Idol Sales News ‘“ Week Ending 01/03/10

This is always an interesting week for numbers. It contains the second half of iTunes Giftcard Week, so it usually boasts some impressive single download numbers. Meanwhile, the January doldrums are in full force with massive drops on the album side. So, the numbers watchers wait with both eager and grim anticipation.

That anticipation will have to wait a little longer because there are no numbers yet. Please post them as you find them. Sometimes, like a ripping off a band-aid, it’s just better to get the pain over with quickly.

Update 1: And now we have download numbers. Thanks consumedbywords!
Updated 2: Now we have album numbers, too.

Idol Sales Numbers (Billboard Date 1/16/10)

Single Downloads27 Kris Allen “Live Like We’re” 86, 824 (-20%; lw 109, 200) Total: 486, 240 (33)
32 Carrie Underwood “Cowboy Casanova” 82, 400 (-34%; lw 124, 008) Total: 915, 174 (25)
43 Kelly Clarkson “Already Gone” 62, 901 (-28%; lw 86, 894) Total: 1, 068, 082 (41)
68 Daughtry “Life After You” 44, 470 (-13%; lw 51, 212) Total: 200, 897 (78)
80 Adam Lambert “Whataya Want From Me” 38, 422 (-16%; lw 45, 843) Total: 135, 893 (94)

Album
17 Carrie Underwood “Play On” 33, 501 (-78%; lw 152, 873) Total: 1, 183, 086
36 Adam Lambert “For Your Entertainment” 17, 236 (-72%; lw 61, 683) Total: 433, 834
63 Daughtry “Leave This Town” 11, 922 (-65%; lw 34, 053) Total: 881, 621
91 Kris Allen “Kris Allen” 8, 565 (-71%; lw 29, 495) Total: 227, 970
159 Kelly Clarkson “All I Ever Wanted” 5, 020 (-64%; lw 13, 948) Total: 815, 483
185 Daughtry “Daughtry” 4, 323 (-63%; lw 11, 681) Total: 4, 613, 395
186 Allison Iraheta “Just Like You” 4, 298 (-64%; lw 11, 884) Total: 74, 309
Carrie Underwood “Carnival Ride” 4K (-74%) Total: 3.045M
Carrie Underwood “Some Hearts” 3K (-73%) Total: 6.197M
Kellie Pickler “Kellie Pickler” 3K (-62%) Total: 372K

Rounded number from Brian at Idol Chatter

Airplay:

No. 9 – Kelly Clarkson (+2.8 million)
No. 60 – Kris Allen (+0.8 million)
No. 92 – Carrie Underwood (+3.1 million)
No. 101 – Daughtry (+0.9 million)
No. 142 – Adam Lambert (+1.2 million)

Streaming:
No. 10 Already Gone

Last week’s Numbers

About Kirsten 3046 Articles
Kirsten has had a long love affair with numbers. Marry that with her love of cheese and the Numbers Threads at MJs were born.

312 Comments

  1. Sales:

    33 27 ALLEN*KRIS LIVE LIKE WE’RE DYING 86824 -20 109200 486240
    25 32 UNDERWOOD*CARRIE COWBOY CASANOVA 82400 -34 124008 915174
    41 43 CLARKSON*KELLY ALREADY GONE 62901 -28 86894 1068082
    78 68 DAUGHTRY LIFE AFTER YOU 44470 -13 51212 200897
    94 80 LAMBERT*ADAM WHATAYA WANT FROM ME 38422 -16 45843 135893

    Airplay:

    No. 9 – Kelly Clarkson (+2.8 million)
    No. 60 – Kris Allen (+0.8 million)
    No. 92 – Carrie Underwood (+3.1 million)
    No. 101 – Daughtry (+0.9 million)
    No. 142 – Adam Lambert (+1.2 million)

    Streaming:

    No. 10 Already Gone

  2. Well damn Kris! I knew it would be another great singles week, and it did not disappoint. Whoo to the hoo.

  3. Wow, great numbers for Kris and Carrie–still over 80,000! Looks like LLWD will definitely be gold next week. I guess then, it can officially be a golden flop!

  4. HDD is reporting Adam sold 16,469 albums last week. This brings his total album sales to 433,469. He is ranked 34. This is the 6th consecutive week he is in the top 50 albums so thats good.

  5. Looks the like the big iTunes boost are the first two days after Xmas.
    But this is still a good week until things go back to normal. LLWD is def going goid next week. That’s a lock.

  6. Wow, very very nice download week. Kris will be hitting gold next week!

    Thanks for posting those numbers!

  7. Wow LLWD really has alot of love again this week. Am so happy for Kris.

  8. I swear I hear LLWD every time I turn on the radio on any of the channels here in the DC area – that is awesome that it will go gold next week.

  9. Adam needs about 67,000 more albums to go gold so I’m thinking beginning of February. I don’t think it’ll happen in time for his birthday which is the end of this month.

  10. I guess then, it can officially be a golden flop!

    And next week the watch begins for the Platinum flop!

  11. Yay, there will be a first S8 gold single next week. Next milestone – Adam’s album should go gold sometime in February.

  12. Solid numbers for all the Idols listed here. Really excited about Kris going gold next week.

  13. Awesome numbers for Kris! Gold by the time Idol starts. First gold single from Season 8!

    And another platinum single from Carrie soon! Perfect single to start off Play On era.

  14. Woohoo!!! Go Kris!!! I hope he sells more in the coming weeks. That goes for both single and album.

  15. I have to laugh, though. Now the prospect of a gold single and a gold album get everybody all excited. While not too long ago, a “merely” gold single or album from an idol winner or high runner-up was widely considered a big flop.

    I’m actually glad that’s changed. Always good when more realism enters the picture, to me.

    Hurrah for Kris (and LLWD, which I’ve always liked), and, a month or two from now, Hurrah for Adam, as well. They just have to keep plugging away, as other musicians do.

  16. Oh and the gold for LLWD (still hate it) rocks hard. So happy for Kris.

    ETA: As Kris isn’t in the top 50 selling albums, news about how his and Allison’s albums are what day again? I forget. I blame my work schedule of the past 6 weeks.

  17. So true. Back in the day (a year ago), platinum was expected for both Archie and Cook’s singles. And Cook’s album had some people expecting another multi-plat breakout like Daughtry.

    Gold used to get you dropped from your label. :) We’re in a new reality for Idol.

  18. Gold used to get you dropped from your label. We’re in a new reality for Idol.

    I think we’re in a new reality for the music industry – album sales are gonna keep getting worse (unless you’re SuBo). Other ways to generate money are gonna become more and more important.

  19. Quick Cut Data – LLWD

    POP: 2734 (+16)
    HAC: 2348 (+9)
    VH1: 10 (+2)

    Published Reports

    POP:
    26 26 KRIS ALLEN Live Like We’re Dying 2318 2250 68 12.689
    +9 Spins
    +0 Bullet
    +0.035 AI

    HAC:
    12 12 KRIS ALLEN Live Like We’re Dying 2164 1956 208 10.734
    +9 Spins
    -26 Bullet
    +0.157 AI

    AC:
    118 37 KRIS ALLEN Live Like We’re Dying 33 13 20 0.313
    +0 Spins
    -4 Bullet
    -0.011 AI

    CAC:
    202 49 KRIS ALLEN Live Like We’re Dying 59 21 38 0.226
    +1 Spin
    -7 Bullet
    +0.001 AI

    POP:
    34 34 ADAM LAMBERT Whataya Want From Me 1466 1471 -5 10.579
    +9 Spins
    -28 Bullet
    +0.025 AI

    HAC:
    44 41 ADAM LAMBERT Whataya Want From Me 277 238 39 1.631
    +4 Spins
    +4 Bullet
    +0.007 AI

  20. Great single week!!
    Can’t be happier for Kris!! Gold next week and who knows ..it may well go platinium too!!

  21. barnie
    01/06/2010 at 10:26 am

    Awesome numbers for Kris! Gold by the time Idol starts. First gold single from Season 8!

    Speaking of Season9, Kris should debut the 2nd single on Idol stage. That would be more viewers than Leno, Letterman, Ellen and Today Show combined.

  22. Other ways to generate money are gonna become more and more important.

    ITA. I guess that’s why people are hearing Red Guitar in the grocery store, lol.

    Seriously, though, in this sales climate (SuBo notwithstanding), Gold seems to be the new Platinum.

  23. I’m actually glad that’s changed. Always good when more realism enters the picture, to me.

    It has changed because neither the winner or runner up are selling that much, which prevents some fanwars. Not long ago (and I’m talking a few months) they were still expected to sell platinum. And honestly, selling plat of an album may be harder these days, but single sales are going up, so it should be easier to sell plat singles each year.

  24. WTG Kris! I’m so happy for him.

    Regarding album sales, we are going to get some numbers today as well, right? (I’m also hitting F5 at Idol Chatter. LOL). Hopefully Kris’ album sales did not drop as much, considering the iTunes sales last week had a slight bump…

  25. on allaccess.com, they were predicting Kris’ album sales dropped 69%. Which would mean he sold less than 10,000. Hopefully that’s wrong, but I’m braced for it to be more or less correct.

  26. Well hopefully RCA will change their dropping of artists who sell less than platinum in Albums. I am glad Kris’s single is doing well.

  27. ITA. I guess that’s why people are hearing Red Guitar in the grocery store, lol.

    Now you’re talking! Tie ins to grocery and other retail stores – subliminal messages to make you buy a product, with a portion of the sales going to the label – I am SOOO running with that idea ;-)

    BTW – those numbers are great for Kris, but I gotta say I still am not really digging the song – I realized, upon hearing it the other day, that it’s mainly because of some of the lyrics, oddly enough – something about hearing about plane and car crashes is just something I DNW while driving down the highway. But that’s just me :-) Heard a coworker the other day bopping along to LLWD, so it’s definitely an earworm.

  28. Seriously, though, in this sales climate (SuBo notwithstanding), Gold seems to be the new Platinum.

    For albums maybe, not singles. Or, what leome said. :)

    Still, Kris did not start out with the typical Idol buying frenzy to boost his single numbers up, so he’s doing it the old fashioned way. Plus his genre isn’t known as this great singles genre. In that sense, gold is good. Plus the song’s run isn’t even ever yet. I’m very happy for Kris right now.

  29. Seriously, though, in this sales climate (SuBo notwithstanding), Gold seems to be the new Platinum.

    I also think that at the rate of sales in the industry nowadays, if it continues to deteriorate, they need to change the definition of gold and platinum for albums (not singles). Otherwise, there will be hardly anyone reaching platinum status.

  30. Kate8
    01/06/2010 at 10:49 am
    Well hopefully RCA will change their dropping of artists who sell less than platinum in Albums. I am glad Kris’s single is doing well.

    See, in Adam’s case, I gotta believe they’re making money off of him in a number of different ways. Sure, only time will tell, but he is positioned to be much more of a “brand”, which is how they kinda started building him up from the get go. I think he has the potential to spread in a number of different directions much more than, say, even successful artists like Daughtry – who really is just bringing in the money through the singles, albums, and tours.

    And I know that the argument will come up that it’s what the LABEL will get, regardless of what kind of money Adam himself brings in. But who really knows what kind of deals are made now between the artists and labels – we can debate and wonder, but don’t really know for sure unless we have an insider willing to spill the beans. And with the music landscape changing so much, I bet new kinds of deals that were once unorthodox are far more common. JMO.

  31. I also think that at the rate of sales in the industry nowadays, if it continues to deteriorate, they need to change the definition of gold and platinum for albums (not singles). Otherwise, there will be hardly anyone reaching platinum status.

    I don’t think they will or should change it. Only 15 albums went platinum last year, about half as many as the year before, those albums deserved to be singled out for achieving a feat that hundreds of other albums didn’t.

  32. See, in Adam’s case, I gotta believe they’re making money off of him in a number of different ways.

    What other ways, besides the music, has RCA started to make money off of Adam? Maybe at some point he will branch out into other areas, but that hasn’t happened yet.

  33. See, in Adam’s case, I gotta believe they’re making money off of him in a number of different ways. Sure, only time will tell, but he is positioned to be much more of a “brand”, which is how they kinda started building him up from the get go. I think he has the potential to spread in a number of different directions much more than, say, even successful artists like Daughtry – who really is just bringing in the money through the singles, albums, and tours.

    I agree with the general sense expressed here, that Adam is being positioned as more of a pop culture celebrity presence than past idols, and that there are a lot of ways to make money off that status that has nothing to do with records sales (endorsements, appearances, concert tickets, etc). But, I wouldn’t say Daughtry is “just” making money off of singles, albums and tours… he made A LOT of money off those things, and is still making it. He’s doing his thing, and Adam will find a way to do his.

  34. What other ways, besides the music, has RCA started to make money off of Adam? Maybe at some point he will branch out into other areas, but that hasn’t happened yet.

    Well, tbh I have no idea about many of the ins-and-outs with this sorta thing, and this isn’t exactly the kind of example I want to run with (for obvious reasons), but case in point are people like Speidi (or other reality stars) – I really don’t know that they actually DO anything, they don’t make music (or at least not anything that’s selling), they aren’t huge movie stars – yet I would not be surprised in the least if they were millionaires.

    So, take that fwiw (and I’m not saying Adam is like Speidi, dear god no, I just used that as an example of some celebs probably making a lot more money than you’d assume they’d be capable of, through other kinds of deals.)

  35. Well hopefully RCA will change their dropping of artists who sell less than platinum in Albums.

    Either way, I don’t see a problem for any of the idols signed under RCA right now.

  36. I don’t think they will or should change it. Only 15 albums went platinum last year, about half as many as the year before, those albums deserved to be singled out for achieving a feat that hundreds of other albums didn’t.

    Certifications for singles have been changed before (I think previously it was 1 million for Gold), so I don’t see why it is totally out of the question for them to change it for albums in the future.

    Different certifications don’t take away credit from the highly successful albums, it only gives more credit to the albums that managed to chug along with 500K-600K in this horrible sales climate. Just my personal opinion.

  37. But, I wouldn’t say Daughtry is “just” making money off of singles, albums and tours… he made A LOT of money off those things, and is still making it. He’s doing his thing, and Adam will find a way to do his.

    Lol – well just because I used the word “just” – doesn’t mean that I’m talking about a small, inconsequential amount of money ;-) Selling platinum has certainly brought in lots of money, and what I meant by “just” is that he isn’t as likely (imo – have no idea for sure) to be making as much on things OUTSIDE of the music – but that hardly matters when you’re making plenty on the music ;-)

    Just trying to be positive before we go back into “so and so is gonna be dropped” territory.

  38. S8 was the first season where I saw most of the episodes and it makes me feel really protective somehow of the top 10 contestants and I really want them all to do well. Like others slightly worried about Allison but I’m sure Jive will give her time. Her swansong when she got booted off was incredible and that’s when I really noticed how good she was.

    Not really keen on LLWD as it makes me feel weird but so happy that at the very least Kris will get a gold single. Not sure if I’m in the minority here but I really want ‘The Truth’ to be Kris’s 2nd single when the time comes.

    Congrats to Adam as well as he is also destined to at least get a gold album and hoping for great things from Danny who was my 2nd favorite on the show!

  39. Just trying to be positive before we go back into “so and so is gonna be dropped” territory.

    Ha. It seems to be an inevitable conversation every week. :)

  40. Babybelle32 – I completely agree with you. Those albums went platinum for a reason. They stood out, and people bought them, because something about the artist and /or album resonated with the buying public!

  41. Lol – well just because I used the word “just” – doesn’t mean that I’m talking about a small, inconsequential amount of money ;-) Selling platinum has certainly brought in lots of money, and what I meant by “just” is that he isn’t as likely (imo – have no idea for sure) to be making as much on things OUTSIDE of the music – but that hardly matters when you’re making plenty on the music ;-)

    Oh no, I know what you meant. I’m just saying that while Daughtry may not have as many revenue streams open as someone like Beyonce, those that are are kicking some major bootay. RCA is very happy with dude right about now. So I think we are saying the same thing.

    Adam ain’t gonna be dropped. Nobody’s saying that. I hope. LOL

    Different certifications don’t take away credit from the highly successful albums, it only gives more credit to the albums that managed to chug along with 500K-600K in this horrible sales climate. Just my personal opinion.

    I agree with this. 1,000,000 records would get a new designation, like “Diamond” or something. It would still be acknowledged.

  42. Either way, I don’t see a problem for any of the idols signed under RCA right now.

    Me neither. All the RCA folks seem to me to have at least the strong *potential* to produce solid sales either as very mainstream artists or as strong niche artists. They all have at least the promise of solid and continuing marketability, I’d say. …. Until they prove otherwise, I guess.

  43. Well hopefully RCA will change their dropping of artists who sell less than platinum in Albums

    No label has a roster of recording artists comprised solely of platinum album sellers. RCA is no different. They have artists who have less than platinum album sales. RCA has not dropped every artist who has failed to have a platinum debut album.

  44. If SuBo can sell 3 million albums in a few weeks, then it’s still possible to sell well. Therefore, I don’t see platinum/gold qualifications being changed any time soon.

  45. pug – ITA – when I get defensive about ANY of the idols this year (lol – oh, that never happens ;-)) it’s really because I believe a lot of them were incredibly strong this year. Adam, Kris and Allison were not only very solid talents on AI, but came out with strong albums. When I get frustrated with a lack of anyone being SuBo level big, it’s generally with that sense that they all really deserve long successful careers in music.

    And ITA about Allison – watching these reruns of the early AI eps, she was so amazing on the show – really strong presence and vocals – imo she and Adam owned it in the Group 2 and MJ shows.

  46. If SuBo can sell 3 million albums in a few weeks, then it’s still possible to sell well. Therefore, I don’t see platinum/gold qualifications being changed any time soon.

    LOL – um, you DO realize what an outlier SuBo is, though, right? No one is even close to those sales numbers. She is a rare perfect storm. And one like that comes around once every 10 years or something ;-)

  47. So I think we are saying the same thing.

    Adam ain’t gonna be dropped. Nobody’s saying that. I hope. LOL

    Yes – we’re on the same page :-)

    Oddly enough, I loved Daughtry so much, and was so defensive about him his season, but once he became big, I kinda lost interest, and I literally think a part of me was like, oh, well, he’s doing so well on his own, phew, I can step back and just let him ride :-)

    With Adam now, it’s much more of a “I want him to get close to that success, too (someday)” and until he does I’ll have to keep agonizing over it!

  48. Different certifications don’t take away credit from the highly successful albums, it only gives more credit to the albums that managed to chug along with 500K-600K in this horrible sales climate. Just my personal opinion.

    Rather than changing the certification levels that currently exist, I’d prefer if the US went to the model of some other countries and added a “silver” certification, perhaps for albums that sell over 300K. Gold albums will still be noted and acknowledged, platinum albums will still be noted and acknowledged, and we won’t have to fuss with renaming previously certified multi-platinum and diamond albums.

    Honestly, what would the new name for those major sellers of the past be? Titanium?

    That said, I don’t think SuBo sales should be used as a market guide. That HuffPo piece flat-out admitted that Columbia went after a market segment that doesn’t buy music through normal retail channels (or, I’m guessing, much music at all). That’s why you could get the CD on QVC and at drugstores. It’s not an approach that would work for a lot of contemporary artists.

  49. Aileen makes an excellent point. Susan Boyle came out with a record at the same time as the Idol’s did, and she managed to sell 3 million in this awful maket. And in a very short amount of time, I should add!Something about her must have resonated with the buying public.

    I have a question – has anyone heard her album? I have not. I actually don’t know of anyone in my little world, who bought or received her album.

  50. Rather than changing the certification levels that currently exist, I’d prefer if the US went to the model of some other countries and added a “silver” certification, perhaps for albums that sell over 300K. Gold albums will still be noted and acknowledged, platinum albums will still be noted and acknowledged, and we won’t have to fuss with renaming previously certified multi-platinum and diamond albums.

    I think that’ll work!

  51. I swear I hear LLWD every time I turn on the radio on any of the channels here in the DC area – that is awesome that it will go gold next week.

    @tierbee: What stations in the DC area have you been listening to? I have yet to hear LLWD. Grant it, the only time I listen to the radio is during my drive to/from work. I don’t really listen to Pop radio stations, but I will be willing to tune in so that I can hear LLWD. Sigh, the things I do for Kris! :-)

  52. I have a question – has anyone heard the album? I have not. I actually don’t know of anyone in my little world, who bought or recieved her album.

    LOL – neither have I – even friends who loved the youtube didn’t buy the album.

    Which goes back to theory #1 – Simon Cowell bought up all those albums (j/k – er, maybe)

  53. Adam still needs his music to hit big for him to become a “brand” or make some big pop culture impact. Right now that’s not happening. His first single flopped and the second is doing ok but it has yet to be relevant.
    We will see what kind of tour Adam has. That and the merch may make more money than his singles.

  54. nekola – I hear it on 99.5 in DC – haven’t heard it on 107.3 yet (which surprised me, they still play “Crush”)

  55. Adam still needs his music to hit big for him to become a “brand” or make some big pop culture impact. Right now that’s not happening. His first single flopped and the second is doing ok but it has yet to be relevant.
    We will see what kind of tour Adam has. That and the merch may make more money than his singles.

    Yes, that’s true. I think WWFM is making a lot of good progress though (still lots of adds coming in, and some more growth on HAC). The holidays messed up its momentum on the charts a bit (as in, LLWD had much better timing, to come out earlier and build up nicely on the charts before the holiday freeze, which positioned it well for the itunes download numbers too). WWFM, otoh, was just gaining momentum and had only been out a short amount of time before the holiday freeze took hold.

  56. Aileen makes an excellent point. Susan Boyle came out with records at the same time as the Idol’s did, and she managed to sell 3 million in this awful maket. Something about her resonated with the buying public.

    Well, I think that a lot of people who are not regular music buyers (or at least not recent buyers) bought her album because they saw a woman who looked like them, was their age group, and sang songs they knew in a pleasant manner. There is clearly a unfilled market for this type of stuff as evidenced by the success in the last few years of Babs, Buble, Groban, Bocelli etc. Also the Rod Stewart and Manilow songbook stuff has done really well also — again people over 40 (or 50 or 60!) singing songs everyone already knows.
    Kris and Adam are contemporary artists — they are not going to appeal to the majority of SuBo’s audience. and then there are all of the other factors people have already discussed (the kitsch factor, the good grandma gift, the qvc sales etc. etc.)
    I also think that there was something “novel” about SuBo…she is from england on a show that isn’t shown in the us and people knew her from youtube video and/or meredith vieira’s incessant today show coverage. AI is not novel anymore…

  57. Does anyone have a link or know how I can see the “top selling” singles for the week outside of Idol. Thanks.

  58. Rather than changing the certification levels that currently exist, I’d prefer if the US went to the model of some other countries and added a “silver” certification, perhaps for albums that sell over 300K. Gold albums will still be noted and acknowledged, platinum albums will still be noted and acknowledged, and we won’t have to fuss with renaming previously certified multi-platinum and diamond albums.

    That’s a great idea. I think it should be for albums that sell 250K.

    Adam still needs his music to hit big for him to become a “brand” or make some big pop culture impact.

    I agree. He’s positioned to be a celebrity, but he still needs a hit to back it up. Once he does that they will branch him out, I bet. They are trying to make him the “It” boy right now. Its working for TV ratings in some cases, which is helpful in making him a bigger TV star, but he needs more. In time he should get there.

  59. LOL – um, you DO realize what an outlier SuBo is, though, right?

    Of course she’s an outlier, but so are all other incredible sellers in any given year. That’s what music is all about. Someone breaks really big and it is possible to sell better than most others. She obviously accomplished enough to sell to people who are not normally music buyers as well as reality show fans. She’s a record label’s dream. She may now be a prototype for other type of marketing. Discounting her as simply an outlier doesn’t make any sense.

  60. “We will see what kind of tour Adam has. That and the merch may make more money than his singles”

    leome- judging from the idol tour and the Gridlock performances, this is where Adam is going to kill if he gets a chance and I believe RCA is well aware of it. I don’t care if he tours solo or opening/with another act, I am so there.

  61. The holidays messed up its momentum on the charts a bit

    Yeah, the holidays really are a bitch. I think last year they also sort of hurt Archie’s second single. Labels have to take that into account. I actually think RCA did well changing singles, WWFM has so much potential, it was just not the best timing for it. Maybe when things go back to normal (I don’t think they have yet) the song can start rising fast again.

  62. They are trying to make him the “It” boy right now. Its working for TV ratings in some cases, which is helpful in making him a bigger TV star, but he needs more. In time he should get there.

    I also think, being the shrewd business man that he is, that he’ll be looking to make some collabs that help him branch out as well. You can already see him (subtely) working it even for things as small as tweeting congrats to Ke$ha, Gaga, Pink, Katy Perry, etc. Or talking about his love of the Twilight series, etc. Moves like that are not necessarily gonna lead to anything, but they certainly don’t hurt in terms of getting that interest out there, put him on people’s radar, etc.

  63. His first single flopped and the second is doing ok but it has yet to be relevant.

    “Not relevant” – am I mistaken or isn’t WWFM a Top 40 hit?

  64. “Not relevant” – am I mistaken or isn’t WWFM a Top 40 hit?

    Yes it is. If my memory serves me correctly WWFM is ranked 34.

  65. “Not relevant” – am I mistaken or isn’t WWFM a Top 40 hit?

    Yes it is. If my memory serves me correctly WWFM is ranked 34.


    #34?

    What a difference a year make. Heh.

  66. Awesome single sales for Kris! I am so glad that LLWD is doing well. Can’t wait for gold next week.

    I’m in DC and 99.5 and 107.3 play LLWD. I have heard it several times and smile every damn time.

  67. #34?

    What a difference a year make. Heh.

    OMG no lie. LMAO!

    But overall I think its good that folks seem to be backing off the Idols a bit.

    That is, until next year when someone explodes out of the gate a la Daughtry and Carrie. Then it will be back on. LOL

  68. OMG OMG OMG!!! LLWD going GOLD!!!!!!!!!! HAPPY SO HAPPY!!!
    I’ve always adored this song… ever since I heard the 30 second snippet. It’s sooo effing catchy!
    GO Kris Allen!!!!! You Sexy Little Beast!!!!

    Oooh Diane :)!! Thanks for the B.B. King’s Blues Club info. Kris was very well received there.

    “Oh my word. Kristopher Freakin Allen!! Sorry, got a little fangirly there!”
    LOL!!!!!! Right there with you Diane!!! ;)

  69. To me, the most interesting unanswered question about Susan B is whether a lot of her cd buyers could be converted to regular music buyers if more music and musicians that hit their sweet spot actually were well marketed to them, or whether they are really not inclined to buy music but bought her cd as more of a “phenomenon” of some sort. I suspect the latter is true, in which case her sales may not actually be of much analytical significance to the industry — in terms of understanding how to drive more sales. But who knows?

  70. girlygirl
    01/06/2010 at 10:48 am
    on allaccess.com, they were predicting Kris’ album sales dropped 69%. Which would mean he sold less than 10,000. Hopefully that’s wrong, but I’m braced for it to be more or less correct.

    :lol: Never underestimate Kris Allen, right?! Time and time again he proves the naysayers wrong. I love it!! :grin:

  71. Even with the decline in CD sales there are still names out there who can defeat the odds and sell well. Not just SuBo but look at Taylor Swift and more recently Justin Bieber who remained amazingly consistent since his EP came out. I didnt expect Adam or Kris to sell platinum out of the gate or anything but I certainly didn’t expect Adam’s CD to be in the 30’s at this point or Kris to be out of the Top 50. Daughtry didn’t explode with airplay immediately and it took time for Its Not Over to make a big impact yet with his debut he spent WEEKS and weeks in the Top 10.

  72. Even with the decline in CD sales there are still names out there who can defeat the odds and sell well. Not just SuBo but look at Taylor Swift and more recently Justin Bieber who remained amazingly consistent since his EP came out.

    Of course Taylor S and Justin B are both selling a lot to quite young kids, I think, for whom music/entertainment buying may be their highest spending category, for whom parents may still buy some of the music, and many of whom may not yet have caught on to downloading free. Plus, Taylor S is officially country, and that’s a genre where fans still are buying in greater numbers than they do elsewhere, apparently.

    I’m not convinced that their sales tell us much more about the possibility of big sales for non-tween-oriented, non-country, and non-phenomenon-a-la-Susan-B artists than Susan B’s sales do. …. Seems to me that all three are in special categories that may go by completely different rules than the rest of the musicians out there, in their thousands.

  73. Even with the decline in CD sales there are still names out there who can defeat the odds and sell well. Not just SuBo but look at Taylor Swift and more recently Justin Bieber who remained amazingly consistent since his EP came out.

    I agree with lucy in response to this, and wanted to add that, sure there are other successes now, but that doesn’t go against the fact that SuBo really is a pretty extreme outlier. After all, Taylor S sold a lot, but SuBo threatened to overtake in 5 weeks what she did in sales all year – that is pretty incredible – and this is talking about Taylor S, who is doing very very well on her own.

    To take that another step further, Taylor S has been out a lot longer, as have been a lot of other artists currently ahead of the guys on the albums chart, and they’ve had much more of a history of success, so comparing the newbies to them is not really fair imo.

    And as for Beiber – well, I guess the teeny boppers still buy a lot of music, but I don’t get that kid at all :-)

    ETA: I don’t know the exact timing of this, but wasn’t Daughtry helped a ton by the success of It’s Not Over, which became a huge hit (hey, I actually heard it pretty early on in DC!) not that long after the drop of the album?

  74. There is no news yet on the Billboard site about sales but MTV supposedly has some rounded figures.

    Susan Boyle Is Billboard #1 For Sixth-Straight Week

    It’s becoming clear that you can’t stop Susan Boyle, you can only hope to contain her. Actually, nobody has even been able to do that yet. The “Britain’s Got Talent” star will hold on to the top spot on the Billboard 200 chart for an amazing sixth week in a row, thanks to another 137,000 units shifted, according to figures provided by Nielsen SoundScan. And while her sales over the New Year’s week dipped by more than 70 percent, Boyle still managed to steam past the 3 million mark in just six weeks.

    http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1629127/20100106/lady_gaga.jhtml

  75. Even with the decline in CD sales there are still names out there who can defeat the odds and sell well. Not just SuBo but look at Taylor Swift and more recently Justin Bieber who remained amazingly consistent since his EP came out. I didnt expect Adam or Kris to sell platinum out of the gate or anything but I certainly didn’t expect Adam’s CD to be in the 30’s at this point or Kris to be out of the Top 50. Daughtry didn’t explode with airplay immediately and it took time for Its Not Over to make a big impact yet with his debut he spent WEEKS and weeks in the Top 10.

    I think there are 2 different issues here. One is overall record sales, which suck no doubt. Taylor and Beiber are selling a lot of records but in the market that existed a few years ago acts as popular as they are would be selling a lot more. Taylor Swift and Lady GaGa SHOULD be seeing something like Kelly’s Breakaway numbers… and neither one is getting anywhere near 12 million, or even 8 million. So that’s the difference. It’s just not that kind of market anymore.

    Now Idols on the other hand, IMO, seem to do well in whatever the current market is (when they are released). So your typical album from a popular idol will stay in the top 20 at least through Christmas. That did not happen this year. But I don’t think they tanked exactly. Adam did okay. The only reason its an issue is because of the massive expectations generated by the media and some of his fans. This is why you should never trash talk. LOL. Still, he has potential pop hits on his record and he should be fine in the long run. Kris, on the other hand, totally did not see Idol top-of-market sales. But, again, when it comes to the post Christmas game he is poised to do really well on HAC and may be able to pick up enoguh pop airplay too. So in the long run, both may be able to turn a nice profit IMO, and that is all that matters.

  76. LLWD going GOLD!!!!!!!!!! HAPPY SO HAPPY!!!
    I’ve always adored this song… ever since I heard the 30 second snippet. It’s sooo effing catchy!

    Haha, I liked it right away too, and I’m glad/not surprised it’s doing well ;). It’s turning out to be a nice little single for Kris. Go Kris!

  77. SashaB
    01/06/2010 at 11:53 am

    “Not relevant” – am I mistaken or isn’t WWFM a Top 40 hit?

    Yes it is. If my memory serves me correctly WWFM is ranked 34.

    —
    #34?

    What a difference a year make. Heh.

    ok, I have to respond to this, WWFM was released in the beginning of December right before the h-days and still managed to get in top 40 in 2 weeks, also managed to clime to 34 during the freeze, and IS still doing pretty well in my neck of the woods (NYC), like number 5 on the biggest pop station like Z-100 playlist along with Lady Gaga, Keisha, Black eye peas, very nice company in MHO.

    Also, just listened to the high noon countdown : WWFM is #2 (was #1 yesterday or Mon)song in NY today, has been in the top 5 for a few weeks already, so doing pretty well. Djs love Adam too, always say something nice about him when announce the song, sometimes mentioning how they love other songs on his album, ets.

    And since I am posting, yes for Kris moving along with his single, slow and steady, just like on AI, and his live performances are just getting better and better, loved him on Fox5 NYE.

    As for someone asking is anyone heard SUBO, I also don’t know anyone who has the cd or like her music, so that Simon idea is very very interesting, lol. But, jokes aside, I think that she sold as much as she did because her audience buys music (older, less computer savy) rather then stealing it. Unfortunately for AI alums, younger fans download music from before it is even available for purchase, and I will give you an example. My teenage daughter was the biggest Kris fan during the season, voting for him non-stop, convinced me to buy tour tickets, and when I asked her if she ordered the album when it came out, she said that she had it for a week already. I gave her a little lecture how you are supposed to support the artists, and she actually ordered a deluxe cd and got a signed poster from Kris Allen Official( i payed, lol) , but that is the current situation in the business.

  78. I am happy for Kris’ single sales because it bodes well for Adam’s single. What I don’t understand is why LLWD is not boosting Kris’ album sales. Isn’t that the point of having a successful single? At this rate it is going to be a loong time before he has a gold record. Maybe if they released another single? I don’t understand the music biz.

  79. I don’t know the exact timing of this, but wasn’t Daughtry helped a ton by the success of It’s Not Over, which became a huge hit (hey, I actually heard it pretty early on in DC!) not that long after the drop of the album?

    In the longrun there was major longetivity due to the success of INO and the rest of his singles, but INO didnt even go for adds until AFTER his album dropped. There was no single building for weeks and weeks. Daughtry’s sales came out of the gate huge even before INO hit big which was pretty remarkable. Lord knows he didnt have ton of expectations either

    Like I said I’m fully aware of how bad overall sales are and the huge percentage drop, but charting well still happens and lots of people remain steady. Their numbers are just on a much smaller scale than previous years. Last year David got knocked for not having Daughtry level sales even though he spent like 5 weeks in the Top 10. Obviously the actual numbers werent anywhere near Daughtry but his sales were pretty consistent.

    eta: When I say remain steady I’m not talking about album after album. I’m talking about an artists current album who stays up high on the charts.

  80. Like I said I’m fully aware of how bad overall sales are and the huge percentage drop, but charting well still happens and lots of people remain steady.

    Hmm, while it does happen, I have heard numerous reports this year about many artists with new releases this year whose new album sales were a fraction of what their last album did (and these are established artists).

  81. What other ways, besides the music, has RCA started to make money off of Adam?

    I’m just throwing some things out there.

    Adam has done a couple of paid private partys. He was also the headliner for a paid gig for New Years Eve. 4,500 people paid $150 and up for this night.
    Also, the FYE video did quite well on iTunes.
    FYE has also sold 45K thusfar outside of the US.

    Another plus I’ve wondered about is the FYE deluxe album. The deluxe version was always ahead of the regular version, yet it is $5 more. That’s $5 more for an extra song (co-written by Adam) and an interview of Adam. There’s not a lot of overhead costs involved with those two extras. Who’s pocket does that extra $5 per deluxe album sold go into?

    For that matter, what about the deluxe version of the album that was sold on AO? Wasn’t it $24.99? What did you get for an extra $13? Wasn’t it a couple of songs and a picture booklet? That album version made 2x as much as most albums sale for.

  82. eta: When I say remain steady I’m not talking about album after album. I’m talking about an artists current album who stays up high on the charts.

    Ahh, ok – I understand. But again, other than Beiber, most of the others in that position are pretty well established on their own, and have been for years (or in the case of someone like Gaga, they’ve had a huge year of great singles to boost the album).

    But, whatevs, I think peeps in general are following AI differently now. Daughtry had the support of the OMG elimination that galvinized fans to buy his cd as a means of vindication (raises hand – lol). And Adam didn’t really have that effect, imo. (heck, maybe he SHOULD have been the shocker elimination in Top 5 week ;-))

    Then you have the fact that someone like Adam, despite all the hype and excitement, still has an uphill battle in terms of convincing the general public, radio, etc. to embrace an openly gay, male artist.

    Then there’s also my stance that this year’s idols are a different batch than previous years – a bit ironic, since I actually love their music more than previous AI alum music, but what I love about it more actually makes it less marketable to the masses. It’s not as safe, not as clearcut and not as obviously radio friendly. Stuff like Daughtry, Carrie, Kelly, is positioned to do well by appealing to the largest common denominator. That’s something that I don’t think Adam’s album, or the others even, do to quite that extent. This year’s albums are a little more diverse, a little more edgy and (dare I say) even “experimental” – well, for AI albums – lol.

    Ok, just some random thoughts.

  83. I’m not sure RCA/19 made much off the Gridlock event. Wasn’t most of the money made of ticket sales earmarked to go to the Red Cross?

  84. I am happy for Kris’ single sales because it bodes well for Adam’s single. What I don’t understand is why LLWD is not boosting Kris’ album sales. Isn’t that the point of having a successful single?

    Well, traditionally, the second single is said to sell the album. So hopefully that will happen here. I’m expecting the second single to come out in Feb. or March, so he can showcase it on Idol ….

    Sometimes this doesn’t work, but, to me, Kris is very much an album-seller kind of guy. (unlike, say, Jordin, who I think is still more of a single-seller type of girl.) So I think that when people hear *two* singles of his they’re likely to realize that they like the guy and his music, not just those songs, and he’ll get more buyers. That’s my Pollyanna view, anyway.

  85. Even though acts like Taylor Swift and Justin Bieber are doing well in comparison to other acts that are out today, their numbers would look average to above average in comparison to the numbers that people put up three to five years ago. A few years ago, someone who released the number of hit singles that Taylor did would have sold more than 2.5 million albums.

    In reference to RCA making Adam into a brand, it seems like people are jumping to a lot of conclusions. Yes, his celebrity status is out pacing his music career, but that might not be the best thing, especially for a new artist, and I have yet to see RCA cash in on that celebrity. Yes, he did have the 2012 song, but it seems like it only took two weeks for RCA to try and distance Adam from that song. In hindsight, doing that song probably wasn’t a good idea, and it might have contributed to what happened to FYE.

  86. Ok been since season 5..My perception was Duaghtry was like a phoenix raising form the ashes for American Idol with expectations of international star sold out arena and so forth.The 2nd cd came out some magic was lost the expectations came down to earth with some proving for not .Who knows maybe too much hype .the economy.or even sounded too much like the first..The band is doing well and has a foothold still not the last chapter yet….Its very hard to keep the same level in pop it is more of a roller coaster ..The ones that stay in or are really international stars are lucky ,hard work.sound a little different and know how to change.

  87. I am curious about SuBo’s sales being so enormous because she has an older audience that actually buys music, instead of stealing it, (’cause those old folks aren’t skilled in computers?) Does that mean Taylor Swift has an older audience? Wasn’t she the top selling cd last year? It seems that when an artist is popular she/he moves physical cd’s. Just asking!

  88. I gave her a little lecture how you are supposed to support the artists,

    Angela, I did the same with my niece. She was filling in his ipod consistently with illegal downloads. She’s only 13 and since his friends around are doing it, she didn’t see how it was not ok. I gave her a little education on the subject. We want artists to make music? Let’s pay for it and encourage them

  89. girlygirl
    01/06/2010 at 1:07 pm
    I’m not sure RCA/19 made much off the Gridlock event. Wasn’t most of the money made of ticket sales earmarked to go to the Red Cross?

    Oh yeah, I remember seeing that! I hope that’s true then! I’m glad the organizers designated profits to go to a worthwhile cause!

  90. Adam has done a couple of paid private partys. He was also the headliner for a paid gig for New Years Eve. 4,500 people paid $150 and up for this night.
    Also, the FYE video did quite well on iTunes.
    FYE has also sold 45K thusfar outside of the US

    All of the things that you mentioned are still linked to his music. My question was, outside of his music, how is RCA making money off of Adam. For the record, videos don’t sell a lot, and we don’t even know how many Adam has sold. The gridlock event was for charity, and even though Adam may have received an appearance fee, I doubt it was a lot. I don’t exactly get how the gridlock event was different from any other concert that AI alums have done. The album selling well in other countries, also still deals with the music. People keep saying that RCA is making Adam into a brand, so that they can make money in different ways, someone mentioned how Daugtry’s success lies in album and singles sales and touring, but how Adam will be different. I just want an example of how people know this to be the case, and how has RCA made money from one of these examples.

  91. I am curious about SuBo’s sales being so enormous because she has an older audience that actually buys music, instead of stealing it, (’cause those old folks aren’t skilled in computers?) Does that mean Taylor Swift has an older audience? Wasn’t she the top selling cd last year? It seems that when an artist is popular she/he moves physical cd’s. Just asking!

    Well, my take is the groups NOT doing the illegal downloads as much are older (over 40 or 50), and very young (tweens and younger). Taylor certainly has a lot of both demographics supporting her.

    However, the illegal downloads effect every artist, not just the idols. Gaga is a good example – her largest demographic is also probably one of the more significant “music stealing” segments – yet she’s doing very well. So, when you do well – you do well. Though she may not be selling QUITE as much as she would if there weren’t any illegal downloads.

  92. well, looks like Kris and Adam will get golden in the near future. Allison just seemed to vanish and Danny….hmmm.

    anyway, congratulations to Carrie for her platinum album and soon to be platinum single. she probably wont be a ‘Global mega super star’ but heck, she is happy just being a country girl who have accomplished her dreams.

    and my girl, Lady Gaga. im surprised how well ‘Telephone’ is being recieved. it might even reach platinum w/o being selected as the next single or the help of an official video. PF 5x platinum? hell yeah!

  93. Ok, peeps. Here are the numbers from Idol Chatter:

    Carrie Underwood’s Play On was the top-selling album from an Idol, though two collections (one Glee, one Now) with either Idol tracks or Idol-related songs ranked above it.

    Glee Cast, Glee: The Music, Vol. 2 (44,000, -57 percent, 429,000)

    Carrie Underwood, Play On (34,000, -78 percent, 1.183 million)

    Glee Cast, Glee: The Music, Vol. 1 (32,000, -64 percent, 642,000)

    Adam Lambert, For Your Entertainment (17,000, -72 percent, 434,000)

    Daughtry, Leave This Town (12,000, -65 percent, 882,000)

    Kris Allen, Kris Allen (9,000, -71 percent, 228,000)

    Kelly Clarkson, All I Ever Wanted (5,000, -64, 815,000)

    Allison Iraheta, Just Like You (4,000, -64 percent, 74,000)

    Carrie Underwood, Carnival Ride (4,000, -74 percent, 3.045 million)

    Carrie Underwood, Some Hearts (3,000, -73 percent, 6.197 million)

    Kellie Pickler, Kellie Pickler (3,000, -62 percent, 372,000)

  94. babybelle32: In reference to RCA making Adam into a brand, it seems like people are jumping to a lot of conclusions. Yes, his celebrity status is out pacing his music career, but that might not be the best thing, especially for a new artist, and I have yet to see RCA cash in on that celebrity. Yes, he did have the 2012 song, but it seems like it only took two weeks for RCA to try and distance Adam from that song. In hindsight, doing that song probably wasn’t a good idea, and it might have contributed to what happened to FYE.

    If you go back and read/watch the interviews, Adam distanced himself from T4M before it was released. He specifically referred to it as a classic rock ballad that was not like of the music on his album. And he was right.

    And regarding RCA trying to make Adam a brand — IMO Adam started the effort before he was even on Idol, he continued it on Idol before he was signed by RCA, and even is the one who requested the snake for the Rolling Stone cover.

    Go back and watch Idol and the pre-Idol performance vids and you will see all of the elements of the Adam brand — from the hair to the elegantly taylored suits to the accessories. A few examples: Ring of Fire – Cat o’ nine tails accessory, the black leather rock gloves, the long coat on Mad World #2. Just my opinion, but the brand vision, the style, the personal values are Adam’s not RCA’s.

  95. I just want an example of how people know this to be the case, and how has RCA made money from one of these examples.

    I sprinkled my earlier posts with some disclaimers that this was the POTENTIAL for Adam, not the current reality (or at least not fully realized, or anywhere near being fully realized).

    I mention the potential because, more than many previous idols, he has shown signs of seguing (eventually) beyond just the music – examples would be a merchandise line (clothing or make-up), the magazines, being mentioned as a possibility for tv roles (Glee guest spot).

    As far as the dollars associated with what he may or may not have already done to add to the RCA/19 coffer by means OTHER than just the album, single, or performance sales – I said earlier that I have no idea, and unless any of us have an insider at RCA/19 – I doubt we’ll ever know for sure.

  96. “What I don’t understand is why LLWD is not boosting Kris’ album sales.”

    imo it is bc Kris is the kind of artist that builds a fanbase. Slow and steady wins the race. He has seemingly busted through the idol bubble and has begun gaining non idol fans. A lot of casual music buyers have to hear a few singles before they commit to an album.

  97. Ok been since season 5..My perception was Duaghtry was like a phoenix raising form the ashes for American Idol with expectations of international star sold out arena and so forth.The 2nd cd came out some magic was lost the expectations came down to earth with some proving for not

    The second album has sold over 800,000 copies, and should go over 900,000 this week. I think the second album sales just show how the industry has changed. The same with Carrie Underwood. Play On went platinum either last week or the week before, but her totals also show signs of being hurt by the current sales climate.

    Also, Daughtry just went on their first headlining arena tour a few months ago, they weren’t selling out any arenas on their own with the last album. RCA didn’t even try to book anything like that, because they knew that it was too much too soon for a new act. And they didn’t sell 5 million albums over night. Even though they sold the first million in a month, the rest of the sales are due to releasing one hit single after another.

    You do bring up a good point about how well Daughtry has done in other countries, so I think that’s another knock against the argument that RCA has other avenues to go with Adam than they did/do with Daughtry.

  98. All of the things that you mentioned are still linked to his music. My question was, outside of his music, how is RCA making money off of Adam.

    These things don’t happen overnight. IMHO the stage is being set now. Things are going on in he background that we won’t know about for a while. I definitely think Adam has the potential to move beyond the music. Time will tell…..

    Oops, I see Mary102 has already covered this. Well, I agree!!

  99. and my girl, Lady Gaga. im surprised how well ‘Telephone’ is being recieved. it might even reach platinum w/o being selected as the next single or the help of an official video. PF 5x platinum? hell yeah!

    For realz with Telephone? I LURVE Gaga (and Beyonce) to death, but Telephone is weak sauce – very gimmicky and short on anything that made the early singles of these ladies strong hits.

    Its very hard to keep the same level in pop it is more of a roller coaster ..The ones that stay in or are really international stars are lucky ,hard work.sound a little different and know how to change.

    Just to go back to Daughtry – this will be his undoing if he doesn’t watch out. I feel, despite his success, that he really needs to be willing to evolve and experiment a little in the future for true longevity. You’re right – the big acts of all time (the U2s, Madonnas, etc.) were so big because they knew how to evolve their sound and style.

  100. Does that mean Taylor Swift has an older audience? Wasn’t she the top selling cd last year? It seems that when an artist is popular she/he moves physical cd’s. Just asking!

    I think anyone who appeals to tweens and younger teens will move a lot of physical cds. Their parents buy the physical cds for them for Christmas, birthdays, etc. Also, friends (especially girls) will give cds as birthday gifts. That age range is also more likely to want the actual cd booklet where you can have the words all in one place so you can sing along with it while mom drives or at sleepovers. Also, they want to have the cute pictures.

    You can’t leave out the younger elementary crowd either. They watch Disney and they like to listen to music from Miley, JoBros, Beiber, Swift, etc. Taylor Swift’s cd is something that mom and kid can listen to together.

    Children/tweens probably do not have a high percentage of stolen music. Neither does country music. There was a statistic that was quoted here at mjs recently that said 50% of Country Music listeners did not own a computer.

  101. Ok, peeps. Here are the numbers from Idol Chatter:

    Adam Lambert, For Your Entertainment (17,000, -72 percent, 434,000)

    Kris Allen, Kris Allen (9,000, -71 percent, 228,000)

    Allison Iraheta, Just Like You (4,000, -64 percent, 74,000)

    AI8 alum have a long way to catch up with previous AI alums.

    ETA, we don’t have seperate digit download # this time?

  102. What I don’t understand is why LLWD is not boosting Kris’ album sales.

    Kris probably needs one or two more hit songs to boost his album.

  103. imo it is bc Kris is the kind of artist that builds a fanbase. Slow and steady wins the race. He has seemingly busted through the idol bubble and has begun gaining non idol fans. A lot of casual music buyers have to hear a few singles before they commit to an album.

    I agree with this. Even though I bought more music in 2009 than I have in years, it’s because I heard a single on the radio first, then went to YouTube to look for more of that artist’s material. If I liked what I heard, then I bought the album. Non-Idol fans seem to be DL-ing LLWD now so if Kris’ second single hits, they’ll be more likely to buy the entire album.

  104. girlygirl
    01/06/2010 at 1:07 pm
    I’m not sure RCA/19 made much off the Gridlock event. Wasn’t most of the money made of ticket sales earmarked to go to the Red Cross?

    All the proceeds when to the Red Cross.

  105. You would think Kris and Allison’s numbers would have been higher considering they were on Fox’s NYE show. At least Kris has a hit single, but poor Allison. Things are not looking good for her at all. She needs a new single pronto.

  106. Q3, the topic was, how well RCA cash in on the Adam Lambert brand. Believe me, I’m totally aware that Adam considers himself to be a brand, and that for him, that has always been more important than the music. It’s one of the reasons why even though I was an early fan of his While he was on AI, I switched my votes to other people. It’s just a personal thing for me, I just don’t take well to people who are style over substance, or new artists who want to promote themselves as being a brand before they have even accomplished anything.

    My argument wasn’t whether or not Adam or RCA are trying to push Adam as a brand, but how has this resulted in them having any money in the bank. I will say that I think all the media attention did help him sell albums, but as we discussed last week, his numbers are no better than any most of the previous idol alums. So, how has promoting the Adam Lambert brand been better for RCA or 19, than promoting any of the previous idol grads, who weren’t not turned into a brand?

  107. There is clearly a unfilled market for this type of stuff as evidenced by the success in the last few years of Babs, Buble, Groban, Bocelli etc. Also the Rod Stewart and Manilow songbook stuff has done really well also — again people over 40 (or 50 or 60!) singing songs everyone already knows.

    What? Buble is 34; Groban is 28.

  108. You do bring up a good point about how well Daughtry has done in other countries,

    What do you mean by “how well”? Daughtry really hasn’t done that much in other countries. Yeah, they sold a few copies, but it’s not like they can go and tour outside US (and Canada).

  109. I’m totally aware that Adam considers himself to be a brand, and that for him, that has always been more important than the music.

    And you know this how?? I completely disagree. I think it’s ALL about the music for Adam and always has been.

  110. All of the things that you mentioned are still linked to his music. My question was, outside of his music, how is RCA making money off of Adam.

    Money off videos, private gigs, extras on albums, and sales outside the US are extra money and exposure. It may not be “outside of music”, but it is still extra money that RCA is making that Jive is not. I’m sure RCA is happy with this extra cash that is comming from areas outside of the sales from singles and cds.

    You would think Kris and Allison’s numbers would have been higher considering they were on Fox’s NYE show.

    That’s true. I thought that was going to be a big boost. They were able to sing two songs each and Kris had a great time slot for both his songs.

    I remember the iTunes numbers going up, but I guess digital downloads didn’t make too much difference in the overall numbers.

  111. babybelle32 I don’t have answer to your question, in addition I really doubt you can get any convincing answer in any idol blog or fan site. heh

  112. Joe Fusco Sr. Television Producer for Extra

    @extrajoe
    There is buzzzz that oprah is gonna do a full hour with Adam lambert! No date yet.
    about 6 hours ago from Echofon

    That would be pretty sweet!

  113. All of the things that you mentioned are still linked to his music. My question was, outside of his music, how is RCA making money off of Adam.

    Money off videos, private gigs, extras on albums, and sales outside the US are extra money and exposure. It may not be “outside of music”, but it is still extra money that RCA is making that Jive is not. I’m sure RCA is happy with this extra cash that is comming from areas outside of the sales from singles and cds.

    Do RCA really get those money? Don’t they just get album/single/MV sales? I mean, that’s what they produce and sell right?

    Maybe Adam gets them and can pay off his costs for producing the album?

  114. I mention the potential because, more than many previous idols, he has shown signs of seguing (eventually) beyond just the music – examples would be a merchandise line (clothing or make-up), the magazines, being mentioned as a possibility for tv roles (Glee guest spot).

    More than many, but not all. Katharine McPhee was made a spokesperson for a hair products company (Sexy Hair), had graced the covers of many magazines by the time her album was released, appeared on Ugly Betty (about the time her album was released) and was cast in a movie.

    Taylor and Kelly were featured in major ads for Ford. Carrie and Cook were spokerspersons for Sketchers. Kelly also did a Vitamin water commercial and I believe that Carrie did some advertising for a candy commercial of some sort. Many Idols (Taylor, Bo, Kris) have also been featured on various musical instrument vendors sites. Archie did a re-make of his “Crush” video for some flower company or something and was involved with “Build-A-Bear”. Kellie Pickler is also a spokesperson and has done several red carpet hosting gigs.

    The Queen of Magazine covers is probably Carrie, but just about every major Idol has been on one or more (even Taylor). I won’t even try to list them.

    As for acting, Jennifer Hudson is the best well known having been in several feature films. Recently, Daughtry was featured in CSI: New York (as a potential serial killer victim) and Archie was on Hannah Montana (and some other Disney show. Both times as himself). Try though we might, we shall never forget “From Justin to Kelly”. Justin was also offered several advertising and acting gigs (most notably “Friends”), but the rules of Idol at that time required that he turn them down.

    Not to say that Adam isn’t unique or that his circumstances are different, just to point out that 19M and Idols have entertained offers for various other media branding before. I think the history of some of these endevours is interesting and thought others might too.

  115. What do you mean by “how well”? Daughtry really hasn’t done that much in other countries. Yeah, they sold a few copies, but it’s not like they can go and tour outside US (and Canada).

    They have toured outside of the US and Canada. They went to Europe to promote their current album, remember it was on a German radio station where Kris did the acoustic version of Poker Face. And they went back to Europe after the album came out. And, they have a European tour that’s starting on the 17th of this month.

    http://www.daughtryofficial.com/tour

    The perception inside the idol bubble is always cloudy.

  116. Joe Fusco Sr. Television Producer for Extra

    @extrajoe
    There is buzzzz that oprah is gonna do a full hour with Adam lambert! No date yet.
    about 6 hours ago from Echofon

    That would be pretty sweet!

    That would be AMAZING!!! Now, that might just mean that Adam gets to sing more than one song!

    I HOPE it’s true, but I’m just happy he is getting to go on at all!

  117. They have toured outside of the US and Canada.

    They also toured Australia. I know because I created a fake blog for Chris mimicking the blogging he had done on some previous tour. LOL.

  118. I’m totally aware that Adam considers himself to be a brand, and that for him, that has always been more important than the music.

    Ahh, so he told you ;-) The secret is out…

    I just don’t take well to people who are style over substance, or new artists who want to promote themselves as being a brand before they have even accomplished anything.

    Well, YMMV, but what you may see as this, I see as someone who embodies each and every song he sings, and gives 110% every time he takes the stage.

    As for the branding, Adam imo is a shrewd business man – he knows personally how incredibly hard it is to make it in the music biz, and he knows that “branding”, even at an early stage in your career, is quite essential to really have a chance of making it big – especially in pop. Lady Gaga is a brand, and she was when she first hit it big (as in, with The Fame).

    To me, a brand is just smart – it means you’re establishing an image that the people can identify with – know who you are, get ingrained in their minds. You don’t have to be a huge star to create your own brand – sometimes the brand is what drives you to BECOME a huge star.

  119. So now we’re piling even more expectations on Adam? In addition to Global Superstar, we’re now saying he’s some sort of pop culture brand who will have clothing & other merchandise lines, etc.?

    Maybe it would make more sense to just let things pan out instead of continuing the hype. I really don’t see the point. Grandiose predictions aren’t going to do anything for him.

  120. remember it was on a German radio station where Kris did the acoustic version of Poker Face. And they went back to Europe after the album

    BTW, it’s Chris.

  121. They have toured outside of the US and Canada. They went to Europe to promote their current album, remember it was on a German radio station where Kris did the acoustic version of Poker Face. And they went back to Europe after the album came out. And, they have a European tour that’s starting on the 17th of this month.

    http://www.daughtryofficial.com/tour

    The perception inside the idol bubble is always cloudy.

    I’m not talking from inside the idol bubble, but inside the european buble. Daughtry are not famous. That European tour is as an opening act for Nickelback. Not saying it’s bad to be an opening act, but it’s not the same as touring on your own and having your own audience. I don’t think RCA is going to make much money out of that.

  122. Well, YMMV, but what you may see as this, I see as someone who embodies each and every song he sings, and gives 110% every time he takes the stage.

    Your confusing the topic again. This started off with Adam marketing himself as a brand, and how unlike with other idols, RCA can make more money off of Adam that doesn’t just have to do with his music. I never talked about Adam’s music, or what he does on stage, I’m referring to the ideas that he’s a brand. As Q3 said, this is how Adam has always been, he’s always seen himself as a brand. I think that’s true, and very conceited. It has nothing to do with the music or how talented he is. I don’t see how you can say one minute that RCA can get money off of other things and not just the music, but then we keep coming back to the music.

  123. Well Adam’s album sales are better than I had expected. Glad I was wrong.

  124. For being such a shrewd business man, he certainly has made some poor business decisions.

  125. Just to clarify, by conceited I mean that I want knew artists to establish themselves with their music first, before they decide that they are a brand.

  126. Not to say that Adam isn’t unique or that his circumstances are different, just to point out that 19M and Idols have entertained offers for various other media branding before. I think the history of some of these endevours is interesting and thought others might too.

    I agree. Turning an Idol into a “celebrity” is not new, but they seem to be doing it early with Adam. Usually they start out as wholesome TV stars which makes them perfect for some product endorsements, but they go straight into attempting to become music stars too, and from there they branch out into other stuff more aggressively. With Adam, he became a pop culture figure much faster than normal, and the image he’s getting is much edgier and controversial than in the past. So I expect that once he gets a hit record, they will try to capitalize of his name recognition and image in other ways. He might also be able to get bigger acting roles because of his background, especially if it is a musical. He could would be considered for different types of roles, endorse different types of products, be associated with different types of tours.

    The thing is, I think using language like “moving beyond” music may (unintentionally?) be implying that this kind of thing would make him BETTER than just a “musician”, or something like that, which is silly. It doesn’t make him better. It gives him another way to maybe make some cash (some for 19, some for RCA). Maybe he’ll make less in record sales but more in another way than the next guy, maybe not. All it is really is working what you got, to me. It doesn’t matter how he generates the money as long as he does it.

  127. Oh fiidlesticks–It was representation of the perception of AI of a certain contestant the reality of whats happening.I do know the stats and think Daughtry is doing well considering the state right now for sales ..Lemans terms Ai sets so high of standards none could possible reach except for a few and also not every cd will be a smash hit ..most fans don’t care..

  128. I’m not talking from inside the idol bubble, but inside the european buble. Daughtry are not famous. That European tour is as an opening act for Nickelback. Not saying it’s bad to be an opening act, but it’s not the same as touring on your own and having your own audience. I don’t think RCA is going to make much money out of that.

    Heh, I was going to post the same (also being in the European bubble). They have been trying to launch Daughtry here but I don’t think it worked very well. I remember them being here on a PR tour last year. This must be a new attempt.

  129. I’m not talking from inside the idol bubble, but inside the european buble. Daughtry are not famous. That European tour is as an opening act for Nickelback. Not saying it’s bad to be an opening act, but it’s not the same as touring on your own and having your own audience. I don’t think RCA is going to make much money out of that.

    This will be the third time that Daughtry has gone to Europe since May, and somehow, I doubt that RCA would be going through the trouble if they didn’t have an audience there, and if they weren’t making money off of it.

  130. Maybe it would make more sense to just let things pan out instead of continuing the hype. I really don’t see the point. Grandiose predictions aren’t going to do anything for him.

    Especially when over and over around here, grandiose predictions have to be backpeddled from, denied, and then adjusted for the real world.

  131. So now we’re piling even more expectations on Adam? In addition to Global Superstar, we’re now saying he’s some sort of pop culture brand who will have clothing & other merchandise lines, etc.?

    Maybe it would make more sense to just let things pan out instead of continuing the hype. I really don’t see the point. Grandiose predictions aren’t going to do anything for him.

    Eileen99, I think this whole topic came up because someone commented that even though Adam didn’t have breakout sales (like Carrie and Daughtry), his popularity as a celebrity and brand meant that RCA was able to (or had, not clear) make money from Adam in ways that RCA would not be able to from someone like Daughtry, who is very successful as a music act but perhaps not as someone who will be likely to get endorsements, or become a type of conglomerate brand a la JLo, Beyonce, etc.

    (By the way, I just remembered. Daughtry actually guess-starred on a CSI (and wasn’t bad IIRC). So, you know, he’s got enough visibility outside of just being a voice on the radio that peeps thought it could maybe/possibly bring in extra viewers if he guest-starred (at least, that’s my theory on why established shows bring in musicians to do some guesting/cameos).)

  132. I just think it’s funny to say that RCA can make more money off of Adam, and then bring up Daughtry and European tours, since based on the facts that we know, money has been spent to promote and market Daughtry to other countries. My earlier question was just because people keep throwing around these statements about Adam being a brand, and already established in other countries, but I’ve yet to see evidence of this. I have access to a chart that ranks the 75 top selling albums in the UK, yet I haven’t seen FYE appear on that chart yet.

    I’m not saying that Adam won’t become a brand, or marketable in other areas besides just music, but why don’t we wait until we have proof of this before we start saying it as if it is a fact.

  133. Your confusing the topic again.

    Well, most of my post addressed the branding issue – so unless that is not the topic, then I’d say I addressed it. Re my music quote, that was in answer to your statement that:

    I just don’t take well to people who are style over substance, or new artists who want to promote themselves as being a brand before they have even accomplished anything.

    Maybe I misunderstood you here, by my comment was addressing that he isn’t style over substance to me (of course, everyone can look at this differently, hence the “YMMV”). In essence, my point is that he can establish a brand for himself to “make it” in the biz, but that doesn’t equate to style over substance – they are not mutually exclusive, and you can approach the business side of music (the branding) and the creative side of it (the music), as two halves of the whole, and not a “one before the other”, or “one over the other”, situation.

    For being such a shrewd business man, he certainly has made some poor business decisions.

    Lol – Who hasn’t? He’s also made some brilliant ones. Being aware of how to treat music as a business doesn’t preclude making some mistakes and learning along the way.

  134. A few years ago, someone who released the number of hit singles that Taylor did would have sold more than 2.5 million albums.

    Taylor’s album Fearless has sold over 5 million. It was released in 2008 and did great that year and still was the top album of 2009 selling over 3 million.

    Adam is selling below last year’s runner up. So no one from S8 is exactly exploding. And by exploding I mean like Daughtry who stayed in the Top 10 of album sales for seven months. Chart position is a good way to compare albums in an era where sales go down every year.

    I don’t really know why S8 has been so underwhelming is selling music. The tour was on par with S7 and ratings didn’t slip that much. It’s kind of a puzzle.

  135. ITs almost impossible to blog to darn careful to to tick someone off.

    Nah, I don’t think anyone’s ticked off. I find the discussion about Daughtry interesting to read and reasoned from both sides. They’re just opinions backed by different things. I have no stake in this, and haven’t made up my mind personally on what I think about the debate. I like him just fine, his music less so, but he seems like a nice guy, and I admire how well he’s done thus far.

  136. (By the way, I just remembered. Daughtry actually guess-starred on a CSI (and wasn’t bad IIRC). So, you know, he’s got enough visibility outside of just being a voice on the radio that peeps thought it could maybe/possibly bring in extra viewers if he guest-starred (at least, that’s my theory on why established shows bring in musicians to do some guesting/cameos).)

    Chris’ success with his music has opened up a lot of doors for him. He’s written music for different artists, not just Kris and Allison. And, I don’t think he would have appeared on NYRE, CMA, or AMA if the producers didn’t think he’d established a mainstream name for himself and his band.

  137. Why all the focus on international sales? As far as I know the only Idol that has killed internationally is Kelly. Jordin has also had success with her sngles. Right now there is really no evidence that Adam will be some huge international star either.

  138. Nah, I don’t think anyone’s ticked off. I find the discussion about Daughtry interesting to read and reasoned from both sides.

    Yes! Maybe it’s the masochist in me, but I actually enjoy (well, sometimes – lol) the opportunity to flex my debating muscles in the weekly sales threads :-)

  139. I don’t really know why S8 has been so underwhelming is selling music. The tour was on par with S7 and ratings didn’t slip that much. It’s kind of a puzzle. When reality show contestants connect they can still sell million though – SuBo for example.

    I’m going to go on record and say, even though S8 has not sold like S7 yet, they will be more succesful. This comes from listening to the material they have on their albums.

    And looking at idol history, the first bulk sale doesn’t matter much in the long run, what matters is the quality of the material. And I think their material in better than pervious idols.

  140. I can’t see any fault with trying to create an identifiable style or a look. Or a ‘brand’ if that’s what you want to call it. Adam has his signature wail, that’s his thing and he also pays attention to how he looks in public. Some artists don’t care about a look, but it doesn’t make them better or more serious artists, it’s just a way one chooses to present and express themselves.

    If Glee doesn’t happen for Adam, I’ll be shocked. Now whether or not Adam will rip out a gorgeous show tune ballad for the first time ever on television, we’ll see! He’s been wishing for a remake of Jesus Christ Superstar afterall.

  141. Adam is selling below last year’s runner up.

    By how much? Is it by more than 13%, because that’s how much album sales have gone down.

    I don’t really know why S8 has been so underwhelming is selling music.

    It’s not. Adam’s cd sales were close as of last week. He is still not far behind. ( Of course, Archie did have two more weeks before the January drop-off. )

    It’s the two winners of season 7 and season 8 that are MILES APART! I don’t have an answer for you there, as those numbers aren’t even comparable.

  142. Chris’ success with his music has opened up a lot of doors for him. He’s written music for different artists, not just Kris and Allison. And, I don’t think he would have appeared on NYRE, CMA, or AMA if the producers didn’t think he’d established a mainstream name for himself and his band.

    babybelle32, I forgot to mention before, but what I really meant to say in my earlier posts is that Daughtry is a huge failure and Adam is the biggest success of all time ;-) (uh, that’s a joke – just to be clear!)

    In all honesty, Daughtry is doing very very well, has done very well – and all of this speculation on my part is just a means of applying logic to try and understand the whole numbers game.

  143. Branding an artist is part of selling an artist — even if the brand is “no brand”, it’s a brand. How is RCA making money on Adam? Depends on the contract but here are the big ones:

    Music sales – about $7 million in revenue so far.

    1. Album sales are around 500,000 at this point – 437K in Soundscan (includes 3K before 11/23), about 5K >50% discount, apx 35K+ Canada, about 20K in other countries.

    2. Sales of digital singles [3 RCA releases] – 420,000 US + some in other countries

    3. Other music sales: ring tones, music videos, DVDs – should grow to be about 20% of Adam music revenue.

    Licensing: FYE licensed by FOX and Showtime. More deals are in the works. [19 also licensed Mad World to ABC – General Hospital and FlashForward.] Plus, whatever they got from the “2012” deal — which could include a % of the DVD sales since the MV is on it.

    Publishing: Almost half of RCA Record’s profits now come from publishing rights management. There are some very good songs on FYE that they manage them.

    Merchandise sales: RCA almost certainly gets a cut of all merchandising, and Adam has said that there are some things in the works.

    Concert receipts: RCA will get a percentage of tour revenues.

  144. Go back and watch Idol and the pre-Idol performance vids and you will see all of the elements of the Adam brand — from the hair to the elegantly taylored suits to the accessories. A few examples: Ring of Fire – Cat o’ nine tails accessory, the black leather rock gloves, the long coat on Mad World #2.

    Sure, Adam seems extremely cognizant of his physical image, but how is that different than Chris Daughtry’s wallet-chain and shaved head? Most recording artists cultivate a look that helps visually cement their brand image. But the point is that while Adam may have potential marketability beyond his music, it hasn’t translated yet. When he signs that inevitable MAC endorsement contract, then we can talk. But for now, even Daughtry is translating his “look” into dollars more than Adam has – if I remember correctly, he actually endorses some kind of scalp wax for dudes who shave their heads. Gotta have that silky, shiny dome!

  145. It’s the two winners of season 7 and season 8 that are MILES APART! I don’t have an answer for you there, as those numbers aren’t even comparable

    Archie had a head start on Adam but sold more albums by the 6th week and also was well on his way to a platinum single.

    Both Adam’s and Kris’ number are way below Cook of last year. Cook also already had a platinum single by the time his ablum dropped. However, Archie and Cook had issues with follow up singles. Adam and Kris may have better luck in that area.

  146. Why all the focus on international sales? As far as I know the only Idol that has killed internationally is Kelly. Jordin has also had success with her sngles. Right now there is really no evidence that Adam will be some huge international star either.

    Kelly has been around for 8 years. I don’t know how Adam will end up doing internationally, but right now he has sold 45K with little or no promotion. How many cds has Kris sold internationally? I really don’t know-just asking a question.

  147. Chart position is a good way to compare albums in an era where sales go down every year.

    This. Yes, it’s early days yet, but if we’re being obsessive anyway and comparing, chart position is the way to go.

    Chris’ success with his music has opened up a lot of doors for him. He’s written music for different artists, not just Kris and Allison.

    Exactly. That’s a lot of royalties going in Chris’ wallet by his writing for Kris, Allison et al and co-writing with Lifehouse and Timbaland (songs which ended up on their albums). Also, didn’t Westlife release a cover of What About Now in the UK? Also, we can’t forget the royalties these guys get from having their songs used in other shows (beyond just AI-related stuff). Chris’ music has been used in a lot of shows and he had a NASCAR promotion on ESPN this past spring, IIRC.

  148. Besides the endorsement deals mentioned previously Carrie also had deals with Nintendo and Hersheys so she alone had 4 major endorsement deals. I’d say she’s a good brand and her people have made a nice chunk of change from those deals. The Skechers deals her and David had were global too IIRC. Maybe Adam should land a couple of endorsements first before there’s predictions of having his own merchandise line. And I’m pretty sure its management that gets a cut of that stuff, not RCA.

  149. How many cds has Kris sold internationally? I really don’t know-just asking a question

    I don’t think Kris is a global superstar. And I don’t think Adam selling 45K albums makes him one yet either. :) Maybe eventually but not right now.

  150. And I’m pretty sure its management that gets a cut of that stuff, not RCA.

    Yeah… why would RCA get a cut in stuff like that?

  151. Kelly has been around for 8 years. I don’t know how Adam will end up doing internationally, but right now he has sold 45K with little or no promotion. How many cds has Kris sold internationally? I really don’t know-just asking a question.

    http://www.worldwidealbums.net/

    If you go to this link and click on the tab, 2009 totals to date, on the left hand side, it shows there estimates for worldwide sales. This is based on last weeks numbers..so,

    Adam 45K
    Kris 6K

  152. Plus, whatever they got from the “2012″ deal — which could include a % of the DVD sales since the MV is on it.

    I didn’t realize this – cool!

  153. And looking at idol history, the first bulk sale doesn’t matter much in the long run, what matters is the quality of the material. And I think their material in better than pervious idols.

    Well kinda sorta. Those bulk holiday sales go a long way towards guaranteeing profitability, and gives you a bit more wiggle room to grow. In short, it buys you time. That is always valuable.

    The record business is totally unpredictable. Sometimes material that everyone thinks is good fails to connect, but material no critic enthusiastically likes sails up the charts. In my totally unscientific opinion, it is about timing, luck and promo as much as it is about quality.

    I still think Adam and Kris will be fine, but there are no guarantees here.

  154. Besides the endorsement deals mentioned previously Carrie also had deals with Nintendo and Hersheys so she alone had 4 major endorsement deals. I’d say she’s a good brand and her people have made a nice chunk of change from those deals. The Skechers deals her and David had were global too IIRC. Maybe Adam should land a couple of endorsements first before there’s predictions of having his own merchandise line. And I’m pretty sure its management that gets a cut of that stuff, not RCA.

    Fantasia also had two endorsement deals, and appeared on at least two TV shows, including a character on The Simpsons (she sounded great in that episode.) So, no, Adam wouldn’t be the first to land acting roles or endorsement deals.

  155. I seriously doubt anything RCA is doing with Adam is much different from the multiple things labels are doing with other Idols. Long lists of all these things that are happening with Adam doesn’t make it unique. As Kirsten said, many Idols have done many different things to branch out and increase revenues. I’m expecting that Chick-fil-A endorsement for Kris any minute now (this is a joke).

  156. Congrats to Chris on those nice single download numbers, and to Adam for holding his own on album sales this week.

    tinawina
    01/06/2010 at 2:21 pm
    Turning an Idol into a “celebrity” is not new, but they seem to be doing it early with Adam. Usually they start out as wholesome TV stars which makes them perfect for some product endorsements,

    I agree. All the Idols get turned over to the image makers and publicists before they even leave the show, and it’s been interesting to watch 19E shape and mold those *brands* for the various AI alum over time. The thing that sets Adam apart to me is that the image they are crafting for him is so far removed from the typical Idol mold, which is designed to appeal to the broadest possible audience. They’ve definitely been willing to take more of a risk with him, and it will be interesting to see how that plays out. A lot of Adam’s public image right now seems to be tied up in him being a flamboyant gay dude – not sure how much appeal that is going to have to advertisers, talk shows tend to like controvery a lot more than advertisers do, so I am really kind of skeptical of the theory that he’s positioned to be a big money maker for 19M through the product endorsement/merchandising avenue, at least in the short run.

    So I expect that once he gets a hit record, they will try to capitalize of his name recognition and image in other ways.

    The music is still key IMO. If he isn’t successful as a musical artist, the pop culture celebrity will fade quickly, and those *branding* opportunities will never materialize.

    It doesn’t matter how he generates the money as long as he does it.

    While Adam and 19M may make money off his non-musical endeavors, RCA makes it’s money by selling the music. That really can’t be discounted away, IMO.

  157. Archie had a head start on Adam but sold more albums

    My original question was:

    By how much? Is it by more than 13%, because that’s how much album sales have gone down.

    Both Adam’s and Kris’ number are way below Cook of last year.

    Adam did not win season 8. Kris did. David C. won season 7. I said the two WINNERS numbers are not anywhere close to each other. I would expect Cook to have more sales than Adam, as I would have expected Kris to have more than Adam. Cook and Kris won their respective seasons and are therefore comparable.

  158. Do we know that RCA gets to share % in anything other than albums, singles, and mv’s? I had heard (repeated often but with no link to a source) that Idols do not sign a 360 degree deal with their label, though Idols do have to share % with their management, 19M, on everything. Makes sense to me that 19M wouldn’t want to share any extra loot with the record label, if they can help it.

  159. Adam 45K
    Kris 6K

    I’m not surprised that Kris doesn’t have international #s. I don’t think jive has really done anything internationally to market him at this point. I expect Adam to have the better # because I do think RCA has pushed him on a more international scale. Also, I’m pretty sure that I remember reading posts about FYE being available internationally in some locations where KA is not.

    I’m expecting that Chick-fil-A endorsement for Kris any minute now (this is a joke).

    Well, he was on the Gibson? website with his guitarist Andrew. And maybe he can also do a Chuck Taylor’s endorsement since he loves those shoes. LOL!!!

  160. including a character on The Simpsons (she sounded great in that episode.)

    I totally remember that episode – good stuff.

  161. Well kinda sorta. Those bulk holiday sales go a long way towards guaranteeing profitability, and gives you a bit more wiggle room to grow. In short, it buys you time. That is always valuable.

    They didn’t buy Taylor or Katherine any time. I’d also argue with the wiggle room, and what another person said about the quality of the album.

    I do think the early sales help in terms of how these people have been perceived by those in the media and the average person who isn’t in the industry. But, the problem has been these big after Christmas drops that have resulted in the albums and idols vanishing after their songs have failed to catch on at radio. The big debut week numbers may hurt how the idols have been viewed by those in the industry, who know that the sales are due to AI fans wanting to support the person, and not necessarily the music.

    I’ll admit that I do think that both Kris and Adam will fare better than a lot of the others, mainly because Kris has some very radio friendly hits on his album, and Adam will benefit from all of the media attention that he’s getting.

  162. Well kinda sorta. Those bulk holiday sales go a long way towards guaranteeing profitability, and gives you a bit more wiggle room to grow. In short, it buys you time. That is always valuable.

    Yeah, I agree and this is a benefit idols have compared to totally “new” artists but if there is nothing there worth promoting it doesn’t matter how much time you have.

    All I am saying is, with better material Cook and Archie would have exploded. There has to be enough good material to have that 2nd and 3rd top40 hit.

  163. Kanadie Bonttell
    01/06/2010 at 2:53 pm
    Kelly has been around for 8 years. I don’t know how Adam will end up doing internationally, but right now he has sold 45K with little or no promotion. How many cds has Kris sold internationally? I really don’t know-just asking a question.

    http://www.worldwidealbums.net/

    If you go to this link and click on the tab, 2009 totals to date, on the left hand side, it shows there estimates for worldwide sales. This is based on last weeks numbers..so,

    Adam 45K
    Kris 6K

    Ouch! And thank you for actually answereing a question straight up!

    jpfan: If you read what I posted, I said, “I don’t know how Adam will end up doing internationally”. I didn’t say he was going to be a global superstar. I just stated how many cds he had sold, which I thought was pretty good thus far.

  164. Cook and Kris won their respective seasons and are therefore comparable.

    I agree…as Cook vs Allen music is more comparable style wise than say Cook vs Lambert also.

  165. babybelle32
    My earlier question was just because people keep throwing around these statements about Adam being a brand, and already established in other countries, but I’ve yet to see evidence of this. I have access to a chart that ranks the 75 top selling albums in the UK, yet I haven’t seen FYE appear on that chart yet.

    On the brand question — they are clearly building an Adam brand but it is not an international brand — yet. And even in the US it would be still be formally classified as a niche/specialty brand. That said, the first step on building a brand is to build awareness and I think that Adam/RCA/19 have done a great job doing that — that effort has been international but primarily focused on North America. We’ll see if Adam becomes a mass brand, like Madonna. But that doesn’t happen often or in a few months. It takes years, sometimes decades.

    Regarding international sales: FYE will be released in the UK in March, but FYE album import was #87 on the UK chart for 1 week, then went below 100.

    FYE album import has sold well in several countries, but I do not believe that Adam is that well know outside of the US, Canada, Israel, and New Zealand. Adam has large fanbases in a number of other countries: Brazil, Japan, Singapore, Hong Kong, Philippines, Finland, UAE, and so on. RCA has releases scheduled for UK, Japan, Brazil/Portugal. It will be interesting to see how Adam does.

    Finally, regarding Daughtry he’s done really well. His album sales for his album #2 mostly reflect the change in the market [album sales declines] and anything selling 1 million unit now is a big success. He has also done pretty well internationally, notably in France, a tough market for US acts. I don’t think that he has done as well in Asia but that is mostly because of the genre doesn’t sell well in Asia. I don’t follow Daughty closely, so I may be mistaken on his success in Asia. But I track Asian markets and just don’t see the fit for Daughtry there.

  166. I’ll admit that I do think that both Kris and Adam will fare better than a lot of the others, mainly because Kris has some very radio friendly hits on his album, and Adam will benefit from all of the media attention that he’s getting.

    Well they both have to chose their singles carefully. I think Kris has to avoid putting out singles that all sound the same, he needs to bring something extra with each one (hence choosing carefully).

    None of Adams stuff sound the same but he needs to pick stuff in the beginning that he is sure the radio stations will play. He can do the risky singles later.

  167. I wasn’t really commenting on any post. I just think there’s an expectation that Adam will fulfill Simon’s prophecy and be an international superstar. Also some of his fans feel that he’ll face less homophobia outside the U.S. Right now Kelly Clarkson is the only global star Idol has produced. That may change in the future of course.

  168. However, Archie and Cook had issues with follow up singles.

    Funny how DC having a platinum album and 2 platinum singles isn’t enough anymore. I think it was Bruce Springsteen and Jon Bon Jovi that both said that they didn’t hit it big until their 3rd album. Let’s just give all the idols time and see what happens. Kelly, Daughtry and Carrie have had the luxury of being out of AI for a number of years and had time to build their careers. I think that DC, DA, KA and AL all deserve the same.

  169. I feel like this whole branding discussion has gotten way out of control. LOL.

    The music is still key IMO. If he isn’t successful as a musical artist, the pop culture celebrity will fade quickly, and those *branding* opportunities will never materialize.

    I agree with that. I said it earlier. He needs to get a hit record before they can do anything.

    While Adam and 19M may make money off his non-musical endeavors, RCA makes it’s money by selling the music. That really can’t be discounted away, IMO.

    I didn’t discount anything away. LOL. I said Adam could make money for 19 and RCA with his edgier image and his musical theater background. Adam can sing for commercials and soundtracks, he can tour with different kinds of acts. If he gets those kinds of musical acting roles, RCA gets a cut of any music that results. My point was he might be in position to do this a little earlier because he became a “celebrity” faster, by being on the cover of magazines right off the show, generating multiple controversies, etc. They seem to have aggressively pursued this kind of thing with him instead of letting the hits come first and then going for it. So if they (RCA and 19) get just one hit they can say “See! He’s the It guy!” and try to push for all they can get. His name recognition would be high and he would have this whole “edgy unpredictable gay guy crusader for equal rights!!!!!!!” to work off. So he can get stuff outta that. That’s all.

    I already said I don’t think this makes him better than any other Idol, I just think his path to making money may end up a bit different, because he has different stuff to work with. Big Whoop. I also said I don’t think it s a guarantee, he needs a hit to back up the image as the Guy Everyone Wants.

  170. Archie had a head start on Adam but sold more albums by the 6th week and also was well on his way to a platinum single.

    Both Adam’s and Kris’ number are way below Cook of last year. Cook also already had a platinum single by the time his ablum dropped.

    It’s really not even close right now. At this point last year Cook had sold 844K copies of his debut album – 108K more than all three AI8 finalists combined. Archie had sold 566K by this same calendar week – that’s a 23% year to year decline between the two second-place finishers, in an album market that’s down 13% overall (and which was only down 7% during the holiday season when all these records were released).

    But there are still singles to be released and tours to be launched and promo to be had. We’ll see where it all shakes out in the end.

  171. I believe that Carrie did some advertising for a candy commercial of some sort.

    That was Hersheys like Trina said. The Skechers and Hershey deals were right out of the gate from AI and didn’t last more than a year. Now Carrie’s got an ongoing relationship with Vitamin Water: they sponsored her 2008 tour and they’re sponsoring her 2010 tour too. She’s done a TV ad a print campaign with them plus special events. Plus there’s the Nintendo DS deal Trina also mentioned.

    Trina‘s right that it’s management that gets a commission off these deals not the label. So it’s probably management that pushes these AIers to expand their identity outside of just music.

    They didn’t buy Taylor or Katherine any time.

    Mcphee? She didn’t have any holiday sales because she didn’t release her RCA album until the end of January.

    All I am saying is, with better material Cook and Archie would have exploded. There has to be enough good material to have that 2nd and 3rd top40 hit.

    ITA except I don’t think good material necessarily leads to top40 hits ;) But at the same time IMO both Davids’ albums were lacking in a lot of standout good material. Archie’s best song IMO was Works For Me and Jive left it off the album! I wouldn’t be surprised if the same were true for Cook. Plus Cook was sitting on a hit with Heroes IMO.

    Adam’s got some radio hits on his album – Sleepwalker’s the obvious one and I don’t think RCA’s going to pass up the chance to release it. Kris also has some potential hits but he’s also got some deceptive songs that sound like they could be hits but won’t be (I know most will disagree with me but Before We Come Undone is in the deceptive category. JMO). I feel pretty confident about their ability to sustain sales at a lower weekly level but that will lead to very respectable total sales.

    I didn’t say he was going to be a global superstar.

    No but Cowell put that albatross around Adam’s neck. Same way Carrie had to carry the expectation from when Simon said she’d sell more records than any AI winner. If Simon says it then it’s going to be part of the expectations game.

  172. Funny how having a platinum album and 2 platinum singles isn’t enough anymore. I think it was Bruce Springsteen and Jon Bon Jovi that both said that they didn’t hit it big until their 3rd album. Let’s just give all the idols time and see what happens. Kelly, Daughtry and Carrie have had the luxury of being out of AI for a number of years and had time to build their careers. I think that DC, DA, KA and AL all deserve the same

    Yes :-) This is why I brought up a point awhile back, when we were discussing the differences between sales of idols, that one reason I’m pretty careful about not saying “Person A sold more than Person B, and therefore they’re better or they’re a success” is that, Well, ok – but how many other people sold more than Person A?

    There’s always gonna be someone doing better than you, and someone doing worse than you – that’s just the way it is. And some guys do better with singles, some better with albums, some better with tours, or other ventures. Some take years to hit it big, and stay on top for awhile. Some shoot up to the top of the charts, and quickly flounder (Beiber, I’m looking at you, j/k ;-))

  173. I feel like this whole branding discussion has gotten way out of control. LOL.

    My bad :-) LOL (burying the post where I brought up the whole thing in the first place!)

  174. They didn’t buy Taylor or Katherine any time. I’d also argue with the wiggle room, and what another person said about the quality of the album.

    Katherine had big sales? LOL. Taylor dropped like a rock after 2 weeks, DURING christmas. So they are not what I am talking about. Of course if your album sinks off the BB200 in weeks nothing can save you. What I am saying is, if you can manage to put a significant amount of money in their pockets while you get it together, it can buy you some time. See Rueben Studdard.

    Actually Katherine is a good example. “Over It” probably didn’t do all that much better than Rueben’s “Sorry”, but he got a second album and she didn’t. Why? He sold over 2 million albums, most of it at Christmas, and she didn’t. So he got 2 more shots: a Christian album, and another secular album before he got dropped.

    All I am saying is, with better material Cook and Archie would have exploded. There has to be enough good material to have that 2nd and 3rd top40 hit.

    Sure. And all I’m saying is that Christmas sales are not a trivial thing to be dismissed. They are not the be all and end all of anyone’s career, but if anything goes wrong in the back half they can get you time. This is not an attempt to diminish anyone or to call doom on anybody. I’m just saying they are nice to have if you can get them.

    Cook and Archie lasted because their music found a home on radio, just not POP radio. So they kept making money for a while. And their labels were happy.

  175. Regarding this year’s lower AI sales … I wonder if it may actually be linked with SuBo’s huge sales numbers. Peeps who would normally pick up the newest idol cd for a safe, generic kind of music purchase may have turned to SuBo instead. I wonder if there were no SuBo, if the AI numbers would look very different. Just a thought.

  176. Sure. And all I’m saying is that Christmas sales are not a trivial thing to be dismissed. They are not the be all and end all of anyone’s career, but if anything goes wrong in the back half they can get you time. This is not an attempt to diminish anyone or to call doom on anybody. I’m just saying they are nice to have if you can get them.

    Cook and Archie lasted because their music found a home on radio, just not POP radio. So they kept making money for a while. And their labels were happy.

    I agree that there is more than one chance to catch the train. As long as you’re on the platform you have the opportunity!

  177. I was in Japan over Christmas and I didn’t see Adam being well known :( The CDs were already in the store but not displayed prominently like Susan Boyle, Lady Gaga, or Rihanna ones. I was really disappointed. They don’t broadcast American Idol on regular TV (it is in English after all), so that’s not a main way people get to know new artists.

    Sony took out a 1/4 page printed ad for Susan Boyle CD in major news paper, and in all the CD stores, you can sample her CD with headsets. Adam’s CD was in “Newly Released” or “Featured” section in only one store, and the rest of the stores, I had to look for it. It was obvious which one Sony was interested in selling at that moment. She was also on the monster NYE music show on national TV.

    Only person who know Adam was the store manager of clothes shop that was selling the leather Jackets perfects for Rock’n Roll bands and next Mad Max movie ;)

    It takes time. I am being patient and doing my part by sending links to You Tube videos to all my Japanese friends as a part of New Year wishes. If 2009 was Adam’s Year in US, 2010 can be Adam’s year one overseas, right?

  178. I wonder if there were no SuBo, if the AI numbers would look very different.

    Really? Wow, that’s reaching. LOL.

  179. I agree that there is more than one chance to catch the train. As long as you’re on the platform you have the opportunity!

    That’s a great way to put it! As long as you are still in the game, there’s hope.

  180. From the Hits article linked above:

    The market was down 55% vs. last week, down 9% vs. same week last year and finishes the 53-week year down 11%. And you thought you had it rough.

    So looks like the strong holiday sales rescued the year a bit, and 2009 album sales finished down 11% compared to 2008 (rather than the 13% overall it was running before the holidays).

  181. Archie had sold 566K by this same calendar week –

    Adam’s album has been out two less weeks than Archie’s.
    Compare 5 weeks to five weeks. Of course, there is still the problem of FYE hitting the January slump 2 weeks earlier than Archie’s cd did.

  182. So looks like the strong holiday sales rescued the year a bit, and 2009 album sales finished down 11% compared to 2008 (rather than the 13% overall it was running before the holidays).

    I wonder if it was Subo that basically helped the year gain 2%? She did have monster sales numbers!

  183. I don’t really know why S8 has been so underwhelming is selling music. The tour was on par with S7 and ratings didn’t slip that much. It’s kind of a puzzle.

    When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras. Maybe it’s as simple as not that many people care for the music that has been released. In Adam’s case, at least, it’s not for lack of exposure.

    Depends on the contract but here are the big ones:
    Music sales – about $7 million in revenue so far.

    I’d love to see the EXPENSES itemized!

    And I don’t know how anybody can compare Adam’s sales favorably to David Archuleta’s. Regardless of the 13 percent drop in sales overall, there’s no way in hell Archie had anywhere near the same amount of money spent on his rollout. To argue so it kind of ridiculous.

    All I am saying is, with better material Cook and Archie would have exploded. There has to be enough good material to have that 2nd and 3rd top 40 hit.

    There was better material, but the labels chose not to release it. Law of diminishing returns, I would imagine. There’s no guarantee they’re going to keep releasing singles for Kris and Adam either, regardless of what’s on their albums.

  184. I was in Sam’s last night and decided to check their albums. SuBo had 10(1) spots for her CDs. Carrie had 2 or 3…can’t remember excactly. Kris had 2. Adam had 1. Very interesting. And there was no way they could have been moved around. This was very organized.

  185. Adam’s album has been out two less weeks than Archie’s.
    Compare 5 weeks to five weeks. Of course, there is still the problem of FYE hitting the January slump 2 weeks earlier than Archie’s cd did.

    Ugh. I don’t think this kind of thing really matters THAT much, but for the record, I really think you have to go on chart position for this sort of comparison. Archie’s album was a stronger seller in his market than Adam’s. Archie had a hit single but Adam had more high quality, high profile promo and buzz. They probably even each other out. Anyway, Adam did fine (and he is the best seller his season) so that’s nothing to sneeze at. And Adam’s poised well for the future, he could very well go on to have multiple pop hits to Archie’s one. But Archie by this time had a faster rising, better selling single and a more solid album sales wise. And Adam might very well best him in the end. And Cookie for that matter. Who the hell knows.

  186. And I don’t know how anybody can compare Adam’s sales favorably to David Archuleta’s. Regardless of the 13 percent drop in sales overall, there’s no way in hell Archie had anywhere near the same amount of money spent on his rollout. To argue so it kind of ridiculous.

    This is the same argument that was used last year to justify sales differences between Cook and Archie. Fans said Archie’s sales were comparable to Cooks because of the money spent on Cook’s rollout.
    I think numbers are numbers. Thus far, The two runners-up from season 7 and 8 are comparable. The two winners from season 7 and 8 are miles apart.

    Archie’s album was a stronger seller in his market than Adam’s.

    But, what were the numbers of album sales? Money is money and that comes from sales, not chart positions. I don’t know what the future holds, no one does. All I’m saying is that their album sales are comparable.

  187. tiger92
    01/06/2010 at 2:57 pm

    My original question was:

    By how much? Is it by more than 13%, because that’s how much album sales have gone down.

    Both Adam’s and Kris’ number are way below Cook of last year.

    If I remember correctly by this time last year Archie’s album sold about 580,000. It officially went gold by week six, while “Crush” by this time last year already sold around 1.3 million.

    Cook’s album went gold in 3 weeks and by this time last year it already sold around 700,000. His coronation single also went platinum around this time. So yeah, S7 smoked S8 by a mile.

  188. But, what were the numbers of album sales? Money is money and that comes from sales, not chart positions.

    But Archie beats Adam in sales too. He just sold better. Its not the end of the world to me though.

    Some Archie will come along and post the sales numbers for the first couple of months. Archie sold better.

    But Adam still sold well. That’s my point. He doesn’t HAVE to be defended here. He did fine, even if someone else did better.

  189. Archie’s first 6 weeks of sales. .

    11/29/08: 182,927 – # 2

    12/06/08: 66,417 – # 11

    12/13/08: 66,175 – # 19

    12/20/08: 55,699 – # 19

    12/27/08: 59,077 – # 21

    01/03/09: 79,193 – # 22

    Archie had probably sold close to 1 million singles by that point.Jive is a very thrifty label. The sales of Crush probably defrayed most if not all of the album costs. Archie’s album sales went down considerably in January and the failure of the 2nd single basically finished the album.

  190. I was in Sam’s last night and decided to check their albums. SuBo had 10(1) spots for her CDs. Carrie had 2 or 3…can’t remember excactly. Kris had 2. Adam had 1. Very interesting. And there was no way they could have been moved around. This was very organized.

    LOL.Maybe, maybe not. Several times I’ve moved Adam’s and Allison’s cd’s around in my Wal-Mart. Especially Allison’s. I’ve moved hers from the alpha bin to the new release section near Adam’s and Kris’s cd’s a couple of times. They had her cd in the new release section for less than a week before putting it in the alpha bin where you had to search for it, as there was no tab with her name on it.

  191. Rather than compare sales from year to year – since many people want to blame reduced sales on the economy – why not compare the BB chart positions of the albums for seasons AI7 and AI8.

    David Cook’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 11 consecutive weeks.
    David Archuleta’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 4 consecutive weeks.
    Kris Allen’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 1 week.
    Adam Lambert’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 1 week.

    Of course things can change in the future but that is how it stands right now.

  192. Check this out: TOP 10 best selling albums from 1996 to 2009.

    Compare the numbers.

    Thanks Mateja. Interesting and saddening. 10 years ago, the top 10 albums were selling in general over 3M with the most popular ones being over the 4-5M mark. Now only 2-3 over 10 are barely exceeding the 3M.

  193. Rather than compare sales from year to year – since many people want to blame reduced sales on the economy – why not compare the BB chart positions of the albums for seasons AI7 and AI8.

    David Cook’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 11 consecutive weeks.
    David Archuleta’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 4 consecutive weeks.
    Kris Allen’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 1 week.
    Adam Lambert’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 1 week.

    Well, to be absolutely fair, Billboard did change their chart rules this year, allowing catalog albums to chart on the BB200. So a better comparison would be the Comprehensive Albums chart placements for S7 vs. BB200 chart placements for S8. That looks like this:

    David Cook’s album was in the Comprehensive Albums Top 20 for 10 consecutive weeks.
    David Archuleta’s album was in the Comprehensive Albums Top 20 for 4 consecutive weeks.
    Kris Allen’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 1 week.
    Adam Lambert’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 1 week.

  194. Taylor dropped like a rock after 2 weeks, DURING christmas.

    Minor nitpick. Taylor did drop like a stone after 2 weeks, but that wasn’t during Christmas. The album was released on December 12th of that year giving it two weeks of pre-Christmas sales. During those two weeks, the album sold just under 300K it’s first week (and that news was greeted with a lot of disappointment by fans and gloating by the fans of others…times have certainly changed) and just over 200K it’s second week. Taylor’s album went gold in just those two weeks (back in the day when lead-off singles for Idols were rare and he certainly didn’t get one).

    The plunge occured after Christmas during the third week and it never recovered.

  195. I didn’t follow S7 post season, but I know Archie’s first single and album were very successful. I guess the second single did not do too well and Jive gave up on it? Is that typical for Jive? It just seems that after a big hit like Crush, they’d have given him more tries for another big single. I’m just wondering if this has any bearing on how things will go down for Kris.

  196. The plunge occured after Christmas during the third week and it never recovered.

    Thanks Kirsten! For some reason I had it in my head that his album dropped the first week of December. Much appreciated. :)

  197. I was expecting 10K for Kat so that’s a better number than my prediction. I don’t understand why they have to release her album in January. I guess she likes January LOL. IIRC, her first album was also released in Jan. Also, HDD is predicting Ke$ha to challenge SuBo for #1 for this week’s sales with 105-115K in sales. I’m pretty impressed with Ke$ha’s sales especially since she’s releasing at the weakest time of the year and I haven’t seen any promos for her yet. Of course it’s too early to tell but it looks like she’ll be able to move albums as well. #1 album and #1 single is pretty awesome for a new artist (well she’s not really new like GaGa but she’s new to the majority of the public).

  198. Check this out: TOP 10 best selling albums from 1996 to 2009.

    Compare the numbers.

    wow, numbers in general have dropped significantly over the years. there is no way kris, adam, or AI 10 contestants can compete with that…its pointless to even compare. its not only the economy but the decline of album purcahses in general (thanks to iTunes).

  199. I’m pretty impressed with Ke$ha’s sales especially since she’s releasing at the weakest time in sales and I haven’t seen any promos for her yet. Of course it’s too early to tell but it looks like she’ll be able to move albums as well. #1 album and #1 single is pretty awesome for a new artist (well she’s not really new like GaGa but she’s new to the majority of the public).

    Is Keishas album a full album? I know it’s discounted on itunes to something like 6.99. I know Bierber cost around that and he only had 7 songs or someting…

  200. Is Keisha album a full album? I know it’s discounted on tinues to something like 6.99. I know Bierber cost around that and he only had 7 songs or someting…

    I just checked iTunes and it has 14 songs so yeah it’s a full album. Funny thing though is that most of those songs have been available online (at music blogs) for months. I remember listening to them back in October.

  201. I just checked iTunes and it has 14 songs so yeah it’s a full album. Funny thing though is that most of those songs have been available online (at music blogs) for months. I remember listening to them back in October.

    Yup. She’s not a regular new artist. She sang on one of last years biggest hits (Right Round), she’s produced by Dr Luke, and she has had buzz for a minute from her songs being all over the internet for like, a year. Very much like Beiber, lots of people already knew who she was before her songs ever hit radio.

    its pointless to even compare. its not only the economy but the decline of album purcahses in general

    You can roughly compare, but that’s why people were saying direct numbers comparisons don’t always work. You have to take the chart position into consideration too, because that will tell you how someone is doing in their market.

  202. When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras. Maybe it’s as simple as not that many people care for the music that has been released. In Adam’s case, at least, it’s not for lack of exposure.

    This seems like the logical answer to me.

    However, when I *look* at the actual music produced in the two seasons, I have a hard time seeing how this could be so. To me, Kris’s, Adam’s, and Allison’s albums are all more apt for them as performers, less “dumbed down” versions of the performers they are, and include more good writing and production than Cook’s or Archuleta’s albums.

    I love David Cook and I’ve had a level of fondness for Archie ever since Star Search, but while I own David’s album and a couple of Archie singles, I don’t want to listen to those albums — find them fairly typical post-Idol fare when it comes to writing and production, just kind of lackluster and not representing the best of the guys at all. (and I really *want* to like them, especially Cook’s. But I just keep forgetting that I own it, even though I love the his live performances, even in crappy videos …)

    Whereas I don’t find that true of Kris’s, Adam’s, or Allison’s albums. There is stuff from all of them in regular rotation on my Ipod and I know that it will continue to be because I *like* the stuff — it’s good stuff comparable to the stuff that other musicians put out.

    Now, I will say that, of all five of these people, my guess is that David C is probably the most marketable to a wide audience with probably the best combination of musical qualities and overall vibe to do really well over time. While the others all seem to me to have the *possibility* of becoming solid sellers, but with more liabilities and more likelihood of ending up small-niche players instead. So is that difference enough to account for so much better sales, even though I don’t think DC’s album is nearly as good an album or as good a representation of him as KA’s, AL’s, and AI,s’ albums are (and I haven’t found that I’m alone in that opinion)? Must be, I guess, since that’s the way the numbers have worked out. But it seems odd to me.

    I guess we’re talking about — David and David’s stuff is more to people’s taste than Kris’s, Adam’s, and Allison’s…. not that the music they’ve actually done is “better” than K, A, and A’s. But while I guess I can see that when it comes to Adam, who’s not doing the typical American boy-music at all, I truly truly don’t get why Kris isn’t just as much to the mainstream taste as either David or why Allison seems to be to nobody’s taste at all ….

  203. she has had buzz for a minute from her songs being all over the internet for like, a year

    That tactic seems to work so well for some artists. It’s kinda amazing because I just naturally assume that leaking your songs way back hurt your sales but I guess not since it helps build buzz too. Wasn’t that the case too for Lil Wayne? His songs were everywhere months back before his album was released and it debut at like 1M or something crazy like that.

  204. Adam’s sales should get a huge boost from his appearance on Oprah. That’s going to be a highly watched episode since SuBo will be on also.

    I agree about the quality of the albums. I really liked Archie but I though his album was a mess. Adam’s album has way better songs on it (by a mile). Ditto for Kris and Allison.

  205. This seems like the logical answer to me.

    However, when I *look* at the actual music produced in the two seasons, I have a hard time seeing how this could be so. To me, Kris’s, Adam’s, and Allison’s albums are all more apt for them as performers, less “dumbed down” versions of the performers they are, and include more good writing and production than Cook’s or Archuleta’s albums.

    While that is a subjective kind of judgment to make, I believe you are not alone in that assessment. That sentiment has gone around this board many times. I like Cook’s album more than some of you, but I think he’s capable of better. That said, that’s why its not always about album “quality” (quality being defined as what critics and your circle of friends like) and sometimes it is about luck, timing, promo, and just plain old what connects with people.There just isn’t any real rhyme or reason to it sometimes, IMHO. Who knows why they didn’t sell better? But they may connect with the general public like gangbusters going forward.

    And for the record, I like Allison’s album the best of all released in the past 2 years, with the possible exception of Brooke and Melinda’s. Cookie comes in 4th.

    That tactic seems to work so well for some artists. It’s kinda amazing because I just naturally assume that leaking your songs way back hurt your sales but I guess not since it helps build buzz too.

    Its part of the reason record labels get crap for being so anti-internet. If you are selling something people want, the internet is your friend. Boneheads. LOL

  206. And for the record, I like Allison’s album the best of all released in the past 2 years, with the possible exception of Brooke and Melinda’s. Cookie comes in 4th.

    Yeah, I love Allison’s album also. …. And it’s, like, by about a million miles the worst seller of any major-label Idol album, is it not? And worse than a bunch of the small-label/indie sorts, too? Very strange.

  207. And for the record, I like Allison’s album the best of all released in the past 2 years, with the possible exception of Brooke and Melinda’s. Cookie comes in 4th.

    Heh. I always knew we shared a brain, tinawina. Though I would probably put DCTR slightly ahead of Brooke’s record, these are my four favorite Idol debuts of the past several years as well.

  208. Well, to be absolutely fair, Billboard did change their chart rules this year, allowing catalog albums to chart on the BB200. So a better comparison would be the Comprehensive Albums chart placements for S7 vs. BB200 chart placements for S8. That looks like this:

    David Cook’s album was in the Comprehensive Albums Top 20 for 10 consecutive weeks.
    David Archuleta’s album was in the Comprehensive Albums Top 20 for 4 consecutive weeks.
    Kris Allen’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 1 week.
    Adam Lambert’s album was in the BB Top 20 for 1 week.

    I think we can all agree that Cook’s and Archie’s albums and singles had stronger releases than either Kris’ or Adam’s albums. And I think that their commercial success is widely recognized and applauded.

    But, both Kris and Adam are doing pretty well. And I measure success over the long term — a year.

    Kris kicked off his commercial career with NoBo [IMO the worst Idol winner’s song ever — maybe the worst song ever.] The Jive botched [and finally fixed] the release of his lead album single. So I say don’t count Kris out — he still may have some tricks up his sleeeve and I am optimistic that Jive will give him a second single that will more effectively drive his album’s sales.

    Regarding Adam — I can only speak for myself, but all I wanted was for Adam to sell enough to get real international releases and a second album. He will at least get 3 real international releases and I am pretty certain that he will get a second album.

    Every artist has a unique launch and a unique sales pattern, and Adam has certainly had a unusual launch.

    1. The first single [T4M] not released to radio and then given away free for weeks by iTunes/Sony as a 1060p HD music video — better audio than a purchased iTunes track.

    2. The second single [FYE] not really pushed to radio — 1 radio promo and that was to promo the AMAs.

    3. The third single [WWFM] is finally released and the go for radio adds and radio promos after the album is released.

    4. Then throw in the wildcard, the AMA performance on the eve of the album on-sale date.

    The lack of Adam performances [a few private or the rest for TV except for Gridlock NYE and the 20 seconds at a Jingle Ball], no lead album single but what may be a trailing single hit, the movie tie-ins, the amount of licensing, the heavy focus on viral marketing, the unreleased dance mixes of FYE, the second music video, etc. Sure other idol alums have had some of this, but the whole strategy looks different to me. And doesn’t remind me of anything I’ve seen in the past.

    Each idol alum is different. I am not sure there is any right way to measure success — is it critical acclaim, total revenue, awards, chart positions, sales certifications, number of single units sold, number if album units sold, etc. — but I think a lot of Idol Alums have achieved a measure of success, each in unique ways. And I think that Kris and Adam will get there, too.

  209. To me, Kris’s, Adam’s, and Allison’s albums are all more apt for them as performers, less “dumbed down” versions of the performers they are, and include more good writing and production than Cook’s or Archuleta’s albums.

    I think out of the five Kris’s is the worst of them. The most bland and forgettable of them, and I say this as someone who doesn’t even like Archie’s album one bit.
    So yeah, it’s all about opinion.
    Regardless, I don’t think the quality of the music is the only thing that sells it. Voices and personality sell music too. Maybe people like the Davids’ voices more. And imo they’re a lot more charistmatic than Kradison.

  210. Yeah, I love Allison’s album also. …. And it’s, like, by about a million miles the worst seller of any major-label Idol album, is it not? And worse than a bunch of the small-label/indie sorts, too? Very strange.

    I wouldn’t call it strange. I would call it sad. But I am holding out hope for her future.

    Heh. I always knew we shared a brain, tinawina. Though I would probably put DCTR slightly ahead of Brooke’s record, these are my four favorite Idol debuts of the past several years as well.

    Ha! You are the best, ladymadonna. Don’t tell Folk I said that. LOL

    Each idol alum is different. I am not sure there is any right way to measure success — is it critical acclaim, total revenue, awards, chart positions, sales certifications, number of single units sold, number if album units sold, etc. — but I think a lot of Idol Alums have achieved a measure of success, each in unique ways. And I think that Kris and Adam will get there, too.

    I 1000% triple dog dare agree with you. I think Kris and Adam will figure out where they fit, and they will be fine. Great even. I’m not worried about them at all.

  211. Regardless, I don’t think the quality of the music is the only thing that sells it. Voices and personality sell music too. Maybe people like the Davids’ voices more.

    yeah, I agree. it’s obviously some magical amalgam of the music, the voice, the image, the personality, the zeitgeist. And obviously nobody can surely predict how that will play out because if anybody could, some label woudl hire them and consistently produce hits. And that ain’t happening.

  212. ladymadonna: Heh. I always knew we shared a brain, tinawina. Though I would probably put DCTR slightly ahead of Brooke’s record, these are my four favorite Idol debuts of the past several years as well.

    That does it. You and tinawina have convinced me to finally get off my butt and buy Allison’s album (her acoustic vids have been amazing, I thought). Sorry Brooke and Melinda, folk/AC singer-songwriter and old school R&B are just NOT my thing.

  213. she has had buzz for a minute from her songs being all over the internet for like, a year

    That tactic seems to work so well for some artists. It’s kinda amazing because I just naturally assume that leaking your songs way back hurt your sales but I guess not since it helps build buzz too. Wasn’t that the case too for Lil Wayne? His songs were everywhere months back before his album was released and it debut at like 1M or something crazy like that.

    De-lurking to say: It can build buzz or not. For whatever reason, people wanted to own these songs. They were not available for months, but when Taylor Swift’s songs were released one a week, I thought it was a bonehead move. Lol. But we know how that turned out.

  214. De-lurking to say: It can build buzz or not. For whatever reason, people wanted to own these songs. They were not available for months, but when Taylor Swift’s songs were released one a week, I thought it was a bonehead move. Lol. But we know how that turned out.

    There is a lot of expermentation going on with how to deal with the rise of digital music. The issues with the economy are really not as significant as the paradigm shift going on with how people own/do not own the music they listen to.

    If you look at the sales charts, they are split between older people who are buying CDs and younger people who are more likely to buy/share digital tracks. I think that is why we have Susan Boyle, Bocelli, Buble, and reissues all over the album charts now, because the demos of the average buyer are changing.

    It will be interesting to seen how David Cook does with his second album — both artistically and commercially. I am hopeful but nothing in this new emerging music market is a guarentee.

  215. They were a little late today but here is the top 10 scoop from Billboard which matches what MTV had along with this:

    Overall album sales in this past chart week (ending Jan. 3) totaled 7.76 million units, down 55% compared to the sum last week (15.14 million) and down 9% compared to the comparable sales week of 2009 (week ending Jan. 4; 8.51 million).

  216. My quotes aren’t working right now, but I wanted to comment in esponse to Cook being the most marketable of the 5 Idols w’ve been discussing (DC, DA, KA, AL, AI). I’m going to have to respectfully disagree with this. In tems of marketability I actually would rank Cook as 3rd.
    1/2. Archie, Kris (not sure which I’d rank where)
    3. Cook
    4/5. Adam/Allison (same as Kris/Archie)
    This has nothing to do with my personal rankings, it’s more to do with how I see their music in the larger landscape. I think Adam and Allison are extremely niche types. Adam recalls the big 80s type of music in hisperformance style, and while itis unfortunate, he’s going to be forced to deal with a certain level of homophobia/wariness. Allison is a rcker chick of sorts, and so far has been having trouble getting off the ground, perhaps because she is Kelly + P!nk mixed together and almost too young for her voice. Cook is also something of a rocker, but depending on his songs seems to ave good cross-over appeal to HAC. Kris and Archie, if they have the right support behind them, the chance to grow, and the right songs, I think are both releveant in both HAC and CHR, with Kris leaning slightly more towards HAC and Archie leaning slightly more towards CHR.
    I think all 5 have the potential to be around for a long time and all have the chances for great careers. For Cook a lot is riding on the secod album. For Adam, if the focus could go more towards his music he will be uge but right now he seems to be building more of a persona as a celebrity rather then a musician. Allison will be awesome I think if Jive gives her a chance to grow and if they release a new, “better” single. Kris has always struck me as a slow grower but, similar to Allison, if given a chance to grow will be awesome and he’s off to a great start. Archie has an amazing voice and people love him, as can be seen from how well his not hyped Christmas album did. Again, like with Cook, a lot will depend on the second album.

  217. I like Cook’s album more than some of you, but I think he’s capable of better.

    That’s exactly how I feel. He is capable of SO.MUCH.BETTER. He showed from his pre-Idol albums that he had HUGE potential and could write *some* great songs, and then he showed on his Idol run that he was growing beyond that huge potential and getting better and better– but even though I do like his album, it fell short of my expectations, and I’m guessing, a lot of others’ expectations.

    I expected the record, with the major label resources and his growth from Idol, to be ~20% better than the best of his pre-Idol catalog, when in actuality, it was maybe 5-10% worse than a hypothetical album comprised of the best 12 old DC songs would’ve been– for me anyway. Of course, the 12 best old DC songs ever were written over 10 years, whereas DCTR was written in 2-3 months during a nation-wide arena tour… so in hindsight, it was silly of me to expect so much.

  218. Interesting discussion comparing the Idols’ successes, including non-musical avenues. I don’t think anyone has mentioned that Fantasia is about to have her own TV series. Fantasia for Real starts Monday:

    http://www.vh1.com/shows/fantasia_for_real/series.jhtml

    I’ve been wondering where this puts her in the hierarchy of Idol success stories. On the one hand, I believe she’s the first Idol to star in her own series, unless you count Justin, Kim and all of the others that host various Idol satellite shows and appear in celebrity rehab, etc. This is a show about her, created for her, though, so I’m inclined to give it more weight. Then again, it’s a VH1 reality show, so it’s not like she got the lead in Grey’s Anatomy. So, what do you think? Does this put her at least in the upper middle class of Idols, or is she still one of the less successful ones? She’s also not managed by 19 anymore. IIRC, she was dropped by them over creative differences a year or 2 ago. She appears to be landing on her feet even without Simon Fuller masterminding her career. Good for her!

  219. Thanks for the Fantasia news! She is so talented and just has had such a rough personal life.

    I hope it is a hit and helps her back on the path to success.

    Fantasia gave one of the best Idol alum concert I have ever seen. I was lucky enough to see her this summer and it was a surprise. It is not that the other Idol alums I have see weren’t great, it was just she was that good. Awesome, awesome vocal talent!

    Regarding the future success of the 5 idols we are discussing. I would rank them as follows YMMV or rather I am sure YMWV [you mileage will vary]:

    1. Adam – most versatile as a vocalist and entertainer – may not be the biggest selling recording artist of the five [Cook may well be], but will be the biggest star. At this point Adam could be the lead in a Broadway show, do Vegas [I hope noe], movies, who knows. And he is still my pick for most record sales over the course of a career.

    2. Cook – an incredibly talented musician, and possibly a great songwritter. I think he has at least one great album in him [hope it is the next one which I am certain will be even better than his first album]. He may well be the most successful recording artist of the five, but I not expecting to see him in Vegas, on Broadway or in a Movie. And because I expect to see Adam have a broader entertainment career, I put Cook #2.

    3. Archie – the challenge for Archie is what happens in the next two years. How does he transition from teen singer to an adult singer. It is a hard transition. If he develops into a successful adult performer then he has a great future ahead. But many teen singers have failed at this transition.

    4. Kris – I never underestimate Kris and I think he has more persistence, drive and guts then people realize. I think he will do a second album and it will be better than his first one. But he is in a crowded genre and this that will keep him in the middle of the pack. Note: if Kris decided to record a country cross-over album, he could be #2 or #3 on this list. Hope and pray he does not.

    5. Allison – I hate putting Alli #5 but I just don’t see her market fit. She is not a pop princess by looks, style, or vocal style. She is not a Taylor Swift singer-songwriter young talent. Sure she can sing rock songs like no one else, but I don’t think she has the personal power to be a frontwoman for a rock band. And can’t imagine that there is a great rock band who want to risk it with a teen girl frontman. Too bad they didn’t put out a rock album for her debut, it at least would have sold. [a joke follows] And, there is already someone on this list gunning to be a “pop princess” — named Adam — and he looks like he has a hit with a Pink song. LOL.

  220. Well, I think its too early to tell about which of the last 2 Idol season’s artists will have the best long-term career. As a major fan of Mr. David Cook, I’d have to call it for Dave. Yes, that’s based on potential, but also based on the tremendous success of the first album as well as the critical acclaim he has received from his peers. The bottom line, even among critics was that he’s capable of making a much better record. And I believe that’s exactly what we’ll get. Yes, the next album as Dave himself has called it, is make-or-break. My gut feel is that Dave’s going to come bursting out of the gate, breaking it down and definitely making it. I think he’ll have that CHR crossover hit we know he has in him. I think he’ll finally make some headway into that rock fortress and also onto the AAA format, and of course, he’ll blow em away in HAC. I think this will catapult him onto the next level with greater international penetration and much bigger tour possibilities – bigger stage show in general to much larger audiences and venues. I think he’ll eventually move to arena level success. I smell major industry success for this album with exploded opportunities as a result. Just a hunch. I think very big things are in store for David Cook.

    On Kris, I think he has a chance at some good HAC/CHR hits. But I’m not at all convinced that will translate to big album sales. I seem him as having a decent, mellow, comfortable career in music but nothing huge.

    On Archie, gosh, it’s so hard to tell. I think he’s taking his time getting to full manhood. Its really hard to imagine what it looks like when he finally gets there. Will he be a Donny Osmond like figure, or a Michael Buble or can he be more of a Rob Thomas? He’s hanging at the cusp and staying in some bubble of innocence that he’ll have to emerge from at some point. What does that transformation have in store? I’m looking forward to it, but until it happens, I can’t yet form any opinion on what his long term career will look like.

    And then there’s Adam, who is getting so much ink, I’m reluctant to add any more to it. At this point, I believe his hype surpasses his talent. He’s busy selling a larger than life persona that I personally don’t feel his music matches. Really, how could it? I’m sure he’ll be big internationally. I’m very curious how his tour unfolds and what the response to it will be outside the rabid fanbase. And then, I’m very curious where he takes his career after that. Broadway, TV, movies, another album? He seems to thrive on shock and awe, on the visual extravaganza. In these times, it will be interesting to see the response. I know I can’t call it. Too early.

    Oops. On Allison. Almost slipped off my radar. My problem with her is that she’s trying to do the Pink thing without the life experience to pull it off. So it falls short. I’m eager to hear how she evolves as a person and as an artist. I think it was a little too soon for her to launch a career. A couple more years will tell how unique a voice and talent she has. So I’m in a wait and see mode for her.

  221. not expecting to see him in Vegas, on Broadway or in a Movie. And because I expect to see Adam have a broader entertainment career, I put Cook #2.

    Actually, DC grew up doing musical theater. There’s a really grainy video of him in the part of Cosmo Brown doing Make Em Laugh, and even from 1000 feet away, he totally owned that singing/dancing/comedy thing. Ooh, found it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2YS9fWmMz8

    I don’t think DC’s looking for a Broadway career at all, but he’s said before “never say never”, and that he actually had always wanted to play the Phantom from Phantom of the Opera. So… yeah, who knows?

    Also, anyone who’s been to a DC show knows that the guy’s a natural story teller, a goof, and can sell a joke. He played himself for that VH-1 Free Radio show, and granted, he played the “straight man” there, but he does a good job of it, and I can see DC starting out guest-spotting in a sitcome or a TV showsomewhere down the line, and maybe moving on from there. (Here’s the show online: http://www.vh1.com/shows/free_radio/season_2/episode.jhtml?episodeID=152047)

    He’s obsessed with It’s Always Sunny in Philadelphia, and he’s also kind of obsessed with Zach Galifinakis (sp?) from The Hangover, so I can see him doing something small in a movie in the far future if it’s the right part, etc.

    But I’m just speculating far out in the future, and for sure, music first. This second album is make or break.

  222. movin2thabeet, I find it interesting that you have Archie pegged as the Buble or Rob Thomas because that’s actually what I would see Kris as. Of course there’s also the John Mayer and Jason Mraz comparisons for Kris (which he himself has called lazy), but I actually think Kris and Archie both have the potential to go in this similar type of direction and there is definitely room for them both since all 4 of these guys are around today.

    monte, Danny is definitely not someone I am counting out but he is not in the CHR/HAC market. Country is a whole different ballgame. The only point witht he other 5 where I see overlap for him is that he and Kris both have Christian music cross-over potential (LLWD is actually charting in CAC this week and I wouldn’t be surprised if Danny has a song or two that does the same.)

  223. Did we get singles downloads sales for Danny and for Allison this week?

  224. Idol Chatter: Singles numbers

    Kris Allen, Live Like We’re Dying (87,000, -20 percent, 486,000 total)
    Carrie Underwood, Cowboy Casanova (82,000, -34 percent, 915,000)
    Kelly Clarkson, Already Gone (63,000, -28 percent, 1.068 million)
    Jordin Sparks, Battlefield [Main Version] (51,000, +1 percent, 1.296 million)
    Daughtry, Life After You (44,000, -13 percent, 201,000)
    Adam Lambert, Whataya Want From Me (38,000, -16 percent, 136,000)
    Daughtry, No Surprise (24,000, +4 percent, 979,000)
    Adam Lambert, For Your Entertainment (20,000, -34 percent, 195,000)
    Kelly Clarkson, My Life Would Suck Without You (19,000, -7 percent, 2.206 million)
    Danny Gokey, My Best Days Are Ahead of Me (4,000, -50 percent, 12,000)

  225. Archie – the challenge for Archie is what happens in the next two years. How does he transition from teen singer to an adult singer. It is a hard transition. If he develops into a successful adult performer then he has a great future ahead. But many teen singers have failed at this transition.

    I completely agree with your asessment here Q3. I’d like to see him do well, but the number of teen singers who’ve made that leap is pretty small and typically those who have broken out of their teen image have done so by playing the sex card pretty heavily – e.g. Justin Timberlake, Brittany, Xtina – which doesn’t seem like an option for Archie.

    As far as Allison goes, I think she’s just been cast into the spotlight too soon. In the long run I think she would have been better served to wait until she could have been launched as an adult singer.

    In regard to the #1 spot and Adam versus Cook, although I am a total Cook fan I could still see it going either way. Neither one has really broken out of the AI bubble a la Carrie as of yet. Both will need some things to fall their way that are largely outside their control for that to happen. There is always the element of luck in major careers that is really impossible to predict.

  226. I have no idea about anyone’s future prospects. I just want everyone to make it to the next album. And make something I will like listening too. Yes, I am too chickenshit to call it. :D

  227. Wow, I am just getting a chance to comment on the sales. Awesome job Kris! I am so excited that his single is almost gold. It sounds like he will have some more appearances coming up in the near future, so that should help with sales.

  228. According to the Los Angeles Times Carrie’s the #9 top-selling album artist for 2009.

    After Jackson and Swift, the Beatles were 2009’s top-selling artist, moving more than 3.28 million total units and benefiting from the much-hyped re-release of its catalog. Rounding out the year’s top-10 selling artists were Boyle (3.1 million), Lady Gaga (2.8 million), Bocelli (2.6 million), Michael Buble (2.28 million), Eminem (2.1 million), Carrie Underwood (1.8 million) and the Black Eyed Peas (1.88 million).

    The 1.8 million for Carrie is a typo that should be 1.9 million. They put her above the Black Eyed Peas who sold 1.88 million which is correct. I added up Carrie’s 3 album’s sales in 2009 and got:

    Play On: 1.183 million
    Carnival Ride: 461k
    Some Hearts: 251k

    Those include the last week counted for 2009 (this week’s chart) so that puts Carrie’s total at 1.895 million. She just beat out the Black Eyed Peas for the #9 spot.

    I wasn’t expecting her in the top 10 so this was a good surprise.

  229. Diane

    Cook fans: Here’s Kris’s David Cook face: :grin:

    lol! It totally is! Lookin’ hot there, Kris, :) Now if you would just lick the microphone for us, ala DC?

  230. In terms of international sales/presence, it will be interesting to see the recption when Kris plays his two concerts in the Philippines next month. He is supposedly pretty well known/popular there. As is Adam. And when the two Davids played that joint concert, they drew a huge crowd.

  231. Hot 100

    28-26 Already Gone – Kelly Clarkson
    32-30 Live Like We’re Dying – Kris Allen
    29-35 Cowboy Casanova – Carrie Underwood
    57-56 Life After You – Daughtry
    68-70 Whattaya Want From Me – Adam Lambert
    **-97 Temporary Home – Carrie Underwood

  232. spritely

    Haha – Kris already does that. (or gives the mic a BJ, anyway)

  233. Yay for Kris, Kelly and Chris D. moving up on the Billboard chart — and for Carrie making her debut with this latest single. I’m a little surprised WWFM moved back, but at least i didn’t drop much. Hopefully it will mvoe back up again next week.

  234. Cook fans: Here’s Kris’s David Cook face:

    LOL, it *is* the squinchy glory note face!

  235. And then there’s Adam, who is getting so much ink, I’m reluctant to add any more to it. At this point, I believe his hype surpasses his talent. He’s busy selling a larger than life persona that I personally don’t feel his music matches.

    I believe just the opposite in that Adam deserves all of the hype he’s getting for his amazing talent.

  236. I like Cook’s album more than some of you, but I think he’s capable of better.

    That’s exactly how I feel. He is capable of SO.MUCH.BETTER. He showed from his pre-Idol albums that he had HUGE potential and could write *some* great songs, and then he showed on his Idol run that he was growing beyond that huge potential and getting better and better– but even though I do like his album, it fell short of my expectations,

    I think this feeling is probably at the root of my admiring Kris’s album considerably more than David’s. When it comes to genres, Kris’s very soft rock (don’t know what else to call it) is way way lower on my interest scale than any of the stuff the other four (of D, D, K, A, and A) sing. So I don’t expect much excitement out of such an album or much that’s really to my taste.

    I find his to be pretty intelligent, somewhat engaging, and not badly produced, so it seems like a good effort to me, and I like Kris, so I’m inclined to think the album is pretty good.

    When it comes to Cook’s album, though, I like his genre much much more, and I expected a lot out of his album. So when I end up feeling that he could have easily put out an album in that genre several times better than the one he did, I’m inclined to think the album is really really disappointing, even though I guess on the excite-me scale it probably pings me about as high as kris’s does. Expectations have a lo to do with the Idol albums overall, I guess.

  237. I believe just the opposite in that Adam deserves all of the hype he’s getting for his amazing talent.

    He was hyped too much before he did anything aside from compete on AI. No matter how good a voice he has right now he is a new artist and the amount of hype he has had around him has not yet brought anything huge. Hype for a talent is great. Hype before the person has done much of anything is a bit much. JMO.

  238. Kris and Archie, if they have the right support behind them, the chance to grow, and the right songs, I think are both releveant in both HAC and CHR, with Kris leaning slightly more towards HAC and Archie leaning slightly more towards CHR.

    Wow, this I really don’t get. Well, I get the Kris part, but I really really don’t get the “Archie is highly marketable in CHR” part. To me, his strength is a gorgeous voice, enormous musicality, gentle sweet witty stage presence, and thoughtful intelligent and kind of conservative persona. And I don’t think a single one of those things is valued in the least by CHR! On the contrary, i think that CHR actively avoids all of those things!

    And, to me, the Christmas album is a case in point for this, actually. I can easily see Archie being very very marketable if he and Jive were willing to go the Groban route — as I would say the Christmas album does — but they seem to be interested in Top 40, and teen pop, and, wow, there I see him as not fitting in a bit.

    Just his very non-edgy sensibility alone makes CHR highly problematic for him, in a marketing way, in my opinion. (I think Elliott’s an example of how being a very sweet, positive, non-edgy guy who sings kind of beneficent songs is a historical example of what I think Archie faces in CHR — i.e., major lack of interest, despite putting out material of absolutely current pop catchiness and being a whale of a singer. And I would think that Kris could also fall victim to that, except that I think Kris has the out of moving into HAC instead, where I think it’s more acceptable.)

  239. Q3 He may well be the most successful recording artist of the five, but I not expecting to see him in Vegas, on Broadway or in a Movie. And because I expect to see Adam have a broader entertainment career, I put Cook #2.

    Like smaillie, I agree that Cook has great potential as a comedic and/or dramatic actor. A college scout offered Cookie a full theatre scholarship after watching one of his highschool performances. He also won forensic (debating) awards at a national (or was it State?) level in highschool. And of course, he is a gifted mimic – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOYdPSELX5Y

    For those who haven’t seen them a million times already like me, here are just a couple examples of Cook’s comic timing:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_Ch9Qkr5d8
    (be sure to check-out his hilarious Bill Pullman monolougue at 3:21)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbf4mzWoF44

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5D0QQGNIJLg
    (David Cook as a pre-teen girl. heh)

    Cook talked about his acting ambitions quite a bit immediately after Idol, and then backed down from it. I think he thought it might be hurting his non-existent rock cred (hahahah). I’ve said before that I think that he is patterning his career after Dave Matthews, and this is just one more example.

  240. It’s funny to me to see FYE single keep selling almost 200,000 without any promo or radio play. Even after taking it off VH1 it still sells. How?

  241. It’s funny to me to see FYE single keep selling almost 200,000 without any promo or radio play. Even after taking it off VH1 it still sells. How?

    You have an extra 0 in your # – isn’t it 20,000? And I think it’s doing well in the dance music scene, probably getting played in clubs and such.

  242. lucy, I might agree with you totally in doubting Archie’s appeal to CHR, were it not for the fact that Crush was such a hit on it. With the right song, he could do it again. And again. I might also bring Jordan into the equation–she’s a “nice girl,” and CHR is where she’s had her greatest radio success, I believe. So. . .I’m thinking CHR is still quite possible for sweet Archie.

    That Cook face? I think it was the late and brilliant blogger “Bitten” who named that his “Money Sex Face.”

  243. You have an extra 0 in your # – isn’t it 20,000? And I think it’s doing well in the dance music scene, probably getting played in clubs and such.

    I meant total sales. He has sold 195,000 total without any promo. Sorry to mislead u. 20,000 for a week wasn’t bad either for a song no one hears. I was just wondering how he keeps selling it -getting total sales to almost 200,000.

  244. Cook fans: Here’s Kris’s David Cook face

    Sorry, no one can make the David Cook face like David does.

  245. Among the 5, I think David A does have the greatest potential for success on CHR IF given the support. Crush, which is close to double platinum proves it. I think the fact that he is different from others having success on the Top 40 is an asset not a liability. Clones seldom do as well as the original. Every year on American Idol, we hear about a contestant being the next [insert current popstar]. I am not aware of any such contestant ever approaching the success of the original. The other reason I think he has the greatest potential on Top 40 is his youth. Most of the big stars on Top 40 are under 40 — several under 20. Unless you are an established star, I think it just become more difficult to succeed in Top 40 as you approach 30. David A is 19 and definitely has time on his side.

  246. Among the 5, I think David A does have the greatest potential for success on CHR

    Love Archie, but don’t see him having an edge at this stage of the game. For any of these artists, it is going to be all about the right song.

  247. Archie might indeed have some more Top 40 hits. But, the acquiring of Top 40 hits does not necessarily equate to having success in the music industry or staying power, especially now when with every passing day and year, commercial radio is fast becoming less and less relevant, just as physical CD sales are also becoming less relevant. Its a rapidly changing industry and in the whole scheme of things, Top 40 changes at a faster rate than most other musical factors. Its, more than ever, about the newest flavor of the month, and in the long run that flavor has no guarantee of lasting more than its appointed month. Taking all factors into account is the only way of measuring real success and that sum equation will need to be recalibrated each year as the landscape changes.

    ETA: Age, schmage. Yes, age is often trotted out as a PR stunt but that has only limited targeted success. How many times can they sell a Taylor Swift or a Miley Cyrus? BTW, there are plenty of current Top 40 artists in the 28-40 zone – Jay-Z, Beyonce, Britney, Timbaland, Nickelback, Shakira, Justin Timberlake, Black Eyed Peas to name a few. It takes time to build a career. This AI deal of mega TV exposure and poof, insta-career is more the anomoly, as it should be. Sure, it gives the kids a good running start, especially on the first album. After that, you’ve got to prove yourself just like every other struggling artist.

  248. Among the 5, I think David A does have the greatest potential for success on CHR IF given the support. Crush, which is close to double platinum proves it. I think the fact that he is different from others having success on the Top 40 is an asset not a liability. Clones seldom do as well as the original. Every year on American Idol, we hear about a contestant being the next [insert current popstar]. I am not aware of any such contestant ever approaching the success of the original. The other reason I think he has the greatest potential on Top 40 is his youth. Most of the big stars on Top 40 are under 40 — several under 20. Unless you are an established star, I think it just become more difficult to succeed in Top 40 as you approach 30. David A is 19 and definitely has time on his side.

    your every word sums up my thoughts regarding his potential. what i’ve seen many try to knock him for are really assets for him – he’s young, god willing he has lots of time on his side to branch out and continue honing his craft, he appeals naturally to demographics many artists work a long time to cultivate, he has a distinctive and instantly recognizable voice unlike anyone else out there now, he understands he’s still a work in progress… being his fan is an exercise in patience, and allowing the process of his growth to unfold as organically as possible… i look forward to watching this occur, and what i’ve witnessed in his growth over the past 18 months, post idol, is very encouraging, indeed.

  249. Archie can have more pop hits. I agree it’s all about the songs, and timing, and the push from the label. Plus he’s had the most success on that format on any of them and has stayed in the mainstream eye ever since. If anybody is going to repeat in that format, its him.

    For Cook and Kris’ genre, they just need one song to do really well on pop and they can have the rest chart elsewhere.

    Adam has a lot of potential ways to go to me, I think we’re all still waiting to see where he’s going to fit in.

    If they ever get Allison rolling, she might have the best long term prospects of anyone as far as pop IMO.

    Still, I have no crystal ball so I can’t definitively call anything. Too much luck involved. But I wouldn’t count Archie out, that’s for sure. Or Allison for that matter.

  250. Ha! You are the best, ladymadonna. Don’t tell Folk I said that. LOL

    Tinawina?!?!?!

  251. After that, you’ve got to prove yourself just like every other struggling artist.

    i think he gets this, and understands this quite well. he has shown no qualms regarding having to pay his dues, and be on the grind day in and out building up his bona fides. there are no guarantees out there for anyone, whether one is considered established or not, but all signs thus far point to a young man willing to put in the work, the long hours, to learn the business and to keep growing and progressing artistically. i don’t worry really about him sustaining a career… he may never achieve the level of some of the artists you named, but there is no doubt that he’ll be in the business for as long as he sees fit to continue singing…

  252. lucy, I might agree with you totally in doubting Archie’s appeal to CHR, were it not for the fact that Crush was such a hit on it. With the right song, he could do it again. And again. I might also bring Jordan into the equation–she’s a “nice girl,” and CHR is where she’s had her greatest radio success, I believe. So. . .I’m thinking CHR is still quite possible for sweet Archie.

    Honestly, I don’t think this works for guys. I wish I did!

    I think they played Crush because they knew that his recent Idol history made him a good bet for pulling in listeners at the moment. But in the long run, I don’t think his persona is much of a go there. Archie-friendly lyrics absolutely wouldn’t be a go there, especially as he grows older and becomes less of a draw for the young-girl, non-threatening-boy audience. Plus, they *certainly* don’t respect pretty voices, especially those belonging to men, so that won’t draw them in. I just don’t see it.

    I think different expectations obtain for women and men, too, so I don’t see Jordin’s singles success as being relevant. Plus, look what a sexpot they’re making her up to be these days, in an attempt to keep selling her at CHR. And that’s really not a viable option for Archie (may not be for Jordin, either … ), while, for guys, I’m about 100 percent sure that — except for the safe-boy-for-the-11-year-old audience Biebers — the men have to be considerably more edgy to pass muster.

  253. I think they played Crush because they knew that his recent Idol history made him a good bet for pulling in listeners at the moment.

    i think they played it because it was a nicely crafted, well sung pop sung that was well received, and resonated with the fans inside and outside of his base… and still resonates, as it is still played, and still sells… how future singles, cd’s, or attempts to quantify his ”success” is just something that we’ll know when we get there, but there are no indications, from where i sit, that with future well crafted, well sung, well produced and well promoted songs and albums that he, like any artist, can have continued success… i’m content to let him keep on keeping on, and let the future take care of itself… i’m enjoying every moment, in the moment…

  254. Tinawina?!?!?!

    Oops. Folk, I didn’t mean it! You are the best! Uhh… it was just an in the moment thing! LMAO.

    Y’all gonna let me back in the DCO numbers thread? Did I just get myself banned? :D

  255. bah, couldn’t edit – should read as

    ”there are no indications, from where i sit, that with future well crafted, well sung, well produced and well promoted songs and albums that he, like any artist, couldn’t have continued success”

  256. I think Crush was a good song sung really well and that’s what made it a hit. But one song does not a track record make and Archie’s second single didn’t find a foothold on radio and that was that. I think Archie is a one-hit wonder at this point, which makes CHR stations more likely to give any new material from him a real listen versus your typical new artist, but that’s about it.

    Also, even looking at Jordin and all her successes in CHR, all it took was for SOS to not do as well as her previous songs and all of a sudden her album seemingly is on life support. CHR is a tough gig, yo. Which is why having a primary format that is NOT CHR is very important for a long term career. If you do really well with a single on your home format (country for Carrie or HAC for Daughtry), you get a shot at least on CHR and, if it doesn’t take off, that’s not that big a tragedy because at least you’ve continued to chart on your home format. This is why some rock bands who you never hear on CHR continue to sell records and make a killing on touring. They may never be heard on CHR but their fans hear them on alt-rock or mainstream and that’s what drives the albums sales and what drives the touring revenue. Something that Jordin with all her singles success is sadly lacking.

  257. Kris’s CD has several singles with huge hit potential. I see him steadily selling his singles which will give him an uptick in CD sales. With radio play and hopefully touring with a big name artist, ala Carrie and Daughtry, I see Kris really having breakout success. A terrific live performer, a proficient musician, a really good-looking guy, and a love for music, gives him a leg-up on many artists out there. Gaga started out very slowly, her 1st week’s sales were quite low. It was the success of her singles that gave her that needed break. Last year, David Archuletta was the big draw at Z100’s jingle ball not Gaga.

    One can predict all they want, but only time will tell. I do agree with Q3 about Adam doing Broadway and finally getting those lead roles. I see his success there rather than the POP genre. YMWV ::grin::

  258. not too shabby – indeed.

    2009 TOP TEN SEASONAL ALBUMS

    (12/29//2008-1/3/2010)

    Title/Artist Units Sold
    1 My Christmas/ Andrea Bocelli
    2,207,000

    2 If On A Winter’s Night/ Sting
    521,000

    3 The Holiday Collection/ Taylor Swift
    445,000

    4 Noel/ Josh Groban
    393,000

    5 Gold and Green/ Sugarland
    256,000

    6 Christmas 25th/ Mannheim Steamroller
    233,000

    7 Christmas From the Heart/ David Archuleta
    210,000

    8 Winter Came/ Enya
    201,000

    9 Let It Snow EP/ Michael Buble
    192,000

    10. Christmas Cheers/ Straight No Chaser
    83,000

    2009 Holiday Season Factoids: (11/15/2009-12/27/2009).

    * Overall album sales during the 2009 holiday season were up slightly (0.1%) over 2008, with sales of 80.2 million.

    * Album sales during the holiday season accounted for 21% of all album sales for the year.

    http://www.businesswire.com/portal/site/home/permalink/?ndmViewId=news_view&newsId=20100106007077&newsLang=en

  259. I love when David Cook imitated Nigel Lythgoe, but I’ll be darned if I can find a video for it. He was talking about what Nigel had said to him and Archie about the votes that came in for the season 7 finale. And just the way he said, “DAAA- vid,” just tickled me.

  260. Now, now, FolkFan, you know tinawina feels just terrible about this. But in case you can’t hug it out? Can I have your flowers?

  261. Here is Danny’s singles download sales for this week. Not real good.

    Danny Gokey, My Best Days Are Ahead of Me (4,000, -50 percent, 12,000)

  262. I love when David Cook imitated Nigel Lythgoe, but I’ll be darned if I can find a video for it.

    It was on The Early Show, right after his win. (Yes, I admit that it’s sad that I still remember that. I’m cursed with a brain that remembers odd trivia better than birthdays!) I couldn’t find it on Youtube either, so I uploaded my MP4. The quality isn’t great, but you can hear what he says. He starts telling the story about 1.5 minutes in.

    http://www.mediafire.com/?jzjmfmm4awm

  263. Danny Gokey, My Best Days Are Ahead of Me (4,000, -50 percent, 12,000)

    haha.

    there goes all those theory’s that he’s shockingly gonna be the biggest seller of AI8.

  264. Give him time to build up some radio play. I could still see Danny selling well in the longer term. Rascal Flatts sells well, and that’s the vein he’s looking to tap into.

    And I’m keeping the flowers and I want candy. Lots of candy.

  265. CathyMK, thank you for that vid of DC on The Early Show! I’d forgotten about that. So charming.

  266. It’s way too soon to worry about Danny’s sales. I will say I was expecting a little better numbers, given that these two weeks have been really strong overall saleswise for singles downloads. And he has been getting some radio play and doing some promotion, although not any big national stuff a la Kris or Adam. I’m not expecting him to outsell Kris or Adam with this single, but that’s in part because I don’t think this song is all that great. But given that it is already on the Billboard country chart, I could see it being a moderate hit, at least.

  267. Last year, David Archuletta was the big draw at Z100’s jingle ball not Gaga.

    This year it was the Bieber boy.

    I do agree with Q3 about Adam doing Broadway and finally getting those lead roles. I see his success there rather than the POP genre. YMWV ::grin::

    I think Q3 was saying that Adam ALSO could do Broadway, as well as movies and tv. It’s wonderful to have so many options in your arsenal. It must be nice to be so talented that you can be the number 2 debut album seller, but also have the option of being the lead on Broadway. Also, Rob Marshall mentioned Adam as the one person he is dying to work with in a movie.

    I wonder if Queen would still like to have Adam be their lead singer. I guess he could tour around Europe with Queen! That wouldn’t suck. :)

  268. I do agree with Q3 about Adam doing Broadway and finally getting those lead roles. I see his success there rather than the POP genre. YMWV ::grin::

    I bet he does at least 2 more albums before he even touches Broadway.

  269. And of course, he is a gifted mimic

    I love all his voices when he tells stories. And the guy loves telling stories.

    I have this thing- I find it irresistably charming when a guy is a good mimic. I get so excited when I find out actors I like can do hilarious spot-on impressions– John Krasinski’s one of the best. I remember watching all the S8 behind the scenes clips of Matt G and being completely charmed by him. I liked him and his style already, but his impressions definitely made me like him more. Not so much the silly duuu stuff with Danny, but his impressions of Danny, Adam, the other guys. And he’s also extremely talented… still rootin for ya, Matty!

  270. I was just wondering how he keeps selling it -getting total sales to almost 200,000.

    Because it’s actually a good song and people want it. Imagine if radio had played it.

  271. Carrie Underwood “Play On” 34K (-78%) Total: 1.183M
    Adam Lambert “For Your Entertainment” 17K (-72%) Total: 434K
    Daughtry “Leave This Town” 12K (-65%) Total: 882K
    Kris Allen “Kris Allen” 9K (-71%) Total: 228K
    Kelly Clarkson “All I Ever Wanted” 5K (-64%) Total: 815K
    Allison Iraheta “Just Like You” 4K (-64%) Total: 74K
    Carrie Underwood “Carnival Ride” 4K (-74%) Total: 3.045M
    Carrie Underwood “Some Hearts” 3K (-73%) Total: 6.197M
    Kellie Pickler “Kellie Pickler” 3K (-62%) Total: 372K

    Interesting. There was a lot of speculation that Adam would experience a MUCH steeper drop than Kris this week, because his holiday sales were only from bulk buyers and Idol fans while Kris’ sales are more stable since they’re from new fans, but I don’t see that happening. I’m not gonna lie: I’m pleased.

  272. That Cook face? I think it was the late and brilliant blogger “Bitten” who named that his “Money Sex Face.”

    Oh my, bitten…I’m glad she broke up with Cook. :wink:

  273. I think Q3 was saying that Adam ALSO could do Broadway, as well as movies and tv. It’s wonderful to have so many options in your arsenal. It must be nice to be so talented that you can be the number 2 debut album seller, but also have the option of being the lead on Broadway. Also, Rob Marshall mentioned Adam as the one person he is dying to work with in a movie.

    I wonder if Queen would still like to have Adam be their lead singer. I guess he could tour around Europe with Queen! That wouldn’t suck.

    I think Adam would be FANTASTIC on Broadway RIGHT NOW. Maybe (?) a small TV guest role, but probably not movies at this point. His style is not naturalistic enough, IMO. But he certainly has the charm and charisma for it to be a possibility down the road, with training.

    I’m sure Rob Marshall meant one of the people he would love to work with, not THE one person. And I really wonder if May/Queen would still be interested in Adam now that he is no longer pimping that disaster movie song he helped write that was going to revitalize rock-n-roll (not a criticism of Adam, but of that sell-out May), or now that Adam’s album sales are proving to be only average. If Adam’s sales blow-up Internationally, expect May to come out of the woodwork again. Along with Meatloaf and Gene Simmons, heh.

  274. Allison Iraheta “Just Like You” 4K (-64%) Total: 74K

    Poor Alison. As much as I hate it her album is bombing. I think the make or break point will be the second single(if she gets one) and her idol performance when she comes back this season. I think that Robot love,beat me up, or you don’t know me could become top 10 hits and need to be released soon. I hope jive doesn’t drop her before a second single. Given the fact that her album sales are the result of little promotion and not bad material.

  275. First time I’ve been able to get her so sorry if this was already posted…

    sales suck…period.

    Intersting that HDD is predicting Ke$ha, who has a monster hit right now, to only sell about 100K. Kinda puts Adam and Kris first week sales into a little prespective, IMO.

    and for the Cook fans, I understand why they didn’t release another single from comments on here (singles won’t sell the album anymore) but isn’t it better to keep the artists name out there, steadily, instead of having him kinda disappear (yes I know he had the tour but total number of people attending his tour is probably less than those who would have heard a single over and over again on the radio.). Is this a strategy the record companies have with all artists? I’m not picking on David, just wondering if this will be the way Adam and Kris go.

  276. You can’t really compare Danny’s single sales with Kris and Adam’s sales now, their singles have been out for months and their albums have been released. I specifically recall LLWD not selling too well in the beginning and everyone was saying it wasn’t going to be a hit. Kris chugged along with increasing radio play and now his single is doing well on radio and in sales. Danny is just taking off on country radio. His single is still considered in light rotation but is increasing in spins. Radio play really correlates with sales, especially when trying to break into the market outside the AI bubble. My Best Days is getting a good reception at radio and I have heard nothing but praise so I do expect it to be at least a moderate hit. The goal according to Brian Mansfield is for Danny’s single to peak at the time his album is released which I have heard is the first week of March.

  277. There is an LA Times Idoltracker blog today that breaks down the AI demographics…this really tells you a lot about why sales are lower this year than in prior years. the average age of the AI viewer is now 44. the main viewer ages are 35-64. the show has lost boatloads of younger viewers. While there are certainly a lot of over 40 fans of Allison, Adam and Kris, in the main, I don’t think their post-Idol music (particularly Adam’s) is going to appeal to the main demographic of the show. It is good music, and I think will and should appeal to the 15-35 year old demographic, but in effect Kradison are really new artists to this group and the Idol experience will not help them that much. The show is trying to find “current” artists, but the bulk of the viewers of the show are not that interested in buying current music.

  278. I posted this on another thread- but maybe it’s more appropriate here:

    WWFM is up to #63 on itunes! Yay!
    Looks like a lot of Kei$ha’s new songs off her new album are pushing down other songs (she’s even pushed down Bad Romance to #3 while holding #1 and #2 spots) very impressive…
    And yet- even though WWFM was pushed back initially, it has now started climbing again (it was #66 only a few hour ago…).

    I think that now that the holidays freeze is over- WWFM will be able to gain back it’s momentum… Crossing my fingers! Go babe!

  279. “I’m sure Rob Marshall meant one of the people he would love to work with, not THE one person. And I really wonder if May/Queen would still be interested in Adam now that he is no longer pimping that disaster movie song he helped write that was going to revitalize rock-n-roll (not a criticism of Adam, but of that sell-out May), or now that Adam’s album sales are proving to be only average. If Adam’s sales blow-up Internationally, expect May to come out of the woodwork again. Along with Meatloaf and Gene Simmons, heh.”
    suenigma-Actually Rob Marshall did say he wanted to work with Adam specifically. It was very interesting what he had to say. Here is the exact quote in Advocate.com
    “Now that you’ve worked with Fergie, is there another pop artist you’d like to direct in a film?
    I think Adam Lambert is an incredibly talented guy, and I’d like to work with him very much. He comes from musicals and theater, so I have this feeling he’ll have a big career past the pop world, and that’s exciting. Because I see how he works — he works as an actor when he sings. ”
    As far as May goes he did not help write TFM, he just happened to hear the recording at the producers studio and I believe I read that on his blog he still speaks very highly of Adam. I also don’t get why you call Brian May a sell-out.

  280. While there are certainly a lot of over 40 fans of Allison, Adam and Kris, in the main, I don’t think their post-Idol music (particularly Adam’s) is going to appeal to the main demographic of the show. It is good music, and I think will and should appeal to the 15-35 year old demographic, but in effect Kradison are really new artists to this group and the Idol experience will not help them that much. The show is trying to find “current” artists, but the bulk of the viewers of the show are not that interested in buying current music.

    ITA-The show needs to allow contestants to sing current songs. I think whoever replaces Simon needs to appeal to a younger demographic. It’s interesting, it seems this year AI made an effort to reach out to the younger demographic by having Lady GaGa and Katy Perry appear on the show. I think it might be rough for AI for a couple of years, but if they can update the show, it will be more relevant.

    In regards to album sales, I think you are right, Kradison’s appeal outside the AI viewership is what is important. So I do think it is better for them to build fans slowly and live with the “they’re failures because they didn’t sell as many as Cook” posts and keep their eye on the prize.

  281. Did we ever get the digital download numbers for the albums? I know there was some curiosity about those numbers. Kris’s album was higher on the ITUNES chart then Adam’s album, but Adam has two versions in the top 200 and Kris only has one. I think some of us were hoping to see the numbers to get an idea of what the gaps in ranking actually reflect, dowload wise.

  282. I don’t think anyone from the past season is a failure if they haven’t sold as much as someone else yet. Their albums only came out a few months ago, for pity’s sake. However, as a David Cook fan, I do think his accomplishments should be recognized.

  283. Ke$has numbers for the absolute worst fort ime of the year for music buying are amazing especially for a debut album so I don’t see how they put Kris and Adams numbers into perspective. Her predicted numbers are still more than Kris sold and if she had released the week Kris did I bet she probably would have sold well over 200k, maybe even more.

  284. The show is trying to find “current” artists, but the bulk of the viewers of the show are not that interested in buying current music.

    Further to this, I was sitting in a taxi on the way to work and the crawl on the little TV screen said that this season was looking for “young,edgy” contestants…well, ok, you and edgy works in the real world, but again, most of the 35-64 year old main AI demographic doesn’t buy young, edgy current music….and at this point, 9 years into the show, with a jillion other channels to watch plus the internet, i doubt that new young viewers are going to be attracted to the show regardless of who the contestants are…so again, we see the show trying to find real life viable recording artists before an audience that doesn’t buy their stuff…

  285. ITA-The show needs to allow contestants to sing current songs.

    There are numerous catch-22s involved with this, though, I think.

    To me, the best thing to do would be to push them toward more of a mix of new and older songs (which would be pushing toward the new), but also encourage or insist that everybody remake the older songs in their own styles — the way they believe they should do them the as the young, contemporary singers that they are. The mistake, to me, is not so much the actual songs chosen but the big-band nights and such where they either allow or encourage them to sing in the old *styles.* ….

    I would hesitate to suggest that they shift to an all-contemporary-*song* format, because it’s much much harder to remake most contemporary songs in your own, contemporary style than it is to remake older songs in your contemporary style, unless the particular contemporary song in question is in a very *different* contemporary style than yours. …

    For example, Kris could remake Heartless very well in his own style, but Apologize, not so much. … If you have *all* contemporary songs, you’re going to have a heck of a lot of karaoke going on, because a few days isn’t enough time for most singers to re-envision in their own style a song that’s already in a contemporary style that’s very close to their own.

    In any case, they have a problem on their hands trying to figure out where to go with all this. … But then I’m not sure that the rest of television or of music have any lesser problems. People are watching less tv, buying less music, etc., across the board, it seems. So it’s not altogether an Idol-specific conundrum. …. Probably the dropoff of interest reflects the increasing number of entertainment options people have and the upswell of interest in social media rather than other entertainment venues and such as much as it reflects anything about Idol itself, I kind of suspect.

  286. and for the Cook fans, I understand why they didn’t release another single from comments on here (singles won’t sell the album anymore) but isn’t it better to keep the artists name out there, steadily, instead of having him kinda disappear (yes I know he had the tour but total number of people attending his tour is probably less than those who would have heard a single over and over again on the radio.). Is this a strategy the record companies have with all artists? I’m not picking on David, just wondering if this will be the way Adam and Kris go.

    lorismile, I don’t see that anybody else has answered you yet, so I’ll give it a shot. Take with grain of salt! David’s fans sure wanted another single, and you would think it would help keep his name out there. But some of these factors may have weighed against it: 1.) cost-benefit ratio in terms of expense to promote a new single vs. how many more albums it would, or might not have, sold; 2.) perhaps a fear that if it didn’t do well it could hurt his chances for the first single off the new album; 3.) taking David away for pr to promote it, when he needs the time to write and produce the next album; 4.) expenses to David, himself, and although I don’t know what those might be, it’s possible there would have been some that would then need to be recouped. There’s also just the nature of the man, which is that he describes himself as being all about progression; when something’s done, it’s done, and he moves on to the next musical stage of his career.

    Maybe others who know more will weigh in here!

  287. Trina
    01/07/2010 at 9:38 am
    Ke$has numbers for the absolute worst fort ime of the year for music buying are amazing especially for a debut album so I don’t see how they put Kris and Adams numbers into perspective. Her predicted numbers are still more than Kris sold and if she had released the week Kris did I bet she probably would have sold well over 200k, maybe even more.

    Trina – I wasn’t trying to downplay her numbers and I agree her numbers would be higher pre-Christmas. My point is that she is the “IT” girl of the moment and it seems some peeps want to beat up on S8. I think Kris and Adam are doing just fine considering they had no major hit when their albums came out.

  288. 1.) cost-benefit ratio in terms of expense to promote a new single vs. how many more albums it would, or might not have, sold; 2.) perhaps a fear that if it didn’t do well it could hurt his chances for the first single off the new album; 3.) taking David away for pr to promote it, when he needs the time to write and produce the next album; 4.) expenses to David, himself, and although I don’t know what those might be, it’s possible there would have been some that would then need to be recouped.

    Sounds right to me. … Obviously, the choice to do one more single or not do one more single is a complex calculation. As such, of course, it can always be calculated incorrectly! But I guess we never know whether that’s happened or not, when the calculation is *not* to release….. Becomes more obvious when the calculation is *to* release but then sales or radio play don’t follow in the hoped-for numbers, of course.

  289. suenigma:
    And I really wonder if May/Queen would still be interested in Adam now that he is no longer pimping that disaster movie song he helped write that was going to revitalize rock-n-roll (not a criticism of Adam, but of that sell-out May)

    aa618892:
    As far as May goes he did not help write TFM, he just happened to hear the recording at the producers studio and I believe I read that on his blog he still speaks very highly of Adam. I also don’t get why you call Brian May a sell-out.

    My recollection coincides with yours, aa618892, that May had nothing whatsoever to do with the writing of TfM, so I don’t think the “sell-out” criticism is valid. May’s enthusiam for Adam’s vocals on the song was heartfelt and genuine and, considering the source and his background, his comments were high praise indeed.

    I also think we need to cut Danny some slack regarding the sale of his single. It’s hard to get any traction when, in your second week, you run into the brick wall that is January sales.

  290. lorismile, I forgot something important: his name is actually still out there on the radio. His three singles are still quite active. In fact, according to a post FolkFan put up at DCO this morning, TOML is back on the Billboard radio format chats. As she said, “So, AI9 is about to start up, and Magic Rainbow is still charting.” Boggles.

  291. and for the Cook fans, I understand why they didn’t release another single from comments on here (singles won’t sell the album anymore) but isn’t it better to keep the artists name out there, steadily, instead of having him kinda disappear

    Believe me, a lot of us fans do not agree with the rationales about why there wasn’t at least one more single. The label sometimes errs, I think they erred, I don’t like what they did with the singles. But such is life.

    The next cd is going to kick butt. Seriously. With songs that are “musically urgent” and lyrics full of “spit and vinegar” (and you know he wanted to say “piss and vinegar” :)

  292. Numbers from Daughtry’s official site:
    “No Surprise”
    24,921 downloads this week
    1,001,012 downloads to date (PLATINUM)

  293. think Adam would be FANTASTIC on Broadway RIGHT NOW. Maybe (?) a small TV guest role, but probably not movies at this point. His style is not naturalistic enough, IMO.

    Of course Adam would be fantastic on Broadway right now, but it’s not what he wants to do “right now”. It is nice that he is so talented that it is an option in the future.
    IMO he would be great in movies. Lots of actors make the transition from stage to movies or movies to stage. The two are different, but it’s like everything-you put work into it to learn something different.Adam doesn’t impress me as stubborn or lazy. Also, it’s not my opinion that really matters because I’m not a movie director like Rob Marshall.

    I’m sure Rob Marshall meant one of the people he would love to work with, not THE one person.

    He specifically mentioned him:

    “Now that you’ve worked with Fergie, is there another pop artist you’d like to direct in a film?
    I think Adam Lambert is an incredibly talented guy, and I’d like to work with him very much. He comes from musicals and theater, so I have this feeling he’ll have a big career past the pop world, and that’s exciting. Because I see how he works — he works as an actor when he sings. ”

    And I really wonder if May/Queen would still be interested in Adam now that he is no longer pimping that disaster movie song he helped write that was going to revitalize rock-n-roll (not a criticism of Adam, but of that sell-out May),

    I’m betting they would still love to have Adam. Nothing about his voice has changed and they seemed to think it would fit with their old and current songs.

    Also, Brian May DID NOT write TFM. He is a fanboy of Adam’s and he heard the song early and thought he sounded marvelous singing it. How is Brian May a sell-out?

    or now that Adam’s album sales are proving to be only average.

    I’m sure there are several idols from this season who would love to have Adam’s “average” album sales. Adam had the second highest selling debut album this past year. He also is close to going gold. These numbers are far from average.

  294. “I think Q3 was saying that Adam ALSO could do Broadway, as well as movies and tv. It’s wonderful to have so many options in your arsenal. It must be nice to be so talented that you can be the number 2 debut album seller, but also have the option of being the lead on Broadway. Also, Rob Marshall mentioned Adam as the one person he is dying to work with in a movie.

    I wonder if Queen would still like to have Adam be their lead singer. I guess he could tour around Europe with Queen! That wouldn’t suck.” –TIgerfan

    I’ve stated before many times that I see Adam as being a triple threat — singer, dancer, actor as in the vein of Sam Harris. The boy is mad talented. I do, however, believe that Talent is best served in stage productions/television/movies, but I’m not so confident about the pop genre. As I said, time will tell.

    Oh, and TBH I really don’t think the Queen thing will ever happen.

    On to another favorite of mine — David Cook. I’m looking forward to his 2nd CD, a bigger tour, and an increase in his debut CD, eventually scoring 2xplatinum.

    It appears to me that IDOL FANS have a fast-food mentality, needing instant gratification. As I said time will tell. I’m curious to see how the Idol season will unfold.

  295. I never got the impression that Adam did AI to get lead roles on Broadway. I think right now he is interested in seeing if he can make it as a recording artist. I know he mentioned he wouldn’t rule out acting in the future though. I think if he takes on too much at once, it could hurt him.

  296. I’m sure there are several idols from this season who would love to have Adam’s “average” album sales. Adam had the second highest selling debut album this past year. He also is close to going gold. These numbers are far from average.

    um he has the second highest opening week for a debut but not second highest selling debut all together. as for hitting gold soon it could probably take till around march or late February. Considering how 19 have been promoting him I think he’s underselling a bit(not as much as Allison or Kris, though I would love to see there sales if they has as much promotion as he has). as for other idols would love to have his sales, there 15 minutes are about up so I think they would even love to have Allison’s sales and that’s not saying much. So if his sales are far from average(I think there okay) then it’s not in a good way.

    I’m not trying to stir the pot or just hate him for the sake of hating him.He’s actually my 4th favorite from this season, I ‘m just presenting it how it is IMO

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