Was Susan Boyle’s Famous Britain’s Got Talent Audition Auto-tuned? (UPDATE: Idol Says They Don’t Use Autotune)

Talkback Thames “is refusing to confirm or deny whether Britain’s Got Talent’s most famous contestant, Susan Boyle, had her audition helped by Auto-Tune

Well, that pretty much says it all.

I always had the feeling that that audition was rigged somehow. The audiences reaction to her before she sings is ridiculous and Simon’s reaction to her singing, when he rests his chin in his hands and has that cheesy grin always seemed so fake to me. Just my opinion!

wonder when the laser beams of exposure will be directed onto american idol. this doesn’t surprise me, there has always been whispering campaigns about the tricks and manipulations these producers use to influence or try to sway public perception, and try to the have some influence on the outcome of the contest for their favorites. i have my popcorn at the ready, waiting and ready for all shoes to drop, lol… fuller and company are playing rough – they seem to be going straight for cowell’s jugular, so i expect the favor to be returned – yay, let the games begin, send in the clowns in this hi tech peeing match for reality /karaoke show supremacy!

Oh crap, I think shits about to his that fan.

I hope that idol doesn’t get caught up in this auto-tune scandal. It’s taken enough hits about manipulations and voting issues. This could sully it more than any idol’s personal life.

wonder when the laser beams of exposure will be directed onto american idol. this doesn’t surprise me, there has always been whispering campaigns about the tricks and manipulations these producers use to influence or try to sway the public perception, and try to the have some influence on the outcome of the contest for their favorites. i have my popcorn at the ready, waiting and ready for all shoes to drop, lol… fuller and company are playing rough – they seem to be going straight for cowell’s jugular, so i expect the favor to be returned – yay, let the games begin, send in the clowns in this hi tech peeing match for reality /karaoke show supremacy!

I wonder what accusations will be thrown at AI – were favorites given auto-tune while others weren’t? And if so, how much more would that say about certain triumphs (Taylor Hicks and Kris Allen specifically)? This could get interesting.

Lee DeWize certainly didn’t sound auto-tuned on Idol to me. If he was, they should return that contraption for a full refund.

I hope that idol doesn’t get caught up in this auto-tune scandal. It’s taken enough hits about manipulations and voting issues. This could sully it more than any idol’s personal life.

imo, simon is not going to let this go unchalleged, lol… boyle is his highest profile success outside leona lewis, his biggest moneymaker, and success story… they have gone after him through her, so he really has no other choice in this crazy game except to return the favor – and you know he will. all in the guise of business, mind you, but this ”feels” personal… watch for it – there will be blood, lol, and i wonder who will be the first idol target’s blood to be spilled. it’s gonna happen, just a matter of when.

negativo:
08/26/2010 at 1:18 pm
Lee DeWize certainly didn’t sound auto-tuned on Idol to me. If he was, they should return that contraption for a full refund.

LOL! If they used auto-tune on him, they must have bought it at the dollar store.

As for Susan Boyle, it’s a little late to worry about it now, she’s made millions for herself and her cat.

ggdoorsfan:
08/26/2010 at 1:06 pm
wonder when the laser beams of exposure will be directed onto american idol.

well with all the missed notes that the contestants had shown last leason, hurting my ears, pretty much states that the show wasn´t auto-tuned, at least for me.

I wonder what accusations will be thrown at AI – were favorites given auto-tune while others weren’t? And if so, how much more would that say about certain triumphs (Taylor Hicks and Kris Allen specifically)? This could get interesting.

there have always been whispers of producer manipulations and interference galore backstage on idol to get the result they wanted – what these specific manipulations have been has been unknown, but in this game of hardball these big boys are playing, i feel the gloves are coming off, as well as all bets, lol. it would not surprise me if autotune or other enhancements have been used, or not, to make some contestants sound better, or worse, depending on the script to be played… i don’t worry about my fave getting caught up in the coming firestorm – they sure didn’t edit out his breathing, cause plenty of people sure had something to say about it then, lol… the anticipation and speculation of simon’s response gives me pleasure – it will be brutal, and coooold – and knowing simon, delivered with a smile.

well with all the missed notes that the contestants had shown last leason, hurting my ears, pretty much states that the show wasn´t auto-tuned, at least for me.

true, they must have let it slide last season, lol… simon was leaving, so maybe they wanted everyone to sound bad to make his last season look bad, lol – i dunno, but this is more exciting than the upcoming season…

As many bad performances as there have been on AI, I would also have difficulty believing anyone was autotuned. Guess it could have happened but I think I’d like to see the proof before I believe it. AI has had it’s share of serious issues but I truly hope this is not one of them. That would likely put the nails in the coffin.

ggdoorsfan, I agree there’s been a lot of manipulation (sob stories, screen time, etc). That’s certainly one of my issues with the show.

If they had auto-tune on American Idol, why didn’t they use during Megan Joy performance of the Bob Marley tune. In that instance, I think the viewers would have understood the necessity to use some type of enhancement.

It would be very funny if it turned out SuBo was auto tuned. It doesn’t really matter, given that she’s already made her money, although I suppose it could affect her slightly going forward. But it would still be funny.

If auto-tune is used on AI, it’s very much a pick-and-choose process. As others have said, if they auto-tuned Lee’s live performances, they were doing something wrong, because he was off-key quite a lot, especially in his earlier performances. And a bunch of others who have finished in the Top 3 in prior years have also had the occasional wonky note or two (not to mention all that flat-out horrid performances by contestants that don’t finish in the Top 10 or whatever). I would think that if AI uses auto-tune, it’s mainly, if not exclusively, for the studio recordings

all due respect to megan joy and her fans, but megan joy did not appear to be a chosen one of the ptb… she was more than likely cannon fodder for them, so why waste their efforts to make her look or sound good, if that was their game plan… perhaps we will find out all the dirty little secrets of idol, now that we have the two simon’s locked in this wicked game, lol… they don’t seem to care what the fallout could be for the contestants, or the fans of the show, so let the games begin…

This is hilarious. For some reason, I feel protective of Idol, and this blow to X-Factor’s credibility makes me chuckle, even if it’s the UK version. I feel like that might translate to the US version in some peoples’ minds.

Can someone jog my memory about this: I swear in an interview, Casey mentioned something about how they use and don’t use a reverb function on the microphones on Idol. I don’t have any clue if this is an advantage or not, because I’m technologically stupid. IIRC, he said something about a dry microphone that makes your voice sound unenhanced, I dunno. Anyone?

I think it was pretty clear that the vocals were smoothed out for Susan Boyle. She has never sounded as clear and on pitch in subsequent performances of I dreamed a dream. I really don’t think autotune has ever been used on idol, however.

I wonder what accusations will be thrown at AI – were favorites given auto-tune while others weren’t? And if so, how much more would that say about certain triumphs (Taylor Hicks and Kris Allen specifically)? This could get interesting.

I don’t understand your references. I always thought that Taylor’s win was much to the chagrin of idol, and if they could have thrown a monkey wrench into that they would have. Also I’ve seem him live, and he doesn’t need to be auto tuned. His genre may not be your cuppa, but dude can sing. How would auto tune come into play as far as Kris? He too can definitely sing…..

I saw a billboard along an interstate in PA the other day with a picture of Susan Boyle that said “she dreamed a dream”, “live your dream”, “pass it on” and then a dot.com address. Now everytime I see it I will think of the auto tune drama. Yuk.

The sad thing is if they auto-tuned Susan Boyle, they did so needlessly. She’s not my cup of tea but she’s got a wonderful singing voice. Save auto-tune for the Lee DeWyze’s of the world.

I don’t understand your references. I always thought that Taylor’s win was much to the chagrin of idol, and if they could have thrown a monkey wrench into that they would have. Also I’ve seem him live, and he doesn’t need to be auto tuned. His genre may not be your cuppa, but dude can sing. How would auto tune come into play as far as Kris? He too can definitely sing…..

I think the point was that, since Idol DIDN’T seem to want either Kris nor Taylor to win, then they wouldn’t have used Auto-Tune on them, so therefore the fact that they won despite any possible disadvantages shows how talented and transcendent they are. Correct me if I’m wrong, anovich.

I saw a billboard along an interstate in PA the other day with a picture of Susan Boyle that said “she dreamed a dream”, “live your dream”, “pass it on” and then a dot.com address. Now everytime I see it I will think of the auto tune drama. Yuk.

i feel ya. showbiz – the land of lies, damn lies, manipulations, cover ups, spin, smoke and mirrors, illusion, fantasy, exploitation – talent not necessarily a requirement… it’s quite enjoyable once you accept all the above

Negativo, I love reading your funny comments, even as a Lee fan.

I don’t think that Idol necessarily uses auto-tune, either. Simon was a judge on the show. What he does in his own shows may not have necessarily been done on Idol. That said, I am with Sunny2 in that there are some things about Simon that are fake. I don’t think XFactor in the US is a guaranteed success by any means just because he is at the helm.

Wow! Now THIS is exciting AI news! Gotta admit that I’m kind of enjoying the thought of Cowell dealing with a major controversy. As far as AI using autotune? Maybe in the studio performances, but I don’t think so during the live ones. Too many sour notes for me to believe that. Remember when Adam *my all-time fave * hit that horrendous note at the end of Mad World? Many would say that TPTB pimped Adam in season 8 – they absolutely didn’t use autotune on that! And yeah, that Susan Boyle performance was so corny. The snickers, the lonebrow, the angelic notes, the amazed looks on the faces of the audience members, and Simon with that dopey look on his face. Ewwwwwww.

negativo:
08/26/2010 at 1:18 pm
Lee DeWize certainly didn’t sound auto-tuned on Idol to me. If he was, they should return that contraption for a full refund.

negativo, you’re hilarious!

Well, I guess the thing is about the Idols, that enough people – both fans and non-fans – have said that they sound great live that the auto-tuning thing seems unlikely. And that goes for all of the better known people from the show, wherever they might have finished in the top 10.

The people who most often get criticised for auto-tune are those who sound fine recorded, but obviously can’t hold a note when they sing live.

Personally, I don’t believe they use auto-tune on Idol, because Lee was so obviously a favourite last year and sounded absolutely dreaful on a fairly regular basis. I mean, if they were using auto-tune on him, then just how dreadful must he be in reality :lol

And I certainly don’t believe that they were using it seasons 1 – 8 and suddenly came over all honest and straight in season 9.

There’s too much evidence of great singers coming off the show. The music they produce might be up for question, but the singing talent generally isn’t.

Can someone jog my memory about this: I swear in an interview, Casey mentioned something about how they use and don’t use a reverb function on the microphones on Idol. I don’t have any clue if this is an advantage or not, because I’m technologically stupid. IIRC, he said something about a dry microphone that makes your voice sound unenhanced, I dunno. Anyone?

I´m curious about that too…I remember that Adam once said (pretty sure it was on his interview with Slezak after the AMA´s)that one of the reasons he did not like his AMA´s vocals was because the sound mix that make his voice sounds dry, seems that the sound of the mic was linked direct to the tv or something and that no reverb was used. He also said that this is what happens on Idol too…

ETA: Yes it was on this interview…he starts to talk about it by the 55sec mark http://www.ew.com/ew/video/0,,20302134_20302138,00.html?bcpid=33539197001&bclid=33547482001

OvenMitt:
08/26/2010 at 2:02 pm
I don’t understand your references. I always thought that Taylor’s win was much to the chagrin of idol, and if they could have thrown a monkey wrench into that they would have. Also I’ve seem him live, and he doesn’t need to be auto tuned. His genre may not be your cuppa, but dude can sing. How would auto tune come into play as far as Kris? He too can definitely sing…..

I think the point was that, since Idol DIDN’T seem to want either Kris nor Taylor to win, then they wouldn’t have used Auto-Tune on them, so therefore the fact that they won despite any possible disadvantages shows how talented and transcendent they are. Correct me if I’m wrong, anovich.

No, that was what I meant. Imagine if the people going against Kris or Taylor (whether Adam Lambert, Danny Gokey, Kat McPhee, Chris Daughtry or whoever else, was given advantages like auto-tune, while Kris and Taylor were not (and I’m not syaing any of them were). If, despite that, Kris and Taylor both still managed to win their seasons, I think it says a lot for the talent that these 2 guys were displaying.

I am not saying that this is what happened as Adam can definitely sing, Daughtry had some wonky vibrato going on, and Gokey’s Dream On is proof enough. But if there was a performance here or there that was tweaked? Who knows?

And if so, how much more would that say about certain triumphs (Taylor Hicks and Kris Allen specifically)? This could get interesting.

If this turns out to be true for AI, you are going to have to cast a wider net and some who didn’t triumph will get caught up in it as well.

wonder when the laser beams of exposure will be directed onto american idol

I don’t wonder that. Notice a theme here? These are shows produced by Cowell that are being accused by “anonymous sources.” How much do you want to lay down that these “anonymous sources” are tied to Fuller and Co, trying to discredit Cowell ahead of X-factor’s debut here in the states? American Idol’s live performances show no signs of autotune (though the iTunes recorded versions are full of it) and I’d bet money that they’re in the clear.

As for the accusations of Boyle…well, I won’t lie. The first time i watched that performance, the whole thing felt fake. I thought at first it was because I knew the outcome, but having gone back and rewatched, compared to say Cook’s “Hello” performance, or Kris’s “Ain’t No Sunshine”…those were out of the blue, felt organic, and the audience’s going wild happens slowly, building with the song. Whereas with Boyle–You Can’t Even Really HEAR her performance of IDAD in the video because the audience goes wild ON HER FIRST NOTE, and what you can hear over them doesn’t really sound live at all. It sounds over polished and slightly removed–which means that people will be more easily swayed to the idea it was autotuned.

I don’t think American Idol has to worry. People’s comments when they see the AI contestants live is that they sound better then on the tv show. I saw Adam in Toronto and there sure wasn`t any autotuning used on him. His voice is fantastic.

Agree with others about season 1-8 winners not needing auto-tuning. All of these winners have toured successfully and I’ve never heard anyone complain about their voices. Actually, they are all much more talented than lots of the big cd sellers who can’t sing live at all. Idol PTB do plenty of manipulations but probably not of the auto-tuning kind, and probably only because they aren’t sure they could get away with it undetected.

I haven’t liked Simon C. the last couple of seasons, especially last season. I never understood the Susan B. deal anyway but I think if she was initially auto-tuned, it will definitely reflect in future sales. If this turns into a major scandal for Simon right before his show debuts, I would enjoy it immensely.

It would be very funny if it turned out SuBo was auto tuned. It doesn’t really matter, given that she’s already made her money, although I suppose it could affect her slightly going forward. But it would still be funny.

I don’t think it would make any difference to the public. Anybody who has ever heard Taylor Swift sing live has to know she is Auto-Tuned to hell and back in the studio. Yet they still flock to buy her albums.

The sad thing is if they auto-tuned Susan Boyle, they did so needlessly. She’s not my cup of tea but she’s got a wonderful singing voice.

I just listened to the link that MJ provided. I’m not expert, but the only suspicious not that sounded like it might have been auto-tuned is at the 3:25 mark when she sings “seems”. When she makes the transition, I think you can hear the characteristic auto-tune whine. This could indicate that they auto-tuned the entire performance, but she’s so close to the notes, it’s not noticeable. One thing that musical purists complain about auto-tune is that it “corrects” notes it shouldn’t (e.g. when riffing between notes or sliding up a note – although some would argue you shouldn’t be sliding up to a note in the first place).

They definitely cleaned up the audio.

Given that Bruce can barely figure out what camera to use and his bumbling sound tech crew seems hardly better, I’d be stunned to discover they ever auto-tuned a live Idol show. X-Factor seems to be doing this mainly with the auditions.

fuller and company are playing rough – they seem to be going straight for cowell’s jugular, so i expect the favor to be returned

Cowell may want to blame Fuller for this blow-out, but he’d be more paranoid than the folks on the knoll to do so. X-Factor got caught with their pants down when they auto-tuned the crap out of that kid singing “Walking on Sunshine”. They’d probably been tweaking things for years and thought they could get away with more and more egregious cases of it. When it gets to the point that the singer starts sounding like a robot, the general public are going to start noticing.

I feel sorry for Gamu. She didn’t ask for any of this and she’s hooped. Cowell? ZERO SYMPATHY

Wow. If Subo was auto tuned that will be huge. All those millions who bought her album because of her voice. And its semi fake. And if AI auto tuned, that will be bad because Lee never sounded good to me except on like 2 songs. At least wrt Adam I have heard him live enough times to know exactly who and what I am listening to.

The sad thing is if they auto-tuned Susan Boyle, they did so needlessly. She’s not my cup of tea but she’s got a wonderful singing voice. Save auto-tune for the Lee DeWyze’s of the world.

Have all of you brilliant Lee DeWyze pundits been here this whole time? I always wondered where you were so I could have someone to agree with about him, ha!!

SuBo never needed auto-tune, if it was in fact used. This should help put to the rest the ideas that Britain’s Got Talent or X-Factor are SOOOO much better than Idol.

No, that was what I meant. Imagine if the people going against Kris or Taylor (whether Adam Lambert, Danny Gokey, Kat McPhee, Chris Daughtry or whoever else, was given advantages like auto-tune, while Kris and Taylor were not (and I’m not syaing any of them were). If, despite that, Kris and Taylor both still managed to win their seasons, I think it says a lot for the talent that these 2 guys were displaying.

I guess I understand….but it’s obvious auto-tuning was or could not have explained Kris win over Adam, or Kat and Daughtry losing to Taylor. As a matter of fact in all of our theorizing and tin foil hatting, that was NEVER floated as reason. Not saying that they haven’t used it, I just can’t see a way in any season that it could have been used to affect an outcome.

Now the Susan Boyle situation….totally different, imho.

Also, sound mixing on a show like Leno, or GMA is certainly different from auto-tuning a vocalist on a live show. Especially since so many singers don’t even bother with that and go straight to lip-syncing, right?

I don’t think it would make any difference to the public. Anybody who has ever heard Taylor Swift sing live has to know she is Auto-Tuned to hell and back in the studio. Yet they still flock to buy her albums

Completely different kettles of fish, because of how they came to publicity. Taylor was presented as a country music child prodigy of sorts, who “wrote her own music” and was “a wholesome alternate to acts like the Pussycat Dolls.” She had out albums before people were aware of her. She didn’t get that deal because the world was manipulated into falling in love with her story on a TV show. Boyle’s status as “some one who is famous because of reality TV” means that her popularity is much more tenuous in the minds of the consumer. She only got a record deal because of her performance, and because the world was aware of her, and those albums were bought because people felt connected to her because of the reality show. They will feel had, like she never deserved the record deal in the first place.
And, No, it’s not fair. Katy Perry is autotuned to the hilt, but if X-factor is proven to have used it, suddenly Leona Lewis (who actually can sing) will be the one who is suspect.

What will this do to Simon’s credibility, or his reputation as a judge? Doesn’t this represent new heights of manipulation, even for him? How will people trust anything he says, now?

I don’t think American Idol has to worry. People’s comments when they see the AI contestants live is that they sound better then on the tv show.

Agreed.

Wow, that audition put Boyle on the map. If it can be proved that it was enhanced, all hell will break loose.

Maybe in Britian. Most people here won’t hear about it. Or, if they do, they’ll shake their heads an move on with their lives. She’s already made her money. Some people that bought her album may feel like they were had, but most will justify their purchase with thoughts like it was likely just a note or two that needed fixing and that her album is great. Either way, here in the U.S. I don’t see this being more than a brief flurry in the media.

As to the speculation of AI being autotuned…then why didn’t they use it for Danny’s Dream On performance when the judges all made a point of praising him for taking a risk? They were still pushing Danny at that point. I’m assuming the answer is that the show being live means they have to make that decision prior to the performance as they don’t have time to do much in post production. In which case, I doubt they do much autotuning at all as they likely want their favorites to be able to sing. Shrug. Either way, I think if it happens, it would be more entertaining than damaging to the show to find out which performances they used it on. It may damage individual contestants post idol careers if a big performance they did turned out to be autotuned, but most likely it could be spun as not being a decision in the hands of the individual.

Even auto tune could not have saved that last screaming note in Dream on. LOL! And remember that awful Haley chick? AI is so not auto tuned. .

Maybe in Britian. Most people here won’t hear about it…here in the U.S. I don’t see this being more than a brief flurry in the media.

I disagree. Thanks to YouTube and the entertianment news shows, most people who never even heard of Britian’s Got Talent saw her audition. That’s why she’s sold millions of albums worldwide. I agree with mj. If this turns out to be true it will be huge.

Also no “insider” has claimed or suggested autotume was ever used on American Idol. I guess I don’t understand why the conversation has turned to speculating about that.

I don’t think Idol uses Auto-Tune for the live performances, but I certainly think they do on some of the studio versions available on iTunes. And even those could affect voting choices on subsequent performance nights.

I don’t think anybody who bought SB’s album will care. We live in an auto-tune-iverse these days. All that her fans care about is that her voice brings the sweet and pretty.

I wonder if that’s why they might have done it — with the straight, sweet quality of her voice, they felt that it needed to not be “marred” by any pitchy moments? Given SB’s style, I don’t know that one would easily accept pitchiness as emotion or drama or roughness as one does with some people’s voices. Her ace is that straight, clear kind of childlike tone and a voice and style like that don’t accommodate slidey pitches very well.

As for AI — Well, they manipulate the audience in lots of ways, but I don’t think there’s any evidence at all that they’ve manipulated the voices. Those who sang mainly on key during Idol all have pretty much proven themselves to be accurate live singers in plenty of venues since. And even quite a few who were frequently off pitch during Idol have sung *much* more on key in live venues later! I don’t think they needed to.

Of course, they do manipulate the studio recordings in various ways. But it seems to me they’ve pretty much done that for everybody, so I would think that nobody would be getting a voting advantage from it.

anibunde
Notice a theme here? These are shows produced by Cowell that are being accused by “anonymous sources.” How much do you want to lay down that these “anonymous sources” are tied to Fuller and Co, trying to discredit Cowell ahead of X-factor’s debut here in the states?

Your argument sounds reasonable. But Talkback Thames refusing to confirm or deny that autotune was used on SuBo is pretty damning.

How much do you want to lay down that these “anonymous sources” are tied to Fuller and Co, trying to discredit Cowell ahead of X-factor’s debut here in the states?

Oh god I feel dirty saying this but I can’t wait to see the back biting and cat fights LOL

starstruck2000:
08/26/2010 at 2:21 pm

I don’t think American Idol has to worry. People’s comments when they see the AI contestants live is that they sound better then on the tv show. I saw Adam in Toronto and there sure wasn`t any autotuning used on him. His voice is fantastic.

Exactly….and this can be said about practically all the idol winners and runner ups. I myself have said that idols at least produces great live singers. Why do you think a lot of them wind up on Broadway Or Theater. They may not be Recording artist but they can sing and if you are going to be on Broadway or touring any major shows you got to be able to sing. Diana Degarmo, Ace, Constantine, Anthony Fedorov, Syesha Mercado are some that did not have successful Recording in the industry but got big rolls on Broadway or Major touring companies and are doing very well for themselves. BECAUSE THEY CAN SING. Auto Tuning is not an Idol issue IMHO. I really don’t think any of the Theories are real issues either whether they are actually things that have been done, I don’t think they really effect the outcome or voting so much. (there were only two time in Idol that I felt the issue was something that effected the outcome….One was the season 2 finale when Clay lost to Ruben by a slim margin and it was brought up that the lines were down in Clay’s state and therefore many votes for him did not get counted….130K worth at least were it would have made a difference in the outcome…..and the time that the wrong phone number was posted under the wrong person….That was corrected and we had to re vote. I felt that was the right choice. But otherwise nothing else really.

Talkback Thames refusing to confirm or deny that autotune was used on SuBo is pretty damning.

No Argument there. But I’d like to add that into my pile of “why I think AI people are behind this.” Whoever put this out there knew Talkback Thames would be put in a position of either “turn a sin of omission into a Huge Lie To The Public” or “give a non answer and duck.” And Talkback Thames’ answer gives much bigger credence to the whole X-Factor is Auto-Tuned rumor. And there’s one group who benefits enormously from that.

Curly from season 1

lol!!! But he (Curly, aka Justin) did just land a pretty good Broadway role so maybe it’s just Blake?

Idol PTB do plenty of manipulations but probably not of the auto-tuning kind, and probably only because they aren’t sure they could get away with it undetected.

It’s funny, Idol does every editing, sob story-milking, special lighting, prewritten judge responses, performance order, smoke and mirrors type manipulation and the public STILL watches it. We seem to suspend reality the MOST when it comes to reality shows, hehe. I bet the only reason they haven’t resorted to auto-tuning is because they are so successful in their other manipulations, it wouldn’t make any difference. Um, “You were off-key during that song, but it doesn’t matter!” anyone??

I wouldn’t really find it surprising if they did in fact actually use auto-tune on SB’s original audition – but probably only in a few places. I haven’t listened to it in quite a while, but she’s sang a number of other times in other places as well and she’s consistently good pitch wise. Of course, there’s nothing to say that there’s not live auto-tuning taking place whenever she sings, but I don’t think she’s really been getting a whole lot of it.

On the thoughts of AI using auto-tune – it wouldn’t shock me at all if they do, or did in the past. As far as Lee, I have trouble seeing how his voice would really work with auto-tune. I really can’t see how it would, because even when he’s in tune, he tends to kinda have a natural warble or something – I can’t describe it, but he tends to slide between pitches at times and just in general isn’t dead on each note – it would be a heck of a challenge to follow along with him in a live performance setting (and my understanding is that you can use auto-tune live, but it’d be much more challenging than doing so in a studio).

People have talked about being so impressed by some of the Idols in concert and how well they sing live – well, there’s really no reason in a concert that they couldn’t be processing or doing things to enhance or improve people’s voices in concerts that are off the show. There’s less risk there even because people watching on TV generally get a better sound mix than you get in a live venue, AND you can see close-ups of their face and mouth to see exactly how things match up (or don’t, if something fishy is going on).

Apparently Casey mentioned somewhere about the mic on Idol being very “dead,” that there’s little to no reverb. Might have been for him, but I’m sure with others there’s been plenty. Seems like the mic/mix was usually pretty rich sounding for Lee (and also admittedly for Crystal, not saying that she needed it). Thinking back to last year, Danny always sounded pretty nice and full, so did Adam. I hate to say it, but I’ve heard some recordings of live performances that Adam has done and thought he sounded nothing like he did on Idol – and not in a good way, but like half his voice was left behind somewhere. Could also have been the recording quality. Several people have commented that on the current tour, it’s apparent at times that Siobhan gets some digital enhancement. When they don’t try to hide it, and the digitized thing is a part of the overall style and substance, it doesn’t bother me – it’s when they try to sneak it in there, especially if it’s during a live show that’s supposed to be about identifying “the best” singers.

When it comes down to it, if Fuller and the AI PTB are floating this rumor to discredit Simon, I think it’ll end up coming back to bite them in the ass too. One of the big things these shows still have going for them is that people mostly believe what they’re hearing. If it comes out that they’ve all used auto-tune or other tricks through the years, it’s going to hurt them all, not just SC and the X Factor. Sure, some won’t mind because all their favorites are auto-tuned anyways, but for those who really do want to hear good singers, if it turns out that half of what you hear is manipulated, es no bueno.

Susan Boyle always seemed like a novelty act to me, and novelty acts generally have very short shelf lives.

If any of this is linked to Simon Cowell, he can always say he is shocked, shocked. His career will survive, probably a lot longer than Susan Boyle’s.

I’ve been to 3 1/4 Adam concerts this summer, and he sounded pretty real to me.

I doubt this story has much effect on SuBo. I heard her on Oprah and she sounded good so unless she’s auto tuned every time she sings, she def has the goods.

The only time auto tuning matters is if the person sounds like crap live and SuBo doesn’t. . But they shouldn’t use if for talent contests where voting is involved. That’s just wrong.

So, Idol says it never uses autotuning.

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/wireStory?id=11490549

So, Idol says it never uses autotuning.

http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/wireStory?id=11490549

I’m glad they said it because this thread was going in a very strange direction.

The War Between the Simons. Yes, folks, get that popcorn supply ready!

Reminder:

Could we keep the discussion focused on the topic? Please avoid making meta comments on the thread, and or questioning/criticizing the motives of your fellow posters.

You can’t really make judgements on the live singing at a concert based on youtube recordings. So many of recordings are done with equipment that is simply not sophisticated enough to capture the full range of sounds in live singing.

soverymel:
08/26/2010 at 8:38 pm
You can’t really make judgements on the live singing at a concert based on youtube recordings. So many of recordings are done with equipment that is simply not sophisticated enough to capture the full range of sounds in live singing.

Quite true – I do realize this, and anyone who’s tried to “bootleg” a concert (I’ve tried, using a reasonably good microphone and a minidisc recorder, at a Van Halen concert) knows that it’s really hard to capture it well simply because of the volume if nothing else. However, you can still get some idea – you can tell in even just a mediocre recording if someone is horribly out of tune, or totally missing notes, or splits tempo with their band. You lose pretty much all the subtle nuances though (although on Casey’s homecoming, recordings appeared where there was no “goaty” vibrato at all…people speculated that it was just because the recording equipment was sub-par, but now others are saying he doesn’t have it on tour either…now, does he or doesn’t he). I’m not saying that concerts themselves really prove or disprove anything though. Too many variables – performers, sound engineers, venues, and lesser quality recording equipment.

So glad Idol came along and said they don’t use auto-tune. We can now rest easy because they’d NEVER lie to us, would they? (/sarcasm) Just saying, of course they’d deny it. Still though, if the rumors about SB came from Fuller and Co., in the end it’ll only create suspicion among many. Take one contestant who wasn’t exactly that savvy (and perhaps a little disgruntled), and have a reporter ask them a question about manipulation of live performances, and they might take the playing with reverb to have been “computer enhancement.” That’ll get tossed around the media and before long “an unnamed former AI contestant” will be quoted as saying that in fact AI does manipulate the voices on the show.

So glad Idol came along and said they don’t use auto-tune. We can now rest easy because they’d NEVER lie to us, would they? (/sarcasm) Just saying, of course they’d deny it.

Because they didn’t equivocate, but flat out said it, I have to believe it. It’s not that difficult to detect as Kirsten was saying in one of these discussions. Also if it were that easy why not autotune the group sing instead of that dastardly lip syncing. It’s not that easy.

I don’t think AI is autotuned, enough people hear them live, if anything, maybe just the recordings. The thing is, on AI they are looking for recording artists, so it would be really much more obvious if they were using something like autotune.

But the goal of BGT (and AGT) is to find someone with an interesting act, and not a singing competition. I don’t think it’s right to actually use autotune even in this case, because it’s still a voting competition, but I could see how it could be justified on these shows more than on AI. Now SuBe did go on to do a tour and sing some live, as well as the cd, but not really to the extent that the Idol finalists have. And there were some problems, maybe there was more to it than just her having problems adjusting to sudden fame.

I kind of wonder now about that 10 yr old girl that sung opera on AGT, Jackie something. That definately didn’t seem real to me even though they say it was. I would think this would affect AGT more than AI.

Also if it were that easy why not autotune the group sing instead of that dastardly lip syncing. It’s not that easy.

6, 10, 12 singers onstage at once would be a really big reason why not to autotune the group sing as well…it’d be horribly difficult. (How difficult it would be to use it on an individual during a live performance, I’m not sure, but I do know this – computing power now is unbelievable and a good bit of it probably wouldn’t even require a human’s intervention – the pitch could be tracked by the computer and adjusted as necessary. I don’t know if auto-tune equipment/systems or whatever are set up that way, but with what I’d learned in music technology, it probably wouldn’t be that hard for an experienced sound engineer to set it up.)

I agree with what you’ve said though – I’m not saying I’m convinced they do in fact use it for individuals, however I am saying too that I won’t necessarily take them at their word. Again, they wouldn’t admit to it at this point if they did use it, and anything less than a flat denial would start even more rumors. So they quashed them as best as they could.

I kind of wonder now about that 10 yr old girl that sung opera on AGT, Jackie something. That definately didn’t seem real to me even though they say it was. I would think this would affect AGT more than AI.

Whether a plant or not, or however awkward or odd it seemed, one thing can’t be faked with that girl (Jackie) – she will be singing in Carnegie Hall in December. If she wasn’t the real deal, they wouldn’t have her there, period. Professional opera singers hope for their whole lives to get to sing in Carnegie Hall. Granted, I’m sure her young age and unusual skill for that age has something to do with her getting to sing there but they wouldn’t have her come there and sing and then have it be lip synched/altered somehow.

Mozart4898, If you want to determine if Adam was autotuned, listen to any of his concert versions of Soaked. Reviewers have repeated described that song as semi-operatic. If you are singing a light pop song, you aren’t going to sing in the same manner as a big song like A Change is Going to Come. I am sure that Idol does not use autotune. Otherwise there were a few instances where Crystal could have benefited.

“”We have never, nor would we ever, use Auto-Tuning during the American Idol competition ,”

Interesting clarifier, imo. Meaning AI may very well auto-tune during the finale? studio recordings? And, we know they auto-tune guests. But, anyway…

As for not using auto-tune “during the AI competition,” I take AI at its word. Lest we forget, Lee DeWyze.

Whether a plant or not, or however awkward or odd it seemed, one thing can’t be faked with that girl (Jackie) – she will be singing in Carnegie Hall in December. If she wasn’t the real deal, they wouldn’t have her there, period. Professional opera singers hope for their whole lives to get to sing in Carnegie Hall. Granted, I’m sure her young age and unusual skill for that age has something to do with her getting to sing there but they wouldn’t have her come there and sing and then have it be lip synched/altered somehow.

No, they’re not going to auto-tune her at Carnegie Hall, certainly, and I doubt that she needs that particular service, anyway. I remain concerned that she has a really whacky-looking vocal-production method that is almost certainly getting her various muscles into bad habits that will be hard to break and may strain her throat down the line. Her body otherwise is just not the right shape to produce those “mature” tones, so they’re clearly having her do various probably at least somewhat ill-advised things with her musculature to produce and sustain it. … That’s likely not irreparable, but I would say it’s still not a great idea to train a young kid in such a way that she’ll certainly have to be retrained later, at least to some extent, just for the sake of making her a sensation because she’s “unusual.”

As for the CH appearance, well, it’s valid in a way but it’s also not as if she’s actually on the Hall’s real program of actual serious music. She’s being brought in by Tim Janis, the very very crossover guy who’s among those who try to gin up interest in “classical” music by producing really pretty but kinda schlocky fake Mozartian stuff and then hyping up audiences by linking the music to warm-and-fuzzy holidays, patriotism, pretty videos, etc. So it’s not as if she’s been christened the next big serious-music thing or anything. Janis is a talented kinda sorta (beschlockmeister and she’s a circus freak (kid-that-sounds-like-adult) with a very pretty voice. It’s really just a Susan Boyle concert with a kid instead of a chubby spinster. Carnegie Hall needs to sell tickets, too, so around holiday time they bring in a cute kid and a guy who is kind of a Thomas Kinkade of orchestral music (well, more talented and way way less cynical than that; seems like a nice guy and all, very into charity concerts and such; but still in a similar sentimentality ballpark) and rake in the sentimental ticket buyers’ cash. Validating for her, but not all that validating, in my opinion.

I don’t have any clue if this is an advantage or not, because I’m technologically stupid. IIRC, [Casey] said something about a dry microphone that makes your voice sound unenhanced, I dunno. Anyone?

Danny also said something in an interview before he went to Nashville that they always used a “dry feed” on AI8 without any sort of technical embellishments. Someone raised that question about the show on the AI tour also that year, I remember the band members quite emphatically denying that AI ever used autotune to include on the AI Tour.

Apparently Casey mentioned somewhere about the mic on Idol being very “dead,” that there’s little to no reverb. Might have been for him, but I’m sure with others there’s been plenty. Seems like the mic/mix was usually pretty rich sounding for Lee (and also admittedly for Crystal, not saying that she needed it). Thinking back to last year, Danny always sounded pretty nice and full, so did Adam.

I can’t imagine any likelihood they would have given special help to Adam and Danny of all people on AI8. Different styles and all, but they can both really sing. If they were going to use it on an AI8 producers’ favorite who had a lot of vocal troubles on the show, it would have been Lil Rounds IMO who had plenty of bad performances with no sign to me of (effective) technical help.

I agree, for the AI finalists who go on the tour and especially on to later singing careers, there are plenty of occasions where you hear them sing live and can judge whether or not they can generally stay on tune or not. Acoustic sets (Danny for example did radio station acoustic sets day in and day out for months on end, tons of them showing up on YT), a cappella performing the national anthem, etc.

Many of the finalists in their later careers show themselves to be consistently very good vocally. Others are less consistent day in, day out but on a good day show they are more than capable of delivering the right song well. Don’t know of any who just can’t sing at all short of having an engineering crew in tow, a la Taylor Swift production miracles.