Change is Coming to American Idol Say Producers: No More Genre Themes, Timbaland To Work with Contestants

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There was a press conference with  newly-announced judges, Randy Jackson, Jennifer Lopez, Steven Tyler and new in-house mentor, Universal Music Group’s, Jimmy Iovine.

Also there were producers Nigel Lythgoe, Ken Warwick, and Fox chief Mike Darnell

There are some changes coming to Idol. See the highlights below. I also heard that the kids will be able to sing original tunes next season. I wish someone had asked that question!

Photos from today’s press conference plus gallery photos:

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  • Contestants will get to perform in their own genres every week! No more county singers singing rock and vice versa.  Themes will focus on decades rather than genres. “It’s really important to develop what they are good at,” says Nigel.
  • There will be big changes that seem very X-Factor like.  Jimmy Iovine, from Interscope/UMG will mentor the kids every week. Big producers like Timbaland will be brought in to coach the kids.  It’ll be the best of the best.
  • There will be NO guest mentors.  Jimmy Iovine will be the “resident in-house” mentor and will work with the kids every week. They laughed at the idea of Miley Cyrus as mentor
  • The kids will be pushed to improve, to become, “better and more interesting” than in past seasons, “developing the young artists the way they would anyone who signs with the label.”
  • It’s possible there will be guest judges if appropriate. Nigel says they would not turn down an Elton John.
  • The middle rounds are going to be re-vamped. Didn’t go into a lot of detail about how.
  • There could be changes regarding the use of instruments. Ken spent some time dissing the guitar players.   He felt some of them hide behind their instruments.  Nigel says there will be no “shoe gazers”.  They want contestants to move.
  • Nigel says after Kelly Clarkson and Carrie Underwood, there were no Idols.  “We have got to go back to creating American Idols,” he says.
  • Backstories aren’t going away any time soon. “We’ve still got to get to know these kids,” says Nigel.
  • Nigel wants to bring the focus back to the talent, rather than making decisions based  on the ratings.
  • Nobody is there to replace Simon Cowell.  Each judge will play themselves, just as Simon did. Every judge will dole out tough critiques when necessary.
  • Jennifer says she believes in “tough love” but could never be cruel.  Sounds like she’ll play the Paula role.
  • Hard to tell what role Steven is going to play.  He’s inarticulate.  He’s moving to Los Angeles. (He lives in Boston).
  • Steven tried to put a positive spin on it, but it’s obvious his Aerosmith bandmates are pissed. He says when they first heard the news they were jealous and angry that they heard it through the media.
  • Jlo unfazed by rumors in the run-up to the announcement. She’s used to bad press. She says the truth is always revealed.
  • Jennifer has a 1st look deal with FOX . She’ll develop film and television projects.
  • Fox brass insists the negotiations with both went really smoothly.

  • springboard

    It’s great that the contestants have a in-house mentor, and big producers to coach them , as long as it is done fairly.

  • zzatrms

    Contestants will get to perform in their own genres every week! No more county singers singing rock and vice versa. Themes will focus on decades rather than genres.
    There will be big changes that seem very X-Factor like. Jimmy Iovine, from Interscope/UMG will mentor the kids every week. Big producers like Timbaland will be brought in to coach the kids. It’ll be the best of the best. The kids will be pushed to improve.
    There will be NO guest mentors. Jimmy Iovine will work with the kids every week.

    I like these changes. Especially the one about not singing out of their genre and the fact that Jimmy Iovine will work with them every week. The consistency will be better for the kids.

  • jpfan

    There will be NO guest mentors. Jimmy Iovine will work with the kids every week

    Not sure I like this. Some mentors really bring history and excitement to the show – Dolly Parton, Stevie Wonder, etc. Of course if your mentor is Miley Cyrus, that’s pretty much a joke.

  • phil25

    It’s really annoying when people say that contestants hide behind their guitar. If it’s part of their performance, it’s part of their performance. It’s up to the voters to judge whether it’s a crutch or not.

  • Chicagolaw

    They better get some REALLY good contestants. I think that’s the only thing that could possibly save this show.

  • Patroo

    Contestants will get to perform in their own genres every week! No more county singers singing rock and vice versa. Themes will focus on decades rather than genres.

    No more RoF? =(

  • itsalleternal

    I’d change the format to start from a Top 20.

    They would be split in half with appearances one night or the other night. However, there are no groups – the percentages are what matter to offset advantages or disadvantages in raw votes on different nights.

    The bottom 2 vote percentages, regardless of performance night, are eliminated. All 20 (or 18, 16, 14 or 12) would be competing against each other, even if they are split on different nights. That would continue until the Top 10, who would go on tour and continue normally. There would be NO judges’ save.

  • wellhesback

    Not all the contestants who played an instrument “hid” behind it – Brooke White didn’t; David Cook didn’t; Kris Allen didn’t.

    ETA — some of these changes seem to be “change for change sake”. For example, I think ‘good’ genre weeks tell a lot about the contestants’ ingenuity, creativity, and musicality.

  • Jx223

    I didn’t want them to get rid of the specific themes week, I just wanted them to choose better themes. I think it’s fun to see people do well performing in other genres of music besides their own. And seeing what some of the contestants come up with each week as they tackle the different themes.

    I don’t like the no guest mentors rule either. They have had some pretty good mentors on this show, some of them have been entertaining to watch. And have been helpful to the contestants. I think that having guest mentors helps keep things interesting.

    If it’s part of their performance, it’s part of their performance. It’s up to the voters to judge whether it’s a crutch or not.

    I agree. Even though some people aren’t very good singers and aren’t very good at playing their instruments. But some people feel more comfortable playing their instruments and that is how they want to portray themselves as artists. And that’s their right, IMO. Especially since some popular artists, including really talented ones, are almost always playing an instrument.

    I was happy when Idol introduced the use of instruments in Season 7.

    They better get some REALLY good contestants. I think that’s the only thing that could possibly save this show.

    I think if there are good contestants for season 10 and possibly beyond then that would be the biggest thing that could save this show. Especially in light of the changes it’s going through right now and the big changes it’s been going through since season 8.

    Letting contestants perform original material sounds interesting. And I think that could definitely have a big impac t on the competition. I could see people being drawn more to those who can write and perform their original music, than those who don’t really do that.

  • Valentin432

    The change in format is big, no more theme weeks + mentors, that’s how the finals worked since season 1.
    I think they are trying to change the image of the brand from cheesy karaoke contest to real artists showcase, something that the show has been evolving into for some seasons now.

    I’m expecting even more changes, from now on, it’s clear they decided to throw away most of what existed previously.

  • Incipit

    It’s really annoying when people say that contestants hide behind their guitar

    phil25 I completely agree with that sentiment – *raspberry to Mr. Warwick* – Idol allowed instruments – now they wanna knock contestants for using them – and incidentally, knock the voters who enjoyed the performances? #CheapShot

    Did we ever see anyone being knocked for hiding behind their Piano? – after all – that’s a much bigger instrument to ‘hide’ behind. IMO. Of Course. *snerk*

  • tinawina

    Hard to tell what role Steven is going to play. He’s inarticulate.

    He’s bringing the crazy back. Having non-crazy people try to fake the Paula level WTF-ness (Ryan, Kara) was forced. They had to bring in some vintage cray cray. LOL

    Randy is really going to have to step up his game if we are going to get anything close to a cognizant A&R perspective. But maybe that’s what Jimmy will do? I do like the idea of Timbaland getting involved.

    I like all the changes except the elimination of theme weeks… I think they should still do them, but maybe not as many. It is still fun to see a little stretching and hoop-jumping. Gotta push people out of their comfort zones.

    Wow. I really thought I might not even watch this year, but now I’m really curious.

  • Patroo

    After Hollywood Solo round, make it a Top 16. They battle it out in the first liveshow, where the Top 12 will be formed with 10 contestants that have the most viewer’s vote and two contestants that will be chosen by the judges.

  • larc

    It’s possible there will be guest judges if appropriate.

    I can imagine it may be “appropriate” if Steven Tyler goes missing as he did on at least a couple of occasions last year when even his fellow band members didn’t know where he was. ;)

  • http://flamingnose.blogspot.com Scott

    The changes sound fine. I mean, it was starting to seem a little stale to me. But the dissing of the guitar players was uncalled for. True, the viewer demographic has skewed toward voting for good looking dudes who play a guitar – and we’ve all weighed in on the WGWG thing – but it’s just bad form to diss 3 former winners. One of whom has a platinum album, two platinum singles and a gold single… another who is about to debut a new album as the reigning champ. And I still don’t see them cultivating talent that’s more relevant to today’s pop music scene.

    Of course, Mr. Warwick could have been talking about other contestants, who never made it to the Top 3 or Top 4, and not been referring to Cook, Allen & DeWyze. And btw, some hid behind their pianos ;)

  • wordnerdarchie

    Bye Bye, American Idol. It was nice knowing you.

  • itsalleternal

    Ken Warwick has always been someone who could never be trusted though. I wish he would have been fired too.

  • windmills

    The idea of in house mentoring from the guy who’ll head up the label that has the rights to sign you bodes well for transitioning after the show. But during the show it’s also dangerous in that it’ll end up being a pimping tool. Look out if Jimmy Iovine finds himself a nu model Nicole Scherzinger.The good thing about the guest mentors who had the experience is that they were uninvested in the outcome of the show.

    Even if the themes are decades I bet they’ll allow people to remake songs outside their genre as long as it ends up being the genre they want to be a part of.

    Universal is going to be all over this show. It’ll be interesting seeing what if any presence the former AI people signed with Sony get to have.

  • springboard

    Ken Warwick has always been someone who could never be trusted though.

    It is the impression I got as well, that he wouldn’t hesitate to put anyone down if it makes himself look better.

  • DarkGlamour17

    this is going to be painful to watch. *shudders*

  • http://twitter.com/maxsmom61 CathyMK

    As usual, the Idol machine needs to put down the previous season in order to build up the new season as “The Best Season Ever with the Most Talented Contestants Ever!!!” Nigel, Ken, and Randy spout variations on the same theme every year.

    I agree with everyone else who said that instruments are not the problem. Playing an instrument while singing is only seen as a handicap in the Idol world. It’s seen as being multi-talented in the real world. If Nigel and Ken want guitar players to move around the stage more, how about using headset mikes? They’ve only been around for 20 years or so. Surely the AI techs could figure out how to use them. Oh wait, these are the people who can’t figure out how to use instant replay technology either.

  • dee

    Nigel says after Kelly Clarkson and Carrie Underwood, there were no Idols. “We have got to go back to creating American Idols,” he says.

    The only way this can be accomplished is to limit the voting. Text voting, which has grown enormously since Idol began, has changed the odds for the contestants.

  • bjames

    Saying there are no Idols besides Kelly and Carrie is pretty harsh. Jordin, David, Kris, Adam, Jennifer, and many more have seen considerable success in the last couple of years.

    And if I remember correctly, the show didn’t “create” Kelly and Carrie. They really stayed true to themselves throughout the show and just had natural talent that you can’t produce out of nowhere.

  • Chicagolaw

    The fact is, TOP 40/CHR has changed a lot, and American Idol hasn’t kept up. They are never gonna get a Michael Jackson (or a Kesha or a Katy Perry) when their audience is clearly AC/HAC. And guitars have nothing to do with it.

    And, Ken Warwick will say whatever he has to in order to save face. He proves that again and again.

    The show didn’t create Kelly and Carrie. They have been working for YEARS to acheive all they have.

  • tinawina

    They dis past seasons every year. I can’t bother to get worked up about it anymore. **jaded**

  • Hazehel

    Nigel says after Kelly Clarkson and Carrie Underwood, there were no Idols. “We have got to go back to creating American Idols,” he says.

    I’m kinda stunned that he dismissed Daughtry that way. Almost 6 million albums sold in the U.S. not good enough?

  • http://www.facebook.com/home.php#/profile.php?id=587900002&ref=name cruzceleste

    Am I the only one offended by this comment:

    Nigel says after Kelly Clarkson and Carrie Underwood, there were no Idols. “We have got to go back to creating American Idols,” he says.

    Dear Nigel,
    Screw you!

  • sr4mjc

    I’m excited! Something different, even if it doesn’t work, is at least something new. As long as I don’t see terrified contestants singing something that makes them uncomfortable, I’m happy. I hate that cringe factor.

    Does this give a little more advantage to the S10 crop? Possibly, but the past Idols are on their own now, nothing can be done about that. The insult to them was unnecessary though.

  • tinawina

    I’m kinda stunned that he dismissed Daughtry that way. Almost 6 million albums sold in the U.S. not good enough?

    I assume he only meant the winners.

    Still, they do this every year. It’s insult the alumni time.

  • http://www.twilightslo.com Mateja

    I would say that American Idol didn’t really create Kelly Clarkson. Okay, yes, AI discovered her and her first album was pretty successful. BUT, she is where is is now because of her second album, Breakaway. I would say Max Martin and Dr Luke were the key to her international success. And her talent – she was able to sell those great songs with her voice and image.

  • sr4mjc

    I’m kinda stunned that he dismissed Daughtry that way. Almost 6 million albums sold in the U.S. not good enough?

    Daughtry didn’t win though, perhaps that is where they are going.

    The wording of ‘creating’ an Idol is telling though.

  • larc

    The only way this can be accomplished is to limit the voting. Text voting, which has grown enormously since Idol began, has changed the odds for the contestants.

    One vote per phone number/per contestant would put things back under the control of the voting majority. Text voting shouldn’t be allowed at all since it not only permits but encourages stuffing the ballot box.

  • cristististi

    I’m more concerned that there wasn’t a mention of updated song lists. Changing theme weeks to decades is fine, whatever. There’s still kind of a theme to every decade, musically. I would much rather see the song lists be dusted off and expanded. Maybe they spent all the song-clearing money for this year on JLo?

  • Studio57

    Great news about Timbaland and no genres! That to me shows they are at least trying to keep up with the times. Original music? Even better. These have been my main peeves about the show all along.

    I do however take exception that they left out Daughtry and Adam at the very least. Adam is getting ready to embark on a huge international tour for the next two months that only Kelly has matched, and headlined more shows on his debut tour then anyone else.

    I agree with the WGWG’s though. Have had enough of them- time to get some people on this show that will make it in the pop world- not reduced to HAC. Would love some hip hop and rap in there and without the genres, that is how it will happen- I am psyched!

  • Hazehel

    Ken spent some time dissing the guitar players. He felt some of them hide behind their instruments.

    Yeah, as if he couldn’t make a rule about not having instruments last season, or that he and the judges aren’t responsible for who went into the semifinals. When the decisions they make go wrong they blame the people they themselves selected. If last season went wrong, the fault lies entirely with him and the judges.

  • Chicagolaw

    LOL about Idol not producing any stars. Maybe they should at least give them a chance to get a second album out first. Kelly and Carrie weren’t overnight sensations.

  • Zastine4974

    Nigel and Ken are tools. Funny how they diss contestants that brought them ratings. Nigel is so old school that he wouldn’t know a star if it bit him in the butt and Ken is just trying to save face.

    Jerks.

  • wellhesback

    American Idol created an Idol when they found David Cook – MY idol anyway. What the hell was whoever talking about when they said no idols after Carrie?? furious.

    Oh – and I wonder if any Sony artists will be featrued on the show now.

  • movin2thabeet

    Yep. I think they’re looking for the next Justin Bieber or Katy Perry – someone they can sculpt and mold and claim as their own creation. I would not be surprised to see headset mikes and very different music, and a greater emphasis on stage performance. I don’t think its a coincidence that their musical director left at the same time as these big changes. I bet they’re going to try for a younger audience this time, one that synchs in better with Top 40 music. Should be interesting. I don’t really see how Steve Tyler fit in though. He seems like a fish out of water.

  • Milly21

    Maybe Lythgoe meant Idol winners? Altho David Cook had some real success. Anywho I think the show is done for. All of the changes made to SYTYCD didnt save it from losing its viewership. The new judges just seem like they dont fit. It looks weird. Stunt casting just means that the show has jumped the shark. i wouldnt mind if this were the last season. Too many changes to it may cause viewers to stop watching. Jimmy Iovine is gonna be a pimp tool. If he sees someone he likes he’s gonna make sure that person makes it to the top. I dont know if i like that the format will stick to respective genres. The viewers of American Idol seem to be so one track minded. The show will never get another R&B star or anything from this ever again. I see another HAC type artist getting it this year. Also if Lythgoe believes for one second that artists are selling the same way they were 5 years ago he’s sadly mistaken. A Michael Jackson or whoever will NEVER come out of this show.

  • Studio57

    I just read on wiki that Iovine is responsible for handing over Eminem’s demo to Dr. Dre, who signed him :)

    I is happy :)

    Can you imagine an Idol world with no more HEATWAVES and AGAINST ALL ODDS????? :)

  • tinawina

    Kelly and Carrie weren’t overnight sensations.

    Carrie kinda was. LOL

  • CanadianFan

    I think it is very embarrassing for Idol when the contestants who don’t win (i.e., Daughtry)do so much better that those who do win. They need the winners to be the stars. Otherwise the voting system seems out of whack.

  • Zastine4974

    Keep dissing the former idols Nigel and Ken and you will lose another viewer (one of many I’m sure).

  • larc

    I don’t really see how Steve Tyler fit in though. He seems like a fish out of water.

    He’s there because they really don’t know what the hell they’re doing! They haven’t for quite a while now.

  • sunchick

    LOL at the insult the alumni/this will be the best evah game. Yeah, said in the other thread, the more things change… 90% of this sounds like bullshit. Oh it’s the guitars, it’s the themes, it’s the past Idols, blah blah blah. Or my favorite- singers need to move around more. This is the show that perfected the 360 degree stand in one spot and belt a glory note money shot. How about it was painfully obvious that the production values went downhill last season? Or the budget got smaller and they weren’t willing to shell out moola to clear new tunes so we heard Hallelujah for the bazillionth time? Or the casting sucked because they were too focused on the musical judges? Or the egos of the judges ate the show?

    This smacks of trying too hard IMO. It shouldn’t be rocket science. Cast interesting talented singers who are teevee friendly regardless of whether they sometimes play an instrument or not, mix it up with singers in different genres so there’s a little something for everyone with varying tastes to root for, CLEAR SOME NEW DAMN SONGS, mix up the theme weeks with the free choice weeks, and then see who shines and who crumbles under the pressure. That’s what the best seasons were all about.

    I am excited about them maybe tapping Timbaland for something. I’d be fascinated to hear him talk about making his brand of magic. Other than that? Phhhht.

  • http://mjsbigblog.com/luvadamlamberts-american-idol-tour-2009-washington-dc-re-cap.htm luvadamlambert

    OMG, could the show actually be GOOD??? :D
    -I don’t like decades instead of themes-I WILL BE BEGGING FOR CURRENT MUSIC!!!
    -OMG, I ‘m REALLY HAPPY about the in house mentors!!
    -Occasional guest judges COULD be cool
    -NOT excited about the new judges; it’s a sad day when I have to say Randy’s my fave judge
    -I think JLo especially will be AWFUL, and leave after this season!!
    -Thank GODDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD Ryan Seacrest is still there!!!! :D
    -Welcome Back Nigel!!!! By Idols, if he means winners, then YES, absolytely I AGREE!!! :D

    And FIANLLY
    YES YES AND YESSSSSS TO NO MORE INSTRUMENTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Weebs787

    but it’s just bad form to diss 3 former winners. One of whom has a platinum album, two platinum singles and a gold single… another who is about to debut a new album as the reigning champ. And I still don’t see them cultivating talent that’s more relevant to today’s pop music scene.

    Thank you. As a Lee fan, this makes me uncomfortable, especially since his album hasn’t even come out yet. It’s almost as if the show is already discounting him, even though while he was on it, he was one of (if not THE) chosen one from the very early goings. The 3 of them can’t help the fact that people voted for them. None of them went up there and faked who they were; people chose to vote for them. It’s in bad taste for the show to diss these guys for their viewing publics decisions. They’re never going to create another Gaga or a Taylor Swift when the audience they possess leans towards something different, and I don’t think the changes they’ve created are going to change that.

    And as far as them no longer creating Idols after Carrie, I just look at Jordin as to why that statement is BS. She really should have been a bigger hit than she is. She’s the prototypical pop star of today, booming voice, pop genre with R&B leanings. She’s young, she’s pretty, she’s got a great personality. From the show, she should’ve gone on to bigger things. Afterwards is where the problems came. Which is why I agree with other people that said the show didn’t create Kelly and Carrie; their success isn’t based solely because what the show did for them, had that been the case; Jordin would’ve been on their level, IMO.

  • sr4mjc

    Keep dissing the former idols Nigel and Ken and you will lose another viewer (one of many I’m sure).

    Nah, only die hard fans care about that. Of all the average voters and viewers, how many buy that first album even though they voted? They diss the contestants all the time.

    I don’t know if the changes will work but I’ll watch just to see how it turns out. Idol is a fascinating social experiment.

  • http://twitter.com/maxsmom61 CathyMK

    It’s weird they say they’re getting rid of the mentors, but bringing in famous producers to work with the contestants. Won’t the producers essentially be mentors anyway? When someone like Quentin Tarrantino can be a mentor, bringing in music producers as mentors would be a step up.

    I’ll miss the genre themes. One of the things I like best about Idol is seeing how contestants deal with unfamiliar genres. Country and Big Band/American Standards nights have given us some amazing performances, like Stuff Like That There, Ring of Fire, and Little Sparrow.

  • gangreen29

    LOL about Idol not producing any stars. Maybe they should at least give them a chance to get a second album out first. Kelly and Carrie weren’t overnight sensations.

    Carrie most certainly was lol.

    I like the changes. I like the mentoring and working with producers. I also like that contestants can sing songs in whatever genre they want. It will make it much clearer to the voting public who they are. What I’m most interested in learning about is the changes to the middle rounds.

  • Chicagolaw

    Steve Tyler is there because no current, “cool,” star would want to be tied so tightly to this show.

    There is a huge disconnect between the show and what makes up the current music scene. Basically, you have to be a HAC/AC artist to win, and then they expect you go and compete on CHR I mean, good luck going after that desperately needed, young demographic.

    LOL, was Carrie an overnight sensation? I honestly didn’t know. (I completely and totally don’t follow country music:) )

  • Hazehel

    American Idol created an Idol when they found David Cook – MY idol anyway.

    I think there is a case for saying that David Cook is the most popular winner ever amongst AI viewers, certainly more so than Kelly Clarkson. But being popular among AI viewers is not the same as having success outside of the AI bubble, and we can’t really tell if David Cook will be as big of a success as Kelly Clarkson until his second album drops. So I’m not annoyed that Nigel is dissing David Cook, because I do think David Cook has yet to prove himself.

  • windmills

    movin2dabeet: Yep. I think they’re looking for the next Justin Bieber or Katy Perry – someone they can sculpt and mold and claim as their own creation. I would not be surprised to see headset mikes and very different music, and a greater emphasis on stage performance. I don’t think its a coincidence that their musical director left at the same time as these big changes. I bet they’re going to try for a younger audience this time, one that synchs in better with Top 40 music. Should be interesting.

    ITA. It’s been my feeling all along that they’re so desperate to get back the younger viewers and be more current they’ll end up favoring people who can do heavily produced CHR music and being honest that’s not what I like.

    As far as Nigel’s comment tinawina‘s right: they do this every year. Last year it was Simon saying he wanted to find somebody who was relevant with the implication being AI hadn’t found somebody like that lately. Let’s not forget: this group includes Ken Warwick who had that whole thing about AI wanting to help out Adam because he hadn’t lived up to expectations and isn’t a superstar or whatevs. He took heat for that here but I’ve always thought there are many people at AI who agreed with him. I’m NOT saying Ken was right. I’m saying these people have a certain narrow idea of “relevance” and “success” that most of us don’t agree with and they have a way of rewriting history and dissing everybody who doesn’t meet that idea.

    CanadianFan: I think it is very embarrassing for Idol when the contestants who don’t win (i.e., Daughtry)do so much better that those who do win. They need the winners to be the stars. Otherwise the voting system seems out of whack.

    I disagree with this actually. I think they’re fine as long as they’ve got a big star coming out of the season. With all these things they’re trying to do they’re going to be fighting the AI voter demographic and I think they know it. Even though they’ll pimp and manipulate they might not get the outcome Jimmy Iovine wants. So I don’t think they’re going to be worried about the winner doing the best if the winner’s not who Jimmy Iovine likes best.

  • Zastine4974

    Sorry but instruments are not the problem with idol. Has anyone tried to sing and play at the same time? Not easy, much more difficult than just singing. Idol needs new music (let go of the bucks PTB) and good singers/musicians/songwriters. Don’t know about original songs though. Might be interesting but what if you don’t write your own songs (like many singers).

    Too bad that they aren’t going to have guest mentors anymore. Some were quite good. I see pimping on the horizon if Iovine likes someone over another. Conflict of interest (IMO).

  • kk613

    For 6 years idol went without instruments and it work just find. So I’m glad they are going to limit the instrument playing. Go back to people who’s voice was their instrument.

  • Ratna12

    There could be changes regarding the use of instruments. Ken spent some time dissing the guitar players. He felt some of them hide behind their instruments. Nigel says there will be no “shoe gazers”. They want contestants to move.

    Fine, you want the next Michael Jackson, but why even take the time to specifically diss the guitar players. Basically they said that the past 3 years were mistakes ? I don’t get it. The judges picked the contestants in Hollywood. Geez !
    At least, 2 of WGWG already released their albums, but how does it feel to be Lee, Crystal, Casey and basically most of last years top 10 hearing that ?

    And I like the themes. I don’t know how it is going to be without themes. I think it will be boring, we’ll see.

  • sunchick

    Country and Big Band/American Standards nights have given us some amazing performances, like Stuff Like That There, Ring of Fire, and Little Sparrow.

    Ditto. A lot of Idol pundits consider Stuff Like That There to be Kelly’s break out moment.

    LOL, was Carrie an overnight sensation? I honestly didn’t know. (I completely and totally don’t follow country music:)

    Ha, ditto. Also don’t follow country and I didn’t watch seasons 3-5 so really didn’t realize Carrie was a big deal until she started dating Tony Romo and was all over the tabloids.

  • itsalleternal

    Dissing past winners/contestants should NOT be tolerated by anyone on the show. There is a reason they won or did really well, even if many don’t agree with it.

  • Valentin432

    Maybe they spent all the song-clearing money for this year on JLo?

    Even not knowing how much Steven is being payed, I’m going to assume that Simon’s salary was bigger than all of the 3 judges combined (I think he was payed 45 million dollars).

    I am not sure that the problem with song clearence is money, a lot of artists simply don’t want their music on reality shows like AI, there was an article with Anthony Kiedis who said why he didn’t want to clear his songs. Maybee Steven Tyler and JLo could call some of their buddies to help clearing songs.

    . Kelly and Carrie weren’t overnight sensations.

    THey kind of were, Clay and Daughtry were too. All the winners until Taylor sold more or close to 2 million units of their first albums.

  • Incipit

    I’m not so concerned with being allowed to do original songs, because that assumes every contestant would have song writing experience. Some did, most did not… IMO, Idol-in-progress would be a crazy-making place to try to learn that – and set the inexperienced up for a massive failure.

    The dichotomy between what ‘they’ want so they can sell a record, compared to what the existing audience wants to hear still applies, and to that end, I’m interested to know about updating the painfully paltry cleared song lists, and who is going to replace Ricky Minor? Unless some one is executing the re-arrangements who is on the ball, musically speaking, we can still get strings and choirs and over loud back up singers in inappropriate places.

    Yes, please – can someone pay attention to the cast selection that underpins the whole thing?
    That’s basic, and that’s on the Producers, and always has been, no matter how much pointing of fingers they like to indulge in.

    I suppose it’s too mundane to inquire if there have been any upgrades to the sound system, or if some one has bought the two-faced Mr. Warwick a stopwatch?

    So far – it’s all hype – and ‘The Best Season Evah’ is old hat. Nigel’s old hat, actually. Talk is cheap – I’ll wait and see what they actually deliver.

  • tinawina

    I’ll miss the genre themes. One of the things I like best about Idol is seeing how contestants deal with unfamiliar genres. Country and Big Band/American Standards nights have given us some amazing performances, like Stuff Like That There, Ring of Fire, and Little Sparrow.

    Me too. I absolutely love Broadway/Standards/American Songbook or whatever night every year, because that was really a night to see who could actually sing. Those songs require real chops as a vocalist. Someone always rose to the occasion, and sometimes it was a surprise who did.

    And Country night was always good for the WTF! boot. So I’ll miss that one too.

    Oh well. There’s enough stuff going on I like, so its all good. :-)

    I’m not annoyed that Nigel is dissing David Cook,

    Ditto. If I were going to be insulted for anyone, it would be Jordin probably.

  • Zastine4974

    So I’m not annoyed that Nigel is dissing David Cook, because I do think David Cook has yet to prove himself.

    He probably will if Busch Gardens was any indication of his new music. Nigel is just trying to create hype for the new season at the former idols expense. He’s still a tool.

  • gangreen29

    LOL, was Carrie an overnight sensation? I honestly didn’t know. (I completely and totally don’t follow country music:) )

    Yes, Jesus Take the Wheel was #1 on the country charts for 6 straight weeks.

    Except for Breakaway era Kelly idol hasn’t produced a star anywhere near Carrie, so I don’t think Nigel is that off base.

  • itsalleternal

    I’ve thought of an alternative solution to the text vote dilemma: I would give each number a limit of 5 free texts per episode, then charge 25 cents per additional text vote (phone votes remain free). All proceeds from those would go to pre-determined charities. That way they would have to choose between paying or limiting.

  • sr4mjc

    Ditto. A lot of Idol pundits consider Stuff Like That There to be Kelly’s break out moment.

    I know it was for me! It was definitely a ‘whoa! this girl is special’ moment for me.

  • Zastine4974

    itsalleternal:
    09/22/2010 at 4:17 pm
    Dissing past winners/contestants should NOT be tolerated by anyone on the show. There is a reason they won or did really well, even if many don’t agree with it.

    ITA

  • Mark

    Dissing past winners/contestants should NOT be tolerated by anyone on the show. There is a reason they won or did really well, even if many don’t agree with it.

    ITA. The changes they’re making are interesting, but it’s hard to hear it over the sounds of pretty much all but the very limited anointed ones getting trampled over. Seriously, can’t the show have some grace about this? Say “Ok, we’re trying to do something new for once”, without the assumption that then everything before it was a mistake?

  • Zastine4974

    Except for Breakaway era Kelly idol hasn’t produced a star anywhere near Carrie, so I don’t think Nigel is that off base.

    Well it would be nice if the most recent idols were given the same amount of time to make it that Kelly and Carrie have had. Maybe it would a make a world of difference in their being a “star”.

  • gangreen29

    Me too. I absolutely love Broadway/Standards/American Songbook or whatever night every year, because that was really a night to see who could actually sing. Those songs require real chops as a vocalist. Someone always rose to the occasion, and sometimes it was a surprise who did.

    I’m assuming we would still get some time of standards night, because they said the weeks will go by decades. I assume that means some 40s and 50s music. I think no themes just means no Beatles week or Disco or Country or whatever, which I’m fine with actually.

  • gangreen29

    Well it would be nice if the most recent idols were given the same amount of time to make it that Kelly and Carrie have had. Maybe it would a make a world of difference in their being a “star”.

    Carrie was a star right away. She didn’t need time.

  • standtotheright

    and we can’t really tell if David Cook will be as big of a success as Kelly Clarkson until his second album drops.

    I’m as fond of the guy as anyone, but there’s almost no way that happens. Even if he did Kelly Clarkson style pop-rock to fit in, the slots for that on CHR are far fewer than when she released Breakaway, and she’s reserved some of those herself based on her (admittedly impressive) track record.

    If he and the band had the reception at Alternative to warm up some crossover singles (see Neon Trees, Shinedown, FOB, and of course, KOL), maybe. But that’s even harder sledding than Pop. Not impossible for evah and evah, I hope. But not something I’m pinning any strategic hopes on.

    So I’m even less offended by it than you, other than by how crass and obvious it is that they’re trying to sell the new product.

    As for the changes, it sounds like they’d be consistent with releasing some money for more (and better) song choices, which is the single most important thing they can do. If not, it’s just arranging deck chairs on the Titanic.

  • wellhesback

    This smacks of trying too hard IMO. It shouldn’t be rocket science. Cast interesting talented singers who are teevee friendly regardless of whether they sometimes play an instrument or not, mix it up with singers in different genres so there’s a little something for everyone with varying tastes to root for, CLEAR SOME NEW DAMN SONGS, mix up the theme weeks with the free choice weeks, and then see who shines and who crumbles under the pressure. That’s what the best seasons were all about.

    totally agree with the above!

    still annoyed they dissed David Cook when he’s so loyal to them.

  • tinawina

    I’m assuming we would still get some time of standards night, because they said the weeks will go by decades. I assume that means some 40s and 50s music.

    Good point! I guess 30s or 40s week would be the one to watch. :)

    still annoyed they dissed David Cook when he’s so loyal to them.

    Since when have they ever cared about that kind of thing! LOL

    Anyway, it doesn’t matter unless someone from 19M or RCA calls him a mistake. Otherwise who cares.

  • Hazehel

    THey kind of were, Clay and Daughtry were too. All the winners until Taylor sold more or close to 2 million units of their first albums.

    I think the point is that AI winners get a free pass as it were with their first album, until a couple of years ago they were expected to sell 1 or 2 million units because of this built-in fan base from the show. To become truly successful the idols have to reach outside of the Idol bubble. I won’t say that Kelly Clarkson or any of the winners apart from Carrie Underwood was a big success outside of the Idol bubble with their first album. Clay IMO was not a success in that sense, but Daughtry I think was.

  • sunchick

    One other thought…I think Idols can still sell records (Cook and Adam’s numbers were impressive compared to other new artists for this record selling climate) because people who watch the show are tired of the same old homogenous crap on the radio, and it gives them a chance to find new artists. When Kelly won there weren’t a ton of pop rock chicks, when Carrie won there wasn’t really a pop country diva heir apparent I don’t think, when Cooke won there wasn’t much in the way of solo male rock acts inundating the airwaves, when Adam made runner up there weren’t any openly gay male Gaga-esque pop stars, etc etc. Sometimes these people break through the mainstream, sometime not, but would you turn into AI to see a Beiber clone or a Katy Perry clone when there’s already enough of that stuff hitting you over the head every five minutes you’re in the car with the radio on? I dunno, I think they are going about this all wrong. AI is one platform where America can decide who it would like to hear without a bunch of A&R people and radio program directors etc etc getting in the way. If this becomes an extended A&R session, I don’t know how interesting that would be, really. Maybe I’m wrong.

  • TreeFrog

    Hallelujah! Free at last! I’m finally free of Idol! I was a faithful viewer and fan of the show itself from the S1 pilot through the S8 finale, rarely missing an episode. S7 was the last good year for me as I loved/agonized with almost all the contestants. S8 was the beginning of the end; I hated the focus on the judges and the no-longer-even-trying-to-be-subtle pimping. It left such bad feelings that I chose not to watch S9, but a junkie is still a junkie so I followed vicariously here at mj’s and at other favorite sites like TWoP and WNTS. The ho-humness vibe I got second hand made me glad I didn’t waste my time. And now that all the shiny new plans for S10 are here? I find I do not care. Be it the final jumping of the shark or the beginning of a new golden era, either way it does not matter one whit to me. I’m done. And it feels SO good!

  • Kirsten

    The changes they’re making are interesting, but it’s hard to hear it over the sounds of pretty much all but the very limited anointed ones getting trampled over. Seriously, can’t the show have some grace about this? Say “Ok, we’re trying to do something new for once”, without the assumption that then everything before it was a mistake?

    Word.

    You can revive the show without saying that it sucked before. Tide doesn’t say “Our old product couldn’t clean water off teflon, buy our new crap. It’s better we promise. I know we said that before, but we really mean it this time!” No, they say “It’s new and improved!”. Always getting better.

    Seriously, DWTS just keeps getting more popular, but i don’t recall hearing them saying “The Celebs last year couldn’t dance. They sucked”. No, they celebrate their show/stars and the fans keep piling on the bandwagon for more fun. AI for some reason likes to toss manure on the people already sitting in the bandwagon – somehow thinking that will lure more people onto the bandwagon.

    And seriously, seriously. I rag all over Lee for not being able to sing in tune, but he was hardly the worst thing last season. The production values and disfunctional judging panel were what sucked.

    STOP BLAMING THE CONTESTANTS. A) You pick the contestants. B) It’s producer choices about the show that have been pile driving this show down the ratings. Lip synching the damn group numbers? Judge’s save? Adding a fourth judge? Thinking Ellen would do well. Idiotic theme nights. Switching the freakin’ theme on a Sunday. Bruce. Grrr…

  • windmills

    sunchick: When Kelly won there weren’t a ton of pop rock chicks, when Carrie won there wasn’t really a pop country diva heir apparent I don’t think,

    Ever heard of Avril Lavigne? Michelle Branch? There were also the wannabes like Cheyenne Kimball. But Kelly wasn’t all pop rock out of the box. Miss Independent was a song that Christina Aguilera’d started cowriting but never finished and there was a lot of poppy soul on Kelly’s debut. IMO she came out of the gates pretty big too. Miss Independent went to #1 on CHR and was a multiformat hit.

    There were A LOT of young country females trying to be the next generation Faith Hill when Carrie won AI. Shelly Fairchild, Julie Roberts, Katrina Elam, just to name a few. Miranda Lambert came in 3rd on Nashville Star that year too. Jessica Andrews was on her way too.

  • Keel

    phil25:
    09/22/2010 at 3:00 pm
    It’s really annoying when people say that contestants hide behind their guitar. If it’s part of their performance, it’s part of their performance. It’s up to the voters to judge whether it’s a crutch or not.

    Cousin Phil Dweezy, is that you?

  • gangreen29

    Seriously, DWTS just keeps getting more popular, but i don’t recall hearing them saying “The Celebs last year couldn’t dance. They sucked”. No, they celebrate their show/stars and the fans keep piling on the bandwagon for more fun.

    Eh..but Dancing with the Stars isn’t sold on excellent dancing but stars being fish out of water. Every year they talk about having the most exciting group of celebrities ever, that is kind of throwing the last group under the bus. Almost all competitive reality shows do this, whether it’s Top Chef or SYTYCD or Project Runway. I don’t understand getting worked up about it.

  • Milly21

    Artists can still play an instrument and still have some movement or emotion going. The problem isnt the instrument its the lack of stage presence. No one ever said guitar playing Elvis, Prince etc, or piano playing Elton John, Gaga or even Liberace lacked stage presence or were hiding behind their instruments. All of the above artists had or have some movement or emotion going when they perform. Theyre also all extremely over the top in their moves. So instead of Idol whining about instrument usage try and find someone who has the STAGE PRESENCE. Seriously…

  • ohnonotagain

    Ken & Nigel suck. AI doesn’t create an idol, it only showcases their talents. I resent dissing David Cook, 1.5 million albums,2 platimum singles, they made money on him and this 2nd album I believe will give him big hits. They need to look at his many accomplishments before putting him down. And he didn’t stay behind the guitar in every performance.

    The judges suck. I would rather have seen Harry Conick & Shania T.

    Is country more accepting than other genres ? Maybe thats wrong. Although Carrie would have been a star anyway.

  • tigervixxxen

    On the surface I don’t mind things changing on Idol but I wish they’d consider it evolving and not “getting back to the magic”. I also don’t like the disdain for guitar players. It is not hiding behind a guitar to play an instrument and show off musicianship skills. Do they ever say that about piano players? I’d also be shocked if any of them “moved around” with the camera blocking and all that, this isn’t SYTYCD. I’m pretty skeptical any real changes will hold. I doubt Nigel and Warwick can get through and entire season without some inane irrelevant theme. I like the idea of broader theme and for the contestants to really show off what genre they are in but it was taking songs in restrictive genres and changing them up is what worked for many of them on their best weeks. If there was an emphasis on rearrangement and creativity and not every performance had to be “BIG!!!” then they wouldn’t have to eliminate the themes. I still hated the ancient ones and the asinine song list they had to work with. I doubt Nigel and Warwick all of a sudden discovered taste so I’m skeptical. It could just be a lot of talk right now.

  • http://mjsbigblog.com/luvadamlamberts-american-idol-tour-2009-washington-dc-re-cap.htm luvadamlambert

    He didn’t specifically even mention David…..:/

    Yep. I think they’re looking for the next Justin Bieber or Katy Perry

    I would LOVE that!

    Has anyone tried to sing and play at the same time? Not easy, much more difficult than just singing.

    It’s great that it’s harder that way but in IMHO they should save stuff like that for AGT!

  • t2

    David Cook is not the only one being dissed. Don’t forget Taylor, Kris, Jordan (the one I always forget) and more importantly Lee (as he is most recent). By the way, it’s not that I disagree with Nigel/Ken on the whole — it’s just that’s just stupid to diss what you have created.

    We’re keeping everyone in their genre all the time…really? Anyone else remember being sick to death of hearing the contestants sing the same stuff over and over again a couple of years ago — specifically in the “let’s get to the top 12″ round.

    Me, I can’t wait to see Steven Tyler in his new role. I wish it would have been announced before the auditions so that more rockers would have applied.

    The biggest problem for these contestants is knowing what they should sing. Historically, when you let these guys pick a song, any song, they epically fail. Including some of my favorites. Not everyone can be Michael Grimm — who has the best song-picker I’ve seen in many years.

  • anibundel

    So Jimmy Iovine is playing the Tim Gunn role for American Idol 4.0? Intriguing….

    I will state for the record: I will miss theme weeks. There is nothing like seeing the poptart like Adam take country and twist it into greatness, or an R&B artist putting a gospel spin on a classic Beatles tune that’s strong enough to take it. And I want to second everyone on Kelly’s Stuff Like That There being her breakout moment, and certainly the best moment from season one, when you watch it back with the benefit of a decade’s distance.

    Now let’s see them really do themselves a favor and cast twelve aspiring artists that are compelling enough to watch every week.

  • 1952

    Me, I can’t wait to see Steven Tyler in his new role. I wish it would have been announced before the auditions so that more rockers would have applied.

    With timbaland, iovine, and jlo looking for the next m jackson, I think I see the direction this show is going, and Tyler has his work cut out for him.

  • soverymel

    Ken & Nigel suck. AI doesn’t create an idol, it only showcases their talents. I resent dissing David Cook, 1.5 million albums,2 platimum singles, they made money on him and this 2nd album I believe will give him big hits.

    I agree that it’s bullshit that they’re putting down their past winners in order to build the unknown new contestants up. But to be accurate, I don’t think Cookie has sold 1.5 million albums yet. Brian Mansfield reported his numbers a couple months ago, and he was at 1.31 million. Still really really impressive though.

    http://content.usatoday.com/communities/idolchatter/post/2010/07/your-random-weekend-memo-1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10-11-12-13-14-15-16-17-18-19-20-21-22-23-24/1

  • Keel

    Heh. Clearly David Cook and his camp have gotten wind of the diss heard round the world and all they have to say is this (from his lead guitarist):

    @nealfingtiemann $1 beers!

    So say we all NFT. So say we all.

  • artemis

    Idol better watch out about biting the hands that feed it- their loyal viewers. Dissing past idols shows a distinct lack of class. Why deliberately p.off large numbers of fans? Nigel and Ken Warwick need to take a refresher course in Tact 101.
    Idol’s main business is getting high enough numbers of viewers to keep their advertisers happy- how contestants do after the show is secondary.
    I agree with Kristin’s post that the main problems last year were crappy production and poor chemistry in the judging panel. That said, I liked a lot of the Season 9 contestants, especially Lee and Crystal.
    Some of the coming changes sound interesting, and I’m sure I will be tuning in as usual. But if many of the contestants are 15 years
    old, I doubt I’ll be able to stay interested. I remember a little show called American Juniors-I think it lasted one season. If WGWGs are banned they will lose even more viewers.
    I know there is one thing that will never change-the voting system.
    They would never deliberately tick off a sponsor.

  • progression

    We’re keeping everyone in their genre all the time…really? Anyone else remember being sick to death of hearing the contestants sing the same stuff over and over again a couple of years ago — specifically in the “let’s get to the top 12? round.

    *raises hand*. Count me as one who’s not sure how this would really work. That’s what, fourteen weeks of hearing the contestants sing “their style” over and over and over? Hopefully the show is going to be doing some fabulous casting, updating the pre-historic song list and doing some interesting things in the middle rounds, or I’m going to get really tired of the contentants by the time the last few weeks roll around. Oh and Jimmy Iovine better be RIVETING if they are going to be giving him a bunch of camera time every single week. RIVETING.

  • sma11ie

    Me too. I absolutely love Broadway/Standards/American Songbook or whatever night every year, because that was really a night to see who could actually sing. Those songs require real chops as a vocalist. Someone always rose to the occasion, and sometimes it was a surprise who did.

    I’m assuming we would still get some time of standards night, because they said the weeks will go by decades. I assume that means some 40s and 50s music. I think no themes just means no Beatles week or Disco or Country or whatever, which I’m fine with actually.

    Don’t give two craps what Nigel’s comments may or may not be saying about David Cook. Love him, but he’s not a star right now. No bigs.

    I’m just really bummed about the theme weeks going away. I love Broadway/standards week, country week, and a lot of the other “rock-like” themes like Beatles or Rolling Stones… I like the R&Bish weeks… I’ll miss them…

  • Eileen99

    I’m looking forward to the changes, just because it’s something new. I will miss some of my favorite cheesy theme weeks, though.

    Ugh, I really don’t like the dissing of any of the Idol alums at all. I was a little surprised to read that Nigel made the comment about Kelly & Carrie because I find him pretty supportive of all the past & current contestants on SYTYCD. I’m hoping it was just a poor choice of words. In any event, try to be classy, Idol.

  • LoveDaRocker

    Like all the changes.
    As for instruments, they should have no-instruments weeks and instruments-allowed weeks.

  • jpfan

    Nigel says after Kelly Clarkson and Carrie Underwood, there were no Idols. “We have got to go back to creating American Idols,” he says.

    Oh Nigel you’re in trouble now. Wait till the Cook and Lambert fans get wind of this.

    I’d change it to after Daughtry, there were no Idols but I won’t quibble.

  • Tony

    Wow. I actually like….every single change. Especially the possible restriction on instruments. What happens the season after instruments are introduced? Back-to-back-to-back winners that were white guys who played guitar. Not saying that they couldn’t sing (Lee was the only one who I really didn’t care for…at ALL) but I prefer that everyone be on an equal playing field and use only one instrument: their voice.

  • bridgette12

    Hazehel:
    09/22/2010 at 3:39 pm
    I’m kinda stunned that he dismissed Daughtry that way. Almost 6 million albums sold in the U.S. not good enough?

    For some reason, I am sure Daughtry really don’t care what anyone who’s connected to Idol, have to say about him and his worth as a artist and Idol. People like Daughtry and Adam understood what the show was about, which is a platform to be seen so they could get a record deal. Winning would have been the cherry on top of the sundae, but for both of them signing with a major record company was the goal.

  • Carolgr

    I like the changes. Especially if we can get more song choices and some originals into the mix. It does seem like they are going to take the kids and make them sing, and possibly dance “ala Justin Timberlake” style. They at least will have to move like “Adam Lambert”. It also sounds like if they cannot dance or move around the stage, that they won’t make it far in the competition. Having said all this, I am a fan of AI9 and all I can say is “thank god” Lee, Crystal and Casey tried out last season, because based on what they said in the press conference, none of them would have made it very far, even if they had a good voice. I do think Nigel Lythgoe can be a “tool” but he also is spot on with allot of what he says. He is pretty much the “Simon” of the show..even though he won’t be judging. My gut says he will have allot to say when it comes to who makes it through.

  • GreenHippo

    artemis:
    09/22/2010 at 5:45 pm
    Idol better watch out about biting the hands that feed it- their loyal viewers. Dissing past idols shows a distinct lack of class. Why deliberately p.off large numbers of fans? Nigel and Ken Warwick need to take a refresher course in Tact 101.
    Idol’s main business is getting high enough numbers of viewers to keep their advertisers happy- how contestants do after the show is secondary.
    I agree with Kristin’s post that the main problems last year were crappy production and poor chemistry in the judging panel. That said, I liked a lot of the Season 9 contestants, especially Lee and Crystal.
    Some of the coming changes sound interesting, and I’m sure I will be tuning in as usual. But if many of the contestants are 15 years
    old, I doubt I’ll be able to stay interested. I remember a little show called American Juniors-I think it lasted one season. If WGWGs are banned they will lose even more viewers.
    I know there is one thing that will never change-the voting system.
    They would never deliberately tick off a sponsor.

    I couldn’t have said it better. Idol ppl clearly fogot, who votes here The American Public will almost always go for save over exciting. AGT just tried that, they pushed and pushed and pushed the exciting acts over the WGWG, and who won? A WGWG – LOL.
    Leaving off the guitars or pianos some time would be good, but not all the time.
    And pissing off your loyal audience before the season even started – WRONG MOVE. But maybe they don’t want their “old” loyal audience back, they want the new young and fresh audience…. Well, Idol you are just not cool enough for that.

  • jpfan

    Ultimately, Nigel is just getting the buzz going for S10.

  • LaRue

    I agree with the WGWG’s though. Have had enough of them- time to get some people on this show that will make it in the pop world- not reduced to HAC.

    It’s the jaded attitude of us fans–who are never satisfied with who wins the show, where hardly any contestant is good enough, no matter what they do–that will bring Idol to its demise, even more than TPTB, IMO.

  • chearts77

    LOL, was Carrie an overnight sensation? I honestly didn’t know. (I completely and totally don’t follow country music:) )

    Practically, yes. I didn’t start watching AI until season 7. But, I knew of Carrie right after her season ended when I heard her songs on the radio. I believe she won Female Vocalist at the ACMs or CMAs (or both) the first time she was eligible. I remember the Faith Hill look when Carrie won. LOL!! And, she’s been burning up the country charts ever since. I’m not a Carrie fanatic either. I like some of her songs…and some songs, not so much. Just giving her credit where credit is due. She is HUGE in Country.

  • GreenHippo

    Contestants will get to perform in their own genres every week! No more county singers singing rock and vice versa. Themes will focus on decades rather than genres. “It’s really important to develop what they are good at,” says Nigel.

    uhm, how many 15 year olds really know their genere? How about contestants, who can sing any genre? what happened to challenges and performing outside of their boxes?
    -jeesh!

  • anibundel

    Hazehel:
    09/22/2010 at 3:39 pm
    I’m kinda stunned that he dismissed Daughtry that way. Almost 6 million albums sold in the U.S. not good enough?

    Daughtry didn’t win. Out of their winners, the only ones who have broken out of the “idol bubble” are Kelly and Carrie….but Kelly didn’t do it until Breakaway, her second album, which came out during Idol’s fourth season.
    Carrie did it on her first album because she had the one-two punch of idol marketing to the country market for the first time, and the impression in the pop market that Idol produced real hitmakers was peaking with Kelly’s four number one hits.
    If Cook’s second album does really well this spring, you might see the same effect on this year’s winner.

  • jpfan

    LOL, was Carrie an overnight sensation? I honestly didn’t know

    I don’t follow country but Carrie won the Grammy for Best New Artist. I don’t think any other Idol has ever done that so she hit big really fast.

  • chearts77

    Oh, and in references to the judges. I think Randy and J-Lo will probably have great chemistry. Steven just looks out of place to me or something. I hope to be pleasantly surprised by their ability to judge.

  • mozart4898

    Just reading through the changes they’re talking about making, I’m even more sure I’m done with this show. It seems to me they’re trying harder than anything to find another Justin Bieber or Ke$ha or something. Pop/R&B producers as weekly mentors? Dissing guitar players and instruments in general? Their changes are only really going to work if they can regain the younger viewers that they supposedly don’t have so many of any more, because the sort of music and artists I see them going for sell mostly to the younger crowd.

    Thing is, I won’t be at all surprised if it all backfires and a WGWG (or possibly without guitar much of the time if they limit that) ends up winning again. And the skill of such WGWG could make Lee look amazing, because there probably won’t be many to choose from – but assuming Idol remains popular with about the same demographic, that’s the guy that people will vote for.

    This whole season? This show in general? Just no. Do not want.

  • RockiDreams

    I am loving the new changes so far. I mean really, could this show get any worse? Maybe but change can be a good thing. To me this show is not about the judges and never has been. I don’t listen to them to decide if I like someone or not. In fact, most often I disagree strongly with them and wonder if we are watching the same show. I get really tired of this BS with the game “who is the most successful idol.” I watched Season One and to date, no one has ever captured my interest and my total love of her voice as did Kelly Clarkson. Her winning was a fantastic moment and a lot of us watching were in tears right along with her. She has also worked very hard for where she is – playing anything and everything right after she won. There are others that I love as well who may not have won the title of American Idol and that is okay. I think Kelly said once that there is room for everyone and that certainly is the case and they have been successful in their own right. I may not be a fan of other winners or non winners, but I can and do respect their success in a very difficult field. I understand what Nigel was getting at and perhaps it could have been said in a more polite manner but that isn’t Nigel. Bottom line is, I really hope they can recapture some of that magic of the first show.

  • sunchick

    Ever heard of Avril Lavigne? Michelle Branch? There were also the wannabes like Cheyenne Kimball. But Kelly wasn’t all pop rock out of the box. Miss Independent was a song that Christina Aguilera’d started cowriting but never finished and there was a lot of poppy soul on Kelly’s debut. IMO she came out of the gates pretty big too. Miss Independent went to #1 on CHR and was a multiformat hit.

    There were A LOT of young country females trying to be the next generation Faith Hill when Carrie won AI. Shelly Fairchild, Julie Roberts, Katrina Elam, just to name a few. Miranda Lambert came in 3rd on Nashville Star that year too. Jessica Andrews was on her way too.

    Oh, you mean the chick who divorced my darling Deryck? LOL ( Ah, there was a time in my youth when I lived for Sum41. Fun times. Still dig them a whole lot.) Anyway, Avril was making a name for herself around the same time that Kelly won AI. I think Let Go dropped summer of 02 and Kelly won in Sept of the same year. So no, I still don’t think there was an oversaturation of that sound that hits Kelly’s vocal sweet spot when Kelly won. Now there is, but back then it was just starting to break. Pink started to morph into more of a pop rock thing with Mizundastood but I don’t think really finished the transformation until Try This. Michelle Branch isn’t even in the ballpark. But I digress..the show was pushing R&B diva sound, and America said hell no, we want this chick with the whiskey voice.

    As for the pop country princesses, if someone like Miranda Lambert or those other people you named who are totally foreign to me had successfully stepped into the country crossover slot vacated by Faith Hill and Shania at the time Carrie won and she was being touted as a reasonable fascimile of that person I don’t think America would have been starving for Carrie. But, then again, I am considerably less versed in country music lore.

    Point was, it sounds like they are going to be molding people to mimic pop music darlings that are already overexposed rather than accidentally stumbling on someone who could conceivably fill a music nitch that may be slightly lacking or on the uptick and maybe America is jonesin to fill. I’m just saying, a sea of Beibies and Perries, well, I don’t think that’s going to be as interesting. But whatever, could be wrong and they’ll nail the coveted younger demo and there will be much celebrating and hair flipping abounding.

    Keel:
    09/22/2010 at 5:36 pm
    Heh. Clearly David Cook and his camp have gotten wind of the diss heard round the world and all they have to say is this (from his lead guitarist):

    @nealfingtiemann $1 beers!

    So say we all NFT. So say we all.

    Clearly Neal Tiemann is a wise, wise man. Speaking of, it’s also $5 pitcher night here, so enough about AI. o/

  • tigervixxxen

    They are never going to find a Bieber or Ke$ha because everything about Idol contradicts the sound and image of current urban rhythmic music. It does not compute on any level. They can’t expect people doing cheesy group numbers to Barry Manilow music to then put out a fresh rhythmic pop single. Nobody is going to vote for that and certainly nobody is going to buy into that image when the Idol gets out into the real world.

  • http://MJO judes

    This smacks of trying too hard IMO. It shouldn’t be rocket science. Cast interesting talented singers who are teevee friendly regardless of whether they sometimes play an instrument or not, mix it up with singers in different genres so there’s a little something for everyone with varying tastes to root for, CLEAR SOME NEW DAMN SONGS, mix up the theme weeks with the free choice weeks, and then see who shines and who crumbles under the pressure. That’s what the best seasons were all about.

    I agree totally- – this all sounds like they are narrowing down who they pick to a small genre of singers – which will mostly appeal to the teens- & so they will lose 3/4 of their audience!!
    Kris Allen was a master of working a theme to suit him – who would have thought that he could make Heartless into what he did & his version is still selling!!
    As a singer musician myself it really annoys me with their comments about instruments – moving around can also be a problem – with out of tune singing. I’d much rather see an instumentalist sing in tune than someone bopping around out of breath & out of tune!!
    Anyway it should be about having a variety of performers so that you get a wider audience – I never did like Nigel’s ideas & it looks like he hasn’t improved!!
    Oh also- still having the backstories – I can see them pimping even more their favourites – but Kris Allen was proof that talent can get past that as he wasn’t shown at all early.
    I remember Carrie as being very wooden on the stage – so no not a ‘Star”straight away- yes she may have sold a lot but it took her a while to improve her performance – which is at it should be – idol should be about finding raw talent – not necessarily already professional performers.
    After reading many comments on here about the Season 9 tour- it seems that many of them were much more comfortable on stage than they showed on the TV show.I think if they are going to force them to move & groove – this will be even worse – when they have done this for the group numbers it has come of as very cheesy.
    It remains to be seen who the Top 12 will be – but if there’s no variety & all are teen try hards trying to be the next “Bieber”- I will definitely be tuning out & so will many others I would think!!

    The advantage of The X Factor is that they have a variety of performers- Under 25 male & female- Over 25′s & groups – so it will be interesting to see how this how goes in the US against Idol!!
    Oh & The X factor here in Australia does have an Updated list of songs – but that doesn’t mean all new songs should be sung- its still about what songs suit a certain performer!!

  • karenc

    I agree that it’s bullshit that they’re putting down their past winners in order to build the unknown new contestants up. But to be accurate, I don’t think Cookie has sold 1.5 million albums yet. Brian Mansfield reported his numbers a couple months ago, and he was at 1.31 million. Still really really impressive though.

    I read somewhere that it’s 1.5 million worldwide and 1.3 million in the US. This also lists CBTM as 489,000 and we now know that it is now gold, so maybe the album sales are higher too. I think it’s terrific for him that there are still sales for his album 2 years later.

    I think that in a lot of ways, that David Cook is one of the most successful winners. Even though other winners have sold more albums, his was #13 of last year. And he was the first person from idol to headline a debut tour with 150 dates.

    I know that his success hasn’t reached the proportions of the most successful people from Idol, but if the second cd is as successful as the first, then he will be among the most successful out of Idol. I think they mean Idol as superstar outside of AI, but to most viewers, their Idol is their favorite.

    Other than that, I can see some good in what they are saying. It seems they are giving more flexability to their song choices by letting them stay in their genre. I would think that by adding Steven Tyler that they are going to have some rock singers included.

  • mozart4898

    tigervixxxen:
    09/22/2010 at 6:22 pm
    They are never going to find a Bieber or Ke$ha because everything about Idol contradicts the sound and image of current urban rhythmic music. It does not compute on any level. They can’t expect people doing cheesy group numbers to Barry Manilow music to then put out a fresh rhythmic pop single. Nobody is going to vote for that and certainly nobody is going to buy into that image when the Idol gets out into the real world.

    But that’s pretty much the sense I get from them. That’s what they seem to be looking for. Look at their mentor and coach. They want people that move. Doing away with instruments. It’s not hard to see which way they’re trying to go with the show.

  • Masieta

    We just thought we’ve had fan wars. With the changes they have made, we now have genres competing rather than contestants. If it’s country that floats my boat, I can’t see myself voting for a rocker, because I am automatically programmed to cringe when he/she sings a rock song every week. In the past, watching the contestants struggle outside their genres made them real people. Are they really going to let a contemporary crooner sing rat pack songs each week and win over all the great-grandmas on speed dial? Are they going to allow contestants (like Mandisa and Chris Sligh) who want to be Christian artists sing in that genre? That could be interesting when it comes to the voting…

    If there are no theme weeks but contestants stay in their genres, I foresee a battling of the genres with the largest voting demographic supporting their chosen genre. Of course, it is hard to get away from that totally. How many times have Adam and Kris said it is stupid to compare them because they represent two totally different styles of music? Yet, Adam and Kris both worked within the themes to make their performances unique. Adam fans can detail his performances that mesmerized them. Kris blew me away during disco week with “She Works Hard for the Money” as well as rat pack week with “The Way You Look Tonight.” The show needs surprises like that… The only way the show would not fall into a genre against genre war is if all the contestants were from the same genre or there were simultaneous tracks and they only competed against people in their own genre. THAT would be boring…

  • http://flamingnose.blogspot.com Scott

    I’m a diehard Cook fan, and I love Kris Allen and think he’s been a great champ. But I agree that the WGWG thing is getting old. However – and slap me down if I’m wrong or out of line – with the large female demographic of Idol’s viewers – many of whom grew up when rock was at its peak, it’s no surprise that hot young guys who play guitar and sing their arses off keep winning lol! I mean, look how long Tim Urban lasted – just based on “the cute.” I just don’t know what changed since the Jordin’s win. It seems that female contestants just don’t get the votes – or the vibe (or the mail!) that the male contestants do.

  • dee

    I respectfully disagree about Nigel “dissing” the other winners. Like it or not, Kelly and Carrie are the only 2 serious success stories(and for producers, success equates to money) in the list of Idol winners. While all the winners and some of the non-winners are successful in a smaller way(with the possible exception of Daughtry)NONE of them match up to the levels of Kelly and Carrie.

    I believe that Nigel is looking for an artist who can reach that kind of success. Our other winners have not…yet.

  • _nyanyanie

    WGWG or Divas, i think the producers should stop dissing idols.. it was a success because of those people..

    every year it was like that… then they should explain who’s idea was the miley cyrus, judges save, fourth judge..

  • http://flamingnose.blogspot.com Scott

    I believe that Nigel is looking for an artist who can reach that kind of success. Our other winners have not…yet.

    Sadly, the state of the music industry and decline of American Idol as an influence may prevent ANYONE from ever reaching those levels again. There are always exceptions, and you never know where “the next big thing” will come from. But right now hip hop, rap and R&B artists are the best sellers, and Idol does nothing to promote or nurture those relevant genres. Maybe that will change. And I have to LOL because I really dislike that form of CHR/Top 40 so if & when Idol goes down that road, it will be unwatchable for me.

  • Carolgr

    Are they going to allow contestants (like Mandisa and Chris Sligh) who want to be Christian artists sing in that genre? That could be interesting when it comes to the voting…

    God, I hope not. I am hoping that is a genre not allowed on the show, since not everyone is “Christian”. In fact I will be flat out offended if peeps are allowed to sing anything on that show that is overtly religious. I could deal with “Hallelujah” although I will shoot myself it someone sings it again on Idol.

  • mozart4898

    If there are no theme weeks but contestants stay in their genres, I foresee a battling of the genres with the largest voting demographic supporting their chosen genre.

    Exactly. This has happened anyways to a point (if people really were voting purely based on the performances each week, Casey would have been dead in the water during big band week – but he made it through), but it’ll be even more apparent now. Basically, figure out what musical genre is most popular among those who watch AI, and you’ll be able to pick who the winner will be. Unless they manage to change their demographic totally, in the past several years, the most popular genre was HAC. It will most likely still be, and this sort of format will just ensure that they have a 4th similar artist winning. However, if they pick a wider variety of singers this season, instead of having competition between the HAC/WGWG types, there may only be one or two from very early on – in other words, it may become even EASIER for them to win. People have said that Lee won basically because their “girl’s year” thing diluted the votes for the girls until only Crystal was left and then she didn’t appeal to a broad enough base. This will be a similar sort of case.

  • mermichelle

    I can see this getting boring very fast if there are no themes. The contestants will sound the same all the time.
    I also see them looking for the next “teen star” and I have no desire to watch that. I do not care for that type of music. I like musicians that play an instrument and have some variety and versatility. I liked the contestants having to change it up and adapt to the theme. (There are an awful lot of “I” statements there!!)
    Maybe I am a creature of habit? All these changes seem so AHHHHH!!
    I will give it a shot, but I do not see myself getting invested this year. Of course, I never did get that invested last year.

    OK….Rant over…sorry :) Now back to your regularly scheduled comments…..

  • Kitwana

    I think Nigel’s comment about Kelly and Carrie was a deliberate slight on David Cook. However, I think it is consistent with Idol’s overall plan to move away from “White Guy with Guitar Winner” they’ve had the past three years. What better way to do this than to ignore the most successful of this category of winner. Right or wrong, AI does notnot want another David Cook like winner, even if he sells over a million albums. They want a winner who appeals to the Bieber and Miley demographic. They want the tweens who will have the Archuleta girls meltdown when their guy loses. They have not really had that kind of winner for a while.

    I think the winner the producers are dreaming of will have the following traits: 1. male, 2. teen, 3. “hip”, 4. attractive but in a Disney kind of way, 5. pop singer, and 6. has a good voice. I think in that order. I think Fox and AI are convinced that they need such a winner to bring the show back to its glory days, or at a minimum to bring back the younger teens/tweens and ditch some of the the “older” less desirable demos. I would not bet against them. This is a make or break season for the show and I can see them doing EVERYTHING to make this happen. Ignoring Cook was just the first step.

  • sr4mjc

    Oh Nigel you’re in trouble now. Wait till the Cook and Lambert fans get wind of this.

    As a fan of both, I’m fine with it. Really, I don’t get the butthurt. Adam is still working finding his spot on radio and doing his tour and Cook is about to release album #2 after a successful debut. While both are successful in their own right, neither are Kelly or Carrie levels of success.

    And I do believe he was talking winners anyway. :) But since you asked about the fans of both, it’s cool.

    I can see this getting boring very fast if there are no themes. The contestants will sound the same all the time.

    That didn’t matter last year, they all sounded the same even with the themes.

  • dee

    I think the winner the producers are dreaming of will have the following traits: 1. male, 2. teen, 3. “hip”, 4. attractive but in a Disney kind of way, 5. pop singer, and 6. has a good voice.

    They already had that guy and David Cook beat him.

  • tigervixxxen

    It is a convenient argument when nothing else works just to generalize and blame it on demographics.

    Mozart, I agree Idol wants to find a Bieber or Ke$ha but the fact is the show just isn’t strong or “cool” enough in that area to produce a star who can make that type of music post Idol. Plus the audience isn’t looking for that type of contestant and likely would not vote for them as a winner.

  • suenigma

    This kinds of makes me sick actually. Especially after hearing about the big promo that they are apparently filming with all of the past winners. So they are going to capitalize on the past Idols’ fanbases, while at the same time slagging the very same Idols and their fans? Disgusting. When I saw all of the winners (bad Cookie) singing and representing at the finale last year, all I could think was, Damn AI, you did good. It is uncivilized to eat one’s young…

    It is not a secret that I am a proud fan of Cook, but I think that American Idol should be very proud of every single one of it’s past winners, for many reasons. Being number 1 is the not the only measure of success or worth. I think it is fine to highlight Kelly & Carrie’s success, but would it not have been classier to have said something along the lines of “We are very proud of all of our past contestants and winners, but to date, Kelly and Carrie have emerged as our only real Superstars.” Same point made, less hard feeling earned.

  • karenc

    dee:

    They already had that guy and David Cook beat him.

    That’s so true!!! And there’s been others since then.

  • zzatrms

    larc:
    The only way this can be accomplished is to limit the voting. Text voting, which has grown enormously since Idol began, has changed the odds for the contestants.

    One vote per phone number/per contestant would put things back under the control of the voting majority. Text voting shouldn’t be allowed at all since it not only permits but encourages stuffing the ballot box.

    ITA… This would level the playing field.

  • shenanigan

    The WGWG phenomenon the last three season of Idol has been interesting. In my humble opinion, David Cook changed the direction of the show with his absolutely riveting performances and story arc. For a huge number of people, the high when he won the show was unsurpassed and his humble and very emotional response, the beautiful performance of the winning moment song, the inclusion of the other very attractive contestants, his right hand man, Michael Johns, his brother saying at the end “That is my brother”. The whole thing was so satisfying and fulfilled so much of the hero myth, was so cathartic, that people have been searching for it ever since. Bruno Bettelheim and Joseph Campbell have written books about archetypal heroes and what are the most deeply fulfilling stories, fairytales, and legends and David Cook hit almost every note. (no pun intended). And there are many more elements, but most especially his deeply moving, soulful voice filled with sorrow and weariness at times, passion and fire at others. He was able to communicate so much nuance of emotion and deeply connect with his audience.

    American Idol cannot have their core audience perpetually seeking a replay of Season 7. Perhaps for that reason, Nigel feels compelled to distance the show from David Cook. Good luck with that, however, Nigel (and I mean that sarcastically). What people are seeking is quite deeply engrained.

    And I agree, no one is selling like Kelly and Carrie sold, and in reality, the music industry is going to have to change in fundamental ways, find another way to make a profit. Pursuing the elusive young teens is not going to work for the basic reason they largely do not pay for their music.

  • gangreen29

    The WGWG phenomenon the last three season of Idol has been interesting. In my humble opinion, David Cook changed the direction of the show with his absolutely riveting performances and story arc. For a huge number of people, the high when he won the show was unsurpassed and his humble and very emotional response, the beautiful performance of the winning moment song, the inclusion of the other very attractive contestants, his right hand man, Michael Johns, his brother saying at the end “That is my brother”. The whole thing was so satisfying and fulfilled so much of the hero myth, was so cathartic, that people have been searching for it ever since. Bruno Bettelheim and Joseph Campbell have written books about archetypal heroes and what are the most deeply fulfilling stories, fairytales, and legends and David Cook hit almost every note. (no pun intended). And there are many more elements, but most especially his deeply moving, soulful voice filled with sorrow and weariness at times, passion and fire at others. He was able to communicate so much nuance of emotion and deeply connect with his audience.

    What?

  • koshka

    I think the winner the producers are dreaming of will have the following traits: 1. male, 2. teen, 3. “hip”, 4. attractive but in a Disney kind of way, 5. pop singer, and 6. has a good voice. I think in that order. I think Fox and AI are convinced that they need such a winner to bring the show back to its glory days, or at a minimum to bring back the younger teens/tweens and ditch some of the the “older” less desirable demos. I would not bet against them. This is a make or break season for the show and I can see them doing EVERYTHING to make this happen. Ignoring Cook was just the first step.

    You are right.. but I’m not sure I’d disagree with them.

    dee:
    09/22/2010 at 7:35 pm
    I think the winner the producers are dreaming of will have the following traits: 1. male, 2. teen, 3. “hip”, 4. attractive but in a Disney kind of way, 5. pop singer, and 6. has a good voice.

    They already had that guy and David Cook beat him.

    How exactly is Archie ‘hip’? LOL

  • Marie23

    gangreen29:
    09/22/2010 at 8:13 pm

    The WGWG phenomenon the last three season of Idol has been interesting. In my humble opinion, David Cook changed the direction of the show with his absolutely riveting performances and story arc. For a huge number of people, the high when he won the show was unsurpassed and his humble and very emotional response, the beautiful performance of the winning moment song, the inclusion of the other very attractive contestants, his right hand man, Michael Johns, his brother saying at the end “That is my brother”. The whole thing was so satisfying and fulfilled so much of the hero myth, was so cathartic, that people have been searching for it ever since. Bruno Bettelheim and Joseph Campbell have written books about archetypal heroes and what are the most deeply fulfilling stories, fairytales, and legends and David Cook hit almost every note. (no pun intended). And there are many more elements, but most especially his deeply moving, soulful voice filled with sorrow and weariness at times, passion and fire at others. He was able to communicate so much nuance of emotion and deeply connect with his audience.

    What?

    haha I’m right there w/ you gangreene, this just completely went over my head, wondering if you’re being sarcastic or serious? nevertheless gave me a good laugh anyway

  • sr4mjc

    ^yeah, you lost me too.

  • koshka

    I get the whole AI tie to the hero myth.. but using cook as the ultimate blueprint.. not so much.

  • gangreen29

    I get the whole AI tie to the hero myth.. but using cook as the ultimate blueprint.. not so much.

    Sorry I don’t get it for anyone from AI. It’s just a singing show.

  • girlygirl

    David Cook isn’t the only Idol winner who was “dissed” — 7 of the nine AI winners got the same treatment.

    Nigel is right in that Kelly and Carrie are the only big stars out of the 9 winners. But it still totally disrespectful to imply that the other 7 winners aren’t worth their time.

    Oh and David Cook in terms of “hero” mythology = huh??? He won a reality tv show. Good for him — he’s talented and deserves to be successful as a musician. But what about it was heroic? IMO, Nothing. He wasn’t even really the underdog.

  • shenanigan

    Uh, sorry guys. Just a theory I’ve had for ages. Ok, to break it down. There are certain writers/psychologists/philosophers who have outlined the elements of drama that make a show satisfying, fulfill the audience, make them want to watch it. For example Bruno Bettelheim, a psychologist, and Joseph Campbell, a writer. Also some of the Greeks.

    A reality show is created with a lot of little stories within it. David Cook had/has the elements of a “hero” as described by these writers/psychologists/philosophers and his story also matched the components that make people like it. Also his singing and voice touched people at the basic level where these elements come into play.

    So, Season 7 was really good.

    So, people want the same from Season 8 and Season 9 so vote for people who some people, not me, call David Cook 2.0 and 3.0.

    Nigel Lythgoe does not want any more WGWGs like David Cook. So he is distancing the show from him.

    But it will probably not work because the reason they liked him was he was/is the classic hero and people always will root for that, according to those writers/psychologists/ philosophers.

    Just a theory.

  • shenanigan

    But, of course, Nigel excluded all the Idols, not just David Cook, so it is probably just a silly theory. Well, glad it provided a laugh or two.

  • koshka

    Sorry I don’t get it for anyone from AI. It’s just a singing show.

    No there isn’t anyone on the show that this fits, but it is what the producers have been trying to recreate. Typical hollywood hero, growth arc crap.

  • sr4mjc

    Maybe if they want a growth arc, they should stop calling the finale before the first votes are counted.

  • ggdoorsfan

    dee:
    09/22/2010 at 7:35 pm
    I think the winner the producers are dreaming of will have the following traits: 1. male, 2. teen, 3. “hip”, 4. attractive but in a Disney kind of way, 5. pop singer, and 6. has a good voice.

    They already had that guy and David Cook beat him.

    How exactly is Archie ‘hip’? LOL

    5 outta 6 still ain’t bad – but he was that guy… and no one else has come close to filling that particular ”role”, screaming teen meltdown drama and all… they tried shoehorning aaron kelly in the archuleta role, didn’t work… david has a quirky charm that a lot of folks like me find endearing, and we’re still nuts about him – in spite of many disses and outright attempts to try and diminish his talent, lol… idol has been known to eat and sometimes diss their own, so if anyone is feeling their idols are being/have been dissed for any reason – welcome, pull up a chair, lol…

  • sma11ie

    What?

    haha I’m right there w/ you gangreene, this just completely went over my head, wondering if you’re being sarcastic or serious? nevertheless gave me a good laugh anyway

    Hee. Love Cook. I mean, trust me, BIG fan… flipped out when he won, but I definitely don’t get hero myth thing. That’s cool that an AI winner has been so inspirational and means so much to some people, though :).

  • GreenHippo

    Just a theory.

    yeah, but I think you got something there :), that coupled with the title IDOL….makes me think. Some of this could explain the winners mostly being male. the audience being predominatly women, want a male idol/hero. The females that won, won because the males were “thin” that year? or the women were just so outstanding that the males didn’t matter (see Carrie)… hmmm I like that theory.
    Idol producers better present an hero next year. They can then sing the Disney song “from Zero to Hero”….. :lol:

  • karenc

    shenanigan:
    09/22/2010 at 8:07 pm
    The WGWG phenomenon the last three season of Idol has been interesting. In my humble opinion, David Cook changed the direction of the show with his absolutely riveting performances and story arc. For a huge number of people, the high when he won the show was unsurpassed and his humble and very emotional response, the beautiful performance of the winning moment song, the inclusion of the other very attractive contestants, his right hand man, Michael Johns, his brother saying at the end “That is my brother”. The whole thing was so satisfying and fulfilled so much of the hero myth, was so cathartic, that people have been searching for it ever since. Bruno Bettelheim and Joseph Campbell have written books about archetypal heroes and what are the most deeply fulfilling stories, fairytales, and legends and David Cook hit almost every note. (no pun intended). And there are many more elements, but most especially his deeply moving, soulful voice filled with sorrow and weariness at times, passion and fire at others. He was able to communicate so much nuance of emotion and deeply connect with his audience.

    I think there’s some truth to what you’re saying, because the past few years, the execution of the finale has really been almost a copy of what David did. I think what happened when David one was purely his idea. What I mean is that when David called the others on the platform at the end, I feel it was his idea, and I could feel real emotion. Even though I like Kris and Lee, it seemed almost like it was set up to be like that in order to end up like David, with the top 10 on the platform at the end. I even thought I saw a stage director point Lee and the others to go to the platform at the end.

    And I’ve been thinking about WGWG. I think it’s really another word for musician. Since they have allowed instruments on the show, more musicians have auditioned for the show.

    I do think the show has to go in a bit of a different direction. But it would be enough to say that we are just looking for a different type this year, and not put down previous winners.

  • ettacandy

    God, I hope not. I am hoping that is a genre not allowed on the show, since not everyone is “Christian”. In fact I will be flat out offended if peeps are allowed to sing anything on that show that is overtly religious.

    Are you kidding me? As fans, we should WANT the contestants to have a totally open choice. It’s the lists and the manipulation that have to go.

    Songs that are anti-woman, anti-gay, or blatantly atheist may offend me but I would rather be offended than be manipulated by the producers. Let them choose freely. If Christian is the “genre” of their choice, so be it.

  • http://www.planetfierce.proboards.com/ CindyM

    Nevah mind.

  • Zastine4974

    They want a winner who appeals to the Bieber and Miley demographic. They want the tweens who will have the Archuleta girls meltdown when their guy loses.

    Well we all know how the “we want a Taylor Swift clone” season went.

  • Kitwana

    David Archuleta was “hip”?? I always thought him adorable and talented, but cool?? Huh.

    I was not referring to David A lol! I was trying to list the Justin Bieber traits. However, David A probably comes closest to these 6 traits than any male contestant in the past three years. He was on Hannah Montana you know :)

  • tinawina

    David Cook isn’t the only Idol winner who was “dissed” — 7 of the nine AI winners got the same treatment.

    I know right? LOL. How did this turn into a Cook thing? :D

    They want a huge mainstream star again, someone who will have multiple smash singles and whose album will ride the top of the BB200 for months and months. Daughtry was the last person to do it and he didn’t win.

    Being Idol has no imagination, they looked around and said “well, who’s doing that now?” and they got some answers: Taylor Swift, Ke$ha, Gaga, and now the Beibs. The tried the Gaga thing with Adam, they don’t want a Ke$ha anywhere near “family show” Idol, they failed miserably at a Taylor Swift last year, so now they will try for a Beiber.

    Of course, the Beiber thing will be played the hell out before they can get their cute moppet clone to the market. LOL. Idol Fail.

    And some over 22 dude who is either playing the guitar or looks like he should be will win.

    But I will enjoy watching how it all plays out. I hope.

  • Falfor

    Nigel saying that there were no Idols other than Carrie and Kelly is nothing but a slap in the face to all of the other winners. This really struck a sour note to me. There are some pretty talented people who won on this show. Not all of them are destined to be on top, but all have a future and career on which to build, and that alone is something they did not have before. Idol started out being based on finding that person who had potential, more so than others, to be a voice in the crowd that was above others, and to fulfill dreams of young people who would otherwise not have a chance at fulfilling those dreams. Now, it has turned into a way for the producers to make a mint. Carrie and Kelly make the most money. To Nigel, money translates to success. So, Nigel, do not say you want to take this show back to being about the talent, because the talent is definitely out there and because at this point these other 7 winners are a success. If your only definition of success is money, then yes, Carrie and Kelly are idols, but if the definition of success is potential, fulfilling dreams and having a stable living, then there are 9 successes out there. I agree that this show needs to get back to what it was designed for, but if having the almighty dollar is the gage for that success, then this show is in much worse shape than it ever has been.

  • Ratna12

    So, Season 7 was really good.

    So, people want the same from Season 8 and Season 9 so vote for people who some people, not me, call David Cook 2.0 and 3.0.

    I agree, season 7 was really good.
    Interestingly for me, it was the only season that I did not vote, not even once – because I liked so many people . I was confused that season and I just listened and watched without rooting for anybody.

    Nigel: “We have got to go back to creating American Idols,” he says.

    I don’t think the producer can really “create” a star. The audience will see easily, whether a person has IT or not.

    *
    And for me, Kris Allen 1.0 is always my only idol. Love him. :)

  • AIaddict

    Falfor Ditto, I could not agree with you more.

  • Ratna12

    Falfor: I second ditto you

  • Falfor

    I think Nigel owes the other contestants an apology. This is not a very good way to start out re-vamping something, with the viewers not liking what was said, and making so many changes that it does not even resemble the original idea. What if one of those top 12 want to be another Elvis? Do we have to listen to Elvis every week? Someone said earlier, how do these kids know what Genre they want to sing. Most of them just want to sing. Lowering the contestants age is proof that this show is trying to gear toward a younger crowd. However, looking at past younger idols who were good, but so young, Jordan, Archie, Allison, and most recently Aaron, they are kids, in an adult world and it is not easy for them. I think a few mistakes are being made. They are taking the heart out of this show in their quest for profit.

  • blissful

    Given the discrepancy between the AI audience and the current make-up of Top 40, Nigel is going to be hard pressed in finding another dominant winner. Plus, by the time the show is over and the album debuts, whoever they find may not be current anymore. The producers always seem reactionary than proactive.

    All the dissing of past idols and winners does not bother me — the producers and judges do it every year to prop up the next crop. If anything it should be worse since they are trying to stay relevant and compete with X-Factor. AI is going to lose to topple from being the #1 show this year. The numbers from Dancing with the Stars are looking real good. AI might have to be satisfied with being just an entertaining show. Just give the winners a cash prize and an EP.

    As for the format changes, I think the lack of theme night is not going to work unless they replace it with something better. Can you imagine the boredom if everyone just sang in their genre? I believe that’s one of the reasons Crystal lost momentum — she became a one note singer (not saying she is, but the overall perception). Half the fun was seeing the finalists turning a song on its ear and making it fit into their style.

    But it might work if they cast the show right. Have appealing and talented singers who are raw (but not too raw) and see their transformation with makeovers (did anyone from S9 get a significant makeover?), improved stage presence, better song choices and interpretations. Maybe that’s the thinking behind a consistent mentor and staying within genres.

  • deshae78

    Most of the changes sound pretty good to me…not too sure about decades instead of genres. I guess they know that Adam was pretty unique in that regard. He tackled every week like a pro, nothing could trip him up. Kris was good at making a song fit him but he only performed in ONE style every week. Apparently we will be seeing more of that. No one will be forced to think out of the box & swith it up. I’m kinda bored by the idea. There will be no surprises, no “great moments.” I think it’s interesting to see the contestants change it up. It really shows what they’re made of & if they are a one trick pony. But I guess Idol doesn’t care…they just want the sales. The next Justin B. doesn’t need to be talented in more than one genre (or talented at all if we are using him as a model).
    I’m really glad the WGWG thing is OVER. Three years of the same type of winner, I’m so over it. And think about the dimeninshing returns. First, DC…really good (never thought he was “great,” Kris Allen…a less interesting, more sleepy DC, & then…Lee…Kris Allen with no personality whatsoever…BOO! Casey was great eye candy, but other than that bored me to tears. If Idol is looking more for a performer then I think they are on the right track. WGWG has had its run, time to wake up the show with some energy & zest! If they find someone with 1/2 the performing skills of Adam Lambert, it might be worth it to watch after the funny auditions.

  • Falfor

    Thanks Aladdict and Ratna12.
    Oh, I do like the idea of a consistent mentor. Kind of like having a physician that you see all the time, they know your case and can prescribe what is best for you.

  • sunchick

    Zastine4974:
    09/22/2010 at 9:36 pm
    They want a winner who appeals to the Bieber and Miley demographic. They want the tweens who will have the Archuleta girls meltdown when their guy loses.

    Well we all know how the “we want a Taylor Swift clone” season went.

    Ezzzzzzzzaaaaaaaaaacccccccttttttleeeeee. (tm Cassanova from Project Runway)

    As a fan of both, I’m fine with it. Really, I don’t get the butthurt. Adam is still working finding his spot on radio and doing his tour and Cook is about to release album #2 after a successful debut. While both are successful in their own right, neither are Kelly or Carrie levels of success.

    Oh, I think both Nigel and Ken came off douchtastically with their largely nonsensical asstalking and should probably be muzzled at future press conferences, but mostly I agree with this. If 19 E actually does want to break up with Cookie to find a new boyfriend or girlfriend, whatevah. He’ll live. They had a nice fling going on for awhile. And if it means more angsty songwriting material, I’m hellafine with that. And Adam sent them a Dear John letter eons ago anyway. I just hope they both (along with Kris) still feel confident that their management arrangement is in their best interest.

  • Valentin432

    Carrie and Kelly make the most money. To Nigel, money translates to success

    Nigel doesn’t say that, Carrie and Kelly are the most successfull artists because they have sold the most albums/singles and have become radio stars. Sure it probably means they are earning the most money too, but I don’t see why he would care about that.

    At the beginning American Idol was supposed to discover the next music superstar, AI needs that to stay relevant. IMO, the diminishing ratings could be attributed as much to the lack of success of the contestants post AI as to anything else.
    If the audience sees that none of the contestants become major stars, there’s a lot less at stakes and the interest diminishes.

  • http://www.planetfierce.proboards.com/ CindyM

    Why would you say that Adam sent 19E a Dear John letter?

  • Falfor

    At the beginning American Idol was supposed to discover the next music superstar

    Of course money is the motivator. Idol did not start out to discover the next superstar. It was supposed to give opportunity and hope to those who had dreams of being a superstar. They were not concerned with who made it or who did not. It was good, clean entertainment for the network and opportunity for contestants, all in one. The fact that it took off as well as it did turned it into the bottom line, with that now being the reason for it’s continued existence.

  • Valentin432

    Of course money is the motivator. Idol did not start out to discover the next superstar. It was supposed to give opportunity and hope to those who had dreams of being a superstar. They were not concerned with who made it or who did not. It was good, clean entertainment for the network and opportunity for contestants, all in one. The fact that it took off as well as it did turned it into the bottom line, with that now being the reason for it’s continued existence.

    I don’t know if you’re being ironic or not but finding the next “superstar” is exactly the moto of the first season. There’s the famous speach of Simon during Hollywood week “One of you will become the most famous person in America etc…”.
    Also it took off because Simon was cruel to those who had no talent so I don’t see where the “clean” part comes from. I have the first episode at home and they are really not concerned about the feelings of the delusional people who want to make it and doesn’t have it.

    That’s the fundamental difference between AI and any other reality tv show, the ending result did matter and fans could follow the carreer of the people they supported on tv from the auditions to the grammies.

  • sunchick

    CindyM:
    09/22/2010 at 11:15 pm
    Why would you say that Adam sent 19E a Dear John letter?

    The FYE AMA performance? Dear AI, I think we’re better off as friends. It’s not you, it’s me. Gotta go and find myself. Picture me with the wind in my hair. Love, Adam

    It’s late, and I had a beer or two. It made sense to me. ;)

    IMO, the diminishing ratings could be attributed as much to the lack of success of the contestants post AI as to anything else.

    Nah. Up until last season, there’s been at least one reasonably successful break out person per season, if not a huge megaseller. I think it’s mostly because last season was not much in the way of entertaining television. And I’d mostly blame the producers and their stupid choices. Paula was muscled out, Kara wasn’t popular, Ellen was a dud, the casting of the contestants didn’t click, people still weren’t loving the judges save, Simon was phoning it in, the production values kinda stunk, song selection was pitiful and repetitive of past seasons, lots of manufactured moments but no real break out performances, and to cap it off, no cheesy coronation song and the win was anticlimatic.

  • Valentin432

    Nah. Up until last season, there’s been at least one reasonably successful break out person per season, if not a huge megaseller. I think it’s mostly because last season was not much in the way of entertaining television

    IA that the quality of the show itself is a reason for the diminishing ratings.
    But the best years of the show in terms of ratings: season 4, 5 and 6 came when the alumnis were the most successfull, Kelly just launched Breakaway, Carrie became a huge country superstar, Daughtry had a massive debut album and a lot of the other contestants had a good carrer too.

    Since then, it’s all going downhill. People here love season 7 and 8 but the ratings were already significantly down and you can’t attribute that to the quality of the contestants.
    The fact that the music industry itself is on a downspiral could play as well, but AI is not as relevant when the winner sells less than 500 tousands units than when he sells 6 millions;

  • http://www.lindafoltz.com linda2u

    I actually liked the theme weeks – just wish there were more songs on the list to choose from. It was wonderful to watch Adam Lambert topple country week on its behind with his own “glam” version of “Ring of Fire”. And David Cook’s “Billie Jean” is legendary, as well. I think it made people work hard to find a way to do a song from a genre different from their own with THEIR sound and style. It forced creativity. It sounds like too much is being handed to the contestants and I’m afraid it’s going to be more boring.

  • http://www.lindafoltz.com linda2u

    There are different ways recording artists make money. Selling cd’s is just ONE way. There is a LOT of money to be made in live concerts. Adam has performed 72 shows – almost all of which have been sold out – and is selling out 35 shows overseas now. As he becomes more and more popular world-wide (and I believe he will be the biggest star ever to come out of Idol – just give it a little time), the radio stations across the globe will be playing his songs. And as he becomes more popular, he will gain even MORE access to killer songwriters and producers. I think Nigel’s comment was erroneous and premature.

  • http://MJO judes

    WGWG has had its run, time to wake up the show with some energy & zest! If they find someone with 1/2 the performing skills of Adam Lambert, it might be worth it to watch after the funny auditions.

    To me that’s the issue- is idol about bringing on already professional people [ like Adam] or taking a raw talent & moulding them into a performer- to me the latter is how it started – Carrie is an example- she was a raw talent on the show & was a very wooden performer but now she is the ultimate professional who gained confidence & worked on her style after the show ended. To me they now want an instant raw talented & relevant performer – which is much harder to find.
    What will be boring for me is if the focus is all on energy & zest at the expense of heartfelt & good singing.
    Not all successful performers prance around the stage all the time .

    So once again I think the key is variety of performers but with these changes I don’t think the Producers will put through that variety. At one stage idol had too many belter singers – so they then managed to put through different genres of singers- they should get back to that!!

  • sunchick

    Actually I believe ratings on the whole were up for season 7 versus season 6 and technically David’s sales were way stronger than Jordin’s out of the gate which doesn’t indicate season 7 was the downturn. The David v. David showdown had a lot of buzz, Adam was all over magazines, and people weren’t unanimously sounding the death knell until this past season, really, and I think that’s because the break out star of this past season was the shark that AI had supposedly jumped. I tend to think most people tune in wanting to be entertained, find someone to root for during the season, etc etc, and the record sales are a completely different monster depending on not only the person’s star potential but also label politics and hitting the perfect storm of factors to break an artist. Sony went through a major upheaval after season 6 and eventually parted ways with AI. I don’t think the AI artist stable was ever Barry’s baby tbh. It remains to be seen how committed they remain to AI grads who still need a little TLC.

  • http://flamingnose.blogspot.com Scott

    And once again it turns into the Adam Lambert thread. J/k. We really should stop with the “nobody before or since was like David Cook” and the “nobody before or since was like Adam Lambert.” Everyone knows that Sanjaya was THE MAN!

  • Jive

    As far as Idol wanting to grow and mold a new prerformer, I’m not sure they can ever go back to the Carrie and Kelly days. The audience has matured… While Carrie did grow, she didn’t turn into a performer until after Idol. You only have so many weeks; you can help the kids make better choices, but it takes time to grow a performer. Honestly, Adam Lambert hurt the show a bit… It’s hard to think about his season and quality of performance he brought and not compare that to the newbies. Whether you liked him or not, you really cannot deny that Adam brought a level of performance that was exciting – he sure made me tune in every week.

  • Jive

    LOL, I just saw the post about turning this into the Adam thread… but honestly, David cook and Adam left a huge mark and we will compare the future to them. David had an amazing ability to transform a song and Adam had incredible performing skills. You can’t go back to the Kelly and Carrie days…. they need to focus on how to grow the future with David and Adam in mind.

  • just sayin

    I’m so very disappointed in the news of no genre themes. If they hadn’t had those forced themes before, I would not have David Cook’s Always Be My Baby, or Jason Castro’s Travellin’ Thru, or Adam’s Ring of Fire, or…..the list goes on. I think the boring factor just went way up for next season.

  • Valentin432

    Actually I believe ratings on the whole were up for season 7 versus season 6 and technically David’s sales were way stronger than Jordin’s out of the gate which doesn’t indicate season 7 was the downturn. The David v. David showdown had a lot of buzz, Adam was all over magazines, and people weren’t unanimously sounding the death knell until this past season, really

    Unfortunately there’s a problem for the ratings of season 7 but for season 6 they are here: http://mjsbigblog.com/historical-charts/season-6-ratings
    From what I can remember they are higher than season 7 as a whole.

    As for buzz, yes the internet blogs and media specialized on AI were much more active during season 7 and 8 and the voting numbers were also significantly up, while at the same time the ratings were going down.
    IMO this means that there were fewer idol viewers but they were very passionate about their favorites and dedicated hours to vote and post about him.
    This creates contestants with a strong support from their fanbase but that lack mainstream appeal at least compared to earlier years idols.

  • sunchick

    Yeah, this may be a case of agreeing to disagree, but I still think you’re wrong on the trend.

    Idol finale ratings….

    Season 9….24.2 million
    Season 8…28.8 million
    Season 7…31.7 million
    Season 6…30.7 million
    Season 5…36.4 million
    Season 4…30.3 million
    Season 3…28.8 million
    Season 2…36.2 million
    Season 1…22.8 million

    To me the two stats that stick out like a sore thumb are season 3 and season 9, the seasons that were very genre overloaded focusing on one type of contestant (diva season, mellow instrumentalist season) and resulted in huge drop offs because people who weren’t into that type of contestant got bored quickly. Season 9 was Season 3 except this time you have the added factor of the judges upheaval, hence the shark jumping panic. Today even Damon Lindeloff tweeted “An American Idol without Simon is like the X Files without Mulder.”

  • Grammie Kari

    I think Nigel owes the other contestants an apology. This is not a very good way to start out re-vamping something, with the viewers not liking what was said, and making so many changes that it does not even resemble the original idea.


    Falfor
    , your posts have been right on. I did not like the way that comment was presented. In addition, he was addressing the winners, but there are several TOP 10 Idols who have a successful career.

    I am also very disappointed in the news of no genre themes. The themes provided a bridge between generations. It challenged the contestants, and specific themes provided some of the best memories on the show. When the contestants got to select “current” music, BillBoard Top 100, etc., there was less success.

    My favorite seasons remain Seasons 2, 5, and 7. Kelly Clarkson and Carrie Underwood did not appear in those seasons.

  • Falfor

    “One of you will become the most famous person in America etc…”.

    Yes and each year someone does become the most famous name in America, then that year passes and someone else moves in to carry that title. Those words do not imply ‘superstar’, they only say your name will be connected with a winner of American Idol. They cannot promise superstardom. The clean part comes from the idea of a wholesome show the entire family could watch and enjoy. I’ve already stated that they did not care who made it or who did not.
    For me season 2, 4, 7 and 8 were the most enjoyable to watch. The contestants make the show, not the judges. The competition involved in each of these 4 seasons made them well worth watching. The judges can push and sway their best, but the public voting tells the remainder of these stories.

  • ilovekrisallen39

    Falfor I so loved what you said.My favorite season’s were 4,5,7,8.And I loved the contestants,tha’s why I watch Idol.I like to see how much they grow as they go throw each week.While I did like Simon and Paula as judges, I watched it more for the talent.

  • hcpoirot

    “Without any specific genres/themes will yet be another mistake from producer”

    They should just try to make the theme more interesting, Instead of boring theme and oldies like sixties or fifties themes maybe songs from Lady Gaga or songs from Usher will attracted more new fresh audiences. They can even try Idol alumni top hits themes such as Kelly or Carrie songs or Daughtry songs.

    It will be tough if next year Idol ratings got stump by DWTS and then X-Factor. Yikes.

  • DarkGlamour17

    PLEASE let some guy be cute this year….otherwise I don’t see a point in watching. I mean I’m shocked they’re kepping Randy. I like him but it’s seems they’re trying to make Idol better when actually they degrading it.

  • Mary102

    Ok, not sure how I feel about a lot of the changes. I for one think the fault with certain seasons has ALWAYS been in the contestants, not in things like the theme weeks. Last year, the critics lambasted the old fashioned theme weeks, but those have often produced the best performances, as long as the PERFORMERS are good enough. Plus, it’s kinda cool to get the likes of Chris Daughtry making a country song a rock song, rather than, say, having Chris always do rock songs that ARE rock songs.

    Not to mention, when the themes have been TOO broad (like a whole decade) we usually have had the most disastrous results, due to bad song choice because there is too much to choose from.

    Next, not a fan of the mentor thing – just having one guy each week. WTF is that? I love the variety of getting new people each week, having the same guy is gonna be so boring, not to mention, it’ll be too much like they’re trying to mold the person to the label’s sensibilities rather than let the person grown and do their own thing – way too manipulative. Ugh.

    Finally, I would have loved to see people like Adam come back to mentor, because, believe it or not, idol, even though he’s not as big a name as J Lo or Steven Tyler, he showed that what the show NEEDS in either a mentor or a judge is someone who is knowledgeable about music, quick on his feet and great at quips, funny, articulate, pointed, honest, yet constructive too. I feel, between choosing J Lo and Steven Tyler, and now the whole “we don’t want jokes like Miley to be mentoring, but we’ll take big names like Elton John instead” they’re completely going for the big names without any consideration for who would actually be 1. Useful, 2. Constructive, 3. Entertaining (for a tv show), 4. know what they’re talking about.

    Ugh, idk. Don’t have high hopes yet. I think J Lo will be a much colder, more self-involved version of Paula without any of the warmth, and that Steven Tyler, for all his experience, will not make for good, articulate, quipy tv.

  • butterbean

    deshae78
    First, DC…really good (never thought he was “great,” Kris Allen…a less interesting, more sleepy DC, & then…Lee…Kris Allen with no personality

    I think Kris Allen is Kris Allen with no personality.

  • colette

    Given the discrepancy between the AI audience and the current make-up of Top 40, Nigel is going to be hard pressed in finding another dominant winner. Plus, by the time the show is over and the album debuts, whoever they find may not be current anymore. The producers always seem reactionary than proactive.

    We can all argue over our favorite Idols till the cows come home, but I think blissful is right in the sense that the Top 40 should NOT be the gauge for talent here. Who wants a bunch of Lady Gaga wannabes? Or Usher and Rhianna wannabes?

    what’s been refreshing for me about Idol is that contestants have to really SING, and can’t hide behind techno/autotune stuff or trendy trimmings. If TPTB want clones, they should be more specific: HipHop Idol, Country Idol, etc. It’s going to be interesting to see if they start shying away from “indy” style artists — you know, the ones who buck trends and come up with something fresh!

    These days, Kris Allen’s single sales and the album sales of David Cook and Adam Lambert are HUGE. They don’t fit into a neat slot, however.

    IMO greed, desperation and lack of imagination are helping to kill the recording industry. I’d hate to see Idol succomb entirely to that, or be chasing the next Carrie or Kelly so hard they forget there’s all kinds of talent out there, and selling a gazillion albums isn’t the only way to be a star….

  • http://MJO judes

    deshae78

    I think Kris Allen is Kris Allen with no personality.

    Obviously deshae you havent seen him in the past year !!

    colette:

    the Top 40 should NOT be the gauge for talent here. Who wants a bunch of Lady Gaga wannabes? Or Usher and Rhianna wannabes?

    what’s been refreshing for me about Idol is that contestants have to really SING, and can’t hide behind techno/autotune stuff or trendy trimmings. If TPTB want clones, they should be more specific: HipHop Idol, Country Idol, etc. It’s going to be interesting to see if they start shying away from “indy” style artists — you know, the ones who buck trends and come up with something fresh!

    I agree Collette- I don’t want any idol to be “moulded” into what TPTB thinks is the latest trend!! The most successful idols were those who knew the musical style they wanted to do.
    Yes they can do more updated songs but only if they suit the idol !! [ Or they can do like Kris Allen did- take a new song & make it suit their style ala Heartless!!]
    The ironic thing is as you say- ïndy style artists are the ones with something fresh- the Rhianna’s & Lady Gaga’s are fast becoming run of the mill!!

  • Grammie Kari

    Last year, the critics lambasted the old fashioned theme weeks, but those have often produced the best performances, as long as the PERFORMERS are good enough

    This may turn out to be a diaster. Specific themes have been the most successful in producing surprising, amazing, and original performances. I hope TPTB will consider this.

    Every here can come up with a list of favorite mentors. I loved Rod Stweart, Dolly Parton, Adam Lambert, etc. Seeing the same mentor week after week is going to be boring, especially if he plays favorites.

  • Ratna12

    Seeing the same mentor week after week is going to be boring, especially if he plays favorites.

    I don’t know why , but I got the feeling that that guy Lovine and Steven Tyler will play favorites.
    I really h*a*t*e it when the judges indicate on the first week who the 2 that will be on the final.

    I hope that they can be impartial and judge fairly, even if the best one is a country singer and not a rocker.

  • MaryT233

    Best change – diss the WGWG!!!! and the WWWG (women) :) the proposed changes will make me want to watch and see. The thing about the person consistently playing in their own genre kinda sucks – if the contestant picks folk music and we hear that ever week, that will be boring. You know in other seasons, even tho they had a genre, they still oftentimes did not change up. If you want to see something very intersting, watch American Idol Rewind on Saturdays (they are doing Season 5 over) you can see how much Idol has changed from Season 5 to 9. the contestants actually ENJOYED performing.

    And i diss Nigel for dissing all the other good idol winners when he said no one is as good as whats her name. ADAM LAMBERT for one!

  • ruru