber bullying. What happened with the tweeting was a hit back at that. What do you do with a bully? What do we tell our kids? To stand up to them.

  • Tara

    ‘Poor Adam? No poor Danny!
    Yeah, I’m beyond poor Danny. There is a whole lotta smoke around this guy.

  • Mom in the Suburbs

    Sunn My friend, I’m pretty sure we’re on the same page in agreeing there’s no excuse! I was just thinking about what their “twisted” logic might be, and trust me I do think Danny is implicated. As I also said:
    This whole act is extremely unethical, especially given that the cousin (and clearly Danny) laughed it up at the dinner and pretended to be nice but later stabbed Adam in the back. It disgusts me.

  • JosieX

    The picture was not in the public domain? That doesn’t compute for me. Here’s something about all this that I don’t get. I would never condone homophobic comments. I’m not a twitterer but have actually done real world things to support gay rights. But I don’t get the assumption that Danny would know that Adam would consider this picture to be “humiliating”. To me, the photo appears to be Adam costumed for a performance. There appears to be a stage in the background. If Adam thought his appearance was humiliating then why in the world would he appear that way for a public performance? That doesn’t make any sense to me. People are looking at a photo of Adam looking down and Lil gazing off in the distance and making all kinds of assumptions about it. That’s their right of course, but I am fans of both of these guys (voted for Adam) and I don’t believe for one minute that Danny hatched a plot to humiliate Adam. I guess the basic premise that the picture is “humiliating” is missing for me.

  • sidewalkstory

    I think his behind the scenes video with Sarver did a lot to do with insulting gay people. I think his refusal to understand that being gay is a choice is insulting (“gay beliefs”), I think him being the accomplice to his cousins insults is an insult to gay people.

  • gingerly

    Danny has done so very much to insult gay people. The first and foremost is saying it’s a belief. He’s totally fucked himself with that statement. He has absolutely no freaking clue about sexual identity (and I’d venture to say he doesn’t want a fucking clue) It’s so much easier to believe what your Paster Roldex says about sexual orientation.

  • undercooked

    JosieX- I happen to really like that photo of Adam and don’t see anything wrong with it. I think he looks great. I think the fact that SOME people (Danny’s family) thought there was something wrong with it and were snickering about it, well that is the problem. Danny asked Adam to sign it, and his cousin scanned it and posted it on her Facebook, not because she was a fan, but because she wanted to mock him.

    Adam is a smart guy. He knew what was up. I sure that is why he was disappointed in Danny (if he was). I don’t think Adam was ashamed of the photo, but he probably knew that some closed minded people wouldn’t understand it and would use to to feed a stereotype about gay people.

  • aek

    My opinion:

    I don’t think Danny thought Adam would be embarrassed or ashamed of the photograph. Danny has said before the Adam is a “very creative individual; He thinks creative, dresses creative, talks creative.” Why would he think that this picture would embarrass Adam since clearly Adam is posing in the picture. I would not have thought it would be embarrassing for him. I would have thought either Adam was expressing his creativity or he was dressed up for some kind of theatre performance. I would NOT have thought that he would be ashamed of a pic that he was clearly posing for.

    As far as the cousin commenting that her father stayed as far away as possible, no I don’t think that was nice. But again, that’s Danny’s cousin….not Danny. There was a poster on here the other day (Danny’s mother works out with her brother) saying that Danny’s father had left the family and that they didn’t see him that often. This girl has the same last name as Danny’s dad. Who knows how close they even are? She is a cousin…not immediate family.

    Danny has always commented very positively on Adam. He has said the he is a great person and the he can’t find any fault in him. He has said that Adam would be “happy for anyone (who won)” “that’s the kind of person he is.” I don’t think that someone with hate in them for Adam would make these comments.

    Also, I didn’t get the impression that Adam was so much embarrassed by the photo as shocked that Danny had a copy of it. He was probably thinking that he needed to get this off of the Internet. I also didnt think that his comment to Danny about Danny “owing him one” sounds like he was angry at Danny or thought Danny was doing him wrong. It sounds more like banter to me.

  • Tess

    I have done absolutely NOTHING to Mr. Gokey, other than make comments here at MJs about how much I totally disrespect the man and his actions. I have not attacked him personally, I have not given out interviews indicating how much I dislike him and the things he says he stands for, I haven’t video’d a tweet and sent it out to the twittering universe, and I have never contacted Danny in any manner what-so-ever.

    I haven’t exhibited any bad “behavior” that I am aware of. I have posted my opinions based on my own filters. If they have come across as hateful, so be it. I don’t need to love everyone…and for me to respect and admire someone they have to do “something” (no matter how small) to earn that respect and admiration from me.

  • aek

    thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s ridiculous and I for one am very proud of Matt for speaking his mind and sticking up for his friend. It shows alot about him IMO.

    I so agree on this. The same goes for Alex. These people KNOW Danny, WE DO NOT.

    Alex was adament in his defense as far as what he knows of Danny as a person. He said that Danny showed his gay friends “nothing but love.”

    He also told Casey Carlson that people just look for reasons to hate Danny, and he is right.

  • Sunn

    That is your opinion and your entitled to it. you are free to find people who are attacking the insufferable Mr. Gokey disgusting, But you must then acknowledge with same breath that people are also free to find the Insufferable Mr. Gokey’s actions and comments disgusting and unacceptable.

  • kokko

    I went back to see the pictures and what Danny’s cousin said, and I did not get why Danny got all the blame??

    He asked Adam to sign a picture. Why do people think that was an embarrassment to Adam? If it was an embarrassment that means there was something “inappropriate” about the picture, if that was the case, why wasn’t Adam being questioned for taking the picture in the first place.

    Disclaimer: I personally see nothing wrong with the picture.

    Adam is now a public figure, a fan saw that was a cool picture and asked it to be signed, what’s wrong with that? Why are we so protective of Adam who has been saying he is” not embarrassed by anything” and he “knows who he is” and he is “proud of himself”.

    If you do not like what Danny’s cousin said on the captions, that is nothing to do with Danny.

    I find the mob or gang mentality to take down someone (even though it is by twitter) scary and has to be condemned. When enough people who believe and actively seeking to demonize a person, it is the worst kind of human behaviour and can do enormous harm.

    I hope nobody will do physical harm to Danny, and if god forbid something of that nature happens, all the haters including those who did that on twitters should be held accountable.

  • LaTasha

    Tess; I completely agree.

  • screamingisgood

    “People just look for reasons to hate Danny”, eh? Don’t have to look far, now do they.

  • undercooked

    Alex was adament in his defense as far as what he knows of Danny as a person. He said that Danny showed his gay friends à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“nothing but love.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ 

    He also told Casey Carlson that people just look for reasons to hate Danny, and he is right.

    Here is the thing. Danny needs to let his friends and family that he is NOT ok with them making fun of Adam. He should have come out against Pastor Rolex for tweeting to vote for Kris because Kris was a good Christian.

    I don’t know Alex and what his views are. I also don’t know Matt and what his views are. I always kind of thought Matt was a bit douche himself. I remember his “secret talent” was making fun of Adam. But Adam seems to like him, so there is probably more out there than meets the eye.

    And who knows, perhaps these guys are all cracking up because the fans are going nutso. I would like to think they all get along. I just know if someone posted those comments about me on a public Facebook account, my feelings would be hurt. Danny should say something about it.

  • Sunn

    Mom in the Suburbs
    Jun 18th, 2009 at 7:20 pm
    Sunn My friend, Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m pretty sure weà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢re on the same page in agreeing thereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s no excuse! I was just thinking about what their à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“twistedà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  logic might be, and trust me I do think Danny is implicated. As I also said:
    This whole act is extremely unethical, especially given that the cousin (and clearly Danny) laughed it up at the dinner and pretended to be nice but later stabbed Adam in the back. It disgusts me.

    I know where you stand believe me, I didn’t think you were defending his actions in any way. I was just trying to answer the questions you posited that’s all. I certainly didn’t mean for my post to sound aggressive or antagonistic in any way. If it did, please accept my apologies Mom in the Suburbs, I’m sorry for it.

  • http://myspace.com/susanatfox sumidol

    I cannot stand Danny, he is sick and wrong. I have stood up for him over and over in the past, I hate people making fun of the sadness he carried in regards to his wife but there is seriously something wrong with him. Socially inept, just an excuse, he is coniving and mean spirited, hiding behind the Lord to achieve what he wants. He just disgusts me now. Tess – exactly

  • aek

    I am not at all surprised that Danny is being villianized for something his cousin did. Heck the man can’t even say he got bored without being ruthlessly ridiculed as a “boring person, with no creativity.” Btw, both Anoop and Allison both said they were “bored” recently, and not a word of bashing for them.

    Also, it does not surprise me that Danny doesn’t try to “say” something in response. Everything he says will be twisted to fit the reader’s agenda. Add that to the fact that he is not the most articulate person in the world (okay, understatement), and really there is no way for him to say anything that would be accepted or make the situation better.

    I have thought too about the tour and how the idols sometimes mingle with the fans. It does occur to me that someone may try to hurt Danny. It’s scary acutually.

  • LaTasha

    kokko; it’s not the picture, it’s the INTENT behind asking him to sign the picture. Whether or not Danny knew the person, he should have realised that the picture wasn’t meant to be signed over a dinner table. Danny was so fucking socially inept and indecent as to ask him to sign it in front of his family and friends, knowing full well that they’re homophobic and would then proceed to laugh at the picture; not very many people know what that feels like.

    I had to sit there on my bed, with my brother crying onto my shoulder (I’m 9 years younger than him, by the way) because one of his ‘friends’ showed everyone an email in which he said he thought a guy was cute. He had to sit there mortified, as his ‘friends’ teased him, supposedly good naturedly, about his email. It wasn’t even big, but then others started getting in on it, and after a couple days everyone would whisper behind his back every time he walked past. How much do you want to bet that Adam had to endure comments about the picture for the rest of the night? It’s the same thing; the original person may or may not have known what they were doing, but it doesn’t erase the hurt.

    And no, I don’t condone the attack of Gokey through Twitter, but there are just some people who take things too far.

    Oh, and kokko, so if Adam suffers a physical injury in the next couple months the people who should be blamed are the ones who prayed that he would ‘be burdened with bodily harm so that he sees the right way’ or whatever the fuck they were saying? Or the ones who threatened to beat him up because he is gay and therefore ‘teaching our kids gay ways through the TV screen’ ? No? Didn’t think so.

  • ravengirl

    Adam is a smart guy. He knew what was up. I sure that is why he was disappointed in Danny (if he was). I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think Adam was ashamed of the photo, but he probably knew that some closed minded people wouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t understand it and would use to to feed a stereotype about gay

    This, I agree with, undercooked. I also think that Adam is smart enough to know already that Danny and fam are some of those close-minded people and that this “prank” was mean-spirited. Hence, the look on his face.
    Still, it looks to me that he did put on his game face, smiled with the folks for photos despite any misgivings he might have had and tried in his good-natured, accepting way to behave well in the hopes that maybe he could help shatter some of that narrow-mindedness. But as we see, it didn’t work out that way.

    For me, last night was as bizarre and breathtaking as watching OJ white SUV chase, and I will admit that I had a tiny hand in the commotion. Like Adam was with that photo, I am also not ashamed.

  • AussieFan

    I think that Stephanie Gokey is his Aunt. I’m sure I’ve seen her name somewhere but don’t quote me on it!

  • Tara

    People just want to pick on Danny? “just” as in randomly?… Like I threw a dart at a map of names and it just happened to hit his name so now I dislike some of his actions?

  • lakhesis

    kokko Jun 18th, 2009 at 7:38 pm

    I went back to see the pictures and what Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin said, and I did not get why Danny got all the blame??

    He asked Adam to sign a picture. Why do people think that was an embarrassment to Adam? If it was an embarrassment that means there was something à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“inappropriateà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  about the picture, if that was the case, why wasnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t Adam being questioned for taking the picture in the first place.

    Disclaimer: I personally see nothing wrong with the picture.

    Adam is now a public figure, a fan saw that was a cool picture and asked it to be signed, whatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s wrong with that? Why are we so protective of Adam who has been saying he isà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  not embarrassed by anythingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  and he à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“knows who he isà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  and he is à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“proud of himselfà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ .

    If you do not like what Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin said on the captions, that is nothing to do with Danny.

    I don’t see anything wrong with the picture either, it’s printed in Rolling Stone, etc. But that picture vs. official AI pictures… strange or no? I personally find it a little strange. It’s like asking Danny to sign a pic where he was clapping for himself, in a weird dance move, etc. It’s not like ooooh scandalous – but it’s questionable.

    I can’t imagine Danny being oblivious about the real intentions behind it…. and the person who promptly gave it to the cousin to put up for ridicule – how can that be fan behavior? All very strange… we aren’t responsible for our family’s actions…. but it does bring up the question “how much are you like them?”

  • St.Lucia

    I tried to read throug most of the comments, but I probably failed so I apologize if this question has been asked.

    How did this dinner come to be?

    Did the Gokey family just come into town and suddenly want to have dinner with all the Idols? I mean that seems a little interesting to me. Why not just have dinner with Danny? And then to take it to the level I believe there had to be some sort of plan going on here to put all this plan into action….apparently the entire Gokey family had an opinion of Adam and I feel this whole mess was just a chance to preach to him as well as exploit Adam for not being “right”.

    The whole mess is uncomfortable and horrifying. I KNOW people who don’t support gay marriage or relationships in general, but none would go to the extremes to put a person that is gay into a very uncomfortable place on purpose.

    I just find Danny(and his family) homophobia frightening. Why do they have to take it to the level? Why do they have to exploit someone? Why do they have to preach and make it “not right” and constantly uphold their doctrine.

    I feel for Adam for having to put up with this idiot for the months that Idol ran. I feel for him that he’ll have to put up with him on tour. In the same respect, I admire his positive wonderful attitude about this. He knows how Danny is, and Adam chose to take the high road.

    In some sense I do wish I could have seen this unfold last night….while I wouldn’t have participated(I don’t tweet(twit? twitter?)) it would have been an entertaining.

  • Anastasia72071

    undercooked
    Why do I think Lil is going to rip Danny a new one after this.

    Heh. When I saw the photo of Adam looking definitely-not-happy and Lil beside him also looking pretty unimpressed, that’s pretty much what I thought – “Uh-oh, I think Lil might go on the warpath!”

  • Jx223

    I heard about some of Adam fans planning to plot revenge on Danny on one of the forums on IDF. It was stated by someone but it wasn’t said clarified which group of fans said that. However some of the Adam fans on IDF came in that thread and said they weren’t planning anything. So I hope that someone was mistaken, and that they really aren’t planning any sort of revenge on Danny. Because that would be awful if that was the case.

    If you do not like what Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin said on the captions, that is nothing to do with Danny.

    I find the mob or gang mentality to take down someone (even though it is by twitter) scary and has to be condemned. When enough people who believe and actively seeking to demonize a person, it is the worst kind of human behaviour and can do enormous harm.

    I am not at all surprised that Danny is being villianized for something his cousin did. Heck the man canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t even say he got bored without being ruthlessly ridiculed as a à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“boring person, with no creativity.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  Btw, both Anoop and Allison both said they were à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“boredà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  recently, and not a word of bashing for them.

    ITA, with both of you. I think that a lot of the stuff said on Danny’s cousin facebook page was wrong, but I don’t think that Danny should be held responsible for what his cousins does. Even if he has a whole family full of awful people, he can’t be held responsible for what they do. Sometimes people have some rotten eggs in their family, IMO, they shouldn’t be slammed for bad stuff that their family members does.

    Also, Adam’s brother Neil has said some pretty rude stuff this season, including insulting stuff about Danny but his comments weren’t held against Adam. Even though he was insulting at least one of Adam’s fellow contestants. I don’t think that Danny should get blamed for his cousin’s actions anymore than Adam got blamed for Neil’s.

    And I also hope along with kokko, and aek, that no one tries to do physical harm to Danny. Not any group of Adam fans, or some of the nuts from ONTD, or elsewhere on the Internet. With all of the hate that he gets, I wonder how far people will take it. I hope he has at least one big burly bodyguard with him on the tour, like the David’s had last year.

  • Jx223

    I think that Stephanie Gokey is his Aunt. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m sure Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve seen her name somewhere but donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t quote me on it!

    And the mystery of who Stefanie is, deepens. I’m not sure who that is. I read it was an Adam fan, that gave the picture to Danny’s cousin to get is signed for her, but I have yet to find more solid proof of that, other than what I read.

    I don’t know if he has an aunt named Stefanie or not. We might find out eventually who the picture was made out to.

  • aek

    As far as I know – the cousinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s account wasnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t hacked. It was PUBLIC, she made it private after the whole shebang. I think that needs to be cleared upà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦ no one made an effort of hacking an account just to find a reason to bash Danny.

    This is NOT true. The girl’s account was private. I was on facebook and I saw her when I was searching for Danny/Danny Fan accounts. I saw her and saw that she had a picture with Danny for her profile picture. She looked young in the picture and I thought she might be a neice (I think she’s actually an older teenager, but not sure). Anyway, out of curiosity I clicked it to see if I could get in. It was set to private. So I know for a fact that her account was not open to the public.

  • Natasha

    How did this dinner come to be?

    I think this was at one of the “good-bye dinners” they have after the show when someone is voted off. It’s a chance to say good bye to whoever is leaving.

    People just want to pick on Danny? à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“justà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  as in randomly?à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦ Like I threw a dart at a map of names and it just happened to hit his name so now I dislike some of his actions?

    Actually I think Danny’s name was drawn out of a hat. Purely at random, of course. None of this has to do with his actions or the words that come out of his mouth.

  • Jx223

    I think this was at one of the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“good-bye dinnersà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  they have after the show when someone is voted off. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a chance to say good bye to whoever is leaving.

    I heard it was the goodbye Dinner for Scott (top 8 elimination). It looks like it was at Buca di Peppo where they usually have the good-bye dinners at.

  • Jx223

    dp

  • May

    I just know if someone posted those comments about me on a public Facebook account, my feelings would be hurt. Danny should say something about it.

    I agree, except the only person he really needs to say anything to is Adam, and none of us know if he has or hasn’t. Based on all of the mean things that have been posted about Danny throughout the internet, he really owes nothing to the idol fandom, especially since the comments were posted by his cousin, not him.

    I’m not crazy about Danny..at all. However, it seems like every year, one contestant gets picked on to get most of the hate and usually in the end, people always go overboard. This year it was Danny, last year it was Syesha (who’s only problem seemed to be social awkwardness). If we met these people in real life, none of us would be such assholes towards them, because if we’re being honest, they’re probably no worse than some of the people we deal with everyday. That twitter incident really served to showcase the hypocrisy of people who advocate tolerance. I’m guessing the treat others as we would like to be treated rule, doesn’t apply to the internet.

  • tj17

    As far as I know – the cousinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s account wasnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t hacked. It was PUBLIC, she made it private after the whole shebang. I think that needs to be cleared upà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦ no one made an effort of hacking an account just to find a reason to bash Danny.

    This is NOT true. The girlà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s account was private. I was on facebook and I saw her when I was searching for Danny/Danny Fan accounts. I saw her and saw that she had a picture with Danny for her profile picture. She looked young in the picture and I thought she might be a neice (I think sheà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s actually an older teenager, but not sure). Anyway, out of curiosity I clicked it to see if I could get in. It was set to private. So I know for a fact that her account was not open to the public.

    The girl’s account was turned from public to private after the fact.

  • soveryMel

    aek

    This is NOT true. The girlà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s account was private. I was on facebook and I saw her when I was searching for Danny/Danny Fan accounts. I saw her and saw that she had a picture with Danny for her profile picture. She looked young in the picture and I thought she might be a neice (I think sheà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s actually an older teenager, but not sure). Anyway, out of curiosity I clicked it to see if I could get in. It was set to private. So I know for a fact that her account was not open to the public.

    I think her Facebook account itself was set normally, with access given only to people who she has friended. But the photo album with the comments in question was set to public. I believe that album has since been changed to private as well, but last night I could view the whole album in all its glory as long as I was signed into Facebook, even though I hadn’t been friended by her.

  • aek

    Someone upthread posted that they didn’t think Anoop was that close to Danny, but rather closer to Adam. That is not true. Here is Anoop saying that he is closest to DAnny and Matt.

    Danny and Anoop were roommates.

    http://preview3.accesshollywood.com/dish-of-salt-idol-2009-runners-up-talk-tour_video_1109933

  • Natasha

    Gokey shouldn’t make any public statement about this – at least not any statement that he himself thought up or wrote. He’s a PR disaster. Every time he opens his mouth he digs himself in deeper. It’s uncanny.

    He should apologize privately to Adam. I have to say, if I were Adam I wouldn’t be to thrilled at the prospect of spending hours stuck on a bus with Gokey and Sarver this summer.

  • JosieX

    Gay bashing makes me sick to my stomach. I have confronted people about it, both strangers and people I know. Yes, in real life! So, as an Adam fan, why am I taking the trouble to defend Danny? Because I think he has become a symbol of oppression in people’s minds and is getting “punished” not for what he has done, but because he and Adam have become a catalyst for people to express very passionate feelings, on both sides. Someone mentioned the anti-Adam comments on EW, I can only imagine. I looked at them one time and felt as if I’d opened the door to some kind of medieval loony bin, and that goes for both sides of the issue. I got out of there quick and have no intention of going back. I hate intolerance of any kind. Gay bashing is one kind. Stereotyping someone of a particular religion is another. I am not saying that anyone who dislikes Danny is intolerant, any more than I would say that about anyone who dislikes Adam. But I do think it is a factor in some of the OTT stuff.

    As I have mentioned here before, I am a non-religious, politically liberal person who lives in a large West coast city. I have close gay friends and support gay rights. I don’t think that being gay is a “belief”. When Danny said that though, I don’t see him as a person filled with hate toward gay people, on par with the murderers of Matthew Shepard. As I said, I’m not religious, but I was brought up going to an evangelical Christian church, so I know the culture fairly well I think. There are hateful people in any group. But the vast majority don’t hate gay people any more than they hate unwed mothers, drinkers, smokers, gamblers, or people who use obscene/profane language. But at least back then, all of those things were things that they considered to be outside the path that they believed that was the right way to live. I don’t agree that these things are “wrong” in the way that they do. But I respect their right to feel that way. I do not take their feeling that way as evidence that they dislike or wish any ill upon people who live differently. They can live their lives as they think best, as I do. When someone is abusive or hateful to another person because their way of life is different, now them I have a problem with. Do I think that Danny has what I would consider to be an enlightened viewpoint about why a person is gay? No. But has he done anything to deserve being made the whipping boy who has to pay for the misdeeds of hateful people who have attacked Adam? No, absolutely not in my opinion.

  • Mom in the Suburbs

    And I also hope along with kokko, and aek, that no one tries to do physical harm to Danny. Wait, I’m confused by this connection. Sure, folks can argue that starting a twitter trend might be overreacting to a public post by the Gokey cousin, words fighting words really. But how does this translate to “physical harm”? Writing words is a far cry from assault, imo. If anyone is threatening violence, that should be dealt with immediately. I would never condone physical assault. In my previous post I even questioned the use of name-calling. Still, people have a right to use words to protest. Things like petitions, letters, editorials, etc. come to mind.

  • aek

    The girlà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s account was turned from public to private after the fact.

    No this was a little while back. I couldn’t see any of her pictures either. All I could see would be people who were her friends.

    Also, people keep bringing Danny’s dad into this. As far as I can tell, noone in Danny’s immediate family was involved in this at all. It’s the cousin and the cousin talks about HER dad, not Danny’s.

    Again, somone commented about Danny’s mother telling her brother that Danny’s Dad had left the family awhile back. She mentioned that money had been tight and that the father didn’t see them that often. This is a cousin on his Dads side. I think Danny’s dad may have been there with his brother and the girl cousin here. But the girl refers to her dad, not Danny’s, as far as I could tell.

  • Mom in the Suburbs

    Sunn It’s all good. As I said awhile back, you are often saying what I’m thinking as an Adam fan! I just wanted to assure you we are still on the same page as always… :thumbup_tb:

  • karenw

    Someone upthread posted that they didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think Anoop was that close to Danny, but rather closer to Adam. That is not true. Here is Anoop saying that he is closest to DAnny and Matt.

    Danny and Anoop were roommates.

    http://preview3.accesshollywood.com/dish-of-salt-idol-2009-runners-up-talk-tour_video_1109933

    Thanks for the link, I hadn’t seen that interview before.

    So Danny and Adam have something in common .. they both like it on top …lol

    …. and thank goodness Anoop was there .. he seemed the only one who could answer a question without pulling a funny face or putting on a stupid voice .. it was nice to hear one articulate answer at the end.

  • soveryMel

    aek

    No this was a little while back. I couldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t see any of her pictures either. All I could see would be people who were her friends.

    I’m no Facebook expert, but the photo album must have been set differently, because I was able to view it no problem last night.

    However, when I tried to view her Wall, I got the same normal teeny pictures of Friends page that you get before someone friends you. I think maybe that’s what you saw?

  • al2009atw

    People just look for reasons to attack Danny? Seriously, I wouldn’t even waste any energy talking about him or paying attention to him at all. I don’t hate him, just don’t care for him. Now, please don’t make Danny a victim here. Defend him all you want, but he really should have known better. Out of many pics of Adam, he had to choose that one for him to sign. “sigh” I am Christian and I totally don’t get the mentality of the Danny clan.

    Adam has been fighting an uphill battle most of his life. I didn’t think I could love him more, but now, I really have to keep him closer to my heart and prayers. He really hasn’t done anything to hurt anybody. He opened my mind and inspired me to think positive. I was against gay marriage, but he may have changed my mind. I am starting to feel like they are being treated unfairly.

  • johanna

    I know every year some people get picked every year but it is not for the same reasons! And homophobia is still kicking and alive in some place and should not be tolerated.

    As far as some Idols defending Gokey, while saying that Danny was there friend and supporting him, they should have also said that they did not approve of the comments on that Facebook account as they where obviously homophobics!

    How could anyone defend anybody that make comments like Gokey has made so often cannot eternally be excuses as a social clutz!

    Some ignorant people don’t perceive themselves has homophobic because they see that type of comments as a joke! It never even cross their mind that it could hurt some feelings!

    If the homophove don’t want to change their thinking, fine, but shut-up about it and let people live the way they were born, homosexuality is not a belief!

  • Jx223

    agree, except the only person he really needs to say anything to is Adam, and none of us know if he has or hasnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t. Based on all of the mean things that have been posted about Danny throughout the internet, he really owes nothing to the idol fandom, especially since the comments were posted by his cousin, not him.

    ITA.

    Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not crazy about Danny..at all. However, it seems like every year, one contestant gets picked on to get most of the hate and usually in the end, people always go overboard. This year it was Danny, last year it was Syesha (whoà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s only problem seemed to be social awkwardness). If we met these people in real life, none of us would be such assholes towards them, because if weà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢re being honest, theyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢re probably no worse than some of the people we deal with everyday

    Or some of the people we are related to. :smile2_ee:

    I remember Chris Rock joking around that the type of person that you dislike will end up in your family somehow. I think that’s true LOL.

    Sure, folks can argue that starting a twitter trend might be overreacting to a public post by the Gokey cousin, words fighting words really. But how does this translate to à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“physical harmà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ? Writing words is a far cry from assault, imo. If anyone is threatening violence, that should be dealt with immediately. I would never condone physical assault. In my previous post I even questioned the use of name-calling. Still, people have a right to use words to protest. Things like petitions, letters, editorials, etc. come to mind.

    I am concerned for Danny’s safety, because the hate for him is so extreme. I have seen quite a few of his fans express this concern. I have been creeped out for a while now by a lot of the stuff that I have seen people say about him on the Internet and to him on Twitter. This is not the first time, he’s been harassed on Twitter. He had people that harassed him on Twitter before this incident.

    They were harassing him, and Michael, and saying creepy stuff to Ryan Seacrest too, regarding Danny. And they have trashed and insulted his fans on Twitter, before. I can recall some people that were harassing him like every day for a while.

    I read some of the hate comments aimed at Danny and it makes me wonder how far people will take things. The people that told him, to “burn in hell” might be people that would physically attack him on tour. I think that it is a possibility.

    Those type of comments demonstrate pure hate right there, IMO. I have never seen this level of hate for an Idol contestant. Danny not only gets attacked, but he gets attacked so personally. And his family, and fans get insulted as well. That Twitter thing was insane, IMO.

    So I can’t help but be concerned that one of these days one or some of the Danny hater’s will take it too far and actually physically harm him.

    I hope they don’t but with the way he’s treated, I think it’s a possibility. I really hope that he has at least one bodyguard on tour that is as burly and big as the David’s bodyguards were last year.

  • lizardino

    I have never been much of a Danny fan simply because I don’t like the way he sings. That said, I hope (for his sake and the sake of his family and foundation) that he hires a really good PR firm soon — and listens to everything that they tell him to do.

    I have spend a fair share of time in my life around people from similar backgrounds as his, and they really have an insular sort of life. And you can’t choose your family, even if they are homophobic idiots (oops–there’s my bias!) The way he speaks of respecting his beliefs and respecting the beliefs of others comes from the way he views reality. The way we view reality isn’t so easy to change — and even if he does start to change in his thinking, it is difficult to change the way you speak. (Try to stop using a word you use every day and see how easy it is).

    I know from psychology that it takes 3 years or so for a behavior to really change. I hope he works on all of this, and talks with his family about this behavior as well. Who knows what good may come out of this whole thing. Maybe it will be a learning experience about acceptance for all people within Danny’s circle of friends and family. I think being on Idol with Adam and some of the others was probably a really good experience for Danny in any number of ways. It might affect him in ways we will never know.

    I have long felt that Danny was in over his head in the competition (not just vocally, but culturally as well), and this only confirms my feelings. Whatever he really feels about this situation, he can’t win. I’m glad his fellow contestants are remaining cool about the whole thing, at least publicly.

  • al2009atw

    Anoop and Matt are friends of Danny, of course they would defend him. But they have to be fair to Adam, too. The way I see it, the popularity of Adam isn’t helping him with other idols, except a few of them. Adam sure has a tough road in front of him.

    Most of Adam’s fans are not planning to do anything stupid. We are not at the same level as the ones who started this.

  • Bufflehead

    The Facebook photo album was set to a public or semi-public setting until late last night. Anyone who had a Facebook account could see the photo album. The privacy settings for photo albums are completely different than the privacy settings for your Facebook profile page. My Facebook profile is set so that anyone who is my friend, a friend of a friend, or in one of my networks can see it. But if you aren’t one of those, you won’t see it.
    On the other hand, my Facebook photo albums are all set to completely public, so that you don’t even need a Facebook account to see them, assuming you have the correct link.
    At some point late last night or early this morning Talea Gokey either removed the photo albums or ratcheted up the privacy settings on them so that no one but her friends can see them.
    So if someone was looking for Talea Gokey on Facebook but could not see her full profile, that doesn’t have anything to do with whether or not the photo album was publicly viewable. It was viewable, I saw it myself, and trust me, I am no friend of Talea Gokey!

  • noctem seizure

    What I’m not clear on is why Danny is catching so much flack for saying essentially the exact same thing that Kris did about Adam’s homosexuality. I wish I could find the exact quote, but I remember thinking wow, Kris is going to catch backlash. But, amazingly nobody said a peep about it.

    Maybe it’s because Kris is so close with Adam that Adamaniacs let it slide? Or else they failed to translate into secular language from “Evangelicalese”?

    I guess I picked up on it, because even though I’m a non-practicing Evangelical, I can still understand the language. But, anyway, both of them esentially said– albeit, Danny in a much more word-fumbling way– that they didn’t agree with Adam’s lifestyle morally, but they didn’t judge him as a person. You know, “reject the sin; embrace the sinner”– that kind of thing….

    But, somehow Kris has acquired this reputation as a liberal Evangelical who is ok with homosexuality. Um, no, he’s not. He’s ok with Adam, his friend, but he’s not ok with homosexuality. He’s not just not as awkward and clueless as Danny about how to express himself.

  • aek

    but because he and Adam have become a catalyst for people to express very passionate feelings, on both sides.

    Exactly. It long ago ceased to be about what either of them says or does, but what they have been made to stand for.

    I, like you, am politically liberal and pro gay rights. I am also agnostic. I have spent two months now trying to find out all that I can about Danny Gokey, mostly because of all the hate I have seen thrown his way. I wanted to see for myself if it was warranted.

    What I have found is that he actually seems to be a decent person, and certainly not the hateful villian that he has been portrayed here on the Internet. (I actually have not encountered many people in my entire life that could measure up the the “evil” characature that has been painted of Danny).

    If he is guilty of anything, it is that he is a devout evangelical Christian who, as Adam says, believes that the Bible is the direct word of God. Do I agree with this? Hell no. It would suit me fine if the Bible disappeared from the face of the Earth. (And I apoligize, because I know many will find that deeply offensive.)

    Still, from all accounts, most people who know Danny describe him as having a big heart, a hard worker, a person who has spent the bulk of his life volunteering to help children from disadvantaged backgrounds. Alex Trugmann describes him as showing love to the several gay friends in the Top 36. Heck, Adam himself, described Danny as being a thinker and having a big heart.

    Is he a perfect person? I am sure he is not. He does seem a bit immature. Is he an articulate person? Hell no, and that is part of the reason he should not make any public statements regarding this. It would be hard for anyone, when people are just waiting to twist your words, let alone Danny. Is he an honest person? I think, by and large, he is. Part of the reason Danny gets himself in trouble is because he is not a politician and does not give politician type answers.

    Why is it that so many praise Obama even though his public stance is that gays should not be allowed to marry? But a simple guy like Danny, who is not the leader of the free world, is crucified for believing like devout evangelical Christians do.

    I dont think Danny is hateful. I don’t think Danny dislikes Adam. He has stated time and again how much he thinks of Adam.

  • Ellie2

    The way I see it, the popularity of Adam isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t helping him with other idols, except a few of them.

    Even if that’s true, Adam only has to make it through the summer. He has always struck me as extremely professional and patient and I’m sure he’ll grin and bear it through any tension during the tour. And after that, he doesn’t have to have much contact with Danny again. Before long Adam will be moving on to much bigger and better things.

  • kokko

    Latasha

    I would not go as far as stating Danny’s intent as a matter of fact way like you did by just looking at the pictures and reading the captions. Honestly, what Danny’s cousin said on the captions are pretty mild compared to a lot of other fans comments on contestants who they don’t like. Unless I have a couple of third party account on what really happened and what Adam’s reaction really was, I would not say for sure that there was any bad intentions of Danny and the Gokeys towards Adam, and that Adam was truly embarrassed by the incident.

    I am sorry to learn about your brother’s story, I just don’t see how that’s related to Adam situation, that “he had to endure comments for the rest of the night?” What comments are you speculating? I thought Adam would be proud of what he did. If you are so concerned about your brother’s feeling on that incident, wouldn’t you be more worrying if he were a target of a mob/gang bullying or attack?

    I don’t wish anything bad happen to either Adam or Danny or any contestants. I just want people to be mindful that this flood of deliberate hateful comments could be inciteful and some lunatics might take things in their own hands, and what I saw in that Twitter towards Danny was unsettling.

  • sallyas1

    Natasha Jun 18th, 2009 at 8:38 pm

    Gokey shouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t make any public statement about this – at least not any statement that he himself thought up or wrote. Heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a PR disaster. Every time he opens his mouth he digs himself in deeper. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s uncanny.

    He should apologize privately to Adam. I have to say, if I were Adam I wouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t be to thrilled at the prospect of spending hours stuck on a bus with Gokey and Sarver this summer.

    If I was Adam I would be thrilled spending hours on the bus. Adam is going to be jetting back and forth recording his cd, and when he is on the bus he will be receiving phone calls from powers that be, while Gokey and Sarver will have to sit there and see it all.

    Adam fans have no need to plot revenge against Gokey. Adam is going to get it himself simply by working on his career.

  • aek

    Anoop and Matt are friends of Danny, of course they would defend him. But they have to be fair to Adam, too. The way I see it, the popularity of Adam isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t helping him with other idols, except a few of them. Adam sure has a tough road in front of him.

    Has Anoop said anything about this/Danny? If so, I missed it. I saw Matt and Alex’s Twitter last night.

    I don’t think them defending Danny has anything to do with Adam’s popularity. I think they all like Adam. I think Anoop and Matt know Danny and therefore they feel like they can speak up for him as to his character…(something the rest of us are only guessing at).

    They don’t know anything about Danny’s cousin and probably think that she is unimportant in the scheme of things. Quite frankly, that is true. Who cares what she thinks? It really has nothing to do with Danny.

    Everyone on my mother’s side of the family is extremely religeous and conservative…the EXACT opposite of me. I am not responsible for their views, but I don’t hate them either.

  • Jx223

    Anoop and Matt are friends of Danny, of course they would defend him. But they have to be fair to Adam, too. The way I see it, the popularity of Adam isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t helping him with other idols, except a few of them. Adam sure has a tough road in front of him.

    I think that all of the Idols care about Adam, including Danny. Anoop cares about him, Adam has said that he loves Anoop. Allison cares about him as does Kris. Lil cares about him and has mentioned that he would always try to be there for her if she had a rough day. I have never heard Megan or Scott say anything bad about him. I think that they and Matt care about him as well. I don’t think that his popularity is affecting his relationship with the rest of the Idols.

    I agree with a lot of what you are saying about Danny aek. I think that overall he is a good guy and has a lot of good qualities about him. He has flaws, but I think that overall he is a good guy.

  • iluvai

    I got this from another site. Supposedly it was the caption underneath the photos that were posted by the cousin.

    “Danny asking Adam to sign the soon to be Famous green picture. Adam posed in a picture where his whole body was painted green and he had blue sparkily lipstick on and a blue hair wig with a Tiara and a necklace. He also wore some sort of long skirt.

    Adam was supper P.O.ed when he saw it his voice went all high pitched and he said à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“What the F***!à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“where did you get thisà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  Danny is all like just sign it. Adam said à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“You owe me for this!à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  LOL! My dad and I just laugh all night long about it, I thought he would be proud of the pictureà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦ i guess notà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦”

    So if this is true, the cousin is pointing out that Adam was upset.

  • soveryMel

    But, somehow Kris has acquired this reputation as a liberal Evangelical who is ok with homosexuality. Um, no, heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s not. Heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s ok with Adam, his friend, but heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s not ok with homosexuality.

    I wish you could find that evangelical-coded quote, because without it, that’s an awfully big inference. I’ve never gotten that “hate the sin, love the sinner” vibe off Kris, ever.

  • noctem seizure

    If he is guilty of anything, it is that he is a devout evangelical Christian who, as Adam says, believes that the Bible is the direct word of God.

    And as I said my post above, SO IS KRIS! Kris just has a lot more social grace and is PR-savvy. But, make no mistake about it he is a FUNDAMENTALIST evangelical Christian– a youth minister, in fact!

    But, he’s spared the scorn that is heaped on Danny I guess because Adam-fans haven’t connected the dots or properly interpreted his relevant comments. Well, NEWSFLASH: Kris ALSO believes homosexuality is a sin. He just doesn’t let it interfere with his friendship with Adam.

    Danny doesn’t either, for that matter. But, he’s just not nearly as close to Adam as Kris is.

  • AC

    What Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not clear on is why Danny is catching so much flack for saying essentially the exact same thing that Kris did about Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s homosexuality. I wish I could find the exact quote, but I remember thinking wow, Kris is going to catch backlash. But, amazingly nobody said a peep about it.

    No, they have not said the same thing at all. There is no backlash against Kris because Kris (and in Adam talking about Kris) have made it clear that he is accepting of Adam and of homosexuality by talking about him being open-minded and how all people should get along and how he doesn’t judge people, etc (it’s all in an ew interview). Also, actions speak louder than words so even if he didn’t say anything, we all know what he represents.

    Also Anoop and Matt are friends of Danny’s so of course they would defend him, but if Adam is a douche suddenly became a twitter trend, I’m sure they would defend him too.

  • lola

    If Gokey has no intentions to humiliate Adam, why didn’t he print a wholesome picture of Adam to be given to the “supposed” fan. Something’s not right.

  • aek

    So if this is true, the cousin is pointing out that Adam was upset.

    I think he was upset in a shocked sort of way. Like, where the heck did you get this picture (I thought I had deleted that stuff from the Internet). If he didn’t want to sign it, I am sure that Adam has the balls to just say, “I don’t think so, Danny.” and not do it. Adam is not a baby, and I don’t think he would do anything that he didn’t want to.

    The “you owe me” thing sounds like banter between DAnny and Adam.

    I don’t agree with the cousin’s comments, but I don’t think any of this says anything about Danny.

  • aek

    If Gokey has no intentions to humiliate Adam, why didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t he print a wholesome picture of Adam to be given to the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“supposedà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  fan. Somethingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s not right.

    How do we know Danny printed the picture? This is new to me.

  • maturin

    Those type of comments demonstrate pure hate right there, IMO. I have never seen this level of hate for an Idol contestant. Danny not only gets attacked, but he gets attacked so personally. And his family, and fans get insulted as well.

    Dunno, that seems like in itself kind of hyperbole.

    It’s not that difficult to nutshell.

    If a family group did the same thing simply at a high school or neighborhood level–went out for dinner socially, posed for photographs. etc–then went back and published pics with lots of insulting comments about one of the fellow guests, whom they had pretended to be polite, to while sneering behind their back on Facebook or the equivalent

    . . . they would get a lot of blowback when other people noticed.

    Now, take the facts that Idol has millions of viewers and thousands and internet groups. You would have to say that Danny and his family are well aware of that fact, since they were expert at using the internet to spread the word to their fans.

    You do something that would result in a big social backlash, even if it happened at a home town level. Then you do that thing in a setting where you know that huge social groups are involved. By the time Gokey decided it would be hilarious to print out an old internet picture of Adam and thrust it in front of him at dinner as a joke, he had to have known that stuff really circulates on the internet–BECAUSE he was holding the shiny green evidence, no?

    Then someone from the dinner scanned the signed photo and posted it for the unpleasantness to begin.

    It seems to me that the Gokey social circle simply received the effects they tried to achieve. They wanted to embarrass someone using the Internet. Instead, the effect happened to them. I see the pain, but not the injustice.

  • noctem seizure

    I wish you could find that evangelical-coded quote, because without it, thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s an awfully big inference. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve never gotten that à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“hate the sin, love the sinnerà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  vibe off Kris, ever.

    It shouldn’t be hard to find at all. I’m sure someone can pull it up, if I don’t get to it first.

    But, do you know where the word “evangelical” comes from? It’s the adjective-form of “evangelize” which, in religious terms, means to spread one’s faith to others. If you’d like to know where its Biblical roots come from, it comes from what is known as the “Great Commission” in the Book of Matthew. After Jesus Christ the Son of God rose from the dead (according to Christian belief), before he ascended to heaven to join “God The Father”, he commanded his followers to “Go into all the world and preach the gospel…”

    In other words, these are people who want to convert you. It’s what defines their faith tradition.

    Now most of them don’t do it. Most of them live in their little Christian bubbles and go to church several times a week and associate only with their Christian friends and congregate and pass judgment on all the heathens in the world (although they may be friendly to you at work).

    But, some of them do take the Commission seriously which is what it sounds like Kris was doing as an overseas missionary. You think he was over there just doing “good works”? No! That’s how “missionaries” ingratiate themselves into a society or community and from their they can start to “spread the gospel”….

  • lola

    “Adam is now a public figure, a fan saw that was a cool picture and asked it to be signed, whatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s wrong with that?”

    - The incident happened during the early stages of the competition. Adam was not being groomed yet as one of the finalists by the producers back then. He was just trying to find his way through the competition. They still had Gokey in mind as the future winner.

  • Natasha

    It seems to me that the Gokey social circle simply received the effects they tried to achieve. They wanted to embarrass someone using the Internet. Instead, the effect happened to them. I see the pain, but not the injustice.

    I never thought of it that way but you may be right. They put it out there to subject Adam to embarrassment but it wound up being embarrassing for them when they were caught. Just goes to show how things can backfire on you.

  • soveryMel

    But, some of them do take the Commission seriously which is what it sounds like Kris was doing as an overseas missionary. You think he was over there just doing à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“good worksà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ? No! Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s how à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“missionariesà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  ingratiate themselves into a society or community and from their they can start to à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“spread the gospel”

    But isn’t it possible that he did missionary work that focused more on helping people than converting them? Does his evangelical worship have to mean he marches in lockstep on the hot button cultural issues of the day? I dunno, maybe it’s because I’m your cliche Cafeteria Catholic, who was first an altar girl then a lector doing the readings, and went to a Catholic college — but from the time I was able to think for myself instead of parroting my parents/grandparents views, I made my own decisions on these issues, including 100% gay friendly. Maybe Kris in his own quiet way did something similar.

    Hey,I’ll even entertain the possibility that Danny did too to some extent — although if so, he gets a major fail on articulating it successfully.

  • linsav

    But, some of them do take the Commission seriously wwhich is what it sounds like Kris was doing as an overseas missionary. You think he was over there just doing à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“good worksà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ? No! Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s how à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“missionariesà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  ingratiate themselves into a society or community and from their they can start to à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“spread the gospelà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ Ãƒ ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦.

    Didn’t Kris just say in his Comcast interview that he did missionary work through his college? I don’t recall him saying he went to a private religious college. He said he was building homes and helping aids groups.

  • noctem seizure

    No, they have not said the same thing at all. There is no backlash against Kris because Kris (and in Adam talking about Kris) have made it clear that he is accepting of Adam and of homosexuality by talking about him being open-minded and how all people should get along and how he doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t judge people, etc (ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s all in an ew interview). Also, actions speak louder than words so even if he didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t say anything, we all know what he represents.

    I’m sorry, I believe you’ve misread his statements. And I do have a frame of reference here, as for the first twenty-four years of my life I was pretty active in this religion, and for one of those years I was actively trying to “evangelize” “non-believers” myself.

    As far as the actions speak louder than words notion, Kris, or those who know him, would characterize his actions as an “example of showing God’s love” or some Christian cliche like that. But, I don’t think you’ll agree with me, because, from reading your words here, your mind seems pretty made up. So there’s no point in us continuing to go back and forth on this.

    If I am able to find the specific quote that caught my attention, I’ll post it and then I’ll break down exactly what it means in “Christian-speak”. And then you can decide whether you concur or not.

  • Jx223

    How do we know Danny printed the picture? This is new to me.

    I heard that the friend gave the picture to Danny’s cousin, for Adam to sign and that she wanted that particular picture signed. That’s what I heard, even though it hasn’t been proved yet. I could see an Adam fan finding that picture online, and printing it out so that Adam could sign it.

    I remember how a lot of the Adam’s fans gushed over, some of the ones of him and his ex-boyfriend Cheeks. So I don’t think that it’s out of the realm of possibility that an Adam fan could have found the picture online and printed out herself.

    I don’t know all of the details of the whole story, but I don’t think that Danny printed that picture out. I don’t. I don’t see going online and looking for old pictures of Adam to print out.

    It’s possible that his cousin could have printed that picture out. But I don’t think that Danny personally went searching on the Internet for old pictures of Adam and decided to print out that particular picture for Adam to sign. I just don’t see that. I think that someone else chose that picture and printed it out.

  • AC

    Yes, my mind is made up based on real quotes and Kris’s actions towards Adam. The end.

  • Sunn

    How do we know Danny printed the picture? This is new to me.

    The cousin said it in her comments on one of the pictures she posted. She said Danny printed the picture. Go to ONTD and find the original post with her comments and you’ll find it there.

  • ruskimom

    AC,

    How ’bout”

    Tweetledee (delightful)
    Tweetledum (dumbass, dumped on)

    You’d call them “dees” and “dums,” depending on the nature of the tweet…

  • http://www.TheAdamLambertConnection.com/forum flynnsgirl

    Adam’s friend Cheeks says it very well, it’s the way he was raised.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWH2NXdZ7O8

  • noctem seizure

    I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t recall him saying he went to a private religious college.

    I went to a Christian liberal arts college for my Bachelors and then a state university for my certification. BY FAR the most devoted Christians I encountered were at the state school.

    Hey,Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ll even entertain the possibility that Danny did too to some extent à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’  although if so, he gets a major fail on articulating it successfully.

    In one of my posts above, I distinguished between “bubble Christians” and (for lack of a better term) “evangelizing Christians”. Danny strikes me as a bubble Christian. Spends almost all of his time with other Christians in their own little Christian world. Bubble types are often very holier-than-thou, but like I said they keep the actual “message” of their faith to themselves.

    But isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t it possible that he did missionary work that focused more on helping people than converting them? Does his evangelical worship have to mean he marches in lockstep on the hot button cultural issues of the day? I dunno, maybe ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s because Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m your cliche Cafeteria Catholic, who was first an altar girl then a lector doing the readings, and went to a Catholic college à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’  but from the time I was able to think for myself instead of parroting my parents/grandparents views, I made my own decisions on these issues, including 100% gay friendly.

    I hate to generalize too much because whenver you generalize, invariably somebody reads it and says “I’m a (fill-in-the-blank) and I don’t fit that generalization!” And then they write an angry post to that effect.

    Having said that, generally, there isn’t a lot of Cafeteria-ism among evangelicals. It’s a fundamentalist faith.

    What you have to remember is that Catholicism is the other side of the coin to Protestantism. It’s very broad. Evangelicalism is a narrow (well, not that narrow) subset of Protestantism.

  • aek

    Yes, my mind is made up based on real quotes and Krisà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s actions towards Adam. The end.

    But we really would need to see the quote. Otherwise, you are just believing what you want to believe about Kris without any proof.

    From what I’ve heard, Kris attends a mega church just like Danny. I also read a quote from the preacher there saying that Kris would “be blessed” in the contest because he was a Christian. This type of language was used against Danny, but everyone let it go when it was Kris.

    Just sayin’. What’s good for one is good for the other.

  • milly93

    Yay! I’m an ONTD-er and didn’t participate in the twitter campaign but thought this was hilarious.

  • a-lamb

    noctem seizure – Do you have ANY proof that Kris is anti-gay? Cause he doesn’t come across like that at all. He and Adam are really good friends and Adam has said on several occasions that Kris is very open-minded and liberal. I don’t think he has any problems whatsoever with gay people.

  • aek

    Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s friend Cheeks says it very well, ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s the way he was raised.

    The biggest problem with the Miss CA issue was that she even contradicted herself in her answer. She wasn’t sticking to any type of belief. She started out saying one thing and then mid way seemed to get nervous and she switched to the other side.

    With Danny, he is sticking to his evangelical Christian beliefs (I don’t agree with them). However, he is still treating gay people respectfully. And from everything that I can gather, likes and admires Adam.

    I don’t begrudge Cheeks his feelings of anymousity in this instance. He has his right to free speech.

    Obviously people need to grow and change throughout their lives, but I don’t know if attacking those people who believe so strongly that the Bible is the true word, is going to change anything. If anything, I’m sure the sheer volume of hate messages that Danny received last night and probably today, will do nothing but make him cling to that faith even more. He already talked about how the different messages on the Internet had kind of screwed with his head, and that was back before the competition was over.

    I can’t begin to imagine how he feels. He’s had a rough year: wife died, grandfather died, and I read yesterday that his grandmother fell and broke something and is in the hospital right now. He has a lot on his plate, and I really don’t think he did anything to warrant this. He is not his cousin.

  • soveryMel

    Having said that, generally, there isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t a lot of Cafetria-ism among evangelicals. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a fundamentalist faith.

    Yeah, I’m probably comparing apples and oranges in an effort to twist myself around to understand something I just don’t have any experience with, having very little exposure to evangelicals (regular flavor or bubble flavor, heh) in my circle of friends.

    I think if you have a fave Idol, you can’t help but think the best of them. I’ve done my best to give the benefit of the doubt to the rest of the Idols as well whenever fanwars start, but it just seems like with Danny, every week there was something I was trying to make excuses for. He’s just worn me out.

  • linsav

    Kris’ preacher is sure mild compared to Danny’s preacher:

    Jeff Pruitt Tweets About VFTW

    Pastor Rolex from Danny Gokey’s church tweeted about VFTW yesterday.

    “Vote for the worst website is voting for Danny to win Idol! WOW, this rem. me of God causing confusion in the camp of the enemy when…9:25 AM May 4th from mobile web”

    The camp of the enemy??? WTH!

  • a-lamb

    To the people who say that Danny didn’t deserve this because it was his cousin who posted those pictures – this is not the first time Danny has come off as homophobic. This was just the last straw. People reacted. If you say douchey things people are going to treat you like a douche. It’s the way of the internet.

  • noctem seizure

    noctem seizure – Do you have ANY proof that Kris is anti-gay? Cause he doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t come across like that at all. He and Adam are really good friends and Adam has said on several occasions that Kris is very open-minded and liberal. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think he has any problems whatsoever with gay people.

    Well, first, I dispute your terminology. I don’t think Kris OR Danny would call themselves anti-gay. What I am pretty confident of is that both of them do not morally agree with homosexual relations.

    Seriously, somebody find the quote! I’m not a Kris fan, but I’m sure some site out there has logged every public statement he’s ever made since they discovered him on Idol. So bring over any statement he has ever made about Adam, and I’ll find the one I’m talking about and decipher the Evangelical code language.

    Other than that, I have no “proof”. But, I am VERY familiar with the faith background he comes from, and I know what their professed beliefs are.

  • aek

    lisav,

    Yeah, I agree about Danny’s church being “out there”, and is probably “crazier” than Kris’s.

    But heck, all of it, even the mild methodist version I was brought up in, is “out there” to me. lol.

    I’m was just pointing out that I did read something where Kris’s preacher seemed to think he would/should win AI because he was a good christian. Danny’s did the same, talking about favor would fall on Danny because he was a good christian….whatever.

    Funny how these people think God gives a crap about American Idol.

  • Tess

    IF Kris totally embraces the teachings of his church with regards to homosexuality he has never said so, as far as I can recall. In fact I think it would be hard to find any quote where he refers to his church much at all. And I don’t think he has ever really said anything about Adam’s homosexuality in a Christian Evangelical context. Now if there is a quote out there I would really like to read it…in context.

  • http://www.TheAdamLambertConnection.com/forum flynnsgirl

    The Danny supporters seem to think this is all based on the one incident, the cousin/facebook thing. It isn’t. It’s remarks Danny has made before, such as the comcast interview and comments Adam has made. Danny’s minister sending those tweets out during the competition, there are way more than one incident that have people upset.
    Trying to take the blame off of Danny for what his cousin did is kinda not the point.
    Calling Danny socially awkward and clueless is the understatement of the year. Anyone who reaches the age of 28 and is as socially retarded as Danny is should not be in the public eye.
    I am not defending the twitter campaign, but for people to act so shocked about it and not realize it has been going on against Adam since the beginning of the season seems pretty hypocritical to me.

  • aek

    Seriously, somebody find the quote!

    Can you remember any of the terminology that he used?

    Where I live, most people are Baptist. Does this count as fundamentalism, because it sure seems like it.

    I can guarantee you that almost all of them beleive that gay sex is a sin. If you believe that the Bible is the direct word of God, don’t you have to believe that it is?

    Honestly, Kris hasn’t had to deal with the tough questions that Danny had to deal with in the Comcast chat. Danny, not being particularly articulate as it is, is trying to answer questions quickly online in a chat. Danny was not in an enviable situation there.

  • ewan

    “It seems to me that the Gokey social circle simply received the effects they tried to achieve. They wanted to embarrass someone using the Internet. Instead, the effect happened to them. I see the pain, but not the injustice.

    Totally agree!

  • jpfan

    I hope all the negativity is gone by the time the tour starts. The tour is usually pure fun because it’s the last hurrah for most of them. Add this to the news about Archie’s dad and Josiah’s mom and there’s not really much positive going on at all.

  • stillcontemplating

    “Krisà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s preacher seemed to think he would/should win AI because he was a good christian. Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s did the same, talking about favor would fall on Danny because he was a good christianà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦.whatever.”

    I’m pretty sure both were Danny’s preacher. When Danny got eliminated Danny’s preacher then twittered about how everyone should vote for Kris because he’s a “believer” but Kris never approved/told Danny’s preacher to post that. Kris has mentioned that his beliefs are personal and private. As for quotes, all the interviews I’ve read with Kris seems to show that he’s very accepting of everyone, homosexual or not and he seems to have been raised in a type of environment where everyone should be loved and accepted. Also, not all Christian religion are against homsexuality.

    Quote examples:

    “There [were all these rumors] about how all the conservative, Christian people that would vote for me hate Adam and never want him to win because of who he is. Oh, it was so frustratingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ really bad, because we are really good friends. Why can’t everyone get along? It never made any sense for me to judge anyone, who they are. It frustrates me that people can’t get along with people because of their differences. And I’ll tell you what, especially Christians. Christians have a hard time accepting people like Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ liberal, from L.A., looks different, maybe acts a certain way. He’s a great, great guy. They don’t even give him a chance. And it’s frustrating because I come from that. A lot of my friends are not that way, which I appreciate, but a lot of people in Arkansas or in the South or wherever are that way. We really hope that our relationship can be an inspiration to people. I could go on about that forever.”

    ~*~

    “I would hope that, in society today, that people would accept Adam just as much as they would accept me. Because that’s kindof what the world is about, just accepting people and loving people. And I hope that that’s what me and Adam’s friendship has shown people, that no matter how different you are, that you can still love people and be friends with them.”

    ~*~

    “My parents always passed on love for other people. And no matter who they are or what they represent or just their beliefs or anything like that. Love for everyone. So, you know, I felt that’s kind of how me and Adam both did this competition, just you know, we fell in love with everyone. You know, me and Adam are great friends now. And you know, I think we were both happy for each other no matter what happened.”

  • Natasha

    I don’t know what church Kris comes from but they probably don’t approve of homosexuality. Most churches don’t but Kris and Adam seem to have forged a friendship anyway. Kris has never seemed anything but 100% sincere in his support of Adam and he doesn’t seem judgmental at all. Maybe that’s the difference.

  • a-lamb

    noctem seizure – If you think that homosexuality is morally wrong, then you are anti-gay. For me there is no middle ground on this issue.

    I sincerely doubt Kris has made a statement that could be perceived as homophobic. I’m not a Kris-fan either so I don’t have a lot of direct quotes from him about Adam, but I know that he and Adam are really good friends and that Adam has said that Kris is very liberal and that he wishes more people were like Kris. I also heard that Adam actually approached Kris’ dad and thanked him for how he raised Kris, because Kris was the first Christian he’d met who had not judged him.

    Just look at how Kris and Adam behave around each other. They’re obviously really close friends and are often openly affectionate. They often stand with their arms around each other and they hug pretty much all the time. If Kris was in some way against homosexuality I don’t think he’d be that comfortable showing affection with an openly gay man.

    I don’t think you can lump all evangelical Christians together. Maybe the ones who are like Kris – openminded and liberal – are few and far between but that doesn’t mean they don’t exist.

  • aek

    I know Danny’s preacher did that both times….yes. I thought it was wrong. He did call Adam a class act, though, but whatever.

    No, I read this from Kris’s preacher. I knew about the Danny preacher thing both times.

    As far as Kris’s comments……Danny actually said that he believed in accepting all people, too. But people latched onto the “belief” thing in his quote and forgot about the rest. Basically the same sentiment was given.

    Danny also said at a question and answer session in Milwaukee when someone asked him something about Jesus or some such…..he said that Jesus lived inside of him and that he accepts EVERYBODY. He also said in this session that he would never try to push his religeon on anyone.

  • unique28v

    Well, first, I dispute your terminology. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think Kris OR Danny would call themselves anti-gay. What I am pretty confident of is that both of them do not morally agree with homosexual relations.

    Yup.

    You are right noctem seizure. Churches teach that homosexuality is a sin. That is just a fact that cannot be disputed. “Love the sinner, but hate the sin”. I was in Catholic school from grade school all through high school, which is why I went to a big public university afterwards …. lol

    Anyways, you can still support and love someone, but disagree with their lifestyle. Parents do it all the time. This is one of those cases.

  • aek

    Just look at how Kris and Adam behave around each other. Theyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢re obviously really close friends and are often openly affectionate. They often stand with their arms around each other and they hug pretty much all the time. If Kris was in some way against homosexuality I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢d be that comfortable showing affection with an openly gay man.

    For the record, I have rewatched the entire season. Because of all this Danny hates gays stuff, I have scrutinized the body language between Danny and Adam.

    Danny openly reaches out to Adam to hug him. Adam reaches around Ryan when Danny finished his last song to give him a very big long hug. And after careful listening, it sounds as if Danny says to Adam, directly after he was voted off “I hope all your dreams come true, I hope you get everything you want.” I could be wrong, but that’s what it sounds like.

    As far as Kris goes, I get the feeling that he is not happy with the Danny hate either. He says that Danny is like a brother to him also, and that he is a great guy.

    I don’t agree with Danny’s beliefs at all, but they are what they are. (Of course I am assuming that I know what he believes here, and I guess that’s not really right) Evangelical christians don’t believe that gay sex is okay because the Bible says that. But with that said, I have seen absolutely no evidence that he treats Adam in any kind of disrepectful way and I truly think he likes him.

  • a-lamb

    Yup.

    You are right noctem seizure. Churches teach that homosexuality is a sin. That is just a fact that cannot be disputed. à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Love the sinner, but hate the sinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ . I was in Catholic school from grade school all through high school, which is why I went to a big public university afterwards à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦. lol

    Anyways, you can still support and love someone, but disagree with their lifestyle. Parents do it all the time. This is one of those cases.

    No.

  • revcat

    I don’t think it serves any purpose to try to get into Kris’s head regarding his religious beliefs. And it is not even necessary as has demonstrated his beliefs over and over: Love one another! That’s all I need to know! As for Danny, as Adam said (I’m paraphrasing) we agree to disagree. Don’t care for him, but why waste my time on him. I just don’t want any ugliness at the AI tour as my tickets weren’t cheap and I’m looking forward to seeing Adam, plus Allison and Kris (formerly indifferent to Kris, but the more I hear about him the more I respect him). GO KRADISON!

    :bye_tb:

  • linsav

    aek Jun 18th, 2009 at 10:50 pm

    lisav,

    Yeah, I agree about Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s church being à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“out thereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ , and is probably à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“crazierà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  than Krisà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s.

    But heck, all of it, even the mild methodist version I was brought up in, is à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“out thereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  to me. lol.

    Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m was just pointing out that I did read something where Krisà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s preacher seemed to think he would/should win AI because he was a good christian. Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s did the same, talking about favor would fall on Danny because he was a good christianà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦.whatever.

    Funny how these people think God gives a crap about American Idol.

    My mother was Missionary Baptist – that was bad in itself. I rebelled and became/married a Catholic and you would have thought I had grown another head. They even tried sort of an “intervention” but I quoted religion back to them and they finally left me alone. I am now pretty much Agnostic. But my mother’s church scared the bejesus out of me.

    I agree with your last sentence. LOL!

  • BestAI

    The Danny supporters seem to think this is all based on the one incident, the cousin/facebook thing. It isnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t. Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s remarks Danny has made before, such as the comcast interview and comments Adam has made. Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s minister sending those tweets out during the competition, there are way more than one incident that have people upset.
    Trying to take the blame off of Danny for what his cousin did is kinda not the point.
    Calling Danny socially awkward and clueless is the understatement of the year. Anyone who reaches the age of 28 and is as socially retarded as Danny is should not be in the public eye.
    I am not defending the twitter campaign, but for people to act so shocked about it and not realize it has been going on against Adam since the beginning of the season seems pretty hypocritical to me.

    ITA with everything you said. BTW, Danny is 29 (which doesn’t make it any better).

    The Twitter campaign wasn’t even necessarily Adam fans, but people who who were against the homophobic actions of Danny and his relatives. I seriously can’t believe people think Danny is in danger. People say many things sitting in front of their computers, and once they leave it, go about their usual lives.

    As far as Kris goes, Adam always has wonderful things to say about him. Adam did say that Kris’ beliefs were progressive, as did his dad about the Allen’s.

  • noctem seizure

    IF Kris totally embraces the teachings of his church with regards to homosexuality he has never said so, as far as I can recall. In fact I think it would be hard to find any quote where he refers to his church much at all.

    But, you’re making a mistake here. In the fundamentalists’ faith, it’s not about what “the church” teaches. There is no pope making proclamations or priesthood or any formal “intermediaries”, so to speak. There is the pastor, and people do meet in church, but the pastor doesn’t issue any specific “church-teachings”. The real authority is, as Danny, would say “The Word”.

    Kris has never seemed anything but 100% sincere in his support of Adam and he doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t seem judgmental at all. Maybe thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s the difference.

    I can almost predict what Kris’s explanation about this would be because I’m ultra-familiar with the “Sunday School answers” that are commonly given because this religion was part of my life for so long. He would say, “I can’t judge anyone. We are all sinners, and only God can judge us.” The fact that Kris is so “comfortable” around Adam to me just indicates that he is better than most at being true to this statement and living it out in practice.

    ETA: “‘””Where I live, most people are Baptist. Does this count as fundamentalism, because it sure seems like it.””””

    Yes, Baptists are fundies. Each denomination puts a different spin on minor doctrinal points (Baptists, not surprisingly are big on baptism), but I can tell you there is NO denomination within the Evangelical strain that does not consider homosexuality a sin. And for those that believe the Bible is 100% inerrant, there’s no way they could believe otherwise.

    I haven’t cracked a Bible in YEARS, but I think I have one packed away somewhere. And if I dug it out, I could find you chapter and verse where homosexuality is condemned.

  • chrgi

    noctem seizure- I am a Kris fan who’s probably read everything he’s said and there has been no such quote from him. I’m like 99% sure of it. In fact I’ve seen the exact opposite from him in various situations

    There [were all these rumors] about how all the conservative, Christian people that would vote for me hate Adam and never want him to win because of who he is. Oh, it was so frustratingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ really bad, because we are really good friends. Why can’t everyone get along? It never made any sense for me to judge anyone, who they are. It frustrates me that people can’t get along with people because of their differences. And I’ll tell you what, especially Christians. Christians have a hard time accepting people like Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ liberal, from L.A., looks different, maybe acts a certain way. He’s a great, great guy. They don’t even give him a chance. And it’s frustrating because I come from that. A lot of my friends are not that way, which I appreciate, but a lot of people in Arkansas or in the South or wherever are that way. We really hope that our relationship can be an inspiration to people. I could go on about that forever.

    Honestly, Danny Gokey is getting flack because of things he has actually said, not because someone jumped to a conclusion based on the church he attends. (I’m Catholic and pro-choice, pro-marriage equality, I’d hate to have anyone tell me that I’m otherwise). He had a lot of haters but no one thought he was homophobic until that myspace incident with Sarver. And it was only made worse by his Comcast comment. Being gay is a belief now?

    So in a nutshell? Quotes or it didn’t happen. ;)

  • http://twitter.com/cara_lee pj

    Well, first, I dispute your terminology. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think Kris OR Danny would call themselves anti-gay. What I am pretty confident of is that both of them do not morally agree with homosexual relations.

    Seriously, somebody find the quote! Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not a Kris fan, but Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m sure some site out there has logged every public statement heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s ever made since they discovered him on Idol. So bring over any statement he has ever made about Adam, and Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ll find the one Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m talking about and decipher the Evangelical code language.

    Other than that, I have no à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“proofà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ . But, I am VERY familiar with the faith background he comes from, and I know what their professed beliefs are.

    I’m late to this conversation, but its possible that people go to a certain church because it’s close and convenient. It’s also possible that they can interpret the Bible differently than the pastor at their church. I think it happens all the time (born and raised in the Bible Belt), and I have no reason to feel as if Kris is disingenuous in his attitude towards Adam. In fact, I remember he said that he thought Drake and Adam complimented each other and were a good pair. It’s also possible for people to grow when they experience life outside of their local “bubble.” That could have happened on his missionary trips, no matter the initial intent.

    Personally, I detect an openness in Kris that I don’t see in Danny. I am not going to project what he feels is a sin or not, because I don’t know his innermost thoughts. But I’m not going to stereotype him either.

  • a-lamb

    For the record, I have rewatched the entire season. Because of all this Danny hates gays stuff, I have scrutinized the body language between Danny and Adam.

    Danny openly reaches out to Adam to hug him. Adam reaches around Ryan when Danny finished his last song to give him a very big long hug. And after careful listening, it sounds as if Danny says to Adam, directly after he was voted off à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“I hope all your dreams come true, I hope you get everything you want.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  I could be wrong, but thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s what it sounds like.

    As far as Kris goes, I get the feeling that he is not happy with the Danny hate either. He says that Danny is like a brother to him also, and that he is a great guy.

    I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t agree with Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s beliefs at all, but they are what they are. (Of course I am assuming that I know what he believes here, and I guess thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s not really right) Evangelical christians donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t believe that gay sex is okay because the Bible says that. But with that said, I have seen absolutely no evidence that he treats Adam in any kind of disrepectful way and I truly think he likes him.

    Look, it’s quite possible that they all are really good friends and that Danny is very respectful towards Adam. But what Danny must realize is that he is a public figure now, and as a public figure he cannot make comments or statements that are going to offend entire groups of people. Kris and Adam may like Danny based on how he acts in private, but fans of the show are going to judge Danny based on how he acts in the public eye. Fact is that Danny has made several comments that could be perceived as homophobic, and people are going to respond to that.

    Also, Danny’s cousin actually said that Adam was upset about the whole picture thing, so obviously Danny has been disrespectful on at least one occasion. I don’t know if it was intended or if he was simply being his usual socially retarded self, but he was.

  • http://www.last.fm/user/RemusL/ RemusL

    You are right noctem seizure. Churches teach that homosexuality is a sin. That is just a fact that cannot be disputed.

    Well, this certainly can be disputed because it’s not true. Not all churches teach that homosexuality is a sin.

    Well, first, I dispute your terminology. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think Kris OR Danny would call themselves anti-gay. What I am pretty confident of is that both of them do not morally agree with homosexual relations.

    Other than that, I have no à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“proofà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ . But, I am VERY familiar with the faith background he comes from, and I know what their professed beliefs are.

    Unless Kris has actually stated he does not morally agree with homosexuality, I don’t see how you can make that conclusion.

    A lot of people go to church regularly but do not necessarily agree with every single official teaching of their church.

  • aek

    Also, Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin actually said that Adam was upset about the whole picture thing, so obviously Danny has been disrespectful on at least one occasion. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know if it was intended or if he was simply being his usual socially retarded self, but he was.

    Why is this being disrepectful, though? He didn’t necessarally know that Adam would get upset. Plus, without being there, we don’t really know how Adam reacted after the initial shock that the picture was out in public. I assumed when I saw it, (and this was before all of the hoopla, but on the same day), that Adam was just shocked that the pic was out there. I think if Adam was that upset about it he would have said something like, “No, Danny, I don’t think I’ll be signing that one.” I think Adam is a strong person, and I don’t for a second think that he is going to feel bullied by Danny Gokey into signing something.

    Instead, he signs it and says to Danny “you owe me.” This sounds playful to me.

    From all accounts Danny is a jokester, he goofs around alot. I really don’t think he was trying to be mean to Adam here. And I’m not sure that Adam took it so much as someone trying to be mean, as “oh shit, I need to go online and see what pics I left up.”

    Look, Adam may not like Danny. But from everything I’ve read Danny does like Adam. His praise of him is not generic, but rather specific. And if Adam doesn’t like Danny, he did a good job of hiding it on tv. Adam probably doesn’t like Danny’s religeous beliefs (if they are what I assume they are), and it may affect how close he feels to Danny. I can understand that. But he has said that Danny is a thinker and has a good heart. He also has said that they bonded. Beyond that, I don’t know.

  • aek

    Well, this certainly can be disputed because ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s not true. Not all churches teach that homosexuality is a sin.

    Most. But I would think that all fundalmendalist churches teach this.

  • lotus2012

    Why so many people despise Danny Gokey:
    Gokey was a semi-private person who lost his wife. Tragic!
    Now he has put himself in the spotlight. His face and words pop up all around us, from the Internet to television to wherever they sell magazines.
    What Gokey fails to realize is that hundreds of thousands of us have had the devastating and gut wrenching experience of losing our wives or husbands.
    We must and are moving on.
    Gokey repeatedly claims he à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹wants to do goodà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢.
    Well, thanks Gokey for incessantly talking about your dead wife, her favorite color, favorite song, etc. and ripping open our hearts all over again by bringing back the memories of OUR lost loved ones and THEIR tragic deaths.
    This egocentric turd does not realize how much pain he persists on inflicting with every TV interview, magazine article, radio interview, any public forum available.
    For us his face is now the equivalent of evil. A real sadist who apparently want us to suffer our losses over and over again.
    Someone please talk to this punk and tell him to shut the Fà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦ up!!!!!!

  • http://twitter.com/cara_lee pj

    I havenà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t cracked a Bible in YEARS, but I think I have one packed away somewhere. And if I dug it out, I could find you chapter and verse where homosexuality is condemned.

    Sure, but almost everything is condemned, such as eating pork and shellfish. I think there’s a little wiggle-room there. :smoke_tb:

  • a-lamb

    Why is this being disrepectful, though? He didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t necessarally know that Adam would get upset. Plus, without being there, we donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t really know how Adam reacted after the initial shock that the picture was out in public. I assumed when I saw it, (and this was before all of the hoopla, but on the same day), that Adam was just shocked that the pic was out there. I think if Adam was that upset about it he would have said something like, à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“No, Danny, I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ll be signing that one.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ 

    Instead, he signs it and says to Danny à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“you owe me.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  This sounds playful to me.

    From all accounts Danny is a jokester, he goofs around alot. I really donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think he was trying to be mean to Adam here. And Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not sure that Adam took it so much as someone trying to be mean, as à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“oh shit, I need to go online and see what pics I left up.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ 

    Look, Adam may not like Danny. But from everything Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve read Danny does like Adam. His praise of him is not generic, but rater specific. And if Adam doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t like Danny, he did a good job of hiding it on tv. Adam probably doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t like Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s religeous beliefs (if they are what I assume they are), and it may affect how close he feels to Danny. I can understand that. But he has said that Danny is a thinker and has a good heart. He also has said that they bonded. Beyond that, I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know.

    I’m saying it was disrespectful because he did it with no regard to Adam’s feelings about it, and because he insisted that Adam sign it even though he was obviously upset by it (he said “just sign it” when Adam protested). It may not have been intentional, but that is being disrespectful in my book.

    Like I said, Adam may like Danny because of how he acts in private, but people who don’t know them are going to judge Danny based on how he acts as a public figure. If you say something that people disagree with, they are going to respond. It’s how it works. If you can’t take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

  • ravengirl

    For what it’s worth, I got this tweet from Michael Sarver after I asked him what the bizz was among the idols at rehearsal today:

    I really don’t know what thats all about. All I know is that some people just love to hate and all we can do is pray for them.

    Whatevs.

  • aek

    and because he insisted that Adam sign it even though he was obviously upset by it (he said à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“just sign ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  when Adam protested). It may not have been intentional, but that is being disrespectful in my book.

    I still think I’d have to hear the tone of both guys’ comments before I would say Danny was being disrepectful. Everyone assumes they know the atmosphere that surrounded this whole situation, but we don’t.

    It could be that if we were there, we would be shocked at Danny’s actions, but it’s just as likely that we might think nothing of it. I wasn’t there, I can’t tell how they were relating to each other.

    Also, the cousin flat out insults Matt G., calling him stand offish. Danny says that he is closest to Matt. More proof that cousin’s views are NOT Danny’s views. But noone seems to care about poor Matt…lol. Somehow, I doubt Matt cares about what Danny’s cousin thinks either. Similarly Adam probably doesn’t care about her as well.

  • Susan M.

    @noctem seizure: I’ve run out of things to quote back (there are so many), but I will say I almost came unglued at your statements. I am an Adam fan to the core, but I feel I need to defend Kris here almost as much as I’ve ever defended Adam.

    I have read volumes of Kris interviews and responses, conscious and unconscious references and have witnessed every nuance of his behavior, before, after and throughout this competition and for you to equate him with Danny is OBSCENE (and incredibly lame). Kris has been exemplary in his behavior and said on multiple occasions he has NO ISSUE with Adam’s sexuality. He even took an interviewer to task for inferring that just because he was from Arkansas, he was conservative.

    Indirect quote: “Uh, I’m from the South, yes, conservative? NO.”

    Now, I do not care for Danny and have read the holier-than-thou, hypocritical, smarmy vibe from him from about the first month in (I liked him initially). I’m not saying I was right with this, but let me tell you, Danny has done just about everything to prove to me my instincts were dead on.

    Kris has been the model of tolerance, acceptance and love and has laughed in people’s faces for suggesting otherwise, whereas Danny has fed that flame.

    Is Danny a socially inept innocent or just a buffoon? I don’t know. I do know that a 23-year-old student from a town of 50,000 or whatever has absolutely run circles around a 29-year-old from Milwaukee à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ a very large city and adjacent to one of the great, (also extremely liberal) universities in this country, UW at Madison. Our excuses for him are getting more flimsy by the moment.

    The behavior of his cousin: DISGUSTING. His part? I tried to give him the benefit of the doubt, but I cannot anymore. There is no rational explanation for what he did (my reasoning is too lengthy to go into right now), but it is concrete.

  • revcat

    Well, thanks Gokey for incessantly talking about your dead wife, her favorite color, favorite song, etc. and ripping open our hearts all over again by bringing back the memories of OUR lost loved ones and THEIR tragic deaths.

    Wow, I never thought about it from that angle. Sorry Lotus2012. While I think that everyone deals with grief in their own way, I don’t think Danny was intentionally trying to hurt anyone by mentioning Sophia, but the AI show really did play up his back story. Some people think it was a big campaign designed to wind up with Danny and Adam battling it out in a “saint vs. sinner” controversial finale. I don’t really buy that, but then again, you never know, if true their plan backfired as did the Gokey cousin’s little stunt. I’m sure to this day she doesn’t think she did anything wrong. Danny is probably scratching his head too. He really is clueless. Mean? I’m not sure. I hope not. I don’t want any trouble on the tour for anyone, like someone upthread said its their last (Idol) hurrah.

  • noctem seizure

    There [were all these rumors] about how all the conservative, Christian people that would vote for me hate Adam and never want him to win because of who he is. Oh, it was so frustratingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ really bad, because we are really good friends. Why canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t everyone get along? It never made any sense for me to judge anyone, who they are. It frustrates me that people canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t get along with people because of their differences. And Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ll tell you what, especially Christians. Christians have a hard time accepting people like Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ liberal, from L.A., looks different, maybe acts a certain way. Heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a great, great guy. They donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t even give him a chance. And ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s frustrating because I come from that. A lot of my friends are not that way, which I appreciate, but a lot of people in Arkansas or in the South or wherever are that way. We really hope that our relationship can be an inspiration to people. I could go on about that forever.

    This quote doesn’t contradict what I’m saying at all. In a nutshell, he’s saying that he’s not going to judge Adam and we should all “show love” to each other. Oh and it is not uncommon at all for Christians to criticize other Christians for being judgmental of others. Trust me, when I spent my time in Christian circles, it’s an issue that came up about once a week!

    So in a nutshell? Quotes or it didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t happen. ;)

    I know what I heard. I just don’t remember the exact words. But, I heard it and read between the lines and knew exactly what he was saying.

    However, you’ve got a point in that many like yourself aren’t buying it unless you see the words in front of you. So I should shut up about it if I haven’t produced them.

    I haven’t tried to look for the quote yet, because honestly I don’t really care that much. However, I will spend a few minutes searching and see if I can come up with it.
    —————————————————————————————————————-

    As for Danny, I really don’t think he’s guilty of being anything here except being bad at public relations. He’s not a politician. He stumbled with his words, while trying to say he didn’t judge what others believe, but they shouldn’t judge what he believes. He phrased it poorly, and he got jumped on for it.

    And even in the thing with Sarver, I very seriously doubt that either one of them was thinking about Adam Lambert when that “incident” occured. It was just two awkward, churchy guys, one who was married and the other who was married, being uncomfortable with manly touching. I say this because I’ve seen uncomfortable “man-embraces” like that happen thousands of times in my years in church.

    To an extent, you could say there was a homophobic element there, but no more so than the majority of the male population have with regards to that kind of thing. The only difference was that they couched their uncomfortability in the reference language with which they both were familiar.

    Now, I don’t say this as a Danny fan. I could care less about him. Maybe, he goes around spray-painting “Die Fag!” on the walls of gay establishments. If I’m wrong, I’m wrong. But, I just think there’s been a bit of overreacting to these “controversies” and some reading into things that haven’t been there

  • Natasha

    Also, Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin actually said that Adam was upset about the whole picture thing, so obviously Danny has been disrespectful on at least one occasion. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know if it was intended or if he was simply being his usual socially retarded self, but he was.

    Why is this being disrepectful, though? He didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t necessarally know that Adam would get upset.

    Okay. Let’s say for the sake of argument he didn’t know it would upset Adam. The problem is that once it did upset Adam, Danny didn’t back off. He persisted. That’s disrespectful. It doesn’t seem natural either. If I said or did something that inadvertently upset someone first, I would be surprised and somewhat concerned or confused. Second, I would pull back and reassure the person that I didn’t mean to do that.

    The fact that Danny wasn’t surprised by Adam’s reaction and didn’t attempt in any way to back off actually indicates to me that he knew what Adam’s reaction would be. He knew he’d be upset. I’m not saying I’m 100% certain but that’s my interpretation of it.

  • terfra

    Just in addition to the previous comments.
    Yes, its possible to be a Christian and accept gay people. But the Christian faith teaches against homosexuality.
    As a Christian you can be a friend to a gay person but not in agreement to what a Christian views as a gay lifestyle.
    I don’t agree that makes someone hateful or homophobic.
    But thats the belief. You are taught to walk in love and respect others.

    Its like a parent that has a child who is gay. They accept them and love them, even if they don’t agree with it. That would be Danny’s thinking and beliefs no doubt. Probably Kris also.
    Kris was just more diplomatic.
    I believe Danny and Adam got along fine in spite of their differences.
    And I think the picture incident and twitter thing has been blown out of proportion and most likely is a different story than would be the truth. But thats what always happens on the internet.

  • cay

    I don’t think you have to agree with each other to be considered open, and be friends. I’ve never heard Kris say he agrees with the homosexual lifestyle. I do know his church that he attends is very much against it, and equates it with adultry and they even say it equates with much worse words. They believe being gay is a choice.

    However, Kris appears to me to be honestly open and accepting. That’s all that both sides should wish for. Each has a right to believe what they do. Kris may just feel that he has to live by his beliefs, but he can truly love and accept a “sinner” whereas Gokey comes across as not able to keep from judging Adam.

    But, I agree that in principle, Gokey and Kris are part of fundamental religion, and it is possible that Kris feels being Gay is a choice and is fundamentally wrong. I see that point. I’ve not heard otherwise so it is logical. But there are more important characteristics that make people accepting, tolerant, and truly chrisitian loving people. Kris exudes that. He’s a non-confrontational being. Danny doesn’t. BUT Kris was a bit cooler to me towards Adam today. He calls Danny his brother and is very close to him. He says he’ll be friends with Adam because they shared a common experience. But, they are extrememly different people, and I’ve never thought they’d hand out much after Idol. Kris is southern, and is a fundamental christian.

  • smartcookie

    Sure, but almost everything is condemned, such as eating pork and shellfish.

    And sleeping in the same room as a woman who has her period and mixing fibers and mixing milk and meat on the same plate, I think. We’d call it situational ethics if it were happening in real life instead of in the Bible. But that’s what strict constructionists generally do — pick the bits they like, and avoid stoning witches or having slaves or whatever they don’t like.

    I don’t think you can generalize across all evangelical churches, or for that matter, generalize that all big-on-Jesus churches are fundamentalist. I’ve got fundamentalist relatives, evangelical relatives and church-of-what’s-happening-now relatives (the megachurch things). I know for a fact that the latter group (specific to my relatives, not saying all megachurches) accepts gays, because my relatives were marching on behalf of a gay kid who was bullied at school after another kid from their congregation committed suicide. They all decided their heretofore-subtle support of gay kids needed to be more overt. And not in a “let’s pray the gay out of him” way. In a “we love him the way he is” way. If I had been stereotyping this particular family based on their church before that, I didn’t after.

    Kris may very well not be defining anything based on sin. I was raised Methodist and then got involved in “Youth for Christ” because it was the cool thing to do in high school, and we certainly never talked about sin.

  • a-lamb

    I still think Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢d have to hear the tone of both guysà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ comments before I would say Danny was being disrepectful. Everyone assumes they know the atmosphere that surrounded this whole situation, but we donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t.

    It could be that if we were there, we would be shocked at Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s actions, but ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s just as likely that we might think nothing of it. I wasnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t there, I canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t tell how they were relating to each other.

    Also, the cousin flat out insults Matt G., calling him stand offish. Danny says that he is closest to Matt. More proof that cousinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s views are NOT Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s views. But noone seems to care about poor Mattà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦lol. Somehow, I doubt Matt cares about what Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin thinks either. Similarly Adam probably doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t care about her as well.

    I think Adam’s face in that picture says it all. He looked upset, Danny’s cousin said that he was upset, so it makes me think that he probably was upset. I don’t think he’d be all “what the f*ck” to Danny (which according to the cousin is what he said) if he was cool with it.

    To be honest, even if Adam has brushed it off and was cool with it, I still wouldn’t be. This was not an isolated incident, and I would want to speak out against homophobia regardless.

    Well, that Matt comment was completely rude, but that really had nothing to do with Danny. Danny was involved with the whole picture thing. I sincerely doubt Adam cares what anyone thinks about him, and certainly not Danny’s cousin.

  • http://twitter.com/cara_lee pj

    Okay. Letà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s say for the sake of argument he didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know it would upset Adam. The problem is that once it did upset Adam, Danny didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t back off. He persisted. Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s disrespectful. It doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t seem natural either. If I said or did something that inadvertently upset someone first, I would be surprised and somewhat concerned or confused. Second, I would pull back and reassure the person that I didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t mean to do that.

    The fact that Danny wasnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t surprised by Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s reaction and didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t attempt in any way to back off actually indicates to me that he knew what Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s reaction would be. He knew heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢d be upset. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not saying Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m 100% certain but thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s my interpretation of it.

    The problem is that it seems Adam had no idea that the pic was even out there at that point and Danny asked him to sign it very publicly. Adam was put in a terrible situation, and if Gokey had any human decency or empathy, he would have said something to Adam about it in private. I have no idea what is in Danny’s heart, so I can only comment on the information that is available and I’m not impressed. At best, he’s clueless and self-involved. Sorry, I can’t give him a pass for that. I have tried over and again to feel sympathy for him, and I’m done.

    That said, I would never send him a tweet or participate in that stupidity. I’ll just comment here and let it be. ;-)

  • a-lamb

    noctem seizure – To be honest, I think you’re being a little judgmental. You’re assuming you know how Kris feels based on your own experiences with Kris’ religion.

    You have no way of knowing how Kris feels about homosexuality, so please don’t act like you do.

  • chrgi

    I don’t know maybe I’m reading into what I think is being said between the lines. I dunno somehow Kris asking things like “how come Adam can’t be the guy next door”, says different things than Gokey’s ramble about accepting their “beliefs”.

    But of course, I could be reading too much into it after all.

  • noctem seizure

    Sure, but almost everything is condemned, such as eating pork and shellfish. I think thereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a little wiggle-room there.

    You get points for making me laugh! But, we are talking about the difference between the Old Testament and the New Testament.

    As to why that’s a critically important distinction, I’m too tired to go into an explanation about the theology of a faith I’m not sure how much I subscribe to it anymore. Is there a such thing a such thing as an Agnostic Evangelical? Because I think that’s the term I would use right now to classify myself….

    ETA: “”””I was raised Methodist””””

    Methodism is what is termed a “mainline Protestant denomination”. They do not fall under the Evangelical umbrella, and many mainline churches do not condemn homosexuality. As for YFC, I’m not familiar with that organization so I can’t comment on it.

  • Susan M.

    First of all, I do not believe all Christian denominations teach against homosexuality. Um, many “Christian” denominations actually teach in the spirit of their namesake à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’ Christ (freaky, I know). But if you want to tell yourselves that Jesus would advocate hate in any way, shape or form, knock yourselves out.

    Why I think that photo was hijacking Adam: Now, I know Adam is a rarity in that he is fearless and seems to be unabashed about anything. Even so, there is such a thing as context and Adam is NO IDIOT; he knew it was a setup.

    I went to Mardi Gras a few years ago at the pleading of one of my friends. My dad had died a few months before and I was devastated. I told myself, if I’m going to go, I’m going to get into the spirit of things. I’m not holding back. Now, did I do the “usual” Mardi Gras things? Barely. Compared to 90 percent of those there, I was rating PG-13 (max!). However, my friend who I was with (who lives in India) told me to post our Mardi Gras photos on Facebook and I said, “There’s not a chance in hell.”

    Again, my photos are somewhat mild, but quite risque for me. If I had a friend or co-worker suddenly present a blown up version to me and say, “Sign this.” As if it were representative of who I was? I would KNOW that was a set-up. BIG TIME! Adam, who is unapologetic about anything, had to know he was being mocked. And Danny’s a F*CK for playing along.

  • lotus2012

    revcat
    Gokey desperately needs a good PR person and a grief counselor.
    He has a good voice and wants to use it to further causes close to his heart. His religion, his dead wife and maybe more. Nothing to despise there. However, he should make a good album first, set up real foundation with a clear statement and mission (he hasn’t to date; the address of his ‘foundation’ is the same as his church).
    Then, as an established artist and celebrity he can choose to announce how his earnings are distributed. His begging is despicable, why not campaign for the American Heart Association?
    This is not about the AI show any longer. Just 2 days ago he participated in a ‘live chat’ with fans on comcast.net.
    I started following it to see if he has learned anything from the negative vibe surrounding him from many bloggers and other media, as he has a right to succeed like any of us.
    No such luck. Right out of the gate it’s the dead wife and more dead wife stuff. DONE. I don’t know if he talked about his religion again but who cares. He should be talking about his music and all the other wonderful things life has to offer. That is how you make and keep fans.

  • aek

    Sure, but almost everything is condemned, such as eating pork and shellfish. I think thereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a little wiggle-room there.

    Points for making me laugh! But, we are talking about the difference between the Old Testament and the New Testament.

    Yeah, I figured it had to do with the old testament versus the new testament, but it’s been so long since I cracked open a Bible that I wasn’t 100% sure that I was right.

    I do remember talking to my Mom when I was a little kid about the whole pork thing, and I remembered her saying to me “but that’s in the old testament” so basically it doesn’t really count.

    Supposedly the fundies live by the teachings of Jesus? Which is the New Testament? Am I right?

    I’m agnostic too. Haven’t been to church since 1988.

  • revcat

    He should be talking about his music and all the other wonderful things life has to offer. That is how you make and keep fans.

    I totally agree lotus2012.

  • smartcookie

    I don’t think any of us need to have someone else explain evangelicalism to us, whether you’ve lived with it for 24 years or a hundred. Everybody is different, and their faith is different, as well as the way they express it. There is no one standard evangelical anymore than there is one standard gay person. My sister is evangelical and crazy and thinks Catholics are going straight to hell. My s-i-l is evangelical and in divinity school right now and she definitely does NOT think homosexuality is a sin. She also does good works for the sake of good works, not to proselytize (I have no idea if I spelled that right — I’m am atheist) and truly believes that people have a right to be whoever they were born to be and that the rest of us should try to help them if we can. Like Kris, working with AIDS in Africa, she has also worked with AIDS patients.

    Based on Kris saying that he was flattered that Adam found him attractive, that he thought Adam and his current bf (or date or whatever) were a really good match and good together, that he was very offended when anybody tried to turn the finale into a culture war, and even Katy saying “We love Adam” when a paparazzi tried to get her to say something rude about him… That tells me their faith is strong and personal and they do not in any way think that there is anything wrong or sinful or anything else about homosexuality. There is no way Kris would say that Adam Drake is a good match if he thought it was wrong.

    All I have to say about “He’s from the south, he’s Christian, he must be intolerant by virtue of his Christianity” is — look at Jimmy Carter.

    ETA: I am well aware, since I was raised Methodist, that it is not evangelical. I was speaking about specific OTHER people who are related to me who are in evangelical churches. I’m also related to a lovely Mennonite (don’t know if they’re evangelical or not), a minister from the Church of the Brethren (peace is their big deal), a boatload of Jewish people, and some people who go to a Dutch Reformed Church, whatever that is. There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

  • Natasha

    At best, heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s clueless and self-involved. Sorry, I canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t give him a pass for that. I have tried over and again to feel sympathy for him, and Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m done.

    I agree with you. And if that’s what he is at best what is he at worst? At worst this was a really mean-spirited stunt that was designed to embarrass and upset someone.

    Doesn’t say much for Danny. I don’t have any sympathy for him or his cousin.

  • revcat

    Thank you smartcookie! :smile2_ee:

  • Susan M.

    Smartcookie: I’ve been thinking this on multiple occasions and haven’t said it … you’re one smart cookie.
    :clap_tb:

  • aek

    Sorry. I doubt that any of you have read the sheer amount of information on Danny that I have. You only know these bits and pieces that are looked at from an already negative view of him.

    I don’t agree with what I assume are Danny’s religeous beliefs, but you will never convince me (unless true evidence is shown, not assumptions) that he did any of this in a meanspirited way. I do not believe he was trying to be hurtful to Adam. Perhaps Adam was hurt (I’m not convinced, but maybe). I still don’t think that Danny meant it that way.

    From everything I have read and seen, and from everyone who has said anything about him, I do not find him to be a meanspirited person.

    I know many of you will disagree. Heck, the other day people were bashing him like crazy for saying he was bored. That kind of tells you the lens through which many are viewing Danny’s part in this incident.

  • JosieX

    aek, you are in good company, if I do say so myself. ;)

  • noctem seizure

    Based on Kris saying that he was flattered that Adam found him attractive, that he thought Adam and his current bf (or date or whatever) were a really good match and good together, that he was very offended when anybody tried to turn the finale into a culture war, and even Katy saying à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“We love Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  when a paparazzi tried to get her to say something rude about himà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦ That tells me their faith is strong and personal and they do not in any way think that there is anything wrong or sinful or anything else about homosexuality. There is no way Kris would say that Adam Drake is a good match if he thought it was wrong.

    I disagree with your assessment. But, I respect your opinion.

    I’ve spent a little time searching for the quote that I know is out there, but the Internet is a big place. I’m tempted to just paraphrase, but as strongly as some have expressed their feelings about what I’ve been saying, I know I need to have the statement verbatim. So, unless I can locate it, I will have nothing more to say about this.

    (Of course, it does occur to me that there’s a simple way to resolve this. Some of you who are fans of this season’s Idols are probably going to see the Idol tour before and also the meet-and-greets. So this summer, when you meet Kris, ask him directly to his face whether he believes homosexual relations are immoral/ sinful or whatever wording you choose. That should settle it pretty clearly.)

    ETA: From some of the things I’m reading in this thread, it appears there has been a bit of “loosening” of the term Evangelical. Perhaps I’ve been away from the scene for too long. Then again, in my experience not eveybody who calls themselves a “Christian” agrees that every one else who calls themselves a Christian actually is one. I imagine that may be true even within the Evangelical set too or it may be gradually becoming true, anyway.

  • twinkle

    amen Smartcookie!

    just like there are cafeteria catholics, i think there are cafeteria evangelicals. must we put everyone in a box and assume they encompass everything typically ascribed to that box?

    if kris really felt, deep down, that homosexuality was a sin i really dont think he would react with the humor, comfort and love that he has when it comes to questions about adam’s sexuality or adam thinking he was attractive.

    we argued that adam shouldn’t have had to SAY “i’m gay” because he was living it. why, now, should we insist that kris SAY “i’m not anti-gay” when HE is living it.

  • Natasha

    That kind of tells you the lens through which many are viewing Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s part in this incident.

    Everyone has to make up their own mind as to what is or isn’t acceptable behavior but I think the lens Danny is viewing things through is the one that needs some adjusting.

  • Kirsten

    The problem is that it seems Adam had no idea that the pic was even out there at that point

    I just want to clarify the timing of all these events because I’ve read various claims in this thread (and I’m just quoting this quote as a jumping off point):

    Jan 2, 2009 – VFTW publishes the picture of Adam in green (prior to the series even beginning).

    Jan 20, 2009 – Adam Lambert’s Audition Airs

    Feb 25, 2009 – Adam’s Semi-Final Round (Round 2)

    March 2, 2009 – Photos leak of Adam at Burning Man and kissing

    March 10, 2009 – Top 13 (Finals start)

    April 7, 2009 – Bill O’Reilly Does his first segment on Adam Lambert (according to Idoltary, Adam knows by at least this point that the pictures were out. I guess he doesn’t read MJs).

    April 8, 2009 – Top 8 boot night (and likely the night that autograph-gate occured).

    So, the “green” picture was not in the batch that caused the BOR controversy, but the party did coincide with BOR, so I would guess that either Gokey has a bad sense of humour (as evidenced by Impersonate-Goat-Gate) or he was being malicious (if it was he who printed out the photo) or [insert favourite theory]. Adds another dimension to things.

  • a-lamb

    aek – Look, don’t assume that I’m being hard on Danny because I just generally don’t like him. That is not it at all. I used to feel sorry for him because he’s so socially incompetent, but not anymore. I have found many of his comments to be homophobic, and that is not something I am willing to tolerate. He’s implied that love between two men is wrong, he’s said that being gay is a “belief” and that he disagrees with it, and he played that terrible joke on Adam.

    I’m sure he’s a very nice person, but I’m not about to overlook obvious homophobic remarks because of that. There are some things you can’t make excuses for.

  • Susan M.

    aek, that’s great if you’ve found that with Danny. As I may have said before, I liked Danny initially. And I’ve REALLY tried to give him the benefit of the doubt and have felt bad for him when he was being bashed. But I’m sorry, it’s long past that. These things rarely come out of nowhere and I think his biggest crime (as Kristen Baldwin said), is his complete lack of self-awareness.

    And again going back to “Idolatry,” Slezak and co. admitted they were wrong with Scott, Matt, Anoop and Adam. Why? They were hard on them at first impression, but their characters ultimately proved otherwise. Why does Danny continue to flounder (and I use that term generously)? Because the dude has issues. Now, as a media professional, I’d try to pinpoint what it was exactly (and believe me, I have my own opinions) but he is NOT coming across as likable, sincere or genuine to the general public and he continues to dig himself in deeper.

    I’ve never in my life used the “D” word, but with Danny, I can so get the definition.

  • lotus2012

    aek
    From everything I have read and seen, and from everyone who has said anything about him, I do not find him to be a meanspirited person.

    Below MJ quoting Danny:

    Yes. I accept gay people, but people have to accept my beliefs,à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  Danny said. à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“We have to accept their beliefs, but they have to accept my beliefs. We agree to disagree. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t judge people, but at the same time, if they believe in what they believe, they have to accept me and what I believe. But I accept anybody as they come. Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s my character and my personality.

    What?

    Danny is his own worst enemy. Is this an adult talking, or a 6 year old who’s Mommy just told him that Santa Claus is not real??????

  • CindyM

    This whole thing makes me sad. I’m not going to judge Danny, I don’t know his mind or his intent. Adam has said nice things about Danny and I assume he knows more than I do. The cousin? Direct proof that she’s an asshole and a bigot. Her dad, the other relatives further proof of some Gokey family assholery. In looking at those pictures and reading those comments made by Danny’s family, I just kept remembering the story by Richard Rushfield of the LA Times after attending Matt’s Top 7 save dinner. This would have been 1 week after this incident as Scott went out in 8th place. Here’s the part I keep thinking of when I see Adam’s face in that picture:

    On learning to deal with harsh comments, which Lambert admits he has seen while surfing the Internet, he said, à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“About the judgment and the criticism, personally I’ve been made fun of my whole life. So I just kind of go, ‘OK. Smile and nod.’ To me I know I’ve figured out how to not take it too personally, and I think that we’re all kind of figuring that out.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ 

    If Gokey in person projects greater intensity than he does on stage, Lambert on the other hand seems much more soft-spoken and vulnerable than his fearless, wild, stage persona, giving off a much gentler self-assurance than his bold strokes on stage suggest. He continued on his methods of dealing with the critics, à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“You just put your force field up. It’s kind of mind over matter. It comes with the territory. “

    When I initially read that quote, all I could think was that it SHOULDN’T come with the territory. People should be better than that. That they aren’t, makes me extremely sad.

  • Cakenbake

    I know this might surprise people but I don’t think Danny Gokey friends and family are Conservatives.

    Maybe religiously, but I don’t think that they are Conservatives. Gokey’s family looks like a typical labor union middle class blue collar family and their family and friends are black and Latinos.

    …and just like in California many black and Latinos and Labor union middle class families who consider themselves Liberal voted Yes on Prop 8. Many in some of the communities can be extremely narrow minded like in other groups. I know some personally who voted for Barack Obama, but when it comes to Gay people they can be pretty narrow minded and some can be down right mean to them and voted for Prop. 8.

    Many people thought that because Kris was from the South and from a religious background that he would be narrow minded, but he has proven that to not be the case. Meanwhile Danny’s family is mixed with friends and family members who are African-American and Latino, working class labor union people. Who probably have not been around Gay people.

    Sometimes we can’t tell a book by it’s cover.

  • lotus2012

    Very interesting and civil discourse about religion.
    All the controversy about Gokey caused me to do some research on Christianity from ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s inception. What baffled me the most is the construction of the New Testament. The gospels that were arbitrarily included and excluded from the New Testament.
    Amazing how people who lived in hovels without plumbing and thought the earth was flat à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹rememberedà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ exactly what Jesus said and what God wanted us to do and think. Some real Mensa material slipped in thereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦Ãƒ ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦ Hah.
    If Gokey finds guidance and comfort from the teachings of his particular church, good for him. However, he should not assume that ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s his duty to share all the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹truthà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ they teach there. That is NOT OK.

    Albert Einstein:
    A knowledge of the existence of something we cannot penetrate, of the manifestations of the profoundest reason and the most radiant beauty – it is this knowledge and this emotion that constitute the truly religious attitude; in this sense, and this alone, I am a deeply religious man.

  • cookcricket

    Sorry, I just had to drop by for one (or two) comments.

    All I have to say about à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s from the south, heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Christian, he must be intolerant by virtue of his Christianityà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  is à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’  look at Jimmy Carter.

    Bill Clinton anyone? I believe if asked, he’d respond that he’s a Christian. Where’s he from? Oh yeah-Arkansas.

    noctem: it’s okay if you don’t like Kris. Everyone’s entitled to their likes and dislikes.

  • lotus2012

    CindyM
    This whole thing makes me sad.
    My sentiments exactly and thanks for the quote from Adam:

    -On learning to deal with harsh comments, which Lambert admits he has seen while surfing the Internet, he said, à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“About the judgment and the criticism, personally Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve been made fun of my whole life. So I just kind of go, à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹OK. Smile and nod.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ To me I know Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve figured out how to not take it too personally, and I think that weà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢re all kind of figuring that out.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  -

    From other interviews and direct quotes from this phenomally talented, charismatic and articulate person, Adam also has learned how to strike back and wink at the same time. Love it!

  • wand3rful

    What Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not clear on is why Danny is catching so much flack for saying essentially the exact same thing that Kris did about Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s homosexuality. I wish I could find the exact quote, but I remember thinking wow, Kris is going to catch backlash. But, amazingly nobody said a peep about it.

    as a kris fan who (sadly….hiding face in shame) has read every fking interview and seen every clip out there of the boy….ummm, what are you talking about? lolz . nothing he has said has been close to danny’s words/quotes..and adam/lamberts remarks that the allens are “progressive” dont jive with this assertion you are making. to each his own, you are entitled to an opinion…but im curious if about this “quote”. at the end of the day, we all read into body language and quotes differently, but this a big giant azz leap to clump danny and kris together based on something you thought you heard but really cant recall (specifics).

    and regarding this talk of homosexuality in churches and what is considered a sin….this day and age, people are selective about what they take from church and the bible. they dont take the Word/Book/the Pastor literally….its 2009. proud to say, we have progressed.

  • isisdagmar

    All I have to say about à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s from the south, heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Christian, he must be intolerant by virtue of his Christianityà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  is à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬’  look at Jimmy Carter.

    This. Kris is what a Christian should be, and as a Christian, I love seeing someone like him in the public square instead of horrendous, pathetic excuses for human beings like Falwell, Bush, etc.

    Lil didn’t get as much focus on her religion, but I am pretty sure that she has said that she is a Christian–if so, based on what she has said about Adam and what he has said about her, she is also a good example of a true Christian.

    And to echo Wand3rful–Kris has never said anything remotely like what Danny has said. Between Adam’s comments about Kris’ open-mindedness and Kris’ own statement that he is liberal and dislikes Christians who have problems with people like Adam, I am pretty sure that Kris supports gay marriage and other gay rights–as many Christians (myself included) do and as all should.

  • wand3rful

    danny is entitled to his opinion on homosexuality….you cannot fault that. you have to respect it (to some degree). truth be told, there are a lot of people in the world that agree with his view. just as there are people that still dont agree w. inter-racial marriages ( i know, random point). look, as long as it doesnt cause harm/pain to others, we are all entitled to our beliefs/opinions….i just hope that in time, we can look at a gay person w.out labeling them “gay” or giving a fk about who they go home to.

    ok, here are my issues:

    1) Danny didnt speak out against this incident to say it didnt reflect him and that he’s sorry if it offended adam and others. just man up about it. fk, if my family or friends did something of this nature, i would have the courage to apologize for making things awkward. its what adults do, they step up to a messy situation and take control.

    2) the godly incident was handled poorly. he is a grown man, he saw the reaction. he could have easily posted on twitter that it came off the wrong way, and his way of speaking shouldnt offend folks. something a bit real and human. look at sarver’s reaction to it…man, his “apology” was almost as offensive/bad as the actual comment itself lol

    3) as someone posted earlier, if those comments were directed at Lil’ and her skin color…holy crap. this would not be acceptable or funny by any means…thus it saddens me that when homosexuality is at the center of crude remarks, its okay or it gets a pass. even more reason for danny to speak out against it.

    having said ALL that, i am bothered by this “eye for an eye” BS these fanatics are suggesting….its very aggressive and i do not agree w. the lynch mob mentality. i see no point in attacking danny. just let the guy know you are upset/ disappointed and move on. and maybe suggest he gets a new family, cuz these folks are NOT doing him any favors

    in life, you can only teach with love, not hate (i cannot believe im typing this shyt….but honestly, its true! LOL). oh, danny boy….

  • Cakenbake

    People are aware that Scott, Lil and Matt are also practicing Christians and sing Christian music. Kris is a Christian also. Not every Christian is narrow minded. It depends on the church they go to. Many churches have different teachings then others so people can’t classify every church or Christian the same.

  • Cakenbake

    Bill Clinton anyone? I believe if asked, heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢d respond that heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a Christian. Whereà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s he from? Oh yeah-Arkansas.

    Good point.

  • lostinidol

    Yes. I accept gay people, but people have to accept my beliefs,à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  Danny said. à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“We have to accept their beliefs, but they have to accept my beliefs. We agree to disagree. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t judge people, but at the same time, if they believe in what they believe, they have to accept me and what I believe. But I accept anybody as they come. Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s my character and my personality.

    Danny is his own worst enemy. Is this an adult talking, or a 6 year old whoà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Mommy just told him that Santa Claus is not real??????

    Aren’t Danny’s comments quite similar to the former Miss California’s rant about her right to express her opinion on this issue. This stuff must come directly out of the homophobic’s handbook for passing themselves off as non-judgmental in a liberal society.

    I guess we all should breath a sigh of relief that Danny accepts gay people since the alternative is stoning them with the stack of Bibles he always seems to be standing on.

  • wand3rful

    The girlà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s account was turned from public to private after the fact.

    oops, im soo late to the discussion, so pardon my multiple posts….

    as of last week, facebook has lifted the privacy setttings of multiple accounts. not sure what happened, but depending on earlier settings, you are now able to access certain accounts (ok, i admit at looking at/cyber stalking an ex..lol).

    the “update header/ie what im doing right now” is normally visible only to friends thus when i saw more of them pop up, i realized that now those folks have open/public accounts. this is very recent.

    anyhoo, this makes sense as to why her pics were initially private, then recently made public, then back to private. hope this clears up the confusion. and if you have a facebook account, double check it!

  • JosieX

    If Gokey finds guidance and comfort from the teachings of his particular church, good for him. However, he should not assume that ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s his duty to share all the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹truthà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ they teach there. That is NOT OK.

    aek addressed this earlier. In a hometown meeting with fans, a man asked Danny what his faith in Jesus meant to him. Danny said it meant everything to him but he never wanted to push it on anyone else. He said he felt that he carried Jesus’ love within him and it does not exclude ANYONE (emphasis his). Danny has answered questions that were put to him but I have not seen him pushing it on anyone and I haven’t heard anyone say that he has. In Adam’s RS interview, it appeared to me that he pretty clearly said that Danny did not push his beliefs on him.

    What Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not clear on is why Danny is catching so much flack for saying essentially the exact same thing that Kris did about Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s homosexuality. I wish I could find the exact quote, but I remember thinking wow, Kris is going to catch backlash. But, amazingly nobody said a peep about it.

    I had the “wonder if he’ll get a backlash” thought when Kris said that he thought that people would overlook Adam’s being gay.

    Someone upthread said something about noctem disliking Kris. I don’t pick that up at all. I think similarly to how he seems to, that people really don’t need to work so hard to distance Kris from his religion. It’s not necessary. The fundamental precepts of Christianity cover this pretty thoroughly I think. Jesus didn’t say to love your neighbor as yourself…oh, unless they’re gay. Since we’re doing a lot of speculating, I’ll speculate too and say that I think that Kris and his family probably feel that Adam’s path in life is for him to work out and their path in life is to love and cherish him as a dear friend. Danny has likewise said that he doesn’t judge and accepts people as they come. I don’t get the sense that either of them feel that it is their place to judge Adam or anyone else. That doesn’t mean that they don’t each have their own set of ideals based on their religion. I might not agree with some of theirs and they might not agree with some of mine, but that doesn’t mean that I don’t respect and feel affection for them. And I’m quite sure they’d like me too despite my wicked ways, if they knew me. ;)

  • lotus2012

    “If Gokey finds guidance and comfort from the teachings of his particular church, good for him. However, he should not assume that ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s his duty to share all the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹truthà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ they teach there. That is NOT OK.

    aek addressed this earlier. In a hometown meeting with fans, a man asked Danny what his faith in Jesus meant to him. Danny said it meant everything to him but he never wanted to push it on anyone else. He said he felt that he carried Jesusà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ love within him and it does not exclude ANYONE (emphasis his). Danny has answered questions that were put to him but I have not seen him pushing it on anyone and I havenà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t heard anyone say that he has. In Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s RS interview, it appeared to me that he pretty clearly said that Danny did not push his beliefs on him.”

    Gokey’s church does tell members that it is their duty to save people from ‘spiritual darkness’ and spread ‘The Word’.

    From RS article:
    Danny Gokey, a worship director from Milwaukee, was not quite as progressive as Allen, and Lambert says they discussed religion a few times. ” Danny is by the book, and the book is the Word,” he says diplomatically. “And I respect that. Just don’t try to push it on me, and we’re cool.”

    Sounds to me that Adam politely and respectfully had to stop Gokey, otherwise Adam would not be cool with him.

  • toonah

    He said he felt that he carried Jesusà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ love within him and it does not exclude ANYONE (emphasis his).

    You know, your arguments sound a lot like what one of Danny’s fans on IDFposted last night:

    “I’m glad you don’t condemn Danny, but I do want to tell you that I am personally ant-gay, save-the-sinner. Those are two requirements to be a true Christian (no offence intended but this is my sect’s laws.)

    I am proud of Danny Gokey wherever he stands, but just a quick thing, if you think his church bashes homosexuality my church is far more so. Gays are not allowed through the doors, gays are not allowed contact with any of our children.

    But just let me get somethings straight with you, my sect loves everyone, from Al Qaida to NeoNazis, even though we highly condemn their practices. Gays are the same to us, another group that is very confused and needs help, and we are willing to give it. Now that I am an adult I am considered mature enough to talk and evangelize to gays. I know homosexuals I’ve made it clear to them where I stand, and they appreciate that I am forward with them and they enjoy that I have an opinion. I am still friends with them and I care for them dearly. I try very hard not to be offensive, but if being nonoffensive gets in the way of my beliefs, the beliefs take precedence.
    I find most gays as more intolerant of me than I am of them. The gays who I do befriend are at least curteous enough to say I have a right to an opinion.”

    You’ll notice that he too does not exclude anyone, not NeoNazis or Al Qaeda or gays. And he considers all three equally evil. If you’re arguing that that sort of ‘inclusion’ is acceptable, then there’s no point in talking to you.

  • isisdagmar

    Toonah: Any Christian who believes what you describe above is a bigot and understands nothing of Jesus. I mean, I have some pretty conservative cousins who don’t support gay marriage and even they would never dream of equating gay people with neo-Nazis. And anyone who would believe such a thing clearly hasn’t read the Bible or hasn’t understood it.

    I hate that such beliefs still exist–beliefs that are so contrary to everything Jesus was about and that are simply and obviously wrong no matter what your religious persuasion. People are entitled to their own opinions, yes, but the difference is that these people’s beliefs are affecting other people’s lives–people like Adam, like all of our gay friends and family members, are made to feel like second-class citizens, are not allowed to get married or enjoy any of the many other benefits that straight people receive, and their emotional well-being and their physical safety is constantly under siege in a society whose laws point to them and say, “Those people are different from you, and they are inferior to you.” People do not hold their beliefs in a vacuum. Good people like Adam suffer, truly suffer, because of beliefs like the ones displayed in the comments on those photographs.

    This breaks my heart. I am a (straight) Christian, and it is difficult to imagine anything more unchristian than this. And while people are allowed to privately believe whatever they wish to believe, they have no right to inflict those private beliefs on their fellow citizens in the form of public policy, any more than racists had the right to keep black people from marrying white people or sexists had the right to keep women out of the workplace and shackled to their husbands. There are issues over which there can be debates in which both sides hold potentially valid opinions–and then there are matters of human dignity. This is the latter.

  • lotus2012

    toonah
    Ouch! You read that post and did not throw up?

    Gokey’s church is really quite endearing. Everyone is welcome.

    They joyously proclaim that anyone who doesn’t agree with their teachings will not go to their wonderful Heaven.

    That means that billions of people around the world will be tumbling in their perception of the various layers of Hell.

    If that is not true love and a call for peace, what is?

  • JosieX

    “He said he felt that he carried Jesusà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ love within him and it does not exclude ANYONE (emphasis his).”

    You know, your arguments sound a lot like what one of Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s fans on IDFposted last night

    What you quoted is not my argument, it is what Danny said.

    I don’t post on IDF, but I went over there to check it out. I think what you quoted from there must be from the 18 year old troubled kid who just apologized on Danny’s forum. He confided that it’s hard for him to like gay people because he was assaulted by a gay man when he was a kid. I’m not sure what his problem is and I hope he gets help.

    As I stated earlier in the thread, I am not a religious person. I am not very interested in religion and certainly not interested in arguing about it. You can dig up all kinds of outrageous statements from purported Christians if you like. If you are frustrated that they do not persuade me that the failure of these people to live up to the religion that they claim to practice tarnishes the fundamental tenets of that religion, then you are indeed correct that there is no point in talking to me.

  • isisdagmar

    I had the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“wonder if heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ll get a backlashà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  thought when Kris said that he thought that people would overlook Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s being gay.

    JosieX: I don’t think anyone thought anything about this statement because Adam used exactly the same phrase in his recent AH interview: when asked about the pictures, he literally said, “I think people were willing to overlook it.” I would be very surprised if Kris didn’t support gay rights and gay marriage or had any issue with homosexuality at all.

    He said he felt that he carried Jesusà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ love within him and it does not exclude ANYONE (emphasis his). Danny has answered questions that were put to him but I have not seen him push it on anyone and I havenà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t heard anyone say that he has.

    People who believe what Danny does are the kind of people who voted for Prop 8 in California and made it impossible for gay people to get married. I don’t think that Danny is evil or anything, but he is misguided and people who believe like he does do push their beliefs onto their fellow citizens by legally curtailing their rights. They exclude their fellow citizens from the institution of marriage, and from enjoying a huge number of other benefits and protections granted to straight people. Whatever they may or may not verbally say, that is what they do. And to me, saying that you don’t exclude anyone from Jesus’ love doesn’t compute with deeming that person unworthy of being included in the institution of marriage and all that comes with it.

  • lotus2012

    isisdagmar:
    People who believe what Danny does are the kinds of people who vote for Prop 8 in California. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that Danny is evil or anything, but he is misguided and people who believe like he does do push their beliefs onto their fellow citizens by legally curtailing their rights. They exclude their fellow citizens from the institution of marriage. Whatever they may or may not verbally say, that is what they do.

    Hear, hear! This is exactly why Danny needs:
    1. A smart PR person.
    2. Memorize a set of non-offensive talking points, preferably all about MUSIC.
    3. Just in case, a one minute delay on his microphone allowing for a responsible adult to translate/rephrase his warbled brain fodder into at least 8th grade English.

  • elw

    Danny missed the ‘you reap what you sow’ lesson in Sunday school.

  • lotus2012

    Adam said some of the material on his album will be provocative. Bring it on. Can’t wait.
    He is incredibly talented with an interesting, multi-layered personality to boot.
    Provocative can be exiting and enriching.
    Negative (Gokey’s nagging public perception) is just that – negative.
    I wonder which label will take the risk of signing Gokey. The ‘Dead Wife’ label, perhaps? I’ve heard their sales are just tremendous.

  • noctem seizure

    noctem: ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s okay if you donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t like Kris. Everyoneà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s entitled to their likes and dislikes.

    It has nothing to do with disliking Kris. I have no feeling of any kind for Kris. I don’t think he has anywhere near the level of overall talent to warrant him being the American Idol, but that’s neither here nor there.

    It’s about the fact that I’m confident in having heard him make the nature of statement that I’m alleging that I heard him make. When I heard it at the time, I raised my eyebrows, wondered if he was going to feel the wrath of Adam-Nation, but he didn’t, and I promptly forgot about it, as I said, I really could care less one way or another about him.

    I did spend some minutes searching for the quote that caught my attention, but as I said the Internet is a big place. I also, though, went to the website of his church, and I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that his church believes homosexual relations are sin. Just by reading their mission statement and doctrinal statements and their views on the “Word of God”, I can assure you of that. Like Kris, however, it also empahasizes “loving people” and not behaving judgmentally.

    As others have pointed out, not everyone within the same church agrees on every doctrinal point. However, I’ve read that Kris was a worship leader for something like six years. That’s a position of leadership within the church. Churches don’t just give those out to anybody who can play guitar and carry a pretty tune. He would have had to meet with the higher-ups and become well-known to them before he got the post and there would have been regular leadership-team study and prayer meetings throughout the time he served.

    For Kris to be morally accepting of the homosexual lifestyle would have constituted a major departure between the doctrinal views of himself and his church not just about homosexuality, but about their views of Scripture itself. I suppose it’s conceivable that this issue would have never come to light in all that time. Or it’s possible that Kris changed his views on the topic over the course of his adult life.

    But, it’s also possible that while him having held a long-tenured position of leadership in a fundamentalist church, isn’t “proof” that I’m right that he and Danny share the same mind on the subject, it is in fact evidence that I’m on to something. However, since I still haven’t located the quote that I claim to have heard, I’ll go back to saying nothing more about it unless I can. I only broke from that because cookcricket addressed me directly.

  • Jx223

    aek, you are in good company, if I do say so myself. ;)

    Yes. :thumbup_tb:

    Did you or aek, see the Twitter messages that Danny, Anoop, and Matt were leaving on Twitter last night for their fans and each other. They were hanging out together, and writing about their “adventures” in a cab. I thought that there comments were cute and funny. I love those guys and I am glad that they are all really close to each other.

  • JosieX

    Jx223, thanks! Yes, I did see those messages, they cracked me up! Those guys are so funny, I’m glad that they’re having fun together.

  • Stormy

    I want to thank all the people who have been speaking up for Kris. I’m an Adam fan (though Kris has grown on me more and more), and an ex-Christian, and the only evangelical Christians I’m still close to (outside of my family) are those who are 100% in favor of same sex marriage and same sex adoption and equal protection under the law for all GLBT people. Now, some of these are of the opinion “it’s wrong but we shouldn’t make laws about it”, and some of the others are of the opinion “It’s not wrong and I hate that my church teaches that it is.” There are many types of Christians under the Evangelical umbrella.

    It’s not fair to try to find one (obviously obscure and possibly non-existent) quote from Kris and use it to equate his brand of Christianity with Danny’s. They are demonstrably different, as are their families. Witness Kris’s family giving Adam a standing ovation on finale night, before the results were even in. Witness Danny’s family creating an opportunity to humiliate and ridicule Adam. Listen to what Kris has said and watch how he behaves, consistently, even when surprises (“Did you know Adam had a crush on you?”!?” are thrown at him.

    End of rant.

  • Tess

    My step-daughter was raised in an ultra-conservative church. And her views about gays were the typical “church” related regurgitation of everything she had learned. And then her much loved cousin came out! And, because her immediate church leaders wouldn’t back down on the teachings and basically told her that her cousin was going to go to hell if he didn’t renounce his gayism……

    Well long story short…she no longer goes to church! She still loves her God but she doesn’t feel the need to profess that love in a building full of judgmental people. She does it privately and sincerely.

    That is what I disliked so much from some idols this year….American Idol is not a pulpit to preach from and some idols decided it was.

    I just hate fanaticism of any sort. Nothing in life is black or white. Everything is multiple shades of gray…and I just wish that people could see that. Or better yet, I wish everyone could see life with all its magical colors that somehow blend effortlessly to create this wonderful world we have a chance to enjoy for such a limited time.

  • chrgi

    Noctem, I was basically doing the same exact thing as Kris at my Catholic Church, I used to play piano and sing for the teen oriented masses (and this is a large church that seats probably 2000 people) and with a few other people I helped start a performing arts ministry at my church for children and teens. I also used to sing at my professor’s Southern Baptist church. But I’m nowhere near Southern Baptist, and I don’t follow the Catholic line on every issue.

    A worship leader is just a glorified term for person who plays and sings. You don’t need to be interrogated by the higher ups to play and sing. Well in my experience, I never was.

  • lakhesis

    You bring up a good point noctem – that is why I was so surprised about how different Kris and Danny seem in their approaches to Adam. A worship leader vs. a church director, I didn’t expect that from Kris. However – I do notice the countless times Adam seems to emphasize “open-mindedness” and “openness” of Kris in his interview. How he doesn’t judge etc… If everyone as openminded- you don’t go out of your way to use that to describe one particular person.

    It’s just the little things that Kris does, that Christianity and its rules do not confine him to being who he is. Is he afraid of appearing homosexual? ROFL he goes and bear-hug attacks Adam… which reminds me of this other recap where Danny was so surprised when Adam gives him a bear hug. Also, Kris never even thinks about classifying his love between him and Adam when it’s heavily speculated and fantasized (ahem those Kradam fics). It’s pretty different him and Gokey.

  • oceana

    Gokeyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s church does tell members that it is their duty to save people from à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢spiritual darknessà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ and spread à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã‹The Wordà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢.

    And this is the problem I have with most christian churches. I, for instance, am not in spiritual darkness just because I don’t believe what they believe, and I don’t want their “Word.” I have read the “Word” and I have my own opinions about it. There are many “Words” in literature and spiritual writings, their “Word” is not the only one. It is not their “duty” to push their beliefs on anyone else. It is not their right to decide who is in spiritual darkness. Just, no.

  • a-lamb

    having said ALL that, i am bothered by this à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“eye for an eyeà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  BS these fanatics are suggestingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦.its very aggressive and i do not agree w. the lynch mob mentality. i see no point in attacking danny. just let the guy know you are upset/ disappointed and move on.

    Oh, c’mon, it’s not like we lynched the guy. All we did was let him know that his comments were not appreciated. #dannyisadouche was the #1 trend on twitter for all of five minutes. That’s it. It’s just normal internet behavior. Everybody jumped on it because they wanted to empower themselves for a little while and at the same time let a homophobe know what we think of his comments. I seriously doubt Danny’s sitting around moping because of something that happened on twitter. I imagine he’s got more important things to think about.

    I took a little part in what happened, and I don’t regret that. In hindsight I think we all probably overreacted a little bit, but we were pissed off and emotional and it got out of hand. It’s really not a big deal.

    The only thing I regret is that some (incredibly stupid) people got the other Idols involved, because that really wasn’t necessary. Just awkward.

    As someone else said here, this might just have been a “joke” on Danny’s part, and maybe he really didn’t mean anything by it, but for people who have been dealing with that sort of passive-aggressive homophobia all their lives it can still hurt deeply. Danny’s family were making fun of Adam, mocking him and laughing at him, and this is something that Adam probably noticed. The fact that Adam has had to learn how to brush that sort of thing off is really sad. He shouldn’t have to deal with that at all. Danny enabled his family to make fun of Adam, and there are no excuses.

  • oceana

    I havenà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t cracked a Bible in YEARS, but I think I have one packed away somewhere. And if I dug it out, I could find you chapter and verse where homosexuality is condemned.

    And the Bible says that women should grow their hair long and not cut it, masturbation is a sin, and a hundred other admonitions that Christians ignore today. So they often cling to the verses about homosexuality, while ignoring those that are not convenient today or don’t make sense in our current world.

  • lucy

    Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve read that Kris was a worship leader for something like six years. Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a position of leadership within the church. Churches donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t just give those out to anybody who can play guitar and carry a pretty tune. He would have had to meet with the higher-ups and become well-known to them before he got the post and there would have been regular leadership-team study and prayer meetings throughout the time he served.

    If Kris was a worship leader for at least six years, he couldn’t have started later than age 17. And since he was away for about a year or so and just recently turned 24 and therefore left the post at age 23 or earlier, I think the more likely age he would have had to be named a worship leader was 16, to fit the time table. 6 years plus 1 year abroad plus 16 adds up to 23, right?

    If that’s true, I’d think that, in his church, being a worship leader must have been much more about the music than about any leadership position. (And I do know some churches where this seems to be the case) Plus, your mind can change a *lot* between the ages of 16/17 and 24.

    I’m not sure we can glean much about Kris’s specific beliefs from his history as a worship leader.

  • oceana

    Again, my photos are somewhat mild, but quite risque for me. If I had a friend or co-worker suddenly present a blown up version to me and say, à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Sign this.à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  As if it were representative of who I was? I would KNOW that was a set-up. BIG TIME! Adam, who is unapologetic about anything, had to know he was being mocked. And Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s a F*CK for playing along.

    Well stated. I agree.

  • endorphine

    Wow. SOOOO much ado about essentially nothing. Danny had NOTHING to do in this trumped-up drama. He has nothing to apologize for. Would I be guilty if my brother said something stupid? If my sister drove drunk? Come on peeps!

    As for his comcast interview, he said he accepts others and they should accept him. That means we agree to disagree and just try to get along in the world.

    Danny has never uttered one word of hate against any group. The thing with Sarver was something that came off wrong. off the cuff. We’ve all done it, said something slightly the wrong way and given people the wrong impression.

    I don’t believe for one minute that Danny hates anyone. His life has been about helping others for the greater good, not about hate. His record reflects that. It’s true he isn’t a polished speaker, but lots of people aren’t. I’m sure there are loads of famous people who don’t express themselves eloquently…so what?

    Can people just try to get along, please? It’s so ironic that people condemn Danny for hate, but they are not above doing it themselves.

    p.s. I think it would be interesting to see what is in Adam’s family or friends’ facebook pages, tho I’d never condemn Adam for anything anyone else did.

    Well, life goes on outside of the internet. Just had to speak my mind for a minute. Have a lovely day, all.

  • Jx223

    As for his comcast interview, he said he accepts others and they should accept him. That means we agree to disagree and just try to get along in the world.

    I think that is what he meant as well.

    p.s. I think it would be interesting to see what is in Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s family or friendsà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ facebook pages, tho Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢d never condemn Adam for anything anyone else did.

    Me neither.And Adam’s brother has said some stuff this season that I have not liked at all. Including he have would have flew into a rage had Danny won, and that if Danny had been in the finale with Adam and won, Adam would have had to deal with the shame of being beaten by someone as lame as Danny.

    :rolleyes_wp:

    Imagine if one of Danny’s family or friends had said that stuff about Adam? Danny would have to suffer through even more backlash, and receive even more hate than he already does.

  • auntieaimee

    Tempest in a teapot.

  • oceana

    I think that a lot of the stuff said on Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin facebook page was wrong, but I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that Danny should be held responsible for what his cousins does.

    How come Danny is “not responsible” for so much that goes on in his life?

    - He “wasn’t responsible” when his friend held up his wife’s picture and pointed to heaven.
    - He’s “not responsible” for his homophobic beliefs, because it’s his religion.
    - He’s “not responsible” for being homophobic, because he was raised by a homophobic family.
    - He’s “not responsible” for the eyeglass company, even though they claimed that the did contact his organization.
    - He’s “not responsible” for his clueless comments to the media. He’s just “socially awkward.”
    - And now he’s “not responsible” for giving Adam that picture to sign, or for letting his family say awful things about Adam on facebook. And he’s apparently “not responsible” for not speaking out against their comments.

    Personally, while I don’t like cyber bullying in general, I am proud to see that homophobes (and the family were the actual cyber bullies) were put in their place, and that people are sticking up for a minority group who have been put down, joked about, ostracized and worse, for far too long. The tide is truly turning, and one more minority group are getting their rights for respect and the right to exist without being attacked. If I had seen the tweets last night, I don’t know how it would have felt to me, I tend to cringe when anyone is attacked, but in this case, I think the cousin and her family and friends deserved it.

  • noctem seizure

    masturbation is a sin,

    Actually, many fundamentalists do still consider masturbation wrong. But, you are right, there are certain “non-controversial” provisions that they take in “cultural context”.

    Anyway, I’m not the mouthpiece for these types. I’m just telling you what they say. So please don’t shoot the messenger!
    ————————————————————————————————————

    Oh and as to the poster above, who reiterated the theme yet again that Kris’s “actions speak louder than words”, I addressed that. He can demonstrate love to another person without approving of everything they do. Actions may speak louder than words, but they don’t tell you what the words inside a person’s head say either.

    Now really, I wish to get off the topic. If you want to disagree with me, cool! If I find the quote, I’ll post it. If not, forget I ever raised this point. But, you see I have a certain compulsion where I absolutely have to post a reply back if somebody posts a reply to me. It’s like an obsessive need! It’s a dysfunction! It’s an illness! I should probably see somebody about it….

  • oceana

    p.s. I don’t think anyone is looking for reasons to attack Danny. Myself I keep trying to ignore him, but these incidents come up and ask to be responded to.

  • Tess

    Jx223
    Jun 19th, 2009 at 9:55 am

    Could I have Neil’s quotes please….thanks, I haven’t seen them even though I read Negative Neil every day.

  • Jx223

    p.s. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think anyone is looking for reasons to attack Danny

    I think that a lot of his haters are like that. Or else why were some of his haters sniffing around his cousin’s facebook page? I want to know what is their reasoning behind that. They claim to hate him, and treat him like he’s the scum of the earth,and that they never want to see him again. Yet they were lurking his cousin’s facebook page. His cousin’s facebook page? They were looking for something to use against him IMHO.

  • Tara

    My take on it. Sometimes you can get someones attention by just tapping them on the shoulder, others times a 2×4 upside the head is necessary. Danny’s life will turn around when he does. It is a great opportunity for him to think and feel his way through all this.

    Kris. I would love to read what NS read. I always thought of Kris as someone who was mainstream with his own interpretations. I met a Catholic woman once up in Ojai, CA. Theosophical Society I think it was. Here she is in the library, working with books all around her about Witches, Satan, etc Encouraging me to read the Bhagavad gita. Point of this story is that after talking with her a bit she said she was Catholic. And no one had the right to tell her otherwise. I thought of Kris being this way. I hope I am right NS!

  • weareallinnocent

    p.s. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think anyone is looking for reasons to attack Danny. Myself I keep trying to ignore him, but these incidents come up and ask to be responded to.

    Isn’t that the truth!

  • Jx223

    Could I have Neilà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s quotes pleaseà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦.thanks, I havenà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t seen them even though I read Negative Neil every day.

    Here is the link to the vote for the worst article, where they pull the quote where he says that stuff from his blog.

    http://votefortheworst.com/20090524/neil_lambert_isnt_vftw_fan

    And here is the actual page of his site, where he says that stuff, and also talks about Kris, Adam and the show.

    http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3136520&userid=11370

    I did not like him talking about Danny like that. And I don’t think that he should have been saying that type of stuff where people in the public can see it, since his brother was competiting on the show.

    If this had been a family member of Danny saying that stuff about Adam or another contestant, Danny would have gotten attacked all over the place.

  • terfra

    endorphine – ITA
    I think people will find out that Danny was not what he is being painted as.

  • Tess

    Jx223
    Jun 19th, 2009 at 10:19 am

    I don’t want to burst anyone’s bubble, but to think that an anonymous posting on a snarky website is indeed Adam’s brother is slightly ridiculous. I read all of the posts and there is absolutely no way that anyone can truthfully say this is Neil Lambert. And somethingawful.com is not Neil’s website….his site is negativeneil.com.

    Quoting someone means going to an actual interview or video that identifies someone…..or having photographic evidence of same.

  • ptslittlecomment

    I have to agree with Tess. Being an avid reader of NegativeNeil.com, the comments posted at the website linked above DO NOT sound like Neil, either in content or writing style.

    Neil once said comments being left on a site by “AdamLambert2009″ were not those of his brother’s because Adam wouldn’t be that obvious. I think the same probably applies to Neil.

    ETA: I found Neil’s actual quote on NegativeNeil.com

    That guy on youtube? Adamlambert2009 or whatever? Not him. Heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s more subtle than that.

  • Stormy

    Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s brother has said some stuff this season that I have not liked at all.

    It’s Danny’s behavior and Danny’s own comments that have brought him all the harsh criticism. His family has made it worse, but Danny himself is culpable. Again, this photo kerfuffle was the last straw, not the only incident.

    why were some of his haters sniffing around his cousinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s facebook page? I want to know what is their reasoning behind that.

    Maybe because the pictures were tagged “Adam Lambert”?!?

  • oceana

    I think that a lot of his haters are like that. Or else why were some of his haters sniffing around his cousinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s facebook page? I want to know what is their reasoning behind that. They claim to hate him, and treat him like heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s the scum of the earth,and that they never want to see him again. Yet they were lurking his cousinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s facebook page. His cousinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s facebook page? They were looking for something to use against him IMHO.

    How do you know it happened that way, or who found the facebook page? Maybe it was Adam fans, searching for news of Adam, who found it. That would be quite innocent and not motivated by hate.

  • oceana

    My take on it. Sometimes you can get someones attention by just tapping them on the shoulder, others times a 2Ã’”4 upside the head is necessary. Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s life will turn around when he does. It is a great opportunity for him to think and feel his way through all this.

    Good point. Danny seems a bit thick-skinned and, I won’t say obtuse, but not overly sensitive or open. I think it might require a lot to get through to him and be heard.

    Actually his insensitivity probably drew even more heat to him, people sensing that he would not hear them unless they were loud and direct. I’m guessing.

  • oceana

    Anyway, Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not the mouthpiece for these types. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m just telling you what they say. So please donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t shoot the messenger!

    LOL. Don’t worry, your personal views on masturbation are not an issue here. That would open a whole can of worms wouldn’t it if we went off on that tangent.

  • Tess

    Okay…I think obtuse is actually the perfect word for Danny:
    lacking in insight or discernment; dense: slow to learn or understand; lacking intellectual acuity.

  • a-lamb

    Jx223 – If Danny’s brother had said about Adam what Neil said about Danny (Tess, it’s been confirmed by Neil that it was him) I would not have put any blame on Danny at all. I wouldn’t even be annoyed by it. Danny’s brother, as well as Neil, has a right to like or dislike a contestant just as much as we do. I would have no issue with that.

    The point here was not that Danny was rude to Adam in particular, it’s that he was being rude to homosexuals in general. This was not a “stop the Adam-bashing” campaign, it was a “stop the gay-bashing” campaign. This was not an act of bitter Adam-fans, MANY of the people who participated aren’t even fans of Adam or American Idol at all. They saw what Danny had said/done and wanted to take a stand.

  • ptslittlecomment

    Could I ask where Neil has confirmed those were his comments? He certainly doesn’t make such statements on the blog he owns and runs and in which he has free reign. It is odd to me that he would make provocative statements on another site (thereby drawing attention and hits to the other site instead of his own).

  • revcat

    Earlier “noctem” suggested a fan ask Kris about his religious beliefs regarding homosexuality during the AI tour at a “meet and greet”…

    I can’t believe nobody responded to that. That is a horrible idea! I’m going to the concert to be entertained, not to do a Bill O’Reilly/Dateline type ambush.

    UGH! :wallbash_tb:

  • a-lamb

    ptslittlecomment – I believe, but don’t quote me on this, that Neil’s username on that forum was posted on his myspace before it was made private. I’m not entirely sure, but I think that was it.

  • ptslittlecomment

    a lamb, the poster was using the name “negativeneil” and posting as if he was Neil Lambert. However, as we have said before, that in itself doesn’t prove anything. It does seem to be a little too obvious. It could be Neil, but I do doubt it.
    In any event, it was obvious that it was Danny’s cousin, and all of that episode seems to have gone past having an opinion to actually doing something malicious, IMHO. To me, there is a world of difference in saying you think someone is “lame” and actually trying to prove it.

  • Jx223

    The point here was not that Danny was rude to Adam in particular, ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s that he was being rude to homosexuals in general. This was not a à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“stop the Adam-bashingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  campaign, it was a à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“stop the gay-bashingà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  campaign. This was not an act of bitter Adam-fans, MANY of the people who participated arenà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t even fans of Adam or American Idol at all. They saw what Danny had said/done and wanted to take a stand.

    I don’t think that Danny’s intentions were meant to be homophobic. I could see where people might say that he was acting clueless or insensitive,not putting the picture away when Adam didn’t seem that comfortable with it. But I don’t think that he was trying to be homophobic and deliberately hurt Adam because Adam is gay. And I bet if someone asked Adam if that was the case he would say no. And what the cousin’s friends said on her facebook is not Danny’s fault.

    Sometimes people have some people in their families or friends, that are bigots, or mean people. They shouldn’t be blamed for the stuff that their family members do or say, unless it’s their little kids or something. And they aren’t disclipining them. But Danny’s cousin is an adult, her and her friends are responsible for their own actions. Not Danny. And I don’t think that Danny should have been attacked as much as he was for what he said in his comcast chat. I don’t think that he was trying to be cruel to gay people.

    I think that people want to take a stand on homophobia, they should have done it another way. They ended up making themselves look really bad, IMO. I think that if one of the big media outlets like CNN or something had caught on to this, I believe that the people that had done this would have ended up looking really bad to the general public.

    Way worse than they claymates ever did. Because they would have had to get all sides of the stories, including Adam’s and I would bet cash money that Adam would say that he doesn’t think that Danny is homophobic if asked about it. And that he doesn’t approve of what these “cyber viligantes” tried to do.

    And he might have thought the situation embarassing like he could have thought that the AT&T thing was. I believe that at the very least he would think it was ridiculous and over the top. I think like tefra mentioned there is more to this story, and if the whole truth comes out, Danny won’t end up being the villian that a lot of people claim that he is.

  • Tess

    Just to get things clear. Neil posted on his myspace account that he was posting on another site using the handle negativeneil where is was bashing another AI contestant. Just a bit circumspect, I do think? I’m not questioning anyone here….I think everyone has a right to think that this poster was Neil if they so believe….I’m just saying that “anonymous” postings (like we do here) are all in good fun and are not being posted as a representative of the idol.

    Now if Neil had made those comments on a public MySpace account or on his blog they could then be scrutinized. just sayin’.

  • revcat

    Yes, Adam’s brother, Neil wrote stuff in his blog indicating that he didn’t care for Danny. However, Neil didn’t go up to Danny and act like he was was cool with Danny by posing for a picture with him and then post said picture on the internet with mean comments. What Danny’s cousin did is called being two-faced. You only get one face with Neil, blunt, sarcastic and witty.

    I get it, some of you think Danny is a wonderful, but misunderstood guy. You may even be right, but using Neil to prove your point just does the opposite.

    The two situations couldn’t be more different. :doh_tb:

    Why not just say Danny isn’t responsible for what his cousin does just like Adam is not responsible for what his brother does?

  • PoorKitty

    I am no fan of Danny Gokey, but I don’t believe he deserves the internet bashing he is taking. He doesn’t appear to be a mean spirited person, he is simply devoid of intellectual curiosity and has no desire to expand his horizons beyond the behaviors and beliefs he learned from his family and his church.

    He grew up poor, was taught no social graces and wasn’t exposed to life and culture outside of his limited environment. These factors shaped his personality and perceptions. Danny could have taken it upon himself to improve his vocabulary and manner of speaking, to learn how to behave in social situations, to self-educate (at the very least about different musical styles, as music is supposedly his passion), but he had/has, apparently, no desire to do so. He is lacking in class, which cannot be acquired, one must be born with that. Danny is, at 29, as good as he is going to get.

    You don’t sit a dog at a piano and then beat it because it can’t play, it simply does not have the ability. Expecting Danny to present himself in any other manner than he does, and then punishing him for his shortcomings, is just as unreasonable.

  • Jx223

    ptslittlecomment – I believe, but donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t quote me on this, that Neilà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s username on that forum was posted on his myspace before it was made private. Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m not entirely sure, but I think that was it.

    There is a thread started by a poster in IDF right now, asking if it’s really him. Adam fans are saying it’s him in it. One has said that he’s been posting on the SA site for almost ten years now.

    Here is the link to that thread.

    http://idolforums.com/index.php?showtopic=616609

    I think that it’s really him. I think that some of the Adam fans found out it was him a while back. Maybe it was through his myspace.

  • lakhesis

    You donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t sit a dog at a piano and then beat it because it canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t play, it simply does not have the ability. Expecting Danny to present himself in any other manner than he does, and then punishing him for his shortcomings, is just as unreasonable.

    LOL that is very true and the imagine is funny. I agree that Danny may just be as clueless and incompetent as he appears to be and it’s not his fault. BUT, if your dog can’t play a piano – you wouldn’t sit him in front of a piano in a national competition / nationwide television. It’s kinda like that. When you choose to go on American Idol – you really have to be prepared for scrutiny and all the ill that gets tackled on. You just have to be prepared for it.

    If you don’t know music and cannot handle the incessant media – you shouldn’t go into entertainment. If you get your foot in your mouth and aren’t PR savvy… please don’t be a politician. =\

  • a-lamb

    I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s intentions were meant to be homophobic. I could see where people might say that he was acting clueless or insensitive,not putting the picture away when Adam didnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t seem that comfortable with it. But I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that he was trying to be homophobic and deliberately hurt Adam because Adam is gay. And I bet if someone asked Adam if that was the case he would say no. And what the cousinà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s friends said on her facebook is not Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s fault.

    Sometimes people have some people in their families or friends, that are bigots, or mean people. They shouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t be blamed for the stuff that their family members do or say, unless ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s their little kids or something. And they arenà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t disclipining them. But Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin is an adult, her and her friends are responsible for their own actions. Not Danny. And I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that Danny should have been attacked as much as he was for what he said in his comcast chat. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that he was trying to be cruel to gay people.

    You don’t know how Adam would feel about it. He might have thought it was totally cool, he might have been really upset, we don’t know. I will say this though – people like Adam often go through life experiencing this kind of passive-aggressive homophobia, so eventually it becomes a sensitive issue. To you or Danny it might not have been a big deal, but to someone who has dealt with it all their lives it can be hurtful. I’m not saying that Adam has, I’m just saying it’s a big possibility.

    Look, I really don’t think that Danny was trying to be cruel with his comments/acts either. But that doesn’t make them okay, and I’m not going to sit back and let him talk like that. We made our voices heard, and let him know that we disagree with his point of view.

    I think that people want to take a stand on homophobia, they should have done it another way. They ended up making themselves look really bad, IMO. I think that if one of the big media outlets like CNN or something had caught on to this, I believe that the people that had done this would have ended up looking really bad to the general public.

    How, exactly? Twitter is completely uncharted territory in that it gives regular people the chance to interact with celebrities on a whole new level, and we used this to our advantage to get our point across. It got out of hand, and perhaps people overreacted, but the main point was still made.

    And quite frankly, I don’t really care if people are offended by this. It’s freaking twitter. People who take offence to sh*t-stirrers on the internet need to go out and get themselves some lives. It was seriously not a big deal.

    Way worse than they claymates ever did. Because they would have had to get all sides of the stories, including Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s and I would bet cash money that Adam would say that he doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that Danny is homophobic if asked about it. And that he doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t approve of what these à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“cyber viligantesà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  tried to do.

    I don’t know what the Claymates have done, so idk. You actually have no idea what Adam thinks of Danny. Both Adam and Danny have actually said that they “agree to disagree” on certain issues regarding religion, so it’s quite possible that it has something to do with homosexuality. But, like I said, we have no way of knowing.

    And he might have thought the situation embarassing like he could have thought that the AT&T thing was. I believe that at the very least he would think it was ridiculous and over the top. I think like tefra mentioned there is more to this story, and if the whole truth comes out, Danny wonà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t end up being the villian that a lot of people claim that he is.

    I never said Danny is a villain. I think he made some really homophobic comments and I helped call him on it. I don’t think he’s a bad person in general, I just don’t agree with his views and I wanted to make that known.

  • lucy

    I think Danny is the Susan Boyle of American Idol. Both are out of their depths in some ways on these shows. At Danny’s age he should be able to learn and adapt more easily, but I don’t know how many more chances he’s going to be given, especially if he brings his more backward-thinking friends and relations any nearer the spotlight.

  • Tess

    I think that ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s really him. I think that some of the Adam fans found out it was him a while back. Maybe it was through his myspace.

    The point is, it is still an anonymous posting with no ties to Adam. The poster (whether Neil or not) is not posting pictures of Danny and himself and adding captions to them).

    I can belittle anyone I want (except posters) on this forum. I can say whatever I damn well please….and what the hey, I might be related to someone on Idol.

  • BootStar

    I don’t have time to read through the entire thread, but as a former evangelical myself (for 30 years, so I’ve got six on you, noctem!), I have to respectfully disagree with you that all evangelicals believe homosexuality is a sin.

    It’s true that the vast majority of evangelicals think it is wrong, but I think Kris definitely falls into the Red Letter Christian camp, one of whose most prominent leaders is Tony Campolo. Tony and his wife Peggy famously disagree with each other about how to view homosexuality, and I have to say, most of the under-35, more liberal evangelicals (check out Jim Wallis of Sojourners for an explanation of that apparent oxymoron) I know are definitely more like Peggy than Tony on this issue. Mind you the Campolos and Jim Wallis are universally decried by the most conservative fundamentalists because they don’t take “God’s Word” literally enough, but whatever.

    Divorce, inter-racial marriage, dancing and drinking were, at one time, universally abhorred across the evangelical spectrum. This is no longer the case, and I imagine homosexuality will be accepted across a broad swath of evangelical Christianity in another generation. It will be folks like Kris Allen who make that possible, IMVHO.

  • auntieaimee

    I think Danny is the Susan Boyle of American Idol. Both are out of their depths in some ways on these shows. At Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s age he should be able to learn and adapt more easily, but I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t know how many more chances heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s going to be given, especially if he brings his more backward-thinking friends and relations any nearer the spotlight.

    Interesting point. While some of the others (namely, Adam, Kris, and Allison) seemed to have wanted this their whole lives, I never got that from Danny. It’s possible that the only reason he tried out was to pay tribute to his wife’s wishes and her memory. Further, I think in the beginning, when he had a breakdown on camera talking about her, that was a genuine moment of grief that should not have been aired. Instead, the show exploited it for ratings. Disgusting.

  • isisdagmar

    Look, I really donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think that Danny was trying to be cruel with his comments/acts either. But that doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t make them okay

    Precisely. If a person said, “I don’t approve of interracial marriage, but I accept people who do, and we can just agree to disagree” would anyone here be saying, “Well, he didn’t mean to be offensively racist, so it’s okay”? I doubt it. Danny probably doesn’t intend to be offensive–but saying things like homosexuality is not “right and godly” etc. is indeed offensive, and reflective of homophobia. Homophobia is not okay just because the laws don’t cover it the same way they do racism and sexism. That doesn’t mean that Danny is evil or anything like that, and I don’t hate him at all–he seems to have good impulses at times–but saying that he doesn’t mean to be offensive doesn’t change the fact that he is and has been several times now, and after that video and his statements, it’s hard to blame people for thinking that whether or not he intended to play a joke on Adam, he probably shares a decent amount of his family’s views. And Adam may very well like him and get along with him, I don’t know–but a lot of gay people I know are used enough to interacting with people who believe that they are immoral in some way that they can still get along with those people to a certain extent. But they shouldn’t have to, and it makes me sad to think of Adam being around people whom he knows disapprove of him.

  • noctem seizure

    Ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s true that the vast majority of evangelicals think it is wrong, but I think Kris definitely falls into the Red Letter Christian camp, one of whose most prominent leaders is Tony Campolo. Tony and his wife Peggy famously disagree with each other about how to view homosexuality, and I have to say, most of the under-35, more liberal evangelicals (check out Jim Wallis of Sojourners for an explanation of that apparent oxymoron) I know are definitely more like Peggy than Tony on this issue. Mind you the Campolos and Jim Wallis are universally decried by the most conservative fundamentalists because they donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t take à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Godà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s Wordà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  literally enough, but whatever.

    Yes, I’m well acquainted with who Tony Campolo is. He and others like him probably represent examples of what I was talking about when I said that not every Evangelical agrees that every person who calls themselves an Evangelical truly is one.

    For example, even if a “liberal” Evangelical Christian offshoot concludes that there is nothing morally wrong with homosexuality (which could be called a peripheral issue or non-”Red Letter” issue), there are certain core beliefs that do define Evangelicals– namely that “salvation” comes solely through having faith in Jesus Christ to forgive you of your “sins”.

    But, Campolo has said, in effect, that Islam was the way God revealed himself to the Arab culture (just as Christianity was how God revealed himself to first Jewish and then surrounding Gentile culture). That right there puts him outside the bounds of any and all accepted Evangelical theology.

    In other words, Tony Campolo may call himself an Evangelical, but he doesn’t meet the standard, regardless of how he feels about homosexuality. I am NOT saying his beliefs are wrong, just that they don’t pass muster with any Evangelical branch, liberal or conservative.

  • BestAI

    …and it makes me sad to think of Adam being around people whom he knows disapprove of him.

    Adam is going to be plenty busy to even worry about Danny and Sarver. He’ll be flying to LA/Hollywood every chance he gets during the tour. When he is with the tour and not performing, he’ll be on his phone colloborating, in meetings, and bouncing ideas with Kris. Danny will be reading his “Grand Ol’ Opry for Dummies”.

  • wand3rful

    However, Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ve read that Kris was a worship leader for something like six years.

    im really not picking at you noctem (kisses) but really, as a non kris fan and someone who could care less about krs, its odd that you seem to remember only faulty information and then post it to prove a point.

    here is kris briefly talking about his worship leadership experience on Huckabee…exact quote “yeah i did that for over like a year“….not exactly six lol.

    http://www.krisallenation.com/2009/05/kris-performing-yesterday.html

    bottom line, we dont know the true thoughts/feelings of ANY idol contestant, and i rather keep it like that. has nothing to do w. the music. however, danny has put himself out there for judgement with his words, actions and nonactions…its very unfortunate, but thats the difference btw kris and danny.

  • http://myspace.com/susanatfox sumidol

    “””He doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t appear to be a mean spirited person, he is simply devoid of intellectual curiosity and has no desire to expand his horizons beyond the behaviors and beliefs he learned from his family and his church.”””

    Danny appears to Pretend that he is devoid of intellectual curiosity – he definitely appears to be a mean spirited person. Hiding behind the “Oh I am a christian so how can I be mean? act – he really should go into acting, I think he would do so much better there than singing

  • aek

    Neil Lambert obviously has a right to post anything he wants online. I knew about his comments a long time ago. I thought they were meanspirited and not very classy.

    In some ways what Neil did is worse than Danny’s cousin because he posted these comments in a public forum. I think Danny’s cousin posted hers in her private facebook account (some say it was hacked, and some say facebook changed the settings). At any rate, it seems she thought she was sharing this stuff privately amongst her family and friends. However, I still think she was meanspirited, but I don’t think she was publically trying to humiliate Adam…she was still wrong.

    Ultimately, you have two families that had a horse in this race. Perhaps Neil felt threatened by Danny’s never being in the bottom three, and he feared that his brother might lose to Danny. This may have fueled some of his “rage.” Because even if he didn’t like Danny’s singing, there was no need to really post publically belittling remarks.

    Danny’s cousin. Well, she had a horse in this race, too. I have often thought about Danny’s family and how they would feel going to an AI website and reading all of the intense hate that was put out there. Most of it seemed to come from the fanbase that was the biggest competitor to Danny. Let’s face it, for the bulk of the season, these two were the ones to beat. I imagine reading this stuff colored there feelings, through no fault of Adam. But it does happen.

    In the end, I think they were both wrong. However, I still believe firmly that Adam can’t control his brother and Danny sure as hell can’t control a cousin. It’s not their fault.

  • BootStar

    In other words, Tony Campolo may call himself an Evangelical, but he doesnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t meet the standard, regardless of how he feels about homosexuality. I am NOT saying his beliefs are wrong, just that they donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t pass muster with any Evangelical branch, liberal or conservative.

    Well, I’ll just have to respectfully disagree with you here, too, noctem!

    Tony Campolo may be on the left-leaning fringe of evangelicalism, but iif he doesn’t meet the evangelical “standard” than a whole helluva lot of folks don’t either. In the northeast, we don’t allow the Southern Baptist Convention to tell us who is, and isn’t, a “genuine” Christian! ;-)

  • isisdagmar

    à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦and it makes me sad to think of Adam being around people whom he knows disapprove of him.

    Adam is going to be plenty busy to even worry about Danny and Sarver. Heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ll be flying to LA/Hollywood every chance he gets during the tour. When he is with the tour and not performing, heà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ll be on his phone colloborating, in meetings, and bouncing ideas with Kris. Danny will be reading his à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Grand Olà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢ Opry for Dummiesà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ .

    Oh, I definitely think he’ll have a fantastic, completely amazing time on the tour–I wish he didn’t have to deal with anyone who disapproves of him, but I’m sure the whole experience will be unbelievable for both him and Kris (and Allison–it must be amazing to go on tour knowing that you are going to release an album).

  • a-lamb

    aek – I think you’re missing the point. We’re not upset because they posted something negative about Adam, we’re upset because they posted something homophobic about Adam. There is a huge difference. Personally, I couldn’t care less whether Danny’s cousin likes Adam or not. It’s the anti-gay remarks that pissed me off.

    Also, like people have repeated several times, it’s not just about Danny’s cousin. Danny is in no way innocent.

    And for the record – Danny’s cousins facebook was NOT private, I visited it myself. It was not hacked. Neil’s comments were made on a forum where you have to pay to be a member. I would also like to add that when Neil found out that his comments had been redistributed around the Idol fansites, he made a post explaining that it was not his intention for them to get out and that he would no longer be posting about Idol on that forum. At least he acknowledged it, unlike certain Gokeys I know…

  • lostinidol

    Yes. I accept gay people, but people have to accept my beliefs,à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬  Danny said. à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“We have to accept their beliefs, but they have to accept my beliefs. We agree to disagree. I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t judge people, but at the same time, if they believe in what they believe, they have to accept me and what I believe. But I accept anybody as they come. Thatà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s my character and my personality.

    I think something that is lost in all this is that being gay is not a belief. It is not a choice. Gays don’t gather in groups on Sunday morning to be preached to about how they should be going out into the world to try to turn the fallen and misguided heterosexual population into homosexuals. If you are truly gay, you are wired differently than heterosexuals.

    I thought AI made a subtle attempt to make this point with the little pimp piece they did for Adam about how “different” he was from a very early age. And I think Adam has tried to make the point how difficult his early years were because he was different. No one would choose this for themselves. It is to Adam’s credit that he has come to accept it and feel good about himself.

    So, in my mind, you don’t have to look any further than Danny’s comments here to understand that he doesn’t get it. He sees Adam as having made some kind of lifestyle choice designed to be a personal affront to Danny’s own beliefs. But Danny, being the forgiving and loving Christian that he is, is willing to accept Adam despite this. Danny’s comments are ignorant and condescending. And because he is now in a world outside of his sheltered church community where conformity in beliefs is demanded, he will be judged as such.

  • a-lamb

    lostinidol – Thank you. Exactly.

  • isisdagmar

    In some ways what Neil did is worse than Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin because he posted these comments in a public forum. I think Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin posted hers in her private facebook account (some say it was hacked, and some say facebook changed the settings). At any rate, it seems she thought she was sharing this stuff privately amongst her family and friends. However, I still think she was meanspirited, but I donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t think she was publically trying to humiliate Adamà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ ¦she was still wrong.

    Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s cousin. Well, she had a horse in this race, too. I have often thought about Dannyà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s family and how they would feel going to an AI website and reading all of the intense hate that was put out there. Most of it seemed to come from the fanbase that was the biggest competitor to Danny. Letà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s face it, for the bulk of the season, these two were the ones to beat. I imagine reading this stuff colored there feelings, through no fault of Adam. But it does happen.

    So, homophobia is less awful if it’s expressed privately (even though it seems that her facebook was public, not private) than simply critical comments are when expressed semi-privately (somethingawful.com is not a completely public forum)? Had Danny’s brother made comments about Adam or Kris in the vein of those that Neil made about Danny–had he made comments that he personally found Adam or Kris annoying and that he didn’t want either of them to beat Danny–I don’t think any Kris or Adam fan here would have been that riled up. But these comments weren’t simply expressing dislike towards Adam–they were homophobic. They weren’t just mean–they were bigoted and hateful. Imagine if Adam were black instead of gay, and the comments on this girl’s facebook had been mocking and hateful towards his race, calling him vile names, etc.–would you honestly saying be making comparison between these comment’s and Neil’s then? Homophobia is bigtory.

    “She had a horse in this race too”–I can’t quite tell if you are saying that the fact that Adam and Danny were frontrunners and rivals, and the fact that a lot of nasty stuff has been said about Danny online, in any way mitigates what she said or what her fb friends said about Adam. If you are: again, would you excuse racist comments on the part of a white contestant against a black contestant by saying that, well, they were rivals and a lot of mean things had been said about the white contestant?

    Look at the comments. This girl found it hysterical that her dad is so repulsed by gay people that he didn’t even want to go near Adam. Her facebook friends called him disgusting, repulsive, a horrible role model for their children–these comments were not deleted or discouraged. One commentator actually said that Adam was a “what” instead of a “who” and that it was hard for her to believe that God loved people who dressed like that. Adam was an “it” to her, not a human being, because he’s gay, and these comments were not deleted or discouraged in any way. The hatred in these comments is unfathomable.

    I can understand saying that we shouldn’t hold Danny accountable for this. He might just have been being insensitive rather than malicious when he asked Adam to sign that picture. If there were no evidence that he agreed with his family, he probably wouldn’t have received any anger over this at all. But between the Sarver video and his own statements about being gay being a “belief” rather than simply how someone is born, there is plenty of other evidence of his homophobia, and people don’t need to believe that he is evil or something to be angry about that. I don’t think he’s an awful person, but he is prejudiced and ignorant, and that makes people angry, as it should.

    And even if we allow that Danny shouldn’t be held accountable for what his relatives say, there can be no logical equivalence drawn between the critical, possibly mean-spirited comments (depending on your perspective) from Neil and the thoroughly disgusting, bigoted, homophobic, utterly hateful comments made about Adam on those pictures.

  • aek

    So, homophobia is less awful if ità ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s expressed privately (even though it seems that her facebook was public, not private) than simply critical comments are when expressed semi-privately (somethingawful.com is not a completely public forum)?

    No, what I’m saying is that I don’t think it was intended to humiliate Adam. I think homophobia is terrible. Please don’t put words in my mouth. I said that what she did was meanspirited and wrong. But I actually do think it would have been even worse if she tried to publically humiliate Adam in some kind of way.

    And I do know that her facebook was set to private. Someone mentioned that the facebook settings had changed, and so people were allowed to see photo albums, and they said last night that we should go and check our accounts. I have no clue, but I do know that her account had been set to private.

    I know people keep saying that Danny was party to this. I still think all he did is ask Adam to sign the picture. I don’t think he thought it would be upsetting for Adam. Noone who knows Danny personally has said ANYTHING but that he is a nice guy. I think those people that don’t know him are making assumptions as to what his intentions were.

    And again, regardless of any of it, Danny can’t control his cousin. We are not talking about his immediate family. It’s a COUSIN, for God’s sake. With his large family, he might have a thousand. lol.

    About Danny’s Comcast quote. Two things: 1. Danny was having to type out his answers very fast and he is not the most articulate person in the world. I didn’t even necessarily take it to mean that he was saying that homosexuality was a belief. The main message was that he wanted to accept others and he wanted them to accept him. 2. That all being said, Danny is a conservative fundamentalist Christian. I don’t think that he can be expected in the course of 5 or 6 months to change everything that he has been believing for his life. If this is going to happen, it would take time. Unfortunately, I personally feel that with the way he’s been treated, it would do nothing but to make him feel like clinging to his religion, and I suppose all at entails. Just my guess.

    And make no mistake, Danny was being clobbered by everyone way before any kind of gay issue was ever brought up by him. Every facial expression, every word out of his mouth during his chats on tv, the clothes he wore, really everything he did was ragged on. He was constantly called a tool and a jerk….and he really had not done anything. When he didn’t get signed and the others did, people gloated and mocked. Yes, people have a right to do this. But it was still hateful

    The hate has been going on since at least mid April….the first time I ventured online. To be honest, I was utterly shocked at what I read. And I personally feel it is very hypocritical to have participated in that hate and then get all upset about any other type of hate.

    Hate is ALWAYS wrong.

    Edit: Let me just say once again, for the record, I am pro gay rights. I am not a Christian, but rather agnostic. I do think the way to fight against any form of hate is not to reciprocate with hate. I don’t think we are going to change the veiws of conservative Christians overnight, and I don’t think bashing them and ridiculing them in the name of your “cause” will do ANYTHING to make them see them light.

    I am really tired of this topic and ready to move on. I’m sure there are an endless amount of comments that we can make and we will all never agree here. I like both Danny and Adam, and I really wish everyone could just get along…pipe dream, I know.

  • revcat

    This was posted June 5, apparently Twitter has been used to attack Sarver because of his “in a godly way” statement.

    http://www.idletard.com/blog/archives/8355#more-8355

    I don’t really like Sarver or Gokey but am thinking all this Twit-crap is for the birds! Who needs it? Yes, you can block people but when it amounts to hundreds of tweeters, isn’t that time consuming?

    Seems like a “celebrity” having a Twitter account is like hanging a “Kick Me” sign around your neck.

    It won’t stop with Saver & Gokey.

  • revcat

    Sorry I somehow double posted when I was editing, misspelled Sarver as Saver, ironically. Anyway here is the tail end I attempted to add:

    Kris is right, Twitter is the devil’s work!
    :furious_tb:

  • aek

    Oh and just to respond to one other thing.

    About the above post. I am trying to understand these people (Adam’s brother and Danny’s cousin). For some reason people always think that if you try to understand the motivations behind something, you are excusing it. I am not excusing it, and am simply trying to get in their heads as best I can.

    I do think those comments made by friends of the girl are dispicable. But really, I didn’t even bother to read those. Friends of his cousin have EVEN LESS to do with Danny than his cousin…if that’s possible.

    Do you really want to start to get into what the friends of cousins think about the contestents? Really? To me, this is starting to get CRAZY.

  • terfra

    Danny appears to Pretend that he is devoid of intellectual curiosity – he definitely appears to be a mean spirited person. Hiding behind the à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“Oh I am a christian so how can I be mean? act – he really should go into acting, I think he would do so much better there than singing

    See, I don’t see where Danny has been mean spirited at any time.
    I have not seen where he didn’t get along well with all the idols, or said anything wrong.
    I really don’t see any difference between him or Adam and Kris in actions, words, or deeds.

    Danny never brought these things up or judged anyone.
    He can’t help that he is a Christian and shouldn’t have to apologise for it.
    I’m sure Adam feels that way about himself also.
    Adam said he is who he is and proud of it.
    Thats his right. But Danny has his right too.
    Some don’t agree with Adam and some don’t with Danny either.
    I guess I don’t understand the hating part just because of not agreeing with someone.
    I do not believe Adam hates Danny, or Danny hates Adam. I think there is mutual respect between them and acceptance of who they are.
    I truly don’t think that Danny, with the heart he has to help misfortunate kids and families, has a mean bone in his body.
    I think he has been the most misunderstood idol I have ever seen on the show.

    I think alot of the negativity on the internet causing Danny to be spurned, was because the issue of gayness came up this season with Adam, and sensitivities flared.
    Danny just happened to be one with the Christian background that teaches against that, and imo has been unjustly treated.
    I don’t believe these issues would have come up otherwise, and Danny was just unfortunate to be on with Adam this year. It may have happened to Kris without Danny being there.
    There have been many Christians that have been on AI every year with no doubt the same belief system as Danny.
    But he really hasn’t done anything but appear on the show and sing.

    I think thats all I am saying about this dead horse subject. I can’t help giving the other view in defense of Danny, or trying to be a voice for him.
    There are only about 3 Danny fans here on this thread and everyone else doesn’t like Danny, so I’m trying to just give my opinion without insulting or criticizing posters here.
    Thats not the intention for sure, just my point of view on Danny and who he really is.

  • Kradamfan

    Remember this?

    http://unapprovedroad.blogspot.com/2009/06/we-get-to-carry-each-other.html

    Love Kradam, let’s try to get this evolved before we die.

    :cool1_tb:

  • undercooked

    Wow, this topic certainly surpassed the Jeff Archeulta story. Yes, Danny got the “twit” kicked out of him but I suspect he ignored most of those messages once he knew what the gist of the comments were. I am very interested in what AI’s view is on tweeter-gate. Were there meetings held about it and how to handle it? I swear the PR department on AI has had to work overtime this season. And let’s face it, all of the idols have twitter now. Can you imagine them logging in seeing “dannyisadouche” trending at #1? I’m sure they had to have talked about it among themselves. I’ve only just started using twitter so I don’t know all of the ins and outs, but wow, it is fascinating. I was directed to the Danny twitter by a poster here. Once I saw it, I did ask myself “to twit or not to twit” question, but in the end, I decided to let this particular twit train pass me by. It was late at night and I was ready for bed.

    I still think that overall this was a learning experience for Danny and his family. Adam has been the target of horrible comments his whole teen and adult life. For Danny, it’s only been going on for a couple of months. Maybe this will help Danny to understand what it is like to be judged and misunderstood by people who don’t know you. Sometimes you really can’t understand what someone goes through until you do walk in their shoes. If Danny is a clueless as everyone says he is, maybe this woke him up. Maybe he can influence and educate his family.

    This AI season doesn’t appear to be a “run of the mill” season. I wasn’t around until the tail end of last year, so I can’t compare, so what does everyone else think?

  • lostinidol

    He canà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t help that he is a Christian and shouldnà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t have to apologise for it.
    Ià ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢m sure Adam feels that way about himself also.
    Adam said he is who he is and proud of it.
    Thats his right. But Danny has his right too.

    Christianity is a choice. Danny could choose to become a Jew tomorrow or a Muslim or an agnostic. Adam can not choose to become a heterosexual. He can choose to live a heterosexual lifestyle despite how his brain is wired. He can deny his sexual desires directed at those of the same sex or he can choose celibacy. But Adam cannot become a heterosexual.

    No one is denying Danny’s right to be proud of who he is or his right to speak out on what he believes. However, the days when Danny was saying these things to his church of fellow believers are over. Danny chose the public spotlight and he chose to speak out. He could have just as easily said that Adam’s personal life is none of his business. Instead, Danny, by his comments, made clear he does not understand the most basic aspects of being gay. It is not only our right, but it is our responsiblity as human beings, to correct him and not allow his misinformation to be spread. I am sure he feels plenty of pressure as he probably has never been exposed to different beliefs or at least allowed to consider them. But he is an adult, and not even a young adult, and if he wants a public career, this is his education on what the public is thinking.

  • BootStar

    This just sums it all up for me!

  • Tess

    BootStar
    Jun 19th, 2009 at 8:28 pm
    This just sums it all up for me!

    thank you, thank you, thank you….

    this said it all!!

  • Cakenbake

    noctem seizure worte:

    Oh and as to the poster above, who reiterated the theme yet again that Krisà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“actions speak louder than wordsà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ , I addressed that. He can demonstrate love to another person without approving of everything they do. Actions may speak louder than words, but they donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t tell you what the words inside a personà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s head say either.

    “actions do speak louder than words”. noctem seizure, you are aware that SEVEN out of the top 10 Idols have deep Christian backgrounds, including Danny Gokey, not just Kris.

    Matt is a devout Christian, who started off singing and performing in his church. Many of his cd tracks are Christian themed music. Lil grew up singing in a choir like her mother in a evangelical church in Memphis TN. Michael is leader in his evangelical church in Texas. Allison grew up a devout Catholic and I have seen her in church photos that were taken recently. Scott performed in his church and also sings Christian songs.

    What I have seen is that many of them seem open minded to me and some don’t because “actions do speak louder than words”.

    In California 60 percent of Latinos and a whopping over 70 percent of African-Americans voted yes on 8 against Gay rights.

    So would you go down the line and ask each and every one of the contestants what they think of the Gay lifesytle?

    That would be rather fascist don’t you think…and I am Gay.

    What a way to make the tour WORSE and uncomfortable for Adam.

    As for me “people’s actions do speak louder than words.” and what I have seen from Kris it is pretty clear that he is accepting of Adam as a person and doesn’t judge him for being Gay…and that is why I like Kris.

  • lostinidol

    Oh and as to the poster above, who reiterated the theme yet again that Krisà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s à ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã…“actions speak louder than wordsà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬ , I addressed that. He can demonstrate love to another person without approving of everything they do. Actions may speak louder than words, but they donà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢t tell you what the words inside a personà ¢Ã¢â€š ¬Ã¢â€ž ¢s head say either.

    Actually, they have a word for this. Hypocrite. How does it work exactly? Kris comes up behind Adam when Adam is speaking to the press just after the final show and Kris throws his arms around Adam. But Kris thinks, “I will demonstrate love to Adam just for show but I really think gays are sinful and abhorrent in the eyes of God.”

    Sorry, but no matter how you try to paint the picture, either Kris is demonstrating Christ’s love or he is not. There are no astericks allowed for Kris’ private thoughts.