Kelly Clarkson: Still Battling Her Record Label

Wow. I had not heard the song before but that does suck for Kelly. They sound identical. I really like Ryan and I’m puzzled why he would do this. I wonder what his explanation is?

Poor Kelly! He can do that?

I like Kelly’s much more. Too bad about the controversy.

Okay, this boggles my mind that her label would release this as a single. Heck, if I were them, I’d have stopped production, spent the money to cut another track, and reprinted the album. It’s not like they weren’t going to make enough money on Kelly’s album.

And, WTF was Ryan Tedder thinking? How stupid can you get? If I were an artist I’d be refusing to work with him after this. How can you know that he won’t do it to you too?

Kelly, girl, you really do need to ditch 19. Maybe it’s time to see what a good lawyer can do for you now that you’ve got the money.

Aww, man. That just sucks. I hate the song Halo- reminds me every time of that damn video game , lol. Isn’t this the guy writing for Kris and/or Adam?

Stand your ground Kelly!

“I really like Ryan and I’m puzzled why he would do this. I wonder what his explanation is?” Let me take a wild guess $$$ had something to do with it.

Kelly is one of my favorite singers and I agree MJ .I hope Kelly does go Indie label because she is more than just a pop singer as evident of singing for the Pope.

I don’t understand why the label isn’t complaining about Ryan, rather than releasing the single at all cost.

Isn’t this the guy writing for Kris and/or Adam?

Adam.

I love that Kelly gets into these controversies. Yes, not good for her career, but to me it shows that she cares a lot about her music and the product she puts out there. She’s not just a singer trying to be rich and famous in any way possible, she’s in it for the art of it all. I love that! I hope she continues to speak her mind and stand up for herself against her record label/outside influences.

MJ…awesome Patty Griffin shout-out. She’s absolutely amazing.

Man she’s brave! Props to Kelly. Hopefully Ryan Tedder will learn from this and not do it again, he’s a talented guy, he doesn’t need to rip himself off.

oops double post!

I like them both but Kelly’s flows better. But seriously I said this before Timberland uses the same sound over and over again, and people still buy his stuff. Omarion and Justin Timberlake’s album was pretty much the same IMO.

Ryan Tedder worked with Daughtry too on a song that ended up not making the cut for Daughtry’s new album. Now reading this I’m wondering if maybe this is one of the reasons that it was cut. I can’t help but chuckle at the thought of Chris Daughtry singing something that sounds like ‘Halo’. Nah, it would never happen; Chris is far too awesome to sing anything so pop-tuneless as that, lol.

Still it sucks for Kelly that the label would fight her on what seems like a no-brainer. I’m not a big fan of her style of music but she seems good at it, and they ought to at least hear her out. At this point in her career it seems like she’s had enough success that they should trust her instincts and let her pick the singles.

OMG THAT SUCKS SO BAD

WTF RYAN TEDDER/RECORD LABEL

anyway, i was just rewatching janette’s elimination T___T and realized that they played already gone on her journey tape thing haha.

Wow that’s crazy I never realized that those songs had similar melodies before. That really sucks for Kelly, I wonder how album’s she still owes the label. She better release a Christmas album to speed up the process.

I am really disappointed in Ryan as well, I’m a fan of One Republic but he should know better than to produce songs with similar melodies and think that a musically talented person like Kelly would just accept that. He’s really turning into Timberland.

I kind of just chalked up the similarity between “Halo” and “Already Gone” to being Ryan’s style. I mean, a lot of producers have a recognizable sound…look at Timbaland. And what about Stargate? Hello, Jordin’s “Tattoo” is a complete ripoff of Beyonce’s “Irreplaceable.” I don’t blame Kelly for being upset though. There’s apparently a rumor that when Beyonce went in to work with Ryan, he played her some stuff including “Already Gone” and she told him she wanted something like that.

I picked out a similarity between “Halo” and another track Kelly did with Ryan, “Save You” (which is my favorite off her album). They both have a little classical-sounding instrumental break. It happens in “Save You” at about 2:37 and “Halo” at around 3:00.

Try also Jordin Sparks’ The Cure -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=blIt8t1GKm8

The first time I heard I thought Ryan Tedder also wrote it because it sounded similar to Kelly’s Already Gone, but apparently it’s written by someone else. Probably just another example of the malaise in pop where all the songs start to sound like one another.

From what I heard, Kelly’s song was written first and the Beyonc one came later, but she rushed to have her song released first. Beyonc knows when she heard a strong tune.

I agree with you MJ I would love to see Kelly go Indie and do what she wants to do artistically. Ryan Tedder is indeed on his way to hackdom. Hope no Idols this season are working with!

Also are we to assume she won’t promote it at all? Is that up to her or can they “make” her sing the song.

Heh… well this guy Nick Pitera (amazing voice btw – he should try out for Idol himself) already noticed the similarities between the tunes when he did a mash-up of them back in April. He’s singing BOTH parts himself, btw.

Nick Pitera – Already Gone/Halo

I don’t think the untrained listener will notice the strong similarity in the songs. I didn’t like “Halo” at all, and yet I love “Already Gone”.

@Hazehel you can’t say Beyonce rushed for her song to come out first. Halo was released on January 20, 2009.

So clearly Beyonce had no wrong doing in this.

Wow, they are similar.But I like the production on Halo’s better.Kelly was smart to jump the gun to save herself…this way, Ryan Tedder solely gets the blame.I think maybe the problem is he may be getting too many songwriting jobs in a short period of time.He probably has deadlines…I mean creativity doesn’t just turn on like a switch…all work and no play, makes Jack a dull boy….

There are actually a lot of similar tunes…especially pop R&B tunes…can’t name any particulars because many of them really sound alike…Ne-Yo’s Closer and Craig David’s Insomnia …The Climb and No Boundaries…and yes those Timbaland songs…

I think this is a sign of the record companies’ greed and lack of dedication to the creative process….

Kelly has balls…she’s admirable for her courage….

To my untrained ear a lot of pop tunes sound so similar that I have a hard time telling one from the other. And not to defend Tedder but a songwriter does notes and/or lyrics and the rest of the stuff is done by the producer and director in their sound mixing. So I think a lot of this can be blamed on the pop “sound” that is so popular right now. (I just don’t get the multi tracs and the clap clap and the synthesized symphony in the background).

As far as MJs comments on Kelly I second the thought for 2 reasons. First she doesn’t want to play the part of a pop princess (she makes that perfectly clear in her attitude, her wardrobe, and in her interviews) and would really like to make her own sound (she is always doing rock covers when she gets the opportunity). So when her contract expires she definitely needs to choose another musical path before she drives herself and her fans nuts.

I would think that for a “true” artist once you get enough money to have a few of the finer things in life its time to start singing and performing for yourself. Hundreds of singers have backed away from the “scene” and have had a good career with a totally different sound. So, if Kelly doesn’t go that route then she has “sold out” and cannot be taken seriously any longer.

They are basically the same songs. It’s not hard to tell if they are played back to back.

I can’t come up a theory why Ryan Tedder and the label did this.

Well, Kelly isn’t marketing, packaging and printing her albums all by herself, so she doesn’t get to make all the decisions. Her label has some major say, because they are the ones allowing her to put out the music and will take a huge risk if no one buys the album. It may be hard to come to grips with, but Kelly needs to realize it’s not always about what she wants.

I don’t feel bad for her. Wasn’t she gushing in other interviews about how beautiful and haunting Already Gone was? How she loved working with Ryan? So, the song changes because it sounds similar to something else he wrote?

Saying that, I don’t think it’s a bad idea to realease the song because it sounds like Halo, but because it’s not a song radio is going to play. It is waaay to slow. Releasing it now will kill All I Ever Wanted.

I do think Kelly is a true artist but that her record label sees her as a pop/commercial singer;hence disagreements like this would likely happen.I think if she continues to be belligerent towards her label, she has to either put up or shut up.You can’t say all these things about your label and then just leave it at that(I mean I don’t think it’s a secret that most labels are in it for the profits).

ooh, that’s too bad for kelly. i wonder what ryan’s excuse is…

I love Already Gone and I’m sorta happy its the 3rd single since its the only song that can maybe save her falling sales but let’s be honest here…all of Ryan Tedders song sound exactly the same with those damn drum beats (bleeding love, AG, Halo, Battlefield). I mean look at that new Ryan Tedder demo that just leaked called Gravity….its a carbon copy of Battlefield

I agree with the consensus that there is probably no harm that was intended by Tedder- it’s just his “sound”, but maybe this one is just a little too close for comfort. I have the same problem with books I read. I usually read by author and after you read a few by the same one( James Patterson, Dean Koontz, etc) they all start to sound alike.

Well, I’ve been thinking for awhile that all Tedder’s songs are beginning to sound alike. I guess he’s now just taken this trend to its logical conclusion.

Cripes. I don’t see how he could even have done this. Surely he *knew* they were the same? Did he really think that others just wouldn’t notice?

If he’s run out of ideas at his young age, he’s in serious trouble when it comes to a long-term career, I’d think. On the other hand, at the moment nobody but Kelly seems to care. And I guess if you make enough money early on by churning out dozens of identical songs, you can spend your later years just enjoying the cash.

I hate pop music. Go indie, Kelly. I’d like to hear My January.

I wouldn’t mind if Kelly wanted to go indie, but with that comes less money for tours and international releases and that may end up hurting her international fan base, which is bad cause she’s the only AI winner who has achieved stardom and is beloved in other continents as well…

Jordin’s Battlefield, written by Tedder, has a similar feel to Halo and Already Gone. I have all three on one of my playlists because they have that pop power ballad vibe.

As for the label releasing it as a single, its been played all summer as the girl’s SYTYCD going home video song. They aren’t going to throw all that marketing value out the window just because Kelly does want to be accused of copying Beyonce.

If he’s run out of ideas at his young age, he’s in serious trouble.

Back in the day a songwriter had a “style” that was sought after by those buying his/her stuff. That is what it was all about…and many, many songs had the same rythym and cadence and that is what a singer liked.

Now, we expect a Songwriter to sound totally different for every song they put out. Ain’t going to happen and it doesn’t need to. I’ll play the devil’s advocate here and say that Kelly is covering her ass because she is seeing that her “new” stuff isn’t sitting at number one nor turning the music world upside down. Anytime that Kelly takes a hit (the bad kind, not the good) she tends to lash out. That’s OK and I don’t mind because it’s a nasty business out in album land.

Again….Kelly needs to move on and out of ‘Pop’. It’s eating her alive.

I tell ya…Kelly has looked bitterly miserable since she began promoting this album…she needs to ditch her label and management. Then she can see what it is like to have no one but herself to blame for anything.

I don’t see how Ryan Tedder is now a monster because of this – I think Kelly making a big deal about it will only back fire against her. Yes Ryan could have changed it a up a bit more, but seriously is it really that devastating, because I didn’t notice until it was pointed out, I guess I’m used to today’s music having a lot of similarities, but if the words and singer is different it’s works in a different way. Granted I’m not a music connoisseur I just know what I like and both song are good in their own ways.

I can’t fault RCA here because it’s the best song on the CD and IMO the only hope of boosting her sliding sales. I blame Ryan for his style that he’s beaten into the ground since Bleeding Love. He’s done some good work but at this point I predict he’s going to start getting very boring and eventually people will notice when every damn song sounds the same.

@Hazehel you can’t say Beyonce rushed for her song to come out first. Halo was released on January 20, 2009.

And Kelly’s album came out on March 6.

So clearly Beyonce had no wrong doing in this.

It may well be one of those stories doing the rounds on the Internet that have no basis in fact, but the dates they are released has no relevance here to when the songs are written and recorded.

I wonder what holds artists to certain labels. Bound by contract? The drive for fame, more money?

My son tells me Nickleback is tied to their label, but has signed to a new label. They can’t work with the new label until they have fulfilled their contract with their older label. They keep cranking out the albums and making money hand over fist for the old label. It appears Nickleback can sell anything –even rushed, uninspired music. Perhaps when the band gets hooked up with the new label, they’ll write less commercial music and get back to their roots — the old Nickleback my son liked.

I love it when artists aren’t driven by money alone or super stardom. That said, Kelly may eventually go Indie and do what she wants to do musically. I love her voice and she is quite capable of writing seriously good music.

I think TPTB get thrown by artists who are not driven by fame and money. Kelly feels she’s financially successful, content, more than comfortable. I can see Kris Allen eventually going that way. He basically wants to be able to make a “comfortable” living at making good music.

Looking at most of the American Idol winners, they all seem to have that level-headed attitude. David Cook, Carrie, Kelly, Kris…

I recall from Ricky’s blog a running joke about MTV’s Jim C. thinking Jordin Spark’s Battlefield (Ryan Tedder) had a similiar sound to some Gospel/Christian song. The chorus seemed pretty much note for note. This is certainly not a glowing endorsement for Tedder as a songwriter.

I applaud Kelly’s candor. Really too bad about the song. Her vocals and emotional delivery were gorgeous on it. Now it seems to be tainted.

I’m in the camp that thinks this is Tedder’s style. Listen to the bass infused angsty ballad Apologise, and that whole One Republic album. It’s kind of their signature. Whatever. IMO, Already Gone is a far better song musically, lyrically and vocally than Halo. Beyonce is a great example of someone with fantastic 5 octave vocals who can sing anything….and not move me. LOL. I like Kelly’s ‘minimalism’ on the song. The voice serves the song, and not vice versa.

I think Tedder is a sellout, doing songs per automatism. Was he writing for Adam or cowriting with? And does that cowriting mean that Adam does the lyrics and not contribute to the melody? I hope he is in there meddling with the melody or he will sound like all the others.

I don’t feel bad for her. Wasn’t she gushing in other interviews about how beautiful and haunting Already Gone was? How she loved working with Ryan? So, the song changes because it sounds similar to something else he wrote?

Maybe she was gushing BEFORE she heard Beyonce’s Halo. Then she realized Ryan didn’t write something special for her and she just got Beyonce’s leftovers.

Here’s another song Kelly did with Ryan, “If I Can’t Have You.” It sounds nothing like any of his other work, imo.

I read somewhere that Ryan said in a radio interview that beyonce heard Already gone in the studio when they were mixing it and called Ryan and asked him to wirte something like that for her. I don’t know if this is true, but I read it in a couple of articles some time ago. Kelly probably never heard Halo until radio started playing it, I guess that’s when she asked the label not to release AG. The interviews where we heard her saying that she loved already gone are from before Halo was released as a single. And I guess she truly likes it, but didn’t want to release it out of respect for beyonce, because it would be like releasing the same song twice. I truly respect kelly. She’s the most honest artist I’ve seen. You should see this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oY-qu-WT-2U&feature=player_embedded

It’s a 30 second video of kelly talking after she sang Already gone on Letterman
She says they did her favorite version of the song, the one they do on tour, it sounds “less like Halo” and then she laughs. It’s hilarious.
I hope she doesn’t work with Tedder again. And I hope he doesn’t do this to Adam.

And the beggining of “If I can’t have you” is exactky like Miley Cyrus’ “Fly on the wall”.

Honestly I would love to see Kelly Clarkson do more of what she wanted. I think All I Ever Wanted was a combo of her doing Breakaway/My December. I love love Already Gone and thinks it’s a gorgeous song. I actually think it will do very well, I love it way more then Halo. Kelly has been battling her label for years all the way back to Thankful. She has fought tooth and nail for herself and I heard she is a tough Texas girl.

IMO no AI will ever touch Breakaway, it’s the best album ever produced by an Idol. Every song was a massive hit and it was like magic in a bottle. Alot of it had to do with how amazing Kelly is. Back then though Kelly was under a big management called the Firm and had a manager named Jeff Kaniwitz. Back then Kelly was thinner, massive, and what Jeff wanted was her to be the biggest star in the world. He also banned her from American Idol. Remember Kelly was absent from Idol for like three years. She refused, declined and would not make appearances on Idol. It was not because she wanted to but because Jeff said he thought American Idol was a joke. That caused lots of dissension between her and AI. In 2006, Kelly emassed a fortune of close to 40 million dollars. She was rich, hotter then ever, had one of the biggest albums of the year and Jeff wanted a machine. He wanted her to be like Britney Spears. Kelly did no want that at all.

When she did My December, she wanted a personal album. RCA wanted another Breakway. Clive Davis was going to pay her an additional 10 million to change the whole album. My December IMO is a jewel of an album, I loved it. it was clear RCA was never going to promote it. I think Can I Get a Kiss or my favorite How I feel which is a really good song could have been great singles. This was all screwed up. Jeff was a big reason for screwing off Clive/Idol. Kelly dumped Jeff and hired Reba’s husband. What Kelly did not want was huge fame, she wanted to be an artist. MD was artistry and a beautiful album the network did not want.

With All I ever Wanted, My life would suck was huge. I do Not Hook up was a modest hit and Already Gone is just gorgeous. I honestly think Halo is so played out, that it will not be a big deal. Kelly hates RCA and I would not be surprised if she changes labels. She still under contract with them but as soon as it’s up she is moving on. I would love to see Kelly go indie because she would do any album she wanted. Honestly though there is Interscope, Capitol Records and alot of other big huge labels that would sign Kelly in a heartbeat. She has 20 freaking million CD sales. I hate the Carrie Underwood comparisons. Carrie is US star who has done fabulously but she has tanked internationally. Kelly is the only star out of Idol that has huge international sales. Also just think about it would American Idol be as popular if Kelly had never won. IMO she paved the way for everyone. Everyone laughed Idol off in season 1, nobody thought any star would sell gold much less platinum on that show. American Idol indeed found a superstar in season 1 and IMO her success is the reasons thousands of auditioned. Kelly might be bigger now, not care about her style but she is the same lovable Kelly we fell in love with in season 1. Most celebrities when there fame rises and bank account explodes because divas, snotty and bitchy. Kelly is the still the same seven years later.

If he’s run out of ideas at his young age, he’s in serious trouble.

Back in the day a songwriter had a ‘style’  that was sought after by those buying his/her stuff.

Oh, I agree with that. Every songwriter has a style that characterizes him/her, so there’s always repetition. Seems to me that it’s more than that with Tedder’s recent stuff, though — but now that I think about it maybe it’s just because most of his songs are so thin in content and concept, that they come down to nothing *but* the “style.”

Whereas a lot of songwriters, especially the great ones of the past, have more content-heavy songs, both musically and lyrically, so they have a lot more room for subtle differences within the one style. They sounded more like a continued exploration of a theme,with many subtle differences and new things in each song, instead of just a repetition of the one thing. I mean, I can always tell a Cole Porter or a Bob Dylan or a Bjork song or a Who song, and so on and so on — but I also feel that each song is a bit different from all the others, too. For the most part, their songs aren’t interchangeable with one another, and the ones that are kind of interchangeable tend to get dropped out of their canons because they actually sound like pale imitations and nothing new. It’s inevitable that you’re going to churn out *some* stuff like that — but if you have enough ideas going on, then you can also turn out stuff that’s clearly in your style and yet sounds fresh and different.

I haven’t felt that with the recent Tedder stuff. What strikes me about so many of his songs — and some other recent pop stuff — is that all of it is just thin thin thin. Like “Battlefield” — to me, there’s nothing to it; it’s got the one catchy thing, but it just hammers on that, it really goes nowhere, to me, and the one catchy thing is pretty much identical thing to all his other catchy things I’ve heard from him in the past few years. If you don’t have enough complexity, then every song *is* going to sound alike, because there’s nowhere for the song to go.

That’s what I mean by “no new ideas.” If you have enough ideas and your stuff is complex enough, you can keep producing new stuff for a lifetime without moving at all from your signature style, and that’s what virtually all writers do. But if you trade in the thin and contentless, well, then, you can’t keep writing for very long before you’re not just in the same style but totally repeating yourself.

And I guess if you set yourself up as a little pop-music factory, then the danger that you’ll run out of content is pretty high.

Actually, I don’t in the least expect songwriters to sound totally different on every song — my favorite people have very very recognizable styles — and I don’t think other people do either. I think we tend to really enjoy hearing a style/writer’s self *repeated,* just as we always did. I don’t know how else you can explain why the same people are behind many many many popular songs — because the songs by the popular writers and producers totally do have similar vibes in each instance. But … today and in the past, I still think that we only want a certain amount of repetition. We want it the same, but changed up. You want a little revelation and surprise in the context of the old and familiar. And I still think a songwriter’s in trouble if he/she can’t keep producing that little revelation in the songs. That’s the secret of the great writers, I’d say.

Hmmm tricky business. It’s unfortunate that Kelly had to speak up about this, I believe she should have stayed quiet, released the single and blamed the similarities, should the question arises, on Ryan Tedder’s musical authorship- which she’s already doing. This is a teachable mistake that Kelly can use in her next outing, and the song most likely would have sold.

I love Halo, not so fond of Already Gone. The fact is, Halo has better lyrics, better production and a better voice behind it. It’s a more sophisticated song that doesn’t come off as strictly a pop-ballad. I’m going to guess that had Already Gone been the better song, Kelly would not have objected so much to releasing it.
In fact Kelly’s album as a whole is… well, lack luster.

I think Kelly going indy would be a mistake,imo. You can get quality writers without leaving the label. Next time Kelly should be more discerning in her collaborations, choose them based on quality not on their hometown appeal.

If Kelly does go indy, I suspect it’s not just because of the music. I don’t think Kelly is comfortable with the image design side of the business, I wouldn’t be surprised to find out that her label has been fighting her on that front for a lot longer than they have about her music.

Whether Kelly is a true artist trying to fight for her art or no, I can’t tell. Certainly her music so far has given no indication of anything beyond commercial pop. She has a great voice. I mean really great. But she needs to find her musical self, I think. She needs to find a way to mesh her artistic side with her human side and somehow make it all fit into a popular sound. From what I’ve seen, and heard, Kelly is still struggling to define who she is. I just hope she doesn’t have to go indy to do it.

I was going to say Tedder can’t sue himself for copyright infringement but if different publishers own the songs, or maybe both songs are property of Sony Publishing? Kelly has a co-write on the song and if their song was first written could she sue him.

Not good if you are running out of original ideas this early into your career.

I like them both but Kelly’s flows better. But seriously I said this before Timberland uses the same sound over and over again, and people still buy his stuff. Omarion and Justin Timberlake’s album was pretty much the same IMO.

I think this is how the label is looking at it. If a certain “sound” has commercial appeal, then the thing to do is milk it as long as possible.

Most celebrities when there fame rises and bank account explodes because divas, snotty and bitchy. Kelly is the still the same seven years later.

I think everything is through the eyes of the beholder. I find Kelly’s current attitude somewhat sucky. Her “Texas schtick” is getting on my nerves and in an obtuse way that is truly as off-putting as being a big diva. What one person considers “down home and natural” another thinks as a flip off to fans that like spark and a bit of glam in theie singers of choice.

Kelly has a beautiful voice, has done amazingly well and, hopefully, will have a long career. Is she the best of the female vocalists out there? Maybe in the top 10. Is she the best performer…no. Does she “grab” the uninvested, I don’t know but her mannerisms are pretty much a turn off for me.

Ryam seems to have an Idol deal. He’s working with all of them. He’s even working with Carrie for her upcoming album!

Here’s another song Kelly did with Ryan, ‘If I Can’t Have You.’  It sounds nothing like any of his other work, imo.

My younger cousin noticed this but google up Miley’s Fly On The Wall. The intro is scaringly similar LOL.

And not to defend Tedder but a songwriter does notes and/or lyrics and the rest of the stuff is done by the producer and director in their sound mixing.

Ryan does all the production on his songs. He’s not “just” a songwriter who writes a song and then moves on. He works the songs he contributes through to completion. Just look at the liner notes for Kelly or Blake or Jordin. So the production is all him, too.

So I think a lot of this can be blamed on the pop ‘sound’  that is so popular right now.

I do agree with this. Most pop music follows a formula. The way I see it is that’s why “different” sounding songs can break through and become hits, and then others try to recapture THAT formula, and it usually doesn’t work.

I’m like the others who think that this is just a part of Ryan’s style. Apologize, Bleeding Love, Halo, Already Gone, Battlefield all are examples of it. Not to mention a lot of the songs from the debut album from OneRepublic. He also can go a more dancey route, as the last link that star provided (for Kelly’s “If I Can’t Have You”) shows plus a lot of what he did for Blake Lewis’s album. He’s better at the power-pop ballad (IMO), but he doesn’t shy away from other types of songs.

I don’t think it was malicious or even purposeful on Ryan’s part, and I don’t think it will damage Kelly or her reputation. Pop music, as I said before and many other posters have said, is repetitive. Therefore, AG and Halo sounding alike is not a career killer. “I Do Not Hook Up” sounds a LOT like “Waking Up in Vegas” (which makes sense, since Katy Perry wrote both of them), but it didn’t hurt the success of IDNHU, and Kelly’s not complaining about that. I wonder if she’s just pissed because she thought she had something special (which, I agree, AG is a GREAT, beautiful song – one of my favorites on the album.), and then she heard Halo.

In defence of Timbaland, and in much of hip hop music, it is mostly the beat track, if that is the right expression, and his little adlibs that is the same not the melody of the songs per se in my opinion being a fan of the album Shock Value and Nelly Furtado and Justin’s albums.

Even Lady GaGa’s songs have that definable something that is common to all her singles but the melody and lyrics are different enough to distinquish them as separate songs.

I mean come on ever listen to AC/DC – they too have a pretty basic formula – I love certain of the songs and I love the Back in Black album but everytime I have seen AC/DC on concert on TV I’m like snooze after the 4th song that sounds like the first song – can’t they just do TNT and Thunderstruck right off the top – in concert it might be different with the live energy. And I just found out that AC/DC is hip with the kids, even 8 year olds. They will live on forever.

And remember when everyone was horrified about sampling? Though really is sampling as long as acknowledged any different than a cover and let’s face it sampling gives the original new life.

Funny my first thought on hearing Battlefield is cute Jordin is being Beyonce Lite.

So you know tit for tat.

I actually really like both Halo and Already Gone.

To be honest, I never really liked Kelly that much during Idol. I thought Thankful was okay, and I hated Breakaway (the album). Especially Since U Been Gone. I just never got the appeal. But then when she released My December I was hooked. It’s definitely my favorite of Kelly’s albums. Now with All I Ever Wanted.. well I like it better than Breakaway, but eh.

I hate pop music. Go indie, Kelly. I’d like to hear My January.

Haha, I would love that.

I certainly appreciate Kelly wanting her songs to be “hers” alone and not sound like another new song out on the charts. But the reality in her genre is that
they all sound sorta the same imo. Kelly can sing any genre – I too look forward to that big voice sound that she commands on slow, soulful numbers. Maybe Narville recommended that she do this last cd be to smooth things over with Clive after My December, and now that she has done that, she and Narville will go in a new direction. Here’s hoping ……..

I’d like to hear My January.

Me too! My December is by far (like miles and miles) my favorite album from Kelly.

Sucks for Kelly. Shitty of Ryan. If the story about Beyonce hearing Already Gone and asking for something like it, then managing to release before Kelly is true, well that’s shitty too. Real world, cut throat, but still shitty.

Is Jordin still with 19 Entertainment?

When I hear the intro to Kelly’s song, I start singing Battlefield in my head. They are all far too similar, IMO. That slow drum pop opening is perfect gun fire. Tragic that Kelly’s and Beyonce’s songs both start with ‘Remember’.

I bought Kelly’s latest album, but quite frankly, I think I have listened to it twice. This kind of bottled pop puts me to sleep.

So, yeah, Kelly. Go indy. Do My Spring Awakening. Upgrade!

I agree with most of this and what several people have already said – Kelly is a fabulous singer and I think she’d do well on an Indie label. She has enough of a fan base that if she were to do that and market properly, she could make more – and probably sound much better – than she can where she is now.

The troubles with her label and now with Ryan Tedder are bothersome. However, while I do see her annoyance and I commend her for not wanting to step on Beyonce’s toes by releasing Already Gone in direct competition with Halo, I think she chose to sound off rather small-minded about it. She has such a compassionate side, I don’t see why she couldn’t have been just a little more gracious.

I certainly don’t fault her for being irritated with the whole thing, though. She kinda should be.

Either way, and probably no matter what happens, she’s still my favorite idol.

VFTW explaining how Tedder ripped off the melody to a Christian song for Battlefield, with links

This guy is bad news, a bland songwriter without an original thought in his head. The record industry needs to stop giving him business.

Of course, this is an industry that thinks good equals auto-tuning a song to within an inch of its life. So I guess he’s a made man.

My younger cousin noticed this but google up Miley’s Fly On The Wall. The intro is scaringly similar LOL.

Well in that case he’s ripping off someone other than himself…

Wow that’s crazy I never realized that those songs had similar melodies before.

Actually, having just given them both a back-to-back listen, I don’t think the melodies are similar at all. The instrumental tracks are basically the same, though, with an almost identical arrangement and (pretty generic) chord progressions. Based on Kelly’s quote — “No-one’s gonna be sittin’ at home, thinking ‘Man, Ryan Tedder gave Beyonce and Kelly the same track to write to.’”– it seems that she wrote her own melody to the backing track provided by Tedder. The melody on Kelly’s is actually far more memorable than Beyonce’s, IMO. If the two songs were written by two different songrwriters, and one decided to sue the other for copyright infringement, I don’t think he’d have a case.

edit: please read my guidelines, dial back the angry defensiveness

And she was totally right in calling out Ryan Tedder. He was hired to be a songwriter and producer for ORIGINAL songs. If she wanted UNORIGINAL music she could have just paid the fees and done a cover of an existing song. Yeah, songs can sound similar, but this is blatantly ripping off the backing tracks of one song and giving it to another artist to use on another song. Not only will Kelly not be working with Ryan in the future, I’m guessing that lots of other artists will be backing off of him.

Just wondering though, did any of the great classical composers ever accuse each other of stealing their ideas?

Not excusing Tedder but to some extent, if you are in music to any degree you likely hear thousand and thousand of songs and maybe a riff here and a chord change there sticks in your head and you are no longer even sure where it came from, it is just in your head.

I think the more types of music you listen to then your own music might be broader in its scope but that’s still doesn’t mean you aren’t subsconsciously copying a bar or two from a Mozart composition or a riff from a Muddy Waters song or a melody line from an Elton John song or a beat track from a Missy Elliot song.

How much variation can you get in genres like country and bluesgrass?

Of course that is why fusions of genres are the most interesting.

Actually I hate Halo I can’t explain why but I change the dial, but I actually like Kelly’s song – because I like the ethereal quality of her voice, it is something I haven’t heard from her. So I could see why the record company wanted to go with it.

Relistened to Halo – Beyonce does not sing well in lower register, even on this overproduced number you can hear her voice is not great on the lower notes…whereas Kelly’s voice is flawless, like a real angel.

Close but not a blatant copy cat I’d say. Actually it sounds like another song but I can’t pin it down in my brain.

VFTW explaining how Tedder ripped off the melody to a Christian song for Battlefield, with links

That’s interesting, because Tedder comes from a family of missionaries and ministers, and graduated from Oral Roberts University…

I read somewhere that Ryan said in a radio interview that beyonce heard Already gone in the studio when they were mixing it and called Ryan and asked him to wirte something like that for her. I don’t know if this is true, but I read it in a couple of articles some time ago.

This story sounds doubtful because Halo was supposedly given to Leona Lewis first who didn’t have the time to record it and so Beyonc got it instead, and it doesn’t sound like something that Ryan Tedder would say (it doesn’t exactly made him sound good). Unless there is solid proof of whichever song got written and recorded first or links to actual report of what Ryan said, I apologise for starting this by repeating something for which there is no reliable information.

ETA – I haven’t found the original interview yet, but the story appears to be that Halo might have been written first, but Beyonc wanted it to sound like Kelly’s Already Gone after she heard it, so Ryan rewrote the song for her (which probably means that Kelly’s song still comes first).

Will I believe you have hit the head of the proverbial nail .

It sounds like the same backing track not the same melody but that’s is still a huge no no unless it is a songwriting clinic on a reality music competition, bwah.

I think because it is a predominantly piano backing track rather than say a drum or rhythm track like Timbaland might use over and over again, therefore it is more glaring perhaps.

WOW.

i had MAD MAD respect for R.Tedder (he and timberland were, in my eyes, the number 1 and 2 writers/producers out there). But after reading this…man. That’s fucking childish. Using the same track for 2 HUGE female superstars. He’s in for a rude awakening.

Poor kelly, it seems like the only gusto she has managed to get back since her GARGANTUAN 2nd album is her first 2 hits with her 4th album- even so, the songs still aren’t as catchy as SYBG and the several others that made it to the top.

Id pay big bucks for her blues/jazz album. Fuck it if it wont be on the radio, she needs to go back to her idol roots where she just sang like a phenom…non of this screaming pop-rock stuff. Her voice is better than that IMO. Just sing Kelly- I’ll always listen.

Here is the question though, if Kelly had said nothing would anyone have noticed?

Or was she concerned they would notice so she figured she better come clean?

Here’s another song Kelly did with Ryan, ‘If I Can’t Have You.’  It sounds nothing like any of his other work, imo.

My younger cousin noticed this but google up Miley’s Fly On The Wall. The intro is scaringly similar LOL.

Ha! And I always thought “Fly on the Wall” sounded a lot like the backing music in “Mr. Personality”.

Just wondering though, did any of the great classical composers ever accuse each other of stealing their ideas?

The classical composers often stole from folk music.

As for the other, more recent composers mentioned in this thread, most people said that Arthur Freed ripped of Cole Porter’s “Be A Clown” when he wrote “Make ‘em Laugh” for “Singin’ in the Rain” – one of the few songs actually written for that movie. Most of them were covers including the title song. Betty Comden and
Adolph Green were given the task of writing a movie to feature Freed’s classic songs. It was felt that they needed a comedy bit for Donald O’Connor and they wanted something like “Be a Clown” so Freed obliged by writing a near duplicate. Freed was also produced the musical “The Pirate” which for which “Be a Clown” was originally written. LOL. Porter didn’t seem to mind because he never complained.

Be A Clown – featuring Judy Garland and Gene Kelly

Make ‘Em Laugh – featuring Donald O’Connor (and a bit of Gene Kelly in the start)

BTW, I think that Tedder sucks for doing that. He must have known those songs would be released right on top of each other and all the accusations of plagiarism that have been going on lately (which hurts the perfomer most).

When Kelly talks about going Indie, does she mean a really small independent record label like say HiFi? Or does she mean companies like Asylum Records and East West Records (which are part of WMG’s Independent Label Group)?

VOILA!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zj4Th_Jhouk

I think because it is a predominantly piano backing track rather than say a drum or rhythm track like Timbaland might use over and over again, therefore it is more glaring perhaps.

The chord progressions are similar…that’s what gives the melodies, even if they aren’t the same note-for-note–their similar sound. The result–definitely more glaring than if it were just the same rhythm track.

When Kelly album leaked alot of people noticed how similar the two songs were.

When Kelly talks about going Indie

Kelly doesn’t talk about going indie. I think people are talking about it here, because I suggested it in my post.

jtoms
Jul 25th, 2009 at 3:23 pm
VOILA!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zj4Th_Jhouk

Wow. That says it all.

Wouldn’t it be nice with a “Back to Basics” album with Kelly (like Christinas)?

mj
Jul 25th, 2009 at 3:26 pm
When Kelly talks about going Indie

Kelly doesn’t talk about going indie. I think people are talking about it here, because I suggested it in my post.

I stand corrected. My question though is still, what kind of indie company are we discussing here?

ETA:

jtoms
Jul 25th, 2009 at 3:23 pm
VOILA!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zj4Th_Jhouk

Wow! Is there anything out there for which there isn’t a youtube?!

Jordin’s Battlefield, written by Tedder, has a similar feel to Halo and Already Gone. I have all three on one of my playlists because they have that pop power ballad vibe.

I was just going to post this. A music critic made the comparison, also. I hear the same vibe between Halo and Battlefield but it’s almost beat for beat the same as Already Gone.

Good for Kelly speaking out. I love that she stands her ground.

Everyone noticed the similarities of halo and already gone when All I ever wanted was released, when halo started being played on the radio. I remember reading about it in music forums, almost everyone thought the songs were too similar. This is not new. And of course kelly noticed it too. A songwriter has a style, but that’s one thing, writing 2 songs THAT similar is a different thing. Kelly has all the right to be pissed, she loved the song, she thought she had something special but when she heard Halo she realized it was very similar to AG and that it wasn’t that special, and because she cares about the product she puts out she asked the label not to release it as a single. And I don’t think she shouldn’t have said anything about it, she’s pissed, she’s honest, she’s spontaneous, it’s kelly, it’s the same kelly from 7 years ago, and I love her for that.

Kelly and David are two idols I secretely wish would go indie.
They’re both wasting their talent doing the Pink/Daughtry thing. I want better versions of Analog Heart and My December for their next albums.

Kelly will be 30 by the time her next album comes out. She has one of the best voices in the buisness along with great interpretation skills. It’s insulting to have her sing the ‘My Life Would Suck Without You’, Demi lovato-ish crap she’s getting. She’s been there, she’s better than that.

ETA: Kelly says she and Beyonce wrote their songs to the same backing track.

Well yes, in the quote that I cited, that is what Kelly says. And Beyonce does have co-writing credit for “Halo,” according to Wikipedia.

Halo (Beyonce Knowles song)

However, as somebody else already mentioned, the song was offered first to Leona Lewis. That would lead me to believe that Beyonce’s contributions were minimal — she probably gets a songwriting credit just for her melismas! I don’t know that Kelly has any real basis for saying they both wrote to the same track, it’s probably more of an assumption based on her collaboration with Tedder.

VOILA!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zj4Th_Jhouk

WOW This is just scary.

This is not really rational, but I realize reading this that part of my fondness for Kelly is that she brings the dramz.

She’s like that one character on a soap opera who’s a likable heroine but all the stuff always happens to. Hopefully she won’t be stalked by an evil twin or wrongly jailed on a case of mistaken identity, but meanwhile I will always read any story about her struggles for Teh Music and identify with her even though she is a kabillionaire. Which I guess indeed makes her the Ultimate Queen of Idol ’cause we follow her story as much as her records.

Its so funny because even though they are similar, I hate Halo, but love Already Gone.

The first time I heard “Halo” (did they use it on SYTYCD this season?), I actually thought it WAS “Already Gone.” That’s how much they sound alike. But so do a lot of Tedder’s songs, IMHO.

And Jordin’s new song, “Battlefield” sounds uncannily like that contemporary Christian worship song “Awesome God,” which Michael W. Smith made hugely popular. After I noticed the similarities, I went online to discover that many folks (Rickey, Jim Cantiello, among others) have noted the similarity, but nobody seems to give a rat’s ass. Probably because the guy who penned it has been dead for more than a decade. So I can see why, in Kelly’s case, management couldn’t care less about the similarities between “Almost Gone” and “Halo.” If anything, that may have been a good thing in their eyes.

I love Kelly’s voice, but I hate her new album. I bought it because my son loves her, and I love her myself, but that album just blows. I would love to see her go indie and do stuff like she did on My December, but unfortunately, anything she does in the future will be compared with her big label releases, and no matter how much critical acclaim she receives, she will be called a “flop,” “loser,” and “has-been” if it sells indie numbers. Hopefully, she’s got the stones to ignore the criticism and make the music she loves.

And, yeah, Patty Griffin is a goddess. She has tons of great songs Kelly would sound fabulous covering, and Patty’s written for a lot of huge acts, including the Dixie Chicks (“Top of the World”).

I really hope it was some sort of mistake on Ryans part especially because Adam has been working with him along with other artists I hope this Ryan guy isn’t bad news!

i think what this all comes down to is that kelly didn’t even want to make this album to begin with. and she doesn’t want to make any more like it. at least that’s the feeling i’m getting. she’s actually talked a lot of shit on it from the katy perry stuff to this. and i love it. because i am a my december fan and like kelly the best when she is being KELLY, not some bubblegum version of herself.

I think it’s a little early to bury Ryan and give the eulogy. If he plagarized himself and intended to mess up things for Beyonce and Kelly that will stay his little secret. The man has awesome talent and has done some wonderful (if not always my style) music. Like in most things this little “fire storm” will flash and burn-out quickly since it’s really an online story.

In the end who is hurt by this story? Obviously Beyonce is keeping quiet (good girl), Ryan isn’t on all the talk shows defending himself (good for you, Ryan), and Kelly is left being the “victim” of her own making again and screaming foul against the big bad record company.

If someone brought up the similarities to her in an interview a little blurb about ‘both songs coming from Ryan at the same time and they are a bit similar but both Beyonce and I have our own styles..ya da ya da’. Instead, its attack everyone so she doesn’t take the heat and comes off as poor little me. I think Kelly just cries “Wolf” too often.

You gotta love Kelly’s candor. And, honestly, I would have thought ‘Halo rip-off’ if I hadn’t seen this before hearing the song. She’s right to get out in front of this.

She’s right to get out in front of this.

Isn’t this the song she has been promorting for the last couple of weeks including singing on the talk shows? I think it is already out! Am I wrong?

And ya know, she could have send something very early on because the album has been out for months. I guess it wasn’t until the song was “high-lighted” that she said something about it being similar to “Halo”.

I am so angry at Ryan Tedder I can’t see straight. I have NEVER liked this smarmy egomaniac, and now I know why. He’s a cheap, one-trick pony. A hack in the making, indeed. All of his songs sound the same, and by some accounts, he’s not very generous of spirit.

Kelly deserves better.

I can completely understand why he thought that, in the very formulaic world of pop music, plagiarism doesn’t matter if you’re only plagiarizing yourself.

But the thing is, when you’re the writer and somebody else is going to put the thing on their album, then they’re the ones who are going to be pointed at as having a song that’s just like Ms. x’s song. So it seems to me that you probably owe it to that person to mention that you’re using the same track as you used for the other song and ask them if they mind. Of course, they probably wouldn’t use the song if you told them that — but maybe that tells you something!

And, truly, if you already need to plagiarize yourself chord for chord — from one of your other very *recent* songs — by the time you’re 30, maybe you should take a break from songwriting and refresh your brain a little bit. I know it’s formulaic, but I can’t believe that, if you really worked at it, you couldn’t come up with something a little bit different. And, if you can’t, I still say you owe it to your employer to tell them that you haven’t, when you’re selling the song to somebody else.

The two songs have very similar chord progression, as different as they sound I find them way too similar to be just “Tedder’s style”.

VOILA!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zj4Th_Jhouk

That is way beyond just being simply Ryan’s style.

To me this says it all. I wouldn’t have noticed the songs were SO similar if I hadn’t listened to this. Thanks to whoever posted it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zj4Th_Jhouk

VOILA!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zj4Th_Jhouk

Another WOW! I find myself asking the same question Kelly asked. Why? Did he really think people wouldn’t notice??? As one of the most successful songwriters of the past few years, why would he risk it?

The labels may turn a blind eye but the discerning public won’t.

I called Ryan and said, ‘I don’t understand. Why would you do that?’”

I would have really wanted to be on three way to hear his answer.

I’m not a fan of Ryan Tedder’s, ever since he reportedly made snarky comments about David Archuleta covering “Apologize.” I read recently that David’s label had reached out to Jesse McCartney to write some songs for him. I hope Jesse doesn’t collaborate with his friend Tedder on this. Not only does Tedder seem to have little respect for David A, but I’d hate for David to end up a situation like this with copycat songs.

Such a shame, because I do love that One Republic album “Dreaming Out Loud.” What happened to Ryan Tedder? Maybe he just needs a break?

ETA: Oh man, Jordin’s “Battlefield” sounds exactly like that Christian song “Our God is an Awesome God.” Wow. Ryan, what gives????

ask and ye shall receive!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5fM8S-Ytws

Ripping off himself on Halo and Already Gone is one thing. The fact that Awesome God sounds exactly like Battlefield is a whole other thing. Oh wait, Halo and Already Gone sound like Battlefield. I think we have a winner.

Sad that Tedder is involved with so many AI alums.

I wonder if Kelly speaking out against her single will have some effect on airplay. I guess we shall see.

These two songs also sound kind of like Bleeding Love, another Ryan Tedder track . I read that this track Halo was originally for Leona Lewis . I guess its time for Ryan Tedder to, either take a vacation and refresh , or keep himself from spreading his creativity thin. He has a credible track record of hits so i think he has something creatively good in there . But it will go to waste eventually, if he keeps churning out sound a-likes .

Just like any artistic product that is issued a copyright or patent , each work is supposed to be unique. But what usually happens is that, if you revise an original enough ,so that it’s not exactly like the original, it usually passes the copyright and patent guidelines . That’s probably what the writer is thinking about, there is enough revision to make it different from each other.

But at the end of the day, the consumer looks for something fresh before they invest their money . Who wants a collection of CDs whose tracks all sound alike ?

On the other hand, most of the CD sales are also artist driven – the more popular artist gets the song sold even if it sounds like someone else’s. It’s pop culture- many go for the popular idol. Not for art just for art’s sake.

MJ: What’s up with editing my earlier post? I was not being provocative, just expressing my opinion on what I’m seeing from some of the posts, similar to what others are doing. I don’t appreciate being shut down, and would be happy to go to another site if that’s going to be happening.

Let me preface this by saying I love Already Gone, Halo, not so much. I think I am just suffering from Beyonce overkill, and Kelly is my favorite singer of the moment. She just makes every song sound more cool, even if it’s not. That is why I can say I like MLWSWU…..

I love Kelly’s honesty, and her seeming integrity regarding her music. It makes me think that its about music and not fame and I can so hear it in everything she does, good or bad. I have never seen Kelly’s personality as a put on, or an act, if that was the case I think she could have honestly played the game the way the pop tarts have and been way bigger than them all. She has the voice, the drive, and the talent. It’s just not what her goal is….that also makes her cool. I don’t know where she will land, but I expect that we will always talking about her, and her music.

Too bad. I love Already Gone. One of my favorite songs on the album, and of course used for SYTYCD goodbye song. Ryan is working with Adam, right? Watch out, Adam.

Go indie, Kelly. Go indie.

Check out the intro to Aerosmith’s “What It Takes”, similar to “Already Gone”

Well, whatever the case, I’ve always liked Kelly for speaking her mind and being honest and who she is. This episode is no different for me. Bravo to her for trying to maintain some originality and integrity, even though I know this latest album is probably not the one she would have preferred to put out.

I’d love for Kelly to go to an indie label and make the music she wants to make. My December is an amazing album and it’s a shame the label’s making her make cheesy pop music again.

Also just think about it would American Idol be as popular if Kelly had never won. IMO she paved the way for everyone.

Oh, please! Kelly’s as popular as she is because she’s the American Idol. The original one. She’s got a great voice– one of the top two or three of any AI contestant from any season– but don’t think for a second she didn’t derive a HUGE benefit from getting to “go first”. Being the inaugural Idol allowed her to form a special bond with the American (and non-American) public that could never happen again after the first season.

Unlike the other Idols, Kelly never had to contend with “Idol fatigue” or “Idol saturation” in the music market. And it seems she took her success for granted, and is now finding out what it’s like to be just another name in the very crowded, broader music field. Like it or not, the name “Kelly Clarkson” just doesn’t carry the same currency anymore. This was supposed to be her “big comeback” album, and it looks like it will be the second one straight that will fail to reach platinum.

Among female artists, the world belongs to the Ga-Gas and Katy Perrys and Pinks now. The pop world moved on while Kelly was (still) in a career snit. It’s just what happened, and it is what it is.

Another initial reaction I have is : why is she knocking the song if she is trying to sell it? How can she expect people to want to buy it when she labels it a rip off? If she hadn’t said anything, not many people would care how similar it sounds. Now they definitely will.

Ack. That youtube posted above—damn. And I liked Already Gone and had hopes that it would turn things around for Kelly.

I’m torn as to whether Kelly should have jumped out and said anything, or said exactly what she did. It certainly seems consistent with her personality, but given how badly she got screwed before when her fight with the label became public, and given that this will definitely make it more clear in the public mind—Hell, I’ve heard Halo enough to be officially burned out on it, and I didn’t notice the similarity on my own—I don’t know that it was a very smart move on her part, particularly to state publicly that she fought against the song being released as a single. If she felt the need to say something, why not just say when I wrote the song to the backing track and fell in love with it, I didn’t know that Beyonce had also written a song to the same backing track, and I don’t want anyone to think that I was intentionally copying her?

FolkFan Jul 26th, 2009 at 2:08 am

Ack. That youtube posted above’”damn. And I liked Already Gone and had hopes that it would turn things around for Kelly.

I’m torn as to whether Kelly should have jumped out and said anything, or said exactly what she did. It certainly seems consistent with her personality, but given how badly she got screwed before when her fight with the label became public, and given that this will definitely make it more clear in the public mind’”Hell, I’ve heard Halo enough to be officially burned out on it, and I didn’t notice the similarity on my own’”I don’t know that it was a very smart move on her part, particularly to state publicly that she fought against the song being released as a single. If she felt the need to say something, why not just say when I wrote the song to the backing track and fell in love with it, I didn’t know that Beyonce had also written a song to the same backing track, and I don’t want anyone to think that I was intentionally copying her?

@FolkFan I agree that I had heard Halo many times and still didn’t think that they were so similar. So much music sounds similar lately that it has become sort of accepted IMO. Any way Beyonce and Kelly have different fans so there wouldn’t be a huge outcry from that front. I also agree with noctem seizure that Kelly was so hell bent on getting her way with My December, then causing such an uproar, that she lost her momentum and failed to realize that pop music is evolving in another direction. Although some people really liked My December her buying public apparently didn’t.

So is it too late for Ryan to ‘pologize?

*snerk* Sorry, couldn’t resist.

Another initial reaction I have is : why is she knocking the song if she is trying to sell it? How can she expect people to want to buy it when she labels it a rip off? If she hadn’t said anything, not many people would care how similar it sounds. Now they definitely will.

That’s how I feel about it.

Halo is the only Beyonce song I own (actually I own one other but not on purpose). I love Already Gone, and I never noticed the similarity between them. I appreciate Kelly’s honesty, and she probably brings up an important issue, but I really didn’t notice the similarity, and I’m usually quick to spot them. Anyway I won’t let it ruin my enjoyment of the song. I’m sorry Kelly didn’t want the song released, because it’s a great song, and she makes it sound very different than Beyonce’s Halo, which I’ve already deleted from my itunes as I got tired of it quickly.

I have mixed feelings about this. I also noticed that Already Gone sounded similar to a lot of songs. Whenever it starts playing on my ipod, I’m always confused about what song I’m about to hear!. However, I still think that the overlying melody, along with kelly’s voice makes it distinct enough. No disrespect to Beyonce, but I like Already Gone 10x more than Halo.
Halo is the only released single on Beyonce’s new album that I’m not crazy about.

I feel bad for Kelly, but I think she should let this issue die. Ryan Tedder has a signature style that really doesn’t vary too much from song to song. If you decide to “co-write” with him, then you have to expect that your songs are not going to sound that unique. When people collaborate with him, it’s probably because they want a top 40 hit, not because they want to create something that sounds different. If Kelly didn’t want to take the risk of sounding like a million other female popstars, she should have worked with someone else. She does have a certain amount of control over what happens to her and I wish she would accept a little more responsibility when these things happen to her. Unfortunately, there is a lesson to be learned here. I wonder how Beyonce feels about this whole incident?

I can’t believe they used the same instrumental track in the beginning. When the song starts, I expect to hear “Halo.” Very weird. After that, though, I think the song takes on its own identity. I love Kelly’s vocals on this song. All too often her vocals get lost in the mix and on this song, they take front and center. She is amazing.

Got a ticket to see her at the NYS fair in August and I’m really looking forward to it. Have always loved Kelly Clarkson!

Oh Please American Idol needed Kelly big time. Did you see how many people/critics dissed Idol in season 1? Hollywood Reporter in it’s review said the show would never last. They thought it was a big freaking joke and finding a superstar out of it was a laugh from everyone in the industry. Years before they had done music shows and nobody substantial had come out of them. They did that horrid PopStars on the Wb, where are they now? If Justin Guarini had won season 1 of Idol, the show never would have been as huge. Kelly winning the show was it’s shining moment. Also back in season 1, they had nothing to go upon and did not even know if anyone was watching the show. When you are off Idol, you have to make it work and do everything possible. Kelly was an inspiration to many. Chris Daughtry/Carrie Underwood both said Kelly Clarkson inspired them to audition for the show. During Breakaway Kelly was a MEGASTAR in a very cutthroat pop world. People keep talking how Carrie mastered country but she had it easy. The country world is nowhere near the same cutthroat as the pop world. During Breakway Kelly was a SMASH, she was a phenom. SHE MADE 40 MILLION DOLLARS IN ONE YEAR. My big question to you is why are all these other Idol tanking INTERNATIONALLY? Why is Kelly the only Idol to make an traction in the international world? A real superstar is not just a star in the US, it’s a world star. You look at Carrie Underwood’s Some Hearts which almost went 7 times platinum but sold squat overseas. Kelly went 6 times platinum for Breakway but another seven times platinum overseas. BREAKAWAY HOLDS the record with 13 million albums worldwide. That’s FREAKING DIAMOND, if you want to talk. Will any Idol ever match Breakways 13 times platinum worldwide? It will never be matched IMO

It’s funny, I always thought Halo was a knockoff of “No Air”. It has the same melody where they repeat the title over and over.

To me, Kelly’s problem is that she lost her distinct Kelly style. Now when her music starts on the radio, I either think it’s Pink, Katie Perry or Sara McLachlan. Sometimes it takes until the chorus for me to figure out it’s her. It’s like she is imitating their singing style as well as singing songs similar to theirs.

I hope she finds her own voice again. I think she’ll be much happier than she seems to be now.

Keel Jul 26th, 2009 at 4:59 am

So is it too late for Ryan to ‘pologize?

Bwah…

lizland Jul 26th, 2009 at 2:36 pm

It’s funny, I always thought Halo was a knockoff of ‘No Air’ . It has the same melody where they repeat the title over and over.

To me, Kelly’s problem is that she lost her distinct Kelly style. Now when her music starts on the radio, I either think it’s Pink, Katie Perry or Sara McLachlan. Sometimes it takes until the chorus for me to figure out it’s her. It’s like she is imitating their singing style as well as singing songs similar to theirs.

I hope she finds her own voice again. I think she’ll be much happier than she seems to be now.

Her voice and interpretation/singing style of a song is all in her control. She needs to think about what direction she wants to go in and get back to an original sound. Like you I don’t even recognize her voice on songs played on the radio for the most part anymore.

Her voice and interpretation/singing style of a song is all in her control. She needs to think about what direction she wants to go in and get back to an original sound. Like you I don’t even recognize her voice on songs played on the radio for the most part anymore.

It’s kind of funny for me that this is coming up. I’ve never really been a Kelly fan but I remember the first time I heard Since U Been Gone and I asked my daughter “who IS that?” and I was shocked when she told me “Kelly Clarkson”. Then I heard Breakaway (admittedly I might have the songs mixed up..but y’all get the drift) and I thought to myself “She’s fantastic and who would’ve thought this could come from AI?” So while I’ve never been a “fan”, I do appreciate what she brings to the table. But these past two songs; My Life Would Suck etc. and I Do Not Hook Up are leaving me cold. I dont know what it is exactly but the best way I can describe it is she seems disconnected to what she’s singing. I can’t get past the slickness factor. I’ve thought more than once that she sounds lost and it would really be something to hear her sing a song she’s truly connected to.

Oh, no…no, Ryan Tedder. Please don’t be a bad guy. I want to continue liking you. Plus you’re so dang cute. And fabulous in concert. Sigh.

Jumping in on this convo late, but I have to say Kelly’s my new hero! Probably not the best move for her career, but chica’s got massive cajones, and I respect that. I noticed a long time ago that Emperor Tedder has no clothes. I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again…sick. to. death. of Ryan Tedder and his homogenizing influence on pop radio. Ugg. Hate Halo, hate hate hate Battlefield with the heat of a thousand suns, never liked Bleeding Love, not a big fan of Apologize, Already Gone is aight. I do think Stop and Stare is a great song, so I know there’s talent in there somewhere, but he’s obviously been in high demand since Apologize blew up, and seems to me he’s now burned out and phoning it in. There’s a big difference between having a signature sound and cloning yourself over and over. People have mentioned Timba, who may also be burned out lately, but when I think about HIS signature hits like Get Your Freak On, The Way I Are, and Sexyback, I don’t find them to be carbon copy-ish like Tedder’s stuff.

ETA: Oh man, Jordin’s ‘Battlefield’  sounds exactly like that Christian song ‘Our God is an Awesome God.’ 

Not to mention Pat Benatar was probably thinking “Battlefield? Is that what love is, Jordin? Really? I mean, REALLY?”

I think Ryan needs to stop trying to churn out so many pop songs for other people and work on his own music with his own sound. His best stuff is the stuff on Dreaming Out Loud. There’s a lot of potential there.

I really hope this isn’t as bad as it sounds. I wanted to hear more from OneRepublic.

I think the Battlefield/Awesome God comparisons are a stretch. They have similar chord progressions in the choruses, not the same melody. That’s about it. So do a lot of songs. Happens all the time.

FTR, I don’t like Halo, but I like Already Gone. They have essentially the same backing music, but they’re pretty distinct songs. So it’s not about the backing track; it’s about how you use it…

“It’s kind of funny for me that this is coming up. I’ve never really been a Kelly fan but I remember the first time I heard Since U Been Gone and I asked my daughter ‘who IS that?’  and I was shocked when she told me ‘Kelly Clarkson’ . Then I heard Breakaway (admittedly I might have the songs mixed up..but y’all get the drift) and I thought to myself ‘She’s fantastic and who would’ve thought this could come from AI?’  So while I’ve never been a ‘fan’ , I do appreciate what she brings to the table. But these past two songs; My Life Would Suck etc. and I Do Not Hook Up are leaving me cold. I dont know what it is exactly but the best way I can describe it is she seems disconnected to what she’s singing. I can’t get past the slickness factor. I’ve thought more than once that she sounds lost and it would really be something to hear her sing a song she’s truly connected to. ”

Watch this:
Patsy Cline’s “Walking after midnight”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amLajm0Qvy4

“Chivas” live (from My December)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClYb892i4NQ

“Sober” live (from My December)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GrZJLkMb7sQ

“Up to the mountain” (Patty Griffin)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vePnI4wyp68

“Hole” live (from My December) (one of my 2 favorites of the album)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LR7Ctng6lvc

“Already gone” acoustic version
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74JmwOcjqjc

If Justin Guarini had won season 1 of Idol, the show never would have been as huge.

Probabaly not. However, Tamyra Gray could have had Kelly-like success with the right material. She was considered a strong contender to win the whole thing before her surprise elimination.

Chris Daughtry/Carrie Underwood both said Kelly Clarkson inspired them to audition for the show.

Since you’ve referenced the other two notable “stars” that Idol produced, do you know what they else they have in common with Kelly? They’re also the “first” major Idol to attempt to make it in their field of music. Hence, they, like Kelly never had to face comparisons to other Idols that came before them and never had to contend with accusations that they were wanna-bes.

Kelly was the first Idol, period, and the first female pop artist the show produced, and nobody else from her genre has come close to replicating her success. Carrie was the first country Idol, and her followups in Pickler and K. Cook didn’t do nearly as well, although to be fair, neither are nearly as talented as Carrie. And Chris was the first contemporary pop rock/ rocker to break out of Idol, and, consequently, he’s done far better than David Cook, but in his case I actually wouldn’t say he is more talented than Cook….

During Breakway Kelly was a SMASH, she was a phenom. SHE MADE 40 MILLION DOLLARS IN ONE YEAR. My big question to you is why are all these other Idol tanking INTERNATIONALLY?…. BREAKAWAY HOLDS the record with 13 million albums worldwide. That’s FREAKING DIAMOND, if you want to talk. Will any Idol ever match Breakways 13 times platinum worldwide? It will never be matched IMO

That was then. Kind of like Kelly herself. She’s “then“. She isn’t “now“….

I think the Battlefield/Awesome God comparisons are a stretch. They have similar chord progressions in the choruses, not the same melody.

Nope, it’s pretty much the same melody as well as chord progressions in that case. Listen to that YouTube side-by-side comparison again.

These two songs also sound kind of like Bleeding Love, another Ryan Tedder track . I read that this track Halo was originally for Leona Lewis .

Yes, absolutely! The first few times I heard “Halo” I thought it was Leona Lewis! I was thinking, “Damn, her second song sounds exactly like “Bleeding Love!”

maria4hitz – if Kelly can’t be connected to what she is singing, it’s not the songs’ fault.

Like many people said, Tedder has a signature sound. That shouldn’t have been a shock if Kelly had done her homework. He probably has given the same track to different people before. (same track doesn’t mean it’s the same song)

Homework??? He gave them the same track to write to, and probably at the same time, she couldn’t have known that unless he told her. She, like the rest of us, heard Halo when the album came out, and at that time Kelly’s album was already being printed, my guess is that she wouldn’t have put the song on her album if she knew there was another song almost identical being released as a single.
And of course if she’s not connected to the song it’s not the song’s fault, I agree with you, singers connect with the music they really love, and you can see that when they’re performing live. I put those examples because there is music that kelly connects to, and it’s that kind of music. Kelly said after performing “Walking after midnight” that she would record a whole album with that music if her label would back her up. Her style is obviously more like singer-songwriter, like My December, but people and her label want her to be a popstar. She left The Firm because Jeff wanted her to be the biggest popstar in the world, and she doesn’t want to. I can’t wait until they finish their contract (she has one more album with them) and see what she does next. She loves music and she enjoys it, and she would never record something she doesn’t like because it’s her voice and her face out there and she’s responsible for the product she releases, but it’s obvious she prefers other kinds of music. This has always been the story, she wants to do something and the label wants her to a completely different thing. And they own her right now, so she has no choice.
So I understand when she complains that Ryan gave her and Beyonce the same song, she agreed with the label that she would work with the producers they wanted for this album, but giving her the same song as another artist… that is just too much. And I admire her courage for saying it, for making people know that she’s not happy with that. She’s honest, it’s that simple, someone asked her about it and she answered.

Count me in the camp that’s sympathetic to Kelly, even if she isn’t doing herself or her career any favors by being outspoken about this. That said, I’m not the least bit shocked Ryan Tedder is copycatting himself. And to me, both these songs sound like a knockoff of Leona Lewis’ “Better in Time” (not so much “Bleeding Love”). Did he write that one, too?

Have to say I don’t like any of those songs very much – “Better in Time” slightly more than the others. Never cared for “Apologize,” either. They just all blend together – a bland blend of blah.

Ryan is speaking out about the issue on his myspace:
BTW his myspace is aliastheproducer
Tuesday, July 28, 2009

Kelly Clarkson ‘Already Gone’  and Beyonce ‘Halo’  issue
Hey everyone, Ryan here. So’ ¦..i’m in Europe on vacation with my wife yesterday when I get a flurry of emails with links to gossip sites and media outlets saying ‘Kelly clarkson throws producer Ryan Tedder under the bus re: Already Gone’  etc etc etc’ ¦ Alleging that I copied myself or ‘pulled a fast one’  on Kelly Clarkson. This couldn’t be farther from the truth and the whole thing is absurd’ ¦.however, I need to actually read what the [heck] is going on, make a call or 2, and be fully informed of it, then I assure you I will have a proper, respectful response. I don’t take allegations of this nature lightly- ESPECIALLY when it’s in regards to artists I respect and admire. Nor do I let things like this go unaddressed. So, give me a minute, and I’ll tell u whatsup and what really happened, or in this case, ‘didn’t’  happen.

Regards-

Ryan Tedder