Idol Sales News – Week Ending 12/19/10

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The big news this week is Crystal’s debut number. But they are being discussed here and not in this thread. MJ keeps scooping me with her Eastern Time Zone.

Updated: Album Numbers. With the exception of the Christmas albums, all Idols see a double digit increase. Most in the 30% range. Nice to get some holiday sales in before the January doldrums.

In other news, Jason Aldean’s album featuring a duet with Kelly Clarkson went gold this week (73K, Total: 565K)

This is the daily numbers thread. Please post them when you find them. Thanks!

Update: Added Download numbers and disclaimer explaining leaked numbers.

Disclaimer: We do not have access to the full SoundScan stats each week. We are dependent on leaks from a variety of sources. The primary source of these leaks is Brian at Idol Chatter. He can have up to 3 updates a week for albums alone. The first set of numbers features those albums in the top 200 and some Nashville based artists. The second release features albums in the top 200 for the year and perhaps more Nashville based artists. The final release may include some special requests he gets from his users. At no point should anybody conclude that albums that are not listed sold fewer albums than the least selling album listed. All that one can conclude is that the album is not likely in the top 200 for the week or the year (Brian is human and does make the odd mistake which he later fixes). We have seen several times that the third release of special request numbers features albums that have sold more than the least selling album listed. We are grateful for any numbers we can get.


Album
28 Crystal Bowersox “Farmer’s Daughter” 57,804
63 Carrie Underwood “Play On” 25k (+30%; lw 19K ) Total: 1.886M (70)
123 Fantasia “Back to Me” 12K (17%; 10K) Total: 362K (122)
133 Lee DeWyze “Live It Up” 12K (+32%; lw 9K ) Total: 84K (133)
Danny Gokey “My Best Days” 2K (+34%; lw 1K) Total: 198K
Jason Castro “Who I Am” 2K (+36%; lw 1K) Total: 9K
Mandisa “True Beauty <1K (+54%; lw <1K) Total: 218K
Chris Sligh “The Anatomy of Broken” <1K (73%) Total: 6K
Mandisa “It’s Christmas” <1K (-5%; lw <1K) Total: 26K
Clay Aiken “Merry Christmas With Love” <1K (+3%; lw <1K) Total: 1.416M
Mandisa “Freedom” <1K (+48%) Total: 131K

179 Daughtry “Leave This Town” 8K (+33%) Total: 1.21M
Carrie Underwood “Some Hearts” 6K (+35%) Total: 7.063M
Adam Lambert “For Your Entertainment” 5K (+25%) Total: 775K
Carrie Underwood “Carnival Ride” 5K (+36%) Total: 3.157M

Downloads
Jason Aldean feat. Kelly Clarkson “Don’t You Wanna Stay” 32K (+24%) Total: 206K
Carrie Underwood “Mama’s Song” 10K (+5%) Total: 234K
Carrie Underwood “There’s a Place for Us” 8K (-4%) Total: 46K
Carrie Underwood “Undo It” 5K (+6%) Total: 932K
Carrie Underwood “Cowboy Casanova” 3K (+13%) Total: 1.534M
Kellie Pickler “Santa Baby” 3K (-11%) Total: 86K
Carrie Underwood “Temporary Home” 3K (13%) Total: 617K
Clay Aiken “Mary, Did You Know” 2K (+4%) Total: 113K
Jason Castro “You Are” <1K (+31%) Total: 7K
Jason Castro “Hallelujah [Album Version]” <1K (+9%) Total: 51K
Chris Sligh “Only You Can Save” <1K (+12%) Total: 10K

Rounded numbers from Brian at Idol Chatter.

From Billboard:

Total Weekly Sales: 12.5M (+23% from last week, -17% from same week last year)
Total Weekly Sales Last Week : 10.2M
Total Weekly Same Week Last Year: 15.14M
YTD: 303.94M (down 13% from last year, 348.99M)

 
  • tripp_ncwy

    Brian has the weekly album sales numbers up.

    http://content.usatoday.com/communities/idolchatter/post/2010/12/crystal-bowersoxs-farmers-daughter-debuts-with-58k-sales/1

    Crystal Bowersox, Farmer’s Daughter (58,000, debut, 58,000 total) (#28 Billboard 200)
    Carrie Underwood, Play On (25,000, +30%, 1.886 million) (#63 BB200)
    Lee DeWyze, Live It Up (12,000, +32%, 84,000) (#119 BB200)
    Fantasia, Back to Me (12,000, +17%, 362,000) (#123 BB200)
    Danny Gokey, My Best Days (2,000, +34%, 198,000)
    Jason Castro, Who I Am (2,000, +36%, 9,000)

    ETA. Added Fannie

  • Valentin432

    Good news for almost everyone, the christmas bump should also help LTT and FYE.

  • twinkle80

    congrats to all the idols with the sales bump! yey for lee! :)

  • Yvonne13

    Yeah Lee! The best Xmas present I could receive. Just wondering where these buyers were the first week, though??? In the long run, it doesn’t matter…just let LIU sell already, LOL. Maybe Lee will experience a different sales trend than others…maybe a slower start but a strong finish. That’s all that counts!

    It’s good to see Danny still picking up sales as well as Jason Castro.

  • jpfan

    Looks like nice 30% increases across the board. This week will be good for sales and then….be prepared for a huge drop. Singles will soar as albums go in the opposite direction.

    I’m guessing the #200 album came in at 9K-10K which means fairly decent sales for even the albums that weren’t in the top 200.

  • Little Boy Blue

    RE: Crystal Bowersox, Farmer’s Daughter (58,000, debut, 58,000 total) (#28 Billboard 200)

    There used to be a time when people were worried about an Idol’s sales numbers when they were near the 300,000 number during its first week debut ( see Hicks, Taylor ).

    Now, it seems that a close to 60,000 debut is considered big.

    How times have changed in just 5 years.

  • Elliegrll

    Maybe Lee will experience a different sales trend than others…maybe a slower start but a strong finish.

    The bump isn’t surprising, since a lot of people buy albums the two weeks before Christmas. Lee’s longterm success will depend on whether or not he can release some hit singles.

  • steph6449

    Glad to see the nice bump up for Danny. He is really close to breaking 200,000. Maybe after another couple of weeks, which is sooner than I was guessing.
    They have his CD on sale at iTunes for $7.99, hope that will help him get there.

  • cristististi

    Congrats to all the idols, I’m glad Lee was a part of the sales bump :D

  • artemis

    I think some people who liked Lee on the show didn’t realize his album was out until they saw the publicity about Crystal’s debut. After the tour, Lee disappeared into the studio until his album debut.
    Crystal was smart to go with Gina Orr, who has done an excellant job keeping Crystal out in the public with all her various causes, including a number of high profile events such as appearing on Anderson Cooper about bullying and the charity single with Melissa Etheridge
    Good news for both of them this week!

  • Hazehel

    Now, it seems that a close to 60,000 debut is considered big.

    I know it’s pathetic, cheered by such sad looking numbers, but hey, you got to be thankful for small mercies. Good boost for Lee, and Lee might get into the 100K mark by the first week in the new year, Crystal perhaps a week or two later, may be earlier if the second week drop isn’t too great.

    Lee should get a little boost when he appears on Idol, Crystal too, I should think she’d get a spot on the show. Let’s hope that Lee’s single will take off in the new year and boost his sales a bit more. However I don’t think Crystal’s single will do much for her sales, I don’t think radio will play it. She’s releasing a different one in the new year, right?

  • Trina

    I’m actually surprised it took Danny this long to crack 200k. Didn’t his album come out in like March?

    Yeah Lee! The best Xmas present I could receive. Just wondering where these buyers were the first week, though???

    Lol I don’t get this. There are albums that keep selling for a year or 2 years, not everyone buys the first week. Its the biggest shopping week of the year so its natural to see an increase, probably Xmas gifts.

    Amen LittleBoyBlue. Even Kris last year got a lot of crap for 80,000 and failing to make the top 10. How times have changed.

  • tinawina

    Singles will soar as albums go in the opposite direction.

    Ain’t that the truth. Be prepared for the pain, people. We only have one good week left, then one kinda okay week, then the depths of hell LMAO.

    Let’s hope that Lee’s single will take off in the new year and boost his sales a bit more. However I don’t think Crystal’s single will do much for her sales, I don’t think radio will play it. She’s releasing a different one in the new year, right?

    IA. I think Lee is the only one that will be getting radio play in a mainstream format come January, so he may be the only one with any single or album sales to track. Let’s see what Ms Orr has in store to raise Crystal’s profile while we wait to see if any of her singles catch on.

  • larc

    nvm

  • steph6449

    I’m actually surprised it took Danny this long to crack 200k. Didn’t his album come out in like March?

    Yes. His sales leveled off after a while but he’s been steadily selling +/- 1000 week since then, occasionally more like this week. And it’s getting him there :)

    In the country genre, 200,000 is quite good. Danny made the top 50 among all country albums of the year list on BBD at around ~#35, without at that point even being as close to 200,000. The only other new artists who have broken the 200,000 threshold this year to my knowledge are Easton Corbin (two #1 songs and generally fawning media as the new George Strait Jr), and The Band Perry (recent #1 hit and lots of associated promo). Neither of them were over 250,000 last I looked.

    I’ve been pretty happy that Danny’s sales have been holding as he hasn’t had a song on radio since September really. But they’ve had him out there touring, doing things like the AMA hosting, a ton of CMA Week radio interviews last month, and the CMT promos this month with the Posted feature and CMT Top 20 appearance. Hopefully that will continue while he’s in this song-writing phase for album #2, until he’s ready to go out promoting a new single (February/March?) and touring full steam again (probably not until spring/summer but with some occasional dates before that).

  • steph6449

    my best guess is that Lee’s album will drop off the cliff after Christmas. This week’s BB200, where it’s evidently in the bottom spot, is likely the last one it will be on

    Not a Lee fan, but don’t Brian’s numbers say he was at #119 this week on BBD?

  • jpfan

    Brian forgot to include Fantasia’s album which also made the BB200:

    123. Fantasia, Back to Me; 12,000 (+17%; 362,000)

    And I was totally wrong on the #200 album selling 9-10K. It’ll be more like 6K:

    199. Elvis Presley, Elvis Presley, Christmas Duets: 6,000 (+12%; 437,000)

  • larc

    steph6449:Not a Lee fan, but don’t Brian’s numbers say he was at #119 this week on BBD?

    Oops! You’re right. I misread that somehow. Thanks for pointing it out.

  • aly

    Yes. His sales leveled off after a while but he’s been steadily selling +/- 1000 week since then, occasionally more like this week. And it’s getting him there

    Good he is still selling, pretty well. His numbers are higher than I thought. As for this years winner and runner-up the sales, imo are dismal.
    AI should pack it up.

  • bridgette12

    jpfan:
    12/22/2010 at 10:46 am
    Brian forgot to include Fantasia’s album which also made the BB200:

    123. Fantasia, Back to Me; 12,000 (+17%; 362,000)

    Congrats to all the Idols, really glad to see Fantasia still selling well. Hopefully she will get a big bump after the Grammy Awards.

  • Indigobunting

    I’m actually surprised it took Danny this long to crack 200k. Didn’t his album come out in like March?

    Like Steph pointed out, 200k is not great for Idols years gone by; but pretty good for a country artist and third placer (much less PR than the finalists).

    Also, Danny has sold all of that without a hit single :)
    His two singles charted top 40 but neither cracked the 10 mill. AI listener point needed to sell albums. So he’s pretty much done it with AI fan base and live performances (including his one main PR event-AI performance-that all S8 received. And hopefully S9 will get their chance).

    He has the top AI album debut for 2010 :)

    Good to see Crystal exceed the expectations and good for Lee getting a nice increase!

  • larc

    Brian put up an interesting list of first week album sales for Idols this year.

    Fantasia, Back to Me (117,000 first-week sales)
    Danny Gokey, My Best Days (65,000)
    Crystal Bowersox, Farmer’s Daughter (58,000)
    Lee DeWyze, Live It Up (39,000)
    David Archuleta, The Other Side of Down (24,000)
    Clay Aiken, Tried & True (22,000)
    Jason Castro, Jason Castro (20,000)
    Katharine McPhee, Unbroken (15,000)
    We Are the Fallen, We Are the Fallen (13,000)
    Adam Lambert, Acoustic Live! EP (10,000)
    Various, American Idols – Season 9 (6,000)
    Jason Castro, Who I Am (2,000)
    Katharine McPhee, Christmas Is the Time to Say I Love You (1,000)
    Chris Sligh, The Anatomy of Broken (less than 1,000)
    Josiah Leming, Come On Kid (less than 1,000)

  • Trina

    Speaking of Fantasia, congrats to her for having the highest first week sales for an Idol in 2010. Its a great album. IMO this will be the year she wins a Grammy so I bet she’ll keep selling.

  • sma11ie

    As for this years winner and runner-up the sales, imo are dismal.
    AI should pack it up.

    AI is a TV show first and foremost. Even if its winners/runner-ups never sell another album, as long it keeps being the #1 or #2 or (gasp) #3 show in America in terms of ratings, it won’t be packing anything up. Even if ratings drop another 20%, which would be huge, it’d still be averaging what, 16-18 million viewers, which is like more than what Glee gets. Lee and Crystal’s sales numbers, however low they may be, are not that powerful that they’d kill AI. Perspective, people!

    In other news, Lee is at 84K. Crystal is at 58K. Let’s say Crystal drops 60% and sells 23K next week, that’d put her at 81K… in the event that Crystal’s album has legs and Lee doesn’t pick up the pace and gain traction on radio, etc (BIG IF’s, of course), she could catch up pretty quickly– maybe in the January doldrums. It might be interesting to see what happens in the next month or so with these two. OR not. I might be bored to death watching so few sales from both and just turn my attention to the (fingers crossed) interesting new talent in AI S10 ;).

  • Elliegrll

    Also, Danny has sold all of that without a hit single
    His two singles charted top 40 but neither cracked the 10 mill. AI listener point needed to sell albums. So he’s pretty much done it with AI fan base

    I don’t see this as a good thing, and it doesn’t bode well for the debut numbers for his second album. But, maybe he will release a hit song before that album is released.

    BTW, it’s Fantasia, not Danny who has the best debut numbers from an AI alum in 2010.

  • Yvonne13

    Larc, very very interesting list, thanks for posting. It’s sad, but it kind of shows how Idol is slipping all around.

  • steph6449

    Which should be troubling, since it indicates that he hasn’t stretched himself beyond his AI fanbase, which doesn’t bode well for the debut numbers for his second album. But, maybe he will release a hit song before that album is released.

    “Big hit song,” no, but he had two “moderate hit” songs chart peaking at #22 and #32 so those reached some listeners. Radio play is local, so in areas where Danny got better airplay he probably picked up some sales.

    I definitely believe he also gained sales through touring. Some of the people attending his shows were his hardcore fans who had the album already, but others were just casual country fans or AI fans who didn’t but bought it later after seeing Danny on stage. To include at events where he opened for others like Sugarland, Lady A, or at multiple-artist festivals/etc. Danny almost always had big post-show lines at his merch tables (record lines according to venue peeps for a couple of the shows). Hopefully those who saw him in those situations and enjoyed the show enough to pick up the CD will become part of his base for album #2.

    A breakout top 10 radio hit wouldn’t hurt, of course, and I think that’s a major goal of theirs for album #2. But as has been pointed out here a number of times, there are plenty of new, and even well-established, country artists who have top 10 or higher charting songs, and have a ton of media exposure, who don’t show much impact on their album sales.

    BTW, it’s Fantasia, not Danny who has the best debut numbers from an AI alum in 2010.

    I think the reference was to best first-timer’s debut album in 2010, not best debut of a new album from someone who has had albums out before.

  • Elliegrll

    Larc, very very interesting list, thanks for posting. It’s sad, but it kind of shows how Idol is slipping all around.

    I don’t think the list says anything about AI. It shows that post show, it’s about the music. People will still watch the show, but that doesn’t mean that they are going to shell out money to buy an album that they may not like, just because someone was on AI.

    “Big hit song,” no, but he had two “moderate hit” songs chart peaking at #22 and #32 so those reached some listeners.

    It’s not about whether or not either song was a hit, but how many people were made aware of the songs. As indigobunting posted, neither song ever reached an AI of 10 million, which is a problem because people need to know that Danny exists, and what his music sounds like. I think the poor showing for Danny’s Christmas song, as well as the lack of movement for Danny’s second single show that idol fans move on, which is why it’s important for alums to connect with those people who like their style of music. And before someone posts that country fans don’t buy singles, we know that is not the case for idol fans, who have supported the singles of Carrie, Kellie and Bucky.

  • bridgette12

    Trina:
    12/22/2010 at 11:15 am
    Speaking of Fantasia, congrats to her for having the highest first week sales for an Idol in 2010. Its a great album. IMO this will be the year she wins a Grammy so I bet she’ll keep selling.

    I’m hoping Fantasia win her first Grammy, she has a great album and she deserves it.

  • Indigobunting

    Which should be troubling, since it indicates that he hasn’t stretched himself beyond his AI fanbase, which doesn’t bode well for the debut numbers for his second album.

    I disagree it is troubling- how are good sales (in this economy) despite no hit a bad thing? It would be worse if he had a hit single and only sold 200k or there abouts ;). I think it means people buy his album after they hear him; vs singles. Which the country crowd tends to do-if you look at single sales compared to pop. The big sellers are pop crossovers.

    But I do agree he needs to get more radio play to take it to the next level. He’s had a good first year with his label trying to establish him in Country. We will see if he can continue his growth.

    Brian’s article on his debut:

    Debut album refers to their first album; not subsequent albums, so Danny has the best debut in 2010 (the champ Fantasia has the best Idol first week sales of an album release).

    http://content.usatoday.com/communities/idolchatter/post/2010/12/fantasia-danny-gokey-have-2010s-top-idol-debuts/1

  • Hazehel

    AI is a TV show first and foremost.

    True, but if AI can’t make someone a star, then it wouldn’t have any credibility left. I’d say that a lot of interest I have in the show is to see how a nobody can become a somebody in the entertainment business, and if the show can’t do it any more, then my interest in the show would also drop considerably.

  • SashaB

    USAToday:

    Season 8′s Danny Gokey had the biggest opening week of any debut Idol act, his 65,000 copies of My Best Days easily surpassing releases from Lee DeWyze (39,000) and Crystal Bowersox (58,000).

    Who would have ever guessed that Gokey would’ve been the best Idol debut for 2010? Heh. Go Gokey.

    Well the numbers reiterate what has been said for months about Season 9. It’s really sad that the AI9 winner and runner up combined could not sell 100K units — with all the TV promo & product placement. Worst ratings, ticket sales, and post AI album sales ever. Season 10 can’t come soon enough.

  • Kirsten

    Lee should get a little boost when he appears on Idol, Crystal too, I should think she’d get a spot on show

    Interestingly enough, if she does she will be the first female runner-up to do so. Diana only made an appearance just this year (singing in the background during the Simon tribute). Katharine was not invited back to the show until S7 (she was from S5) after being dropped from RCA. Crystal could be the first female runner-up invited back the following season while she still has her Sony contract. Success will aid this in coming true. The rumors about her being difficult behind the scenes will not.

  • asics85

    I would say that Danny’s debut number of 65,000 for his first album would be his core Idol fanbase, and the majority of the other 135,000 are a result of his live shows and the new fans he has gained even without that hit single and with very little national exposure.

    Following Danny over the course of this first year reminds me of “The Little Engine That Could” story….his perserverance and hard work can and will get him to that goal of a career in music that every Idol alum hoped for when they went on the show. Those around Danny have said that they are looking for him to have longevity in Country music rather than be a “flash in the pan”, and I would say he is on the right course for that.

  • gangreen29

    The rumors about her being difficult behind the scenes will not.

    I’ve never seen rumors about her being difficult while on idol. Did she fight to get the album she wanted? Yes, thank God! I certainly have never seen anything negative about her behavior on the show though.

  • Elliegrll

    I disagree it is troubling- how are good sales (in this economy) despite no hit a bad thing? It would be worse if he had a hit single and only sold 200k or there abouts

    Both scenarios are bad. How is it a good thing that the bulk of the sales are because of AI fans? We know how this has worked out for other alums, we have a perfect example with David Archuleta. More importantly, labels are all about marketability, if Danny, Kris or anyone else shows that they aren’t appealing to people outside of the AI fanbase, then they are going to get dropped.

    True, but if AI can’t make someone a star, then it wouldn’t have any credibility

    This theory is flawed, because it only works if the reason why people watch is to see people become “superstars” after the show ends, but we know that 1. Most people who watch don’t vote. 2. Most people who watch and vote don’t buy the albums. 3. Critics have been questioning the credibility of idol for years, yet people still watch. 4. People don’t have the same definition of the word superstar, and most viewers are only aware of what happens to idol alums if their music is playing on the radio stations that they listen to, or if they appear on the shows or in the magazines that they read.

  • PerfectStorm

    I don’t see this as a good thing, and it doesn’t bode well for the debut numbers for his second album. But, maybe he will release a hit song before that album is released.

    BTW, it’s Fantasia, not Danny who has the best debut numbers from an AI alum in 2010.

    Obviously TPTB – Danny’s label – must think it’s good enough to give him a second album. A lot of Idols that finished in the Top 2 never even made it past this point.

    Danny had the best album of any Idol that debuted in 2010. Fantasia’s album is not a debut. It’s also very telling considering that Danny finished in 3rd place and those in the Top 2 are always given more promotion.

  • jumpstart

    Be prepared for the pain, people. We only have one good week left, then one kinda okay week, then the depths of hell LMAO.

    Yeppers. I’m happy that I’m not invested enough this year to care although I do wish Lee and Crystal all the best.

  • indigo15

    Let’s also not forget, as someone else posted, that Danny never got a big promotional tour like Kris or Adam. He got even less promo than Allison in terms of TV appearances and performances. Allison performed on “Idol,” “The Ellen DeGeneres Show,” “Good Morning America,” and “So You Think You Can Dance,” but Danny only had the one “Idol” appearance as far as “big” TV performances are concerned. And he hasn’t had a lot of support from country radio in general, so I find his 198,000 units sold since March rather impressive. The problem with Danny’s second single and Christmas single aren’t his fans or Idol fans–believe me, there’s LOTS of requesting going on for his music. The problem is that there are many country stations across the country that are not willing to play his music, and some stations only play Christmas music for one week–the actual week of Christmas.

  • Elliegrll

    The problem with Danny’s second single and Christmas single aren’t his fans or Idol fans

    Idol fans have never needed radio in order to know that their favorite has a song or album out. Look at it this way, as time passes, AI fans, no matter who their favorite is, are less likely to keep up with an artist who isn’t making the type of music that they like, and who isn’t getting radio or media exposure.

  • windmills

    More numbers from Brian:

    Daughtry, Leave This Town (8,000, +33%, 1.21 million) (#179 BB200)
    Carrie Underwood, Some Hearts (6,000, +35%, 7.063 million)
    Adam Lambert, For Your Entertainment (5,000, +25%, 775,000)
    Carrie Underwood, Carnival Ride (5,000, +36%, 3.157 million)
    Kellie Pickler, Kellie Pickler (less than 1,000, +36%, 440,000)
    Mandisa, True Beauty (less than 1,000, +54%, 218,000)
    Chris Sligh, The Anatomy of Broken (less than 1,000, +73%, 6,000)
    Mandisa, It’s Christmas (less than 1,000, -5%, 26,000)
    Clay Aiken, Merry Christmas With Love (less than 1,000, +3%, 1.416 million)
    Mandisa, Freedom (less than 1,000, +48%, 131,000)

  • sma11ie

    True, but if AI can’t make someone a star, then it wouldn’t have any credibility left. I’d say that a lot of interest I have in the show is to see how a nobody can become a somebody in the entertainment business, and if the show can’t do it any more, then my interest in the show would also drop considerably.

    I understand that– heck, like you, I obviously care about seeing how ex-Idols fare in the real world as well or I wouldn’t follow this blog and comment so much, but we’re really not that representative of the majority of AI’s 20 million remaining viewers. My example of selling NO more albums was extreme, but honestly, if the 5% of the audience who follows post-show careers and 10% or whatever who actually stil buys AI albums stop watching, and AI loses say, 20% viewership, the show would not be the juggernaut it is now, but it would still be kicking some butt in ratings.

    A lot of people who watch AI anymore are the type who watches the show like they watch Dancing With The Stars, or any other cheesy family entertainment show. The season ends and they forget about the cast, until they’re reminded in subsequent seasons, and even then it’s like, oh that’s nice, I liked that guy/girl. I mean, the millions who watch DWTS don’t seem to care that the has-beens or athletes who win don’t suddenly have super-star careers. The trophy means very little to them after the show… just like the AI win is a feel good TV moment (or not) for many viewers and then they forget about it.

    Obviously, I’d like for the show to stop shedding viewers and see S10 mark a return to form as a show that could actually create stars, or at least music careers that the public cares about… but I was just making the argument that even if it doesn’t, the show would not die for a while. My OP was in response to a comment that said AI should pack it up because of the dismal S9 sales.

    Kellie Pickler, Kellie Pickler (less than 1,000, +36%, 440,000)

    Good for Kellie! Didn’t realize she’s sold 440K! Is this era over, or is she still pushing singles? Any shot at gold for her? What did she sell on her first album? I know she went gold, but I forget how far past it she was.

  • Kirsten

    I’ve never seen rumors about her being difficult while on idol.

    Well, I have. I can’t provide a cite after all this time and even with a cite it is just a rumor. If false, there is no impediment to her returning. If she doesn’t return, this might help to explain why (instead of just assuming low sales). Crystal strikes me as somebody who fights for what she believes in and is not afraid of speaking her mind. I don’t think that started when she got to Jive. And I can see Idol producers not being fond of it.

  • carson

    Brian has some additional album numbers listed:

    Daughtry, Leave This Town (8,000, +33%, 1.21 million) (#179 BB200)
    Carrie Underwood, Some Hearts (6,000, +35%, 7.063 million)
    Adam Lambert, For Your Entertainment (5,000, +25%, 775,000)
    Carrie Underwood, Carnival Ride (5,000, +36%, 3.157 million)

    Daughtry’s LLT made it back into the BB200 at #179.

  • Elliegrll

    Well, I have. I can’t provide a cite after all this time and even with a cite it is just a rumor. If false, there is no impediment to her returning. If she doesn’t return, this might help to explain why (instead of just assuming low sales). Crystal strikes me as somebody who fights for what she believes in and is not afraid of speaking her mind. I don’t think that started when she got to Jive. And I can see Idol producers not being fond of it.

    This could explain why she’s not with 19M. Knowing Simon Fuller, he’s not going to work with someone who is constantly butting heads with him.

    That being said, it looks like Crystal is getting better management than she would have gotten if Simon had signed her.

  • bridgette12

    If there is anyone who’s going to be guaranteed a spot on Idol, it would be it’s biggest sellers that are still on the charts. That would be Kelly, Carrie and Daughtry, plus possibly a few others, but it won’t be too many because Sony is no longer associated with Idol. As it has been stated several times, Nigel is back and it should be a faster paced show with hopefully the hottest acts in music today. All Nigel care about is making Idol the number one show again and bringing the ratings back up. He will invite back those who will help the shows ratings. otherwise several Idol favorites will not be on the show.

  • girlygirl

    I don’t think you can say 135K of Danny’s sales are from his live shows. First of all, he didn’t start touring until his album had been out for awhile. Secondly, if you are going to say that anything after the 1st week sales come from outside the AI core fan base, that would mean that 250K of Kris’ sales are from outside the AI bubble, and more than 500K of Adam’s sales are from people who aren’t part of his core fan base.

    Sorry, I really doubt that. Danny, like all the Idols, has made some new fans which hopefully will help him going forward. But if half of his total sales are from people who hadn’t heard of him prior to March, that would be amazing. More realistically, I would guess that somewhere between 20-30% of Danny’s and Kris’ CD sales are from people who hadn’t heard of them prior to them releasing their CDs. Adam, I’d put at between 30-40% being sales to new fans who didn’t know of him from AI.

  • bridgette12

    carson:
    12/22/2010 at 12:04 pm
    Brian has some additional album numbers listed:

    Daughtry, Leave This Town (8,000, +33%, 1.21 million) (#179 BB200)
    Carrie Underwood, Some Hearts (6,000, +35%, 7.063 million)
    Adam Lambert, For Your Entertainment (5,000, +25%, 775,000)
    Carrie Underwood, Carnival Ride (5,000, +36%, 3.157 million)

    Daughtry’s LLT made it back into the BB200 at #179.

    Great numbers for Carrie, Daughtry and Adam. What can you say about Carrie, but wow, can she sell some albums.

  • Elliegrll

    If there is anyone who’s going to be guaranteed a spot on Idol, it would be it’s biggest sellers that are still on the charts. That would be Kelly, Carrie and Daughtry, plus possibly a few others, but it won’t be too many because Sony is no longer associated with Idol. As it has been stated several times, Nigel is back and it should be a faster paced show with hopefully the hottest acts in music today.

    Kris, Adam, Danny, Fantasia. Cook, Archie and Jordin are all signed with 19Records, and Kris, Adam, and Cook, along with the three that you mentioned, are all signed with 19 Management, so if they have music to plug, Simon Fuller will get them a spot on AI. The music is just licensed to Sony, and now Universal, but the real record label (even if it is just legally) is 19 Records.

  • indigo15

    Elliegrll: What you said is very true. What I meant, though, was that Danny needs radio to expand his fanbase beyond his core group of “Idol” fans, and if radio is unwilling to play his music, even when it’s requested by his fans, then it’s going to make it much harder for him to make any sort of impact–whether it’s in sales or just getting the word out to country radio listeners who aren’t “Idol” fans. His fanbase is very large, supportive, and very happy with the album he released, but in country music, everything comes down to radio and radio support. If you don’t have the support from them, everything is going to be a slow uphill climb, no matter how many fans you have or how vocal they are.

  • Indigobunting

    Both scenarios are bad. How is it a good thing that the bulk of the sales are because of AI fans? We know how this has worked out for other alums, we have a perfect example with David Archuleta. More importantly, labels are all about marketability, if Danny, Kris or anyone else shows that they aren’t appealing to people outside of the AI fanbase, then they are going to get dropped.

    You don’t know that the “bulk” of the sales are AI fans. They could be, but I have no doubt many are country fans. On iTunes when you see “music others have bought” it is country music. But like Steph pointed out, he has done a lot of touring and when non-fans see him live they buy. There is nothing to drive his sales so much of the time without music on the radio except for after a show.

    And obviously the label thinks he is; since he is still with them ,and is writing for the second album which Brian has in print-it will be out next year.

    I think it is pretty well accepted all Idols need radio play and need to get outside the bubble, but I disagree that selling 200k in this economy, in a brand new genre , without a big hit to drive sales is a bad thing.

  • Elliegrll

    indigo15, I agree with everything that you just said, and I wasn’t taking a knock at Danny, I can say the same thing about Kris. Like I said, Archie is a perfect example of someone who sold a whole lot better than Kris and Danny have, but who failed to connect with those outside of the bubble.

  • shell29

    I don’t remember many giving Taylor Hicks grief for his first week’s sales of his post-Idol debut. It was when his sales took a nosedive(and Daughtry’s skyrocketed) that the negativity started. Yes, Crystal and Lee’s opening week sales look rough in comparison, but times have changed since 2006. It’s not so much how you start, it’s how you finish. If Crystal or Lee’s albums can develop legs and sell consistently over the long haul they should be fine. If that doesn’t happen, then I would be concerned about their status with their respective labels. I still think it’s too early to be worrying now.

  • Indigobunting

    I don’t think you can say 135K of Danny’s sales are from his live shows. First of all, he didn’t start touring until his album had been out for awhile.

    I agree, Girlygirl. We don’t really know how many sales were AI and they can’t be all new fans past his first week.
    But one correction- he started his tour with Sugarland just a couple of weeks after the album debut, so it was quite soon.

  • asics85

    I see your point girlygirl. My guess would be that the bulk of Kris’ and Adam’s sales beyond their debut weeks would be new fans, especially since both have had strong singles and a lot of radio play, not to mention national promotion and media that comes with being the winner and runner-up on AI.

    Danny began touring in the Spring with Sugarland, shortly after his album came out, and has been doing live shows pretty much every week since then either as an opener or as a headliner. The fact that he is selling between one and two thousand almost every week since his album’s initial first few weeks indicates to me that he is gaining new fans, most likely as a result of his tour and live shows since he hasn’t had a lot of radio presence yet.

  • poster

    4. People don’t have the same definition of the word superstar, and most viewers are only aware of what happens to idol alums if their music is playing on the radio stations that they listen to, or if they appear on the shows or in the magazines that they read.

    Although I truly believe the age we live in of “digital” music buying coupled with the economy are the truly biggest factors leading to lower album sales (not just for Idols), but I have wondered if the lack of a true “coronation” song has something to do with it. David Cook’s Time Of My Life was what I consider to be the last Idol coronation song that was really promoted, by which I mean played on radio, and he’s the last Idol winner to have great sales. In my opinion, having their song on the radio right after they win keeps the public interest and also alerts non-Idol viewers to the fact that Idol has put a new artist out there.

    If Lee would have had a decent new song written for him to put out there immediately after he won, which radio would have played, then he might have seen better numbers. (The same could have been said for Kris Allen last year.)

  • Eriko

    As it has been stated several times, Nigel is back and it should be a faster paced show with hopefully the hottest acts in music today.

    You mean like Lady Gaga, Bieber, Usher, Miley etc like last season? Judging from various forums and blogs, people preferred the alums by a mile

  • Hazehel

    Interestingly enough, if she does she will be the first female runner-up to do so.

    I’m surprised by that, but then there haven’t been that many female runners-up. Which of the male runners-up didn’t appear on the show the next season? I suspect Justin Guarini didn’t (he didn’t have anything out by Season 2, Kelly did), don’t know about the rest.

    This theory is flawed,

    Not at all. I didn’t say people would stop watching the show, just that whatever credibility it has would have gone – its raison d’être is to create a star, if it can’t, then out goes its only source of credibility. I don’t watch shows like Dancing With The Stars – to me they are pointless shows, even if many find them entertaining. Idol is not pointless, not at the moment, but will soon be if it can’t create any more stars.

  • aa618892

    EditK : Please refer to the Disclaimer.

  • Trina

    ITA girlygirl. Danny was on a popular Idol season. You mean to tell me his first week sales was his Ai fanbase and that’s it? That his 2nd or even 3rd week couldn’t possibly still be Idol fans and all the rest was entirely new fans? That’s reaching a bit. TBH Adam is the only one from season 8 I’m convinced reached beyond AI fans and I’d bet that’s from his radio hits. Kris and Adam released during the holidays and that’s often AI fans, Adam’s very long BB200 was impressive. Strong sales during the holidays even past week 1 means nothing.

    I remember Simon Fuller giving an interview to Billboard once and he gave a quote about how he was getting picky about who he chose to manage. I forgot his wording but I thought it was interesting at the time.

    ETA: here it is, its all good reading. Its from 2009
    http://www.billboard.biz/bbbiz/content_display/industry/news/e3i322daa247a5902fc7948fd1228f28ead

    Contractually we have options on all of the contestants. That’s always been the case. But at this point, it doesn’t mean I will always option those rights. It has to feel right to me. I have to feel there is a relationship there. We will always have the winner signed to 19, so we’ll have the recording rights. But as for the management, that is much more of a human element. I feel more emotional about these things now than I ever did before. I want everyone to be focused and excited. I haven’t quite got it in me to push water uphill anymore.

  • jpfan

    Real Soundscan numbers of Top 25 albums:

    1 SWIFT*TAYLOR SPEAK NOW 259,136 29 200,927 2,607,188
    2 BOYLE*SUSAN THE GIFT 254,341 5 243,227 1,602,302
    3 JACKSON*MICHAEL MICHAEL 227,673 999 515 228,219
    4 EVANCHO*JACKIE O HOLY NIGHT 190,720 28 148,646 846,573
    5 GLEE CAST MUSIC: XMAS 158,227 -18 193,421 750,381
    10 GLEE CAST GLEE: THE MUSIC,V4 86,842 17 74,489 289,658
    12 BIEBER*JUSTIN MY WORLDS ACOUSTIC 82,887 17 70,711 335,448
    15 PERRY*KATY TEENAGE DREAM 74,287 26 59,100 858,364
    18 BIEBER*JUSTIN MY WORLD 2.0 73,079 36 53,855 2,219,734
    19 ALDEAN*JASON MY KINDA PARTY 71,167 27 56,225 565,117
    21 EMINEM RECOVERY 68,519 39 49,319 3,214,279
    22 WEST*KANYE MY BEAUTIFUL DARK TWISTED FANT 66,128 -1 66,501 738,122
    23 VARIOUS NOW 36 65,152 31 49,654 368,379
    25 LADY ANTEBELLUM NEED YOU NOW 61,624 33 46,486 2,995,136

    SuBo may not sell 2 million albums after all. I wonder if the rumor that they shipped 3M is true? Well, they can sell them next Xmas. ;)

  • bridgette12

    Elliegrll:
    12/22/2010 at 12:13 pm
    Kris, Adam, Danny, Fantasia. Cook, Archie and Jordin are all signed with 19Records, and Kris, Adam, and Cook, along with the three that you mentioned, are all signed with 19 Management, so if they have music to plug, Simon Fuller will get them a spot on AI. The music is just licensed to Sony, and now Universal, but the real record label (even if it is just legally) is 19 Records.

    That sounds great in theory, but not all of these people will be on Idol, even if they do have a song to plug. You will have Carrie, Daughtry, Kelly(possibly), Cook, Fantasia, Jordin, Kris, Adam, Archie, Lee, Crstal, Casey and Danny, plus the non-Idols stars who also will have new songs to pimp, like Katy, Beiber, Gaga, Usher, Bruno, so on. There is only so many guest spots open in one week and a lot of compeititon to get them. It would be great if all of the Idols got a chance to perform, but I doubt they all will.

  • aa618892

    If Lee would have had a decent new song written for him to put out there immediately after he won, which radio would have played, then he might have seen better numbers. (The same could have been said for Kris Allen last year.)

    This is a very good point. A new, good single should be released at least as soon as the tour is over. Surely they have time over the summer to come up with something and test it to radio to get some momentum and buzz going for the winner. It seems to me a lot of the issues for sales this season could have avoided or a least mitigated somewhat with better timing. The same could be said about Kris’ subsequent singles.

  • sma11ie

    David Cook’s Time Of My Life was what I consider to be the last Idol coronation song that was really promoted, by which I mean played on radio, and he’s the last Idol winner to have great sales.

    Coronation songs from seasons 2 through 6 were not really played on the radio either– with the possibly exception of Fantasia’s in season 3… and lots of Idol winners from season 2 through 6 had great sales. I don’t think there’s a direct corollation between a coronation song on the radio and great album sales. In 9 seasons, we really only had 2 coronation songs that made any radio impact, but we’ve had a lot more Idol winners who sold great.

  • tinawina

    Danny was on a popular Idol season. You mean to tell me his first week sales was his Ai fanbase and that’s it? That his 2nd or even 3rd week couldn’t possibly still be Idol fans and all the rest was entirely new fans? That’s reaching a bit.

    Yeah I agree. When you look at album sales in general, the pattern usually stays the same no matter who you are talking about:

    1st week sales > 60-75% drop in second week > ~25% drop in third week.

    To me, that’s probably about all the people who rush out and get that album right away… aka your biggest, most enthusiastic fans. Its not like that pattern changes much with radio play or regular promo (maybe awards show type performances interrupt the pattern) no matter whether the act is from Idol or not. So Danny’s first 2 weeks at least were probably about people who loved him from Idol. But after that third week, it was about more casual fans and new fans more and more, I would think.

  • bridgette12

    As it has been stated several times, Nigel is back and it should be a faster paced show with hopefully the hottest acts in music today.

    You mean like Lady Gaga, Bieber, Usher, Miley etc like last season? Judging from various forums and blogs, people preferred the alums by a mile

    The American Idol audience is lot bigger than just forums and blogs, the only way to actually tell who the audience perfered is to look at the week after and see who got a bump in sales. There was some Idols who did great and some were kind of blah, and the same can be said for the non-Idol singers. That’s why I think it’s going to be a mixture of Idol and non-Idol performers, who can deliver great performances and needed ratings.

  • Jx223

    Good for Danny for having the highest AI debut in 2010. I don’t know what percentage of his album sales is his AI fanbase vs, new fans he’s gained since he got off the show.

    But I definitely think he’s gained some new fans, especially with him selling around 1,000, sometimes closer to 2,000 weekly.(Especially with very little presence on radio and without a radio hit right now) I am glad to see that he is still selling albums and hasn’t stopped selling albums yet. More than likely Brian will have him down for 200,000 albums sold by early Jan.

  • PerfectStorm

    Danny may have been on one of the most popular seasons of Idol. But he is one of the reasons why it was popular. Because Season’s 8 high profile certainly did not help people like Allison Iraheata or Michael Sarver who have already ended contracts with their labels.

    I remember a point Evan Farmer of the CMT countdown made when he had interviewed Danny – he said Danny brought in a lot of new fans to Country music that otherwise would not have been there. Everyone who comes off Idol needs a jumping off point. And Idol money still counts towards sales.

    That say, I don’t see Danny expecting that to carry him. He has always been very pragmatic about building industry credibility and career longevity. His album has been out for close to 11 mos now. And I doubt it’s the same Idol fans buying his album over and over again.

  • Jx223

    I think that the numbers for Crystal’s album are decent numbers. She did much better than I thought she would. (I had predicted she would sell between 25-32K) Good for her and Fantasia who is still selling well.

  • asics85

    Tinawina, that is the point I was trying to make in my post…although you said it better than I did.

  • Valentin432

    I’m surprised by that, but then there haven’t been that many female runners-up. Which of the male runners-up didn’t appear on the how the next season? I suspect Justin Guarini didn’t (he didn’t have anything out by Season 2, Kelly did), don’t know about the rest.

    I remember Justin performing at least twice on Season 2. I think Clay performed Solitaire on season 3. Diana didn’t perform. Bo got to perform during the semifinals of season 6 but I’m not sure about season 5. Kat didn’t perform on season 6. Blake performed during the semifinals of season 7. David A. perfomed during the result show of Disco night on Season 8 and Adam performed and mentored during Elvis week of season 9.

    The sample size is really small, but so far, female runner ups have been shafted.

  • Elliegrll

    Not at all. I didn’t say people would stop watching the show, just that whatever credibility is has would have gone

    My point was who will the show lose credibility with? If the average viewer doesn’t keep up with what these people do post AI, and judge success based on which radio stations they listen to, then how are seasons 8 and 9 different from any other season? And if we are talking about losing credibility with reporters, other artists, and music insiders, these people have always looked down on AI,and felt that it’s more of a popularity contest than anything else. They’ve always seen it as AI manufacturing talent, and have held alums to a different standard, so what’s changed?

    That sounds great in theory

    I never said that they would all be on, just that AI severing ties with Sony doesn’t play a role, since the majority of these people are still signed with 19 Records, and since Simon Fuller is still involved with making a profit off of them.

    What happened to Kris’ numbers. I was fully expecting KATA to get a decent bump for the holidays. I figured he would sell at least a couple thousand. Could Brian just not have those numbers yet?

    Kris album isn’t in the top 200, country, or Christian, so it is harder for Brian to get the numbers for it.

    People expected Adam’s acoustic album to make the BB 200 again this week, did it fall off, or did Brian overlook it?

  • smeggingnuts

    Ok question for the number geeks…with Crystal’s predictions was this the first time HDD has under predicted and Idols sales. I keep hearing that they always over predict and was just wondering.

  • tinawina

    But I definitely think he’s gained some new fans,

    Clearly he has. Its just a question of how many.

    And his label is giving him another album right? So they think its enough. That’s all that really matters.

    Tinawina, that is the point I was trying to make in my post…although you said it better than I did.

    I think you said it fine!

  • Elliegrll

    Brian posted the numbers for the singles.

    Jason Aldean feat. Kelly Clarkson, Don’t You Wanna Stay (32,000, +24%, 206,000 total)
    Carrie Underwood, Mama’s Song (10,000, +5%, 234,000)
    Carrie Underwood, There’s a Place for Us (8,000, -4%, 46,000)

    Additional track data:

    Carrie Underwood, Undo It (5,000, +6%, 932,000)
    Carrie Underwood, Cowboy Casanova (3,000, +13%, 1.534 million)
    Kellie Pickler, Santa Baby (3,000, -11%, 86,000)
    Carrie Underwood, Temporary Home (3,000, +13%, 617,000)
    Clay Aiken, Mary, Did You Know (2,000, +4%, 113,000)
    Jason Castro, You Are (less than 1,000, +31%, 7,000)
    Jason Castro, Hallelujah [Album Version] (less than 1,000, +9%, 51,000)
    Chris Sligh, Only You Can Save (less than 1,000, +12%, 10,000)

  • SashaB

    Coronation songs from seasons 2 through 6 were not really played on the radio either– with the possibly exception of Fantasia’s in season 3… and lots of Idol winners from season 2 through 6 had great sales. I don’t think there’s a direct corollation between a coronation song on the radio and great album sales. In 9 seasons, we really only had 2 coronation songs that made any radio impact, but we’ve had a lot more Idol winners who sold great.

    Agreed.

    Kris’s sold more than twice as much as Lee did his first week.
    Kris also had LLWD on radio in multiple formats before his album dropped. I don’t think Lee is going to have the sales succcess or radio charting that Kris did for his single — certainly not gold or platinum level success. But again, never say never.

    Wonder why RCA waited so long for SS? It’s interesting that FOX chose to go with Archie on it’s NYE special than the Idol winner. Last year, Kris and Allison were on FOX’s NYE broadcast. Couldn’t they squeeze the winner in? Maybe they felt he wouldn’t be as much of a ratings draw.

  • Eriko

    I like this tweet from David Bendeth the producer

    @DavidBendeth
    Music is not a contest. It is always a sharing of creation, sales are a contest for sellers.

  • cwm

    I’m curious to hear how many of Adam’s Acoustic Live! EPs sold this week, especially since, as far as I can tell, a good portion of the hard copy CDs from the first pressing were shipped this past week, along with all of the second pressing orders. Do we know anything about those numbers?

  • Hazehel

    My point was who will the show lose credibility with?

    Me for one, and I doubt I’m the only one. If SOME journalists and critics are a bit sniffy about American Idol, they can’t deny that the show has created legitimate stars like Carrie, Kelly and Daughtry, even Jennifer Hudson in films. That is its source of credibility, whether some people are snobbish about the show is completely irrelevant.

  • Oksana2000

    cwm:
    12/22/2010 at 1:13 pm
    I’m curious to hear how many of Adam’s Acoustic Live! EPs sold this week, especially since, as far as I can tell, a good portion of the hard copy CDs from the first pressing were shipped this past week, along with all of the second pressing orders. Do we know anything about those numbers?

    Brian reported only digital sales of 1000 copies, but I know that bulk of sales must’ve been from hard copy CD. Why it wasn’t reported by AO to Soundscan, beats me… :-(
    BTW, if CD was shipped to other countries (and I know it did) does it count?

  • Trina

    IMO the ones still* managed* by 19 will get to come back. Didn’t even Matt Giraud say he would be back?

    The whole debate about a good coronation song I still don’t get. TOML was a freak of nature. Carries song was awful and didn’t do much, Jordins pretty much flopped and it was her own songs that became hits and kept her selling.

  • Valentin432

    So complete breakdown for Hazehel (I may have forgotten something, so please correct if you find it):
    Justin performed on top 5 result show, a song from his album and on top 3 result show, he performed “Unchained Melody” which was his single.
    Clay performed on top 12 result show “solitaire” and on top 4 result night he did a bizarre group performance with the remaining finalists.
    Diana as far as I know didn’t get to perform.
    I did find Bo performing on the last result show of the semifinals of season 5. It was his single “The Real Thing”
    Kat didn’t perform on season 6.
    Blake performed on the last result show of the semifinals singing “How Many Words”.
    David A. performed “Touch My Hand” on top 7 result night (bis).
    Adam mentored and perfomed WWFM on top 9 week (bis).

  • smeggingnuts

    haha darn looks like Adam just barely missed BB200 again

    199. Elvis Presley, Elvis Presley, Christmas Duets: 6,000 (+12%; 437,000)

    Adam Lambert, For Your Entertainment (5,000, +25%, 775,000)

  • mickeybordentwo

    I just want to thank MJ and Kirsten for hosting these numbers threads, which, frankly, I find considerably more interesting than Idol itself.

  • bridgette12

    What happened to Kris’ numbers. I was fully expecting KATA to get a decent bump for the holidays. I figured he would sell at least a couple thousand. Could Brian just not have those numbers yet?

    It’s amazing everyone got a bump in sales except for Kris.

  • Indigobunting

    I remember Simon Fuller giving an interview to Billboard once and he gave a quote about how he was getting picky about who he chose to manage.

    That was interesting. More importantly; I think many Idols are probably becoming more savvy about pushing for outside management. Like Danny and Casey who are country and will benefit much more from a Nashville insider group. And Crystal, who is not following the usual Idol arc so needs an “out of the box” manager like Gina.

    Kris album isn’t in the top 200, country, or Christian, so it is harder for Brian to get the numbers for it.

    I don’t understand how he gets numbers for Adam’s album and not Kris’s if it isn’t on the BB200. And what about Adam’s acoustic? It must not have been on the BB200, but you would think he would get numbers for that if he got FYE. It is a mystery to me!

    ETA: I see he did report 1k of the digital Adam acoustic. He reported 2k of hard copies last week-you would think there are more.

  • smeggingnuts

    cwm:
    12/22/2010 at 1:13 pm
    I’m curious to hear how many of Adam’s Acoustic Live! EPs sold this week, especially since, as far as I can tell, a good portion of the hard copy CDs from the first pressing were shipped this past week, along with all of the second pressing orders. Do we know anything about those numbers?

    With the way AO has handled this whole thing they probably didn’t even report the sales *eye roll* lol

  • http://legan0.tripod.com mama2dasha

    This was posted on AO by mged in response to this question about the acoustic EP

    6,252 total physical and digital copies TW. 16,559 since release.

  • smeggingnuts

    I don’t understand how he gets numbers for Adam’s album and not Kris’s if it isn’t on the BB200. And what about Adam’s acoustic? It must not have been on the BB200, but you would think he would get numbers for that if he got FYE. It is a mystery to me!

    Indigobunting
    the reason Brian can get numbers for FYE alittle later in the day after he gets the BB200 numbers is because FYE is in the Top BB200 sellers list for the year. When it falls off of that (which since there is only a few weeks left I doubt it) he won’t be able to get the numbers any more. Which mean that start of the year not more FYE numbers.

  • larc

    Oksana2000:
    Brian reported only digital sales of 1000 copies, but I know that bulk of sales must’ve been from hard copy CD. Why it wasn’t reported by AO to Soundscan, beats me… :-(

    I get the impression that whoever is running AO is asleep at the wheel sometimes. There was never any mention on the Events calendar of the Jingle Balls Adam performed in.

  • luly

    Congrats to all the idols that got a nice increase this week :).

  • jpfan

    It looks like FYE acoustic just missed the BB200 if it sold 6200. There’s probably alot of albums sellings in the 5K range though.

  • Oksana2000

    From AO

    6,252 total physical and digital copies TW

    If it was reported, Acoustic CD would chart.Or maybe it missed Top200 by few sales. I dunno..

  • Hazehel

    Justin performed on top 5 result show, a song from his album and on top 3 result show, he performed “Unchained Melody” which was his single.

    Was that really his single? I didn’t think he released any single, but looks like I’m wrong.

  • luly

    bridgette12- we don’t know how much KATA sold this week, so we don’t know if it got a bump in sales or not.

  • windmills

    sma11ie: Good for Kellie! Didn’t realize she’s sold 440K! Is this era over, or is she still pushing singles? Any shot at gold for her? What did she sell on her first album? I know she went gold, but I forget how far past it she was.

    This era’s been over for a few months since Makin Me Fall In Love Again peaked at #30 on Billboard. We’re basically waiting for her to announce a new single to lead off her new album. There’s been a delay for her too and the reason isn’t really known. She’s been tweeting away merrily though so it wouldn’t surprise me if she’s waiting to get married first or at least finish up her wedding plans before they get going with all the news for her album.

    I think the last known sales figure for Kellie’s debut album is 854k but that’s from back in March from Brian Mansfield.

    It’s clear Danny’s singles weren’t what gave him sales because his single downloads were low even for the amount of airplay he got compared to other acts who were getting similar airplay on country radio at the time, even new acts. There would’ve been more of a correlation between single and album sales with airplay if that’s what was getting him going. I’d say the vast majority of his album sales have been to people who liked him on AI.

    Danny deserves credit for hanging on to enough of those fans by making the exact kind of album he was expected to make coming off AI: inspirational pop/soul marketed to the only mainstream genre that makes room for inspirational music: country. But his album didn’t help him overcome his credibility issues in the country world. Now since he’s trying again in country he has the dilemma of changing his style to try to be more believable in the country world or sticking to who he really is and what his AI fans have come to expect.

  • Incipit

    Kat didn’t perform on season 6

    Valentin432, I’m flying by and didn’t check – but didn’t Kat perform “Red High Heels” on Season7? I cannot imagine any other circumstance that I would know about it – unless she was on the one season I actually watched. Bo performed on that season as well, IIRC.

    Perhaps I’ve misremembered, IDK. ;)

    ETA – Never mind – now I think that was Kellie Pickler. Sheesh.

  • Elliegrll

    Me for one, and I doubt I’m the only one. If SOME journalists and critics are a bit sniffy about American Idol, they can’t deny that the show has created legitimate stars like Carrie, Kelly and Daughtry, even Jennifer Hudson in films. That is its source of credibility, whether some people are snobbish about the show is completely irrelevant.

    Carrie’s success hasn’t stopped these people from being snobby, or from saying that those from AI are reality show stars, not artists. Even Billboard, in an article that they wrote about who could get a Grammy nod, made a point to indicate that Adam and Susan Boyle are reality show stars, and made it seem like that, not their music, would be the reason for their nominations.

    So, I still don’t see what the difference will be. Critics have been slighting AI for years, and each year, have pointed to alums not doing as well as previous former contestants as proof that AI is dying.

    Brian reported only digital sales of 1000 copies, but I know that bulk of sales must’ve been from hard copy CD. Why it wasn’t reported by AO to Soundscan, beats me…

    Maybe they were reported the week before. I thought it was odd that Sony reported digital sales numbers the week before the album was available. I also think that people are putting too much faith into what the RCA (whatever his name is) moderator is posting. The EP also shows how important publicity and promotion are, for everyone.

  • smeggingnuts

    mama2dasha:
    12/22/2010 at 1:33 pm
    This was posted on AO by mged in response to this question about the acoustic EP

    6,252 total physical and digital copies TW. 16,559 since release.

    Did they distinguish between US and International sales?

  • Valentin432

    Was that really his single? I didn’t think he released any single, but looks like I’m wrong.

    That’s how Ryan introduced it, so I trust him.

    Valentin432, I’m flying by and didn’t check – but didn’t Kat perform “Red High Heels” on Season7? I cannot imagine any other circumstance that I would know about it – unless she was on the one season I actually watched. Bo performed on that season as well, IIRC.

    “Red High Heels” is Kellie Pickler’s single and she did perform it on season 7.
    Kat performed on season 7 too but I was answerring a question about runner ups performing on the season immediatly after theirs.

  • Tess

    Music is not a contest. It is always a sharing of creation, sales are a contest for sellers

    If this was even remotely true than there wouldn’t be any reason to have a BB200, or any other measuring tool for sales. A recording is made to be sold…otherwise “real music” would just be sung to handy listeners.

    Quotes like these are only flaunted when numbers don’t meet expectatations….just like saying that an Artist is only interested in singing and heck if they sell anything. If that is the case they should be very happy with just “singing” in a back-water bar someplace and would have no need to even try and “record” something.

    I’m a full-fledged cynic and don’t think for one moment that there are many altruistic people in the music “business”.

  • Incipit

    I was answerring a question about runner ups performing on the season immediatly after theirs.

    Ahah. (I just like to say that) That’s what I get for flying by – didn’t read the qualifiers. Sorry ’bout that. ;)

  • windmills

    Ha! Incipit, you made me remember all the comments people made about how Kat and Kellie both had shoe-themed lead singles! Good times…..

  • luvmusic

    Regarding a comment that someone made that Danny didn’t start touring till way after is album was released. Well here are some concert dates that he did right after the album came out on March 2nd 2010.

    March 3rd The Rodeo Club in San Jose, CA
    March 6th CD release party
    March 8th Diamond Back Saloon in Detroit
    March 10th High Noon Saloon in TN.
    March 13th Grand Ole Opry
    April 1st Cotton Eyed Joe in TN.
    April 2nd HOuse of Blues in Myrtle Beach
    April 9th Dallas Bull in FL.
    April 10th House of Blues in Orlando,FL
    April 15th Joes Bar in Chicago
    April 30th Wild horse Saloon in Nashville, TN
    May 6th 1st Concert with Sugerland

    And the list goes on

  • cwm

    mama2dasha:
    12/22/2010 at 1:33 pm
    This was posted on AO by mged in response to this question about the acoustic EP
    6,252 total physical and digital copies TW. 16,559 since release.

    Thank you mama2dasha. I wonder why they didn’t report these to Soundscan. It’s a mystery. I also wonder how many were domestic and how many international. Obviously not all of those 6200 are domestic US sales.

  • Hazehel

    So, I still don’t see what the difference will be. Critics have been slighting AI for years, and each year, have pointed to alums not doing as well as previous former contestants as proof that AI is dying.

    I’m not really sure what you are trying to argue, that journalists and critics think that Carrie and Kelly aren’t legitimate stars? If they cite Adam or SuBo what has that got to do with Carrie or Kelly? Did they think American Idol hadn’t created them? I’m not sure why you think citing SOME critics and journalists equals what ALL critics and journalists think about the show, or that some of them being snobby equals them thinking that it doesn’t have ANY credibility. What has some of them thinking the show is dying got to do with what we are discussing? You are not making any sense.

  • car

    I’m pretty sure that Adam’s Grammy nomination and well as Fantasia’s and Carrie was because of the music and not because they were reality stars. The show is where they got their start. What they make of that opportuinity is up to them. Some will have more success than others. Nominations, award wins, critical success, commercial success, international success, resulting in more exposure and more opportunities which is what they want and hope for by going on the show. They are artists. Does not matter where they got their start.

    What is really impressive about Carrie is that she maintained and increased her accomplishments many years after her start.

  • aa618892

    16,500 for Adam’s EP? That is pretty impressive, IMO. Since the physical CD was only available on the fansite and no real promotion I was not expecting much. This is great and FYE still selling after a year makes me happy.

  • bridgette12

    Tess:
    12/22/2010 at 1:50 pm
    If this was even remotely true than there wouldn’t be any reason to have a BB200, or any other measuring tool for sales. A recording is made to be sold…otherwise “real music” would just be sung to handy listeners.

    I figure David decided to tweet after hearing some criticism that someone coming off American Idol only sold 58K during the biggest sales week of the year. I am sure if she goes gold, he will the first to tweet touting her numbers then.

  • SashaB

    Carrie’s success hasn’t stopped these people from being snobby, or from saying that those from AI are reality show stars, not artists.

    Let’s see — she not only sold well immediately after her launch and continued to do so on every album she has put out, she’s also earned the highest industry honors available to her. Not to mention BNA Grammy and ACM Entertainer of the Year. She’s a member of the Grand Old Opry. And every year that she’s been elligible, Carrie has received a Grammy nomination. She’s now nominated for a Golden Globe for her song writing efforts in Narnia. Exactly how are these people defining artistry?

  • Indigobunting

    Thanks smegginnuts for the BB200 differentiation ! Explains it.

    Now since he’s trying again in country he has the dilemma of changing his style to try to be more believable in the country world or sticking to who he really is and what his AI fans have come to expect.

    If the Boot country blog can list “Pray for you” as a top country song in addition to Taylors song for 2010- both way less country and way more poppy than Danny- than he certainly has some credibility with some and can gain more.

    People who have listened to the album and have seen him live know how multi-dimensional he is. The Opry just had him back for the 5th time; so I guess he has credibility there ;)

    “Who Danny really is”. Only Danny knows but IMO and in some of his own words- is a very talented versatile singer who had no prior musical identity and loves country-and hopes his type of soul infused country will play in the country world. It sure seems to during live performances with traditional fans who have ranked him near the top (second after Jason Aldean, above The Band Perry and Glorianna and others in Cleveland; Third at a huge country festival in Alabama-a festival no fan on any of his sites even attended) on post concert surveys.

    What it is AI fans have come to expect= Excellent music sung with a unique voice (his sexy, soulful cover of Keith Urban’s Raining on Sunday is a definite fan favorite) and an open, accessible persona to fans. Contrary to your implication, a minority of fans want inspirational music from him; although his optimistic outlook on life won’t ever leave his art, IMO.

  • Kirsten

    It’s amazing everyone got a bump in sales except for Kris.

    I guess I do need to post that monstrous disclaimer every week.

    Main post updated.

  • jpfan

    Where did the info about FYE selling 5K come from?

  • CindyM

    Even Billboard, in an article that they wrote about who could get a Grammy nod, made a point to indicate that Adam and Susan Boyle are reality show stars, and made it seem like that, not their music, would be the reason for their nominations.

    Billboard made no such claim or inference. They stated that they came from reality shows because they did. They made no statement that it would be the reason for nomination. The Billboard article was about the Best New Artist category, it made sense to talk about their start. You’re really reaching there.

  • sr4mjc
  • Kirsten

    I don’t remember many giving Taylor Hicks grief for his first week’s sales of his post-Idol debut.

    LOL. You clearly weren’t on this blog during this same week in 2006. The blog meltdown was epic. The Daughtry fans were very “concerned” for poor Taylor and offered lots of “sympathy” to his fans. The Taylor fans told them to shove it (his numbers weren’t that bad) and planned a virtual Daughtry platinum party. Throw in the Elliott and Kat fans and this place exploded in a mess of passive-aggressiveness mixed with a huge helping of outright aggressiveness. By the time that Christmas rolled around (before Taylor’s numbers plummeted), MJ had to close down the blog and require people to create accounts. The entire blog changed to the format you see now.

  • aa618892

    jpfan:
    12/22/2010 at 2:13 pm

    Where did the info about FYE selling 5K come from?

    Brian updated his numbers
    http://content.usatoday.com/communities/idolchatter/post/2010/12/crystal-bowersoxs-farmers-daughter-debuts-with-58k-sales/1

    Also, according to RCA Ed, aside from the 16,500 for the EP, he posted the totals of the individual tracks.

    http://www.adamofficial.com/ca/node/1868387

    Scroll down a bit to see Ed’s post.

  • oladyrocklover

    It’s amazing everyone got a bump in sales except for Kris.

    Didn’t you know? Kris is a big loser. That’s why he moved back to Arkansas with his pretty wife and cute dog. All is not lost,though, I hear that the shoe store that he used to work at needs Christmas help.

    Anyway, I just heard Lee’s song on the radio and it sounded good. It actually helped my mood a little. That is until I decided to check out this numbers thread :)

  • sr4mjc

    I see including Music Again over Sleepwalker was a good choice *rolls eyes*. Not surprised Mad World is selling well, it’s a great version. And I was convinced I was sick of the song.

  • koshka

    shell29:
    12/22/2010 at 12:23 pm
    I don’t remember many giving Taylor Hicks grief for his first week’s sales of his post-Idol debut. It was when his sales took a nosedive(and Daughtry’s skyrocketed) that the negativity started. Yes, Crystal and Lee’s opening week sales look rough in comparison, but times have changed since 2006. It’s not so much how you start, it’s how you finish. If Crystal or Lee’s albums can develop legs and sell consistently over the long haul they should be fine. If that doesn’t happen, then I would be concerned about their status with their respective labels. I still think it’s too early to be worrying now.

    I absolutely and completely agree with this. I’ll also add that the spread between the CB and LD is not that great and could easily flip (or not) by the end of the year. It just depends on promo and radio play at this point.

  • Eriko

    I figure David decided to tweet after hearing some criticism that someone coming off American Idol only sold 58K during the biggest sales week of the year. I am sure if she goes gold, he will the first to tweet touting her numbers then.

    Well you figured wrong. He´s THRILLED with the numbers and tweeted them a few hours before it was posted on mj. Anyone can interpret his tweet as they want, I surely interpreted it differently than Tess did, and I´m sure David meant it differently also since he´s so pleased with Crystal´s #

  • mmb

    Can someone post the numbers posted by RCAed ( which I presume need to be taken somewhat with a gran of salt)? Ao forum threads are not accessible on mobile devices.

  • Elliegrll

    I’m not really sure what you are trying to argue, that journalists and critics think that Carrie and Kelly aren’t legitimate stars? If they cite Adam or SuBo what has that got to do with Carrie or Kelly? Did they think American Idol hadn’t created them? I’m not sure why you think citing SOME critics and journalists equals what ALL critics and journalists think about the show, or that some of them being snobby equals them thinking that it doesn’t have ANY credibility. What has some of them thinking the show is dying got to do with what we are discussing? You are not making any sense.

    I thought that I was making sense.

    To bring it down to a level that I think that even a third grader can understand: For at least eight seasons people have been predicting the end of AI, saying that it has no credibility, that it produces tv stars and not real artists, and pointing to various alums seeming lack of success and saying that it proves that the show isn’t about creating real artists, so how will this year be any different?

    The success of Carrie and Kelly has not stopped people from dismissing the show or the alums.

    BTW, this year and last year are also not the first time that the fans of those who didn’t win have said that the show is going to end or doesn’t have any credibility. None of this is new.

  • sr4mjc

    Here you go mmb. RCAEd’s post

    Oh yeah, all numbers reported. The combined physical & digi sales for the week (6,252) just weren’t large enough to make the Billboard 200… they were just below the chart. Digital for the week was 1,013, so that would make physical 5,239. While I’m slaving over Soundscan for you guys (LOL), individual song sales total 12,406 and break down as follows:
    WWFM: 5,781
    Music Again: 802
    Aftermath: 1,267
    Mad World: 3,297
    Soaked: 1,259

  • Elliegrll

    I don’t remember many giving Taylor Hicks grief for his first week’s sales of his post-Idol debut.

    I remember Taylor getting slammed by the mainstream press, but these were the same people who slammed Fantasia and predicted AI’s demise, when Fantasia’s debut week numbers were so much lower than Ruben’s.

  • car

    What is really strange about the show to me is that there are more male winners than female winners. Yet all the female winners delivered the goods and came in first with sales their seasons. But David Cook is the only male winner who came in first and was not outsold by a non-winner. Perhaps that has something to do with the credibility issue in the minds of some.

  • Elliegrll

    Billboard made no such claim or inference. They stated that they came from reality shows because they did. They made no statement that it would be the reason for nomination. The Billboard article was about the Best New Artist category, it made sense to talk about their start. You’re really reaching there.

    My quote is that they “made it seem like”. Unlike the other acts, they didn’t list either Adam or Susan’s musical success from the past year, and just labeled them as reality tv stars. Maybe it wasn’t the writers intent to dismiss what they have done this year, but it’s similar to what other journalists have done in the past.

  • Kirsten

    Some sales stats from Billboard:

    Total Weekly Sales: 12.5M (+23% from last week, -17% from same week last year)
    Total Weekly Sales Last Week : 10.2M
    Total Weekly Same Week Last Year: 15.14M
    YTD: 303.94M (down 13% from last year, 348.99M)

  • sma11ie

    Ao forum threads are not accessible on mobile devices.

    OT, but really? I always thought the Sony sites were similar, but DCO threads are accessed just fine on mobile devices I’ve tried.

    LOL, Kirsten, wasn’t around then, but your recap of the Taylor/Daughtry/etc mess sounds awesome. And by awesome, I mean, so ridiculously awful it’s pretty hilarious in hindsight.

    I know very little about Taylor aside from the pop culture conscious, where he’s often the punchline of jokes, but my limited exposure to his voice/performance has made me realize that he has a great voice once I close my eyes, even if it’s not my preferred musical style/genre. I can see how people liked him. That said, I still can’t watch him perform because his movements make me way uncomfortable, lol.

    What is really strange about the show to me is that there are more male winners than female winners. Yet all the female winners delivered the goods and came in first their seasons. But David Cook is the only male winner who came in first and was not outsold by a non-winner.

    But of the three male winners who were outsold by a non-winner, only one was outsold by a female non-winner (this season with Lee/Crystal). The other three were outsold by male non-winners. What does that mean? LOL, no idea. Just wanted to throw in that bit since we’re talking genders.

  • Hazehel

    To bring it down to a level that I think that even a third grader can understand: For at least eight seasons people have been predicting the end of AI, saying that it has no credibility, that it produces tv stars and not real artists, and pointing to various alums seeming lack of success and saying that it proves that the show isn’t about creating real artists, so how will this year be any different?

    Doesn’t help. You didn’t even bother to answer my questions.

    Try a few logical exercises – a boy cried wolf a few times, first couple of times there were no wolf, therefore every time he cried wolf there must have been no wolf. True or False?
    If an earthquake strikes Los Angeles tomorrow with a Richter scale of 9, it won’t be that different from when it was last struck with a big quake on the scale of 6.7. True or False?
    If I said Taylor Hicks wasn’t a star, then that means American Idol can’t create stars. True or False?
    So on and so forth. Your posts just lack any logical thought process in there.

  • Kitwana

    Love this inside information from RCA Ed at Adam Official. Brian posted it on his Idol Chatter blog.

    Ed writes, re: Adam’s “Acoustic Live!” EP:

    “Right now, the sales seem to be matching most volume expectations. Even the first run of physical copies (7,500 units), which I know you guys felt were too low, would have actually been spot on if so many people hadn’t ordered MULTIPLE copies. Knowing you guys as I do, I told my RCA and 19 colleagues we should probably expect an unusually high number of folks ordering 3, maybe 4 copies, but not even I expected some of you to order 10 or more! What, are you making a quilt? (Smiling) As of today, the ratio of copies purchased per consumer is 1.6, which is simply off the charts. However, physical orders have tapered off significantly, even after the addition of the ‘Red Label’ series, so, again, the overall estimates and expectations are matching up quite nicely. Depending on demand, we’ll investigate the possibility of producing additional physical units in the future.”

  • koshka

    LOL. You clearly weren’t on this blog during this same week in 2006. The blog meltdown was epic. The Daughtry fans were very “concerned” for poor Taylor and offered lots of “sympathy” to his fans. The Taylor fans told them to shove it (his numbers weren’t that bad) and planned a virtual Daughtry platinum party. Throw in the Elliott and Kat fans and this place exploded in a mess of passive-aggressiveness mixed with a huge helping of outright aggressiveness. By the time that Christmas rolled around (before Taylor’s numbers plummeted), MJ had to close down the blog and require people to create accounts. The entire blog changed to the format you see now.

    Wow what a hot mess!!

  • Keel

    LOL. You clearly weren’t on this blog during this same week in 2006. The blog meltdown was epic. The Daughtry fans were very “concerned” for poor Taylor and offered lots of “sympathy” to his fans. The Taylor fans told them to shove it (his numbers weren’t that bad) and planned a virtual Daughtry platinum party. Throw in the Elliott and Kat fans and this place exploded in a mess of passive-aggressiveness mixed with a huge helping of outright aggressiveness.

    Damn. Where was I with my big bag of popcorn during this time? Sounds awesome!

    It’s amazing everyone got a bump in sales except for Kris.

    I guess I do need to post that monstrous disclaimer every week.

    Main post updated.

    Heh. And . . . full (Idol) circle (of life).

  • tinawina

    Wow what a hot mess!!

    Ah, memories. now THAT was some fanwarring. Massive popcorn eating. LMAO

    I still think anyone who thinks their Idol is the Most Persecuted Idol Ever should take a look back at what happened to poor Kat McPhee on here. :D She got the drubbing of life for just being pretty and lasting longer than Daughtry & Elliot, plus for Simon preferring her over Taylor. The only thing I’ve seen rival it since was the drubbing Danny got. Good times people. Good times.

  • lorismile

    but not even I expected some of you to order 10

    Why would ANYONE need 10 copies!!!! LOL

    Well, it is Adam laughing all the way to the bank.

  • Valentin432

    I still think anyone who thinks their Idol is the Most Persecuted Idol Ever should take a look back at what happened to poor Kat McPhee on here. :D

    Is there any place were we can see those comments sections? Just morbid curiosity here.

  • windmills

    Kirsten: I guess I do need to post that monstrous disclaimer every week.

    LOL. I’d been thinking about commenting about the lack of disclaimer but I didn’t want to jinx it!

    Indigobunting: his sexy, soulful cover of Keith Urban’s Raining on Sunday is a definite fan favorite

    I did not know this existed until you mentioned it so I went to check it out on youtube because I wanted to see how Danny did with a pop country song (because I didn’t think Danny sounded country singing country pop songs on AI and I don’t think his album is country at all). Maybe I’ve got Keith’s amazing phrasing and the ache in his voice too ingrained in my mind but I found Danny’s version to be clinical and oversung. Sorry but I did give it a chance.

    sma11ie: But of the three male winners who were outsold by a non-winner, only one was outsold by a female non-winner (this season with Lee/Crystal). The other three were outsold by male non-winners. What does that mean? LOL, no idea. Just wanted to throw in that bit since we’re talking genders.

    Technically there are 2 female non-winners who have outsold the male winners because Kellie also outsold Taylor Hicks (but Chris outsold them both so your point still stands).

    EDIT: You were probably talking about 1st week sales. Never mind! Taylor had the highest 1st week sales for s5.

  • tinawina

    Is there any place were we can see those comments sections? Just morbid curiosity here.

    I don’t know, try the archives! But I have to tell you that was a big reason why I got hooked on mjs. I didn’t hate Kat at all but man, people were HILARIOUS with the savage jokes at her expense. Making (good natured) fun of Idols was part of the game back then, there would be whole threads that would devolve into just jokes. Kat’s were mean but funny as hell.

  • sma11ie

    Kellie also outsold Taylor Hicks (but Chris outsold them both so your point still stands).

    You’re right, Daughtry’s the big story there, but it is pretty awesome for Kellie that she outsold the winner of her season (she finished outside the top 5, right?). Thanks for saying my point still stands though– since I wasn’t quite sure what my point was anyway, lol. Just throwing out stats and numbers into the discussion. It’s kinda fun =P.

    ETA: Saw your ETA, windmills. I don’t know if I was talking first week sales! I was piggy-backing of the OP… who I guess had to be talking first week sales, since the Crystal/Lee comparison only goes to the first week. So yay, my “non-point”, or at least my stat still stands!

    ETA2: tinawina, I’m sad I missed the comedy! We need some good natured jokes around here I feel…

  • koshka

    I still think anyone who thinks their Idol is the Most Persecuted Idol Ever should take a look back at what happened to poor Kat McPhee on here.

    I never visited MJ or AI.com until about 2 years ago. I never knew there were so many tomatoes thrown her way. I just got disgusted by her rising hem lines every week, but my husband thought I was nuts. LOL Awwww to be a fly on the wall during this time. Did she have many fans supporting her?

  • sr4mjc

    Did RCA not think people might want to give away physical EPs as gifts? Since you can’t buy them in stores, I’m not surprised multiple copies were ordered. I’m actually surprised the ratio is as low at 1.6 per order.

    (I bought 5. 1 for myself and 4 for people who went to the tour, but would not have known the EP was for sale. They love it.)

    Wow, S5. Sorry I missed it here. I didn’t have a huge fave then, liked Daughty well enough, that sounded fun in a crazy way.

  • Elliegrll

    Doesn’t help. You didn’t even bother to answer my questions.

    Try a few logical exercises – a boy cried wolf a few times, first couple of times there were no wolf, therefore every time he cried wolf there must have been no wolf. True or False?
    If an earthquake strike Los Angeles tomorrow with a Richter scale of 9, it won’t be that different from when it was last struck with an big quake on the scale of 6.7. True or False?
    If I said Taylor Hicks wasn’t a star, then that means American Idol can’t create stars. True or False?
    So on and so forth. Your posts just lack any logical thought process in there.

    I think my post makes sense. You say Taylor isn’t a star, but those who paid him mega bucks to appear in Grease for a few minutes, and those who went to see him, would probably disagree. Everybody basis who is a star on who is on their radar. A great example of that is regular AI posters dismissing Fantasia, despite the fact that pretty much every song that she’s release has been a hit.

    People inside and outside of the bubble predicting AI’s demise is not new. People saying that AI produces reality stars, but not legitimate artists is not new. People saying that AI alums are manufactured is not new. Previous AI alums doing better than new ones isn’t new. Viewers, industry insiders, and journalists saying the show is not credible is not new. All this stuff has been going on for years, so why would viewers suddenly care about it this year, when they haven’t cared about it in the past?

    I haven’t been reading the entirety of your posts, so I may not have seen your questions.

  • koshka

    Did RCA not think people might want to give away physical EPs as gifts? Since you can’t buy them in stores, I’m not surprised multiple copies were ordered. I’m actually surprised the ratio is as low at 1.6 per order.

    ITA, I cheap, easy gift and since it is acoustic it probably would have a wider appeal.

  • cwm

    A further post from RCAEd at AO about the Acoustic Live! EP sales. Apparently all of the figures he reported (6200 this week, 16,000 total) are US domestic sales only.

    RCAEd:
    The figures I listed below apply ONLY to U.S. sales, download or physical.

    And I agree with koshka and sr4mjc on the multiple purchases as gifts. I bought a few to give as gifts to others who I knew would enjoy it but wouldn’t necessarily have known about it.

  • tinawina

    I just got disgusted by her rising hem lines every week, but my husband thought I was nuts. LOL Awwww to be a fly on the wall during this time. Did she have many fans supporting her?

    She didn’t have many fans here. What little she had got driven away for the most part. That’s why it was so bad. Plus it was the blog’s first year, so very few people had developed the sense to temper their emotions or tamp down on the rivalries. I think most of the long timer posters have since figured it all out and gained a little more perspective – myself included!

    But yes, it was highly entertaining and quite crazy that year. Very fun.

    You would have loved it because may people shared your opinion of her hemlines and boobage, and their contribution to her staying power. No one credited her voice. Poor Kat. :D

  • jpfan

    However, physical orders have tapered off significantly, even after the addition of the ‘Red Label’ series,

    That’s good news. It seems like even OTT fans won’t actually buy the same EP over and over again even with a different label.
    I always worry about some folks going broke “supporting” their fav and it really doesn’t even matter who the fav is.

  • Oksana2000

    I’m surprised, that RCAEd at AO is surprised. If he didn’t figured it out yet, it is X-mas time!! Gift buying. Gift giving.
    I had to buy for some folks who would NEVER buy anything on-line.You know, if you buy on-line your credit card number will be stolen and similar nonsens.. :roll:
    And lorismile is right, Adam is laughin’ all the way to the bank..

  • carson

    You were probably talking about 1st week sales. Never mind! Taylor had the highest 1st week sales for s5.

    It was close, but Taylor didn’t have the highest 1st week sales in s5. The exact numbers are posted somewhere upthread… Daughtry had 304,000, Taylor had 298,000.

  • car

    Of course some people will buy a $4.99 EP as gifts. Has there ever been any evidence of people going broke buying CDs of their favorites or going to multiple shows? I keep seeing this concern but I have never heard any real stories of this happening.

  • mmb

    Bizarre that RCA couldn’t anticipate that a cheap pretty EP released during the holiday season would be bought as a gift lol. I bought one for my mom who liked Adam on ai but his cd was not her speed ( she is definitely more of an easy listening type- she likes subo and Josh groban-hates everything on pop radio, did not enjoy the FYE cd that she demanded I buy her last year) She LOVES the ep and plays it constantly in her car. Maybe they should have marketed the ep to the subo/ Jackie e/ easy listening crowd– if my mom is any indication, they might like it

  • sr4mjc

    RCAEd:
    The figures I listed below apply ONLY to U.S. sales, download or physical.

    This is good to know. It looks like RCA made a small bit of profit on a relatively inexpensive project. The shipping cost was extra to the consumer (except for a one day glitch.) Itunes has low overhead, although they get their cut I am sure. Internationally, if they can sell 5-10k each in Japan, Finland, Australia and NZ digitally, the bigger Adam fanbases, that’s great.

    I think it’s funny they stopped taking orders at 7k copies and then are suprised they sold 7k? What did they expect? HAHA

  • Valentin432

    What I don’t get, is the “He’s going all the way to the bank” remarks, I mean (just to be clear, I mean that for ANY IDOL FANS), do people really care about how much money these guys make?
    Record sales, airplay, touring I get because it means their music is being heard more, but I couldn’t care less if the guy/girl is making millions or just making enough to live decently (I would care if they were homeless but it doesn’t seem to apply to any of the idol contestants we continuously debate around here).

    I mean worst case scenario, these guys earn more in 1 or 2 years than most of us could ever hope to make in the same timeframe.
    For instance, I never hear sport fans rejoicing how much their quaterback is making (they will complain a lot about it tough if he’s not delivering good numbers).

  • windmills

    carson: It was close, but Taylor didn’t have the highest 1st week sales in s5. The exact numbers are posted somewhere upthread… Daughtry had 304,000, Taylor had 298,000.

    You’re right, I mixed their first week sales up in my head. Sorry! I was thinking 3 male winners outsold by non winners and I thought that was Ruben (outsold 1st week and overall by 1st runner up Clay), Kris (outsold 1st week and overall by 1st runner up Adam), and Lee (outsold 1st week by 1st runner up Crystal). But Taylor was outsold 1st week and overall by 3rd runner up Chris and he was outsold overall but not 1st week by 5th runner up Kellie.

  • Hazehel

    I think my post makes sense.

    You seem to have a habit of posting what you think makes sense without regard to anything I have said. Happened a few times already before but I ignore those (the last time was when I said something is broken with Idol but you turned it into a “someone said Adam broke Idol” discussion). And to turn a hypothetical question into a statement about Taylor Hicks is just ridiculous. (I happen to think Taylor is not a star but that isn’t what I said.)

  • jpfan

    There were stories of women looting their retirement funds to follow Taylor around. Ditto for Cook. I’m pretty sure there are other Idol fans who have let their obsessions take over. It’s okay if fans are rich but it’s scary if they’re not. Sometimes people spend $ they don’t have (even on cheap EPs) to “support” someone who’s alot richer than they’ll ever be. ;)

  • koshka

    You would have loved it because may people shared your opinion of her hemlines and boobage, and their contribution to her staying power. No one credited her voice. Poor Kat.

    The funny thing is that I am FAR from a prude. I’m more of to each there own. LOL To this day I can’t remember her voice or a song she sang on the show.

  • Indigobunting

    Maybe I’ve got Keith’s amazing phrasing and the ache in his voice too ingrained in my mind but I found Danny’s version to be clinical and oversung. Sorry but I did give it a chance.

    Well, I did say “fan” favorite, lol! To me Keith’s version has no soul and is very poppy, although pleasant. And Danny’s is very soulful and romantic (what you call oversung I guess). My alt. country friend who never heard of Danny until I treated her to a concert (and she will 100% go again she said) thought it was quite toe-curling :)

    The context of that example was not to say he was better than Keith, but to counter your assumption that fans want “inspirational” from Danny. They actually have clamored for more love songs like that and rock-influenced songs like Get Away.

    But thanks and kudos to you for listening to the song.

    Re S5-I know marriages that have been in trouble because of fan warring and evil deeds. Better than a soap opera.

  • aa618892

    So the 16,500 is only domestic? I wonder if we we will ever get the international sales? I read somewhere that the EP is in the Top 10 in Japan Pop iTunes. As far as multiple copies, I bought 3, one for me and the others for a couple of friends who are fans but not online followers and would never have known about the EP. They both love FYE and this little EP is going to be a real treat for them. Perfect small gift.

  • Kitwana

    Did RCA not think people might want to give away physical EPs as gifts? Since you can’t buy them in stores, I’m not surprised multiple copies were ordered. I’m actually surprised the ratio is as low at 1.6 per order.

    I agree with RCA Ed. 1.6 is a fantastic number. It would mean that if you had 5000 purchasers, this would translate into 8000 sales. 10,000 purchasers would mean 16,000 sales etc. I wish Billboard or Kirsten would start tracking this stat for all Idols and all artists. It is very interesting.

  • koshka

    think people who have no idea about MJ or AO or twitter would have picked up a copy in the store for $4.99 especially if it said Acoustic and had Mad World and WWFM.

    Well that was almost my thought as well. I toyed with getting my husband’s boss the CD because, although I’ve never met her, I knew that she was a fan of his. She went to see him on the AI tour. This would have been a big surprise for her. She is not the type to be tied to MJs or AO. Not too expensive to seem like too much. In the end I downloaded the EP, so I bypassed any physical order. Oh well, hubby will have to gain brownie points on his own.

  • bridgette12

    car:
    12/22/2010 at 3:53 pm
    Of course some people will buy a $4.99 EP as gifts. Has there ever been any evidence of people going broke buying CDs of their favorites or going to multiple shows? I keep seeing this concern but I have never heard any real stories of this happening.

    I didn’t go broke buying Daughtry acoustic album and surely didn’t buying Adams. Hopefully one day if the music gods are listening, I will buy David Cook’s EP.

  • car

    Ok, I get it jpfan, I guess I’m just not up on the finances of others so my concern meter is not working so well.lol

  • sr4mjc

    What I don’t get, is the “He’s going all the way to the bank” remarks, I mean (just to be clear, I mean that for ANY IDOL FANS), do people really care about how much money these guys make?

    I’m not too concerned about how much the Idols themselves make, that’s for their lawyers and management to negociate. But I do like to see albums and side projects like EPs be successful, simply because if it makes money, labels are likely to spend more the next era (and insure a next era). And it keeps fans interested, which helps the next era. I would never buy more than I needed as gifts though, all in the name of any Idol’s financial well being.

    Speaking of RCA, where oh where is Cookie’s album? Give us just a hint of when to expect it please. Kelly?

  • sma11ie

    I will buy David Cook’s EP.

    No EP before the LP! After waiting well over 2 years, and compiling intel on David writing literally dozens of songs for this album, we should really be getting a double album from David, so anything less than a full album in 2011 will pretty much make me want to kill RCA LOL. Of course, if we get an EP in addition to the next LP, I’d be just thrilled =P. I don’t bank on it though. Cook fans have gotten ZERO extras from RCA… I know, cry us a river =P.

    Sorry, pretty sure the “EP” was a typo, but I just wanted an excuse to go off about my growing impatience RE: Cook’s album =P.

  • alterego7

    I’m sorry to say this, but unless something really drastic happens – and it has to be something really big – Lee Dewyze will likely be dropped by RCA this time next year, or even sooner. I just can’t see them investing in him, when you consider that they dropped Bo Bice who had a gold single.

  • Indigobunting

    No EP before the LP!

    Do you think Brian was talking about Cook?

    His tweet about an EP from some Idol in 2011? That made me very curious.

  • bridgette12

    Sorry, pretty sure the “EP” was a typo, but I just wanted an excuse to go off about my growing impatience RE: Cook’s album =P.

    No it wasn’t a typo. I was talking about a EP after his LP, like Daughtry and Adam got this year.

  • sma11ie

    No it wasn’t a typo. I was talking about a EP after his LP, like Daughtry and Adam got this year.

    Oh okay. In that case, hope we get one, even though I’d be somewhat shocked! But yeah, in any case, LP first– please please please =P. Although who knows… like I said in another thread, with what we’re hearing from Kelly fans about the Sony exec shake-up affecting 2011 releases, I have no idea when to expect Cook’s LP.

    I feel like Brian’s mysterious tweet about an EP isn’t about Cook. His inside info seems to be just Country or Christian… JMO.

  • sr4mjc

    Maybe Casey is going the EP route first?

    Or someone not on a major label, like Aaron Kelly?

  • dhunken

    Oops-having technical issues.

  • smeggingnuts

    Indigobunting:
    12/22/2010 at 4:38 pm
    No EP before the LP!

    Do you think Brian was talking about Cook?

    His tweet about an EP from some Idol in 2011? That made me very curious.

    I thought I heard a rumor that there was talk of Danny’s next effert being an EP.

  • madison

    Lee Dewyze will likely be dropped by RCA this time next year, or even sooner. I just can’t see them investing in him, when you consider that they dropped Bo Bice who had a gold single.

    It wasn’t strictly sales with Bo, though. He was working on songs for a second album, but after his 2nd and 3rd emergency surgeries he told RCA that this time he was going to have to take several months off to really heal. That’s when they cut him loose. As long as Lee’s intestines don’t start tying themselves into knots too, RCA might keep him if he manages to get close to gold.

  • carson

    Do you think Brian was talking about Cook?

    His tweet about an EP from some Idol in 2011? That made me very curious.

    If you go on Brian’s usatoday twitter page, you’ll see that he was actually retweeting Lacey Brown (s7/8?).

    http://twitter.com/laceybrown

  • car

    I wish Lee well, but don’t see him getting close to gold. Kris started out with higher numbers and he has a platinum single but he is not close to gold. But anything is possible so there is that.

  • Montavilla

    Cook fans have gotten ZERO extras from RCA… I know, cry us a river =P.

    I wonder if the plethora of “extras” from Adam’s RCA team has anything to do with Adam’s own focus on marketing. In his Idolatry interview, he talked about how the modern artist has to be an entrepreneur. He also talked about creating an eclectic debut album in order to appeal to different national markets — which is exactly what RCA has done. They’ve released “Fever” and “Sleepwalker” to various countries, even though it seems they wouldn’t play on U.S. radio stations.

    Putting out a $5 EP, especially when people were clamoring for acoustic versions of the FYE songs was really a no brainer. The only mistakes were not printing more copies in time for Christmas and whatever it was that caused the shipping delays.

    Hopefully, they’ll do that again in the second era. Just maybe with a wee bit better planning?

  • jpfan

    I agree with RCA Ed. 1.6 is a fantastic number. It would mean that if you had 5000 purchasers, this would translate into 8000 sales.

    I think that means the higher the number, the fewer actual fans someone has. But the more likely they are to buy product. It would be interesting to see how that number translates to other Idols. Although I guess there would be no way to get that number outside of fan sites.

  • Elliegrll

    You seem to have a habit of posting what you think makes sense without regard to anything I have said.

    And you don’t have this habit? I think I’m right, and you think that you are right. There’s nothing about that that’s hard to understand.

    You think that you are right concerning how many superstars AI has produced, and that people are suddenly going to see the show as less credible, because in your eyes, people won’t see Kris or Lee as being successful. It doesn’t matter to you that people judge success based on what happens in their own little bubbles, this also goes for how people view the show, or that this will not be the first time in the history of AI that people have said that the voting is flawed, or that people will stop watching the show because of it.

    I get that you think that there is evidence this year and last year to back up these annual complaints about the show and the voting, but as a longtime watcher of the show, I know that those who made these same complaints after previous seasons also thought that they had evidence to back up their opinions.

  • Elliegrll

    I wish Lee well, but don’t see him getting close to gold. Kris started out with higher numbers and he has a platinum single but he is not close to gold. But anything is possible so there is that.

    It all comes down to the singles and promotion. The Truth wasn’t going to result in anybody buying the single or the album,, but who knows what would have happened if Jive had followed up a hit like LLWD with a radio friendly song, that appealed to multiple formats like LLWD did. And who knows what will happen to SS after the freeze.

  • https://twitter.com/pmhowden undercooked

    What is really strange about the show to me is that there are more male winners than female winners. Yet all the female winners delivered the goods and came in first their seasons. But David Cook is the only male winner who came in first and was not outsold by a non-winner. Perhaps that has something to do with the credibility issue in the minds of some.

    I’ve also thought there was a double standard when it came to male vs female idols. Probably because most of the male winners have leaned more towards rock. I think the rock world is kind of macho and going on AI to get ahead can seem like a weakness in that circle. I also think country embraces AI more because AI is all about being the boy or girl next door.

    By the way, I have no data to support my theory. :) It is just how it looks from my perspective.

  • http://emuisemo.com eilonwy

    I wish Lee well, but don’t see him getting close to gold. Kris started out with higher numbers and he has a platinum single but he is not close to gold. But anything is possible so there is that.

    Hey, I’ve been modeling this since about week 2 of LIU’s release! As things stand, to hit gold in 52 weeks, LIU has to settle at 8,000-9,000 copies sold per week in January and stay there for the rest of the year.

    Essentially, that’s a Daughtry-like tail on an album coming from a much lower opening week. The first sign that LIU has a shot at this will be whether SS can peak on HAC at #5 or better and show some staying power there. One HAC hit alone shouldn’t add up to Daughtry-like numbers (LTT has had three), but ya can’t hit subsequent benchmarks if ya don’t hit the first one.

  • jpfan

    HDD predictions for this week’s sales:

    ONE-DAY SALES: With the last few days before Santa slides down your chimney still to go, Taylor Swift’s Big Machine blockbuster Speak Now appears to have the best shot to repeat at #1 on next week’s chart.

    The week’s key debuts include J/RMG’s Jamie Foxx and Geffen’s Keyshia Cole, both in the 120-130k range, followed by Interscope’s Keri Hilson with a target of 90-100k.

    They’ll probably put out the Top 20 predictions on Friday but then will close shop till 2011.

  • steph6449

    Danny deserves credit for hanging on to enough of those fans by making the exact kind of album he was expected to make coming off AI: inspirational pop/soul marketed to the only mainstream genre that makes room for inspirational music: country. But his album didn’t help him overcome his credibility issues in the country world. Now since he’s trying again in country he has the dilemma of changing his style to try to be more believable in the country world or sticking to who he really is and what his AI fans have come to expect

    You’re entitled to your own viewpoint of course, and sure, you aren’t alone in that view. But country music thankfully is not monolithic and there are various industry people in media, GAC/CMT, and country radio who have been quite supportive of Danny’s trying to establish himself as a pop-country artist. Also Danny’s AI fans are not monolithic either, and include a good number who are long-time country music listeners. The traditionalists will probably never be big Danny fans, but there are those who are open to various styles in country music, or don’t have an ideological bent at all and will just like what they like. The latter is how I’ve perceived the country audiences at Danny’s concert appearances at country music bars, festivals, etc. He is very well-received as a live act (“kickass” live in the words of a cowboy-hat wearing country guy at one show I attended this fall). People in general enjoy his shows without tying themselves into knots over what to label it, and not a few of them buy his album. And a few people go, and don’t like it because they think he is too country for them. Lol.

    his sexy, soulful cover of Keith Urban’s Raining on Sunday is a definite fan favorite

    I did not know this existed until you mentioned it so I went to check it out on youtube because I wanted to see how Danny did with a pop country song [..] but I found Danny’s version to be clinical and oversung.

    Well, I did say “fan” favorite, lol! To me Keith’s version has no soul and is very poppy, although pleasant. And Danny’s is very soulful and romantic (what you call oversung I guess). My alt. country friend who never heard of Danny until I treated her to a concert (and she will 100% go again she said) thought it was quite toe-curling :)

    Definitely count me in the toe-curling camp. Mmmm. Have seen Danny sing that one in person a few times, clinical is not by any stretch the word I would use :) I like Keith’s version also, but I don’t find Keith to be a particularly interesting vocalist. Also Danny’s version and Keith’s don’t entirely have corresponding lyrics, which gives them a different sense for me.

    I thought I heard a rumor that there was talk of Danny’s next effert being an EP.

    That was probably some of us confused Danny fans commenting here :oops: When he first started talking about working on new music, he was fairly vague (“fresh material”) and we were trying to guess what it would be. The first guesses were an EP, as various country acts do put out EPs these days. Also that early we were trying not to be overconfident Danny & team were going straight to album #2 in 2011 as it now seems clear they are.

  • Indigobunting

    If you go on Brian’s usatoday twitter page, you’ll see that he was actually retweeting Lacey Brown (s7/8?).

    Ah! That explains it. Twitter confuses me sometimes when people retweet. I just read his feed so didn’t see the whole “retweet” part.

    Sorry for almost starting a rumor!

    LOL Steph, block quote fail!! :lol:

  • renataamelo

    do people really care about how much money these guys make?

    I want Adam to be rich!!! :) :)

  • shell29

    LOL. You clearly weren’t on this blog during this same week in 2006. The blog meltdown was epic. The Daughtry fans were very “concerned” for poor Taylor and offered lots of “sympathy” to his fans. The Taylor fans told them to shove it (his numbers weren’t that bad) and planned a virtual Daughtry platinum party. Throw in the Elliott and Kat fans and this place exploded in a mess of passive-aggressiveness mixed with a huge helping of outright aggressiveness. By the time that Christmas rolled around (before Taylor’s numbers plummeted), MJ had to close down the blog and require people to create accounts. The entire blog changed to the format you see now.

    LOL…ah memories. :) I was (and I am still) a Taylor fan and I actually do remember the crazy Daughtry/Taylor fanwars on this blog (along with the almost daily snarking on poor Kat McPhee). I guess I probably should have said that I don’t remember Taylor getting much grief from the press/Idol bloggers for his opening week sales. The fanwarring and concern trolling always seems to be present every season, and those Taylor/Daughtry wars took BSC to new heights. I don’t think Taylor became the red-headed stepchild of Idol winners until his album dropped off the BB200 and it became clear that Daughtry would be the breakout star of season five. The fact that Daughtry’s sales crushed Taylor’s didn’t help matters unfortunately.

  • car

    I was not an idol watcher. But I had heard of Taylor, Daughtry and Kat. What I remember most was seeing Kat everywhere and asking myself, has she made any music? Never heard anything about a song or album. I’m sure there was one just never heard anything about it.

  • Hazehel

    I think I’m right

    I’m sure you do think you are right, except that what you think in this conversation has been largely irrelevant to the discussion. In a conversation you are suppose to listen to what the other person has to say and come up with a reply that has some kind of pertinence to the discussion, it isn’t a conversation if you say what you want to say regardless of what I have said in the first place. I’m sure you got plenty of pearls of wisdom to impart, but it’s time for me to end this conversation I think.

  • steph6449

    LOL Steph, block quote fail!! :lol:

    I fixed it. With considerable difficulty, lol :)

  • smeggingnuts

    steph6449:
    That was probably some of us confused Danny fans commenting here When he first started talking about working on new music, he was fairly vague (“fresh material”) and we were trying to guess what it would be. The first guesses were an EP, as various country acts do put out EPs these days. Also that early we were trying not to be overconfident Danny & team were going straight to album #2 in 2011 as it now seems clear they are.

    Ohh ok…haha at least what I was remember kinda actually happened. haha somewhere there was talk with the words Danny and EP in the same general space :D

    But hey EP releases of new music worked for Gaga and Beiber. Though as a fan I want my 13 new songs damnit!! LOL

  • asics85

    Wow Steph….thanks for that link to Danny singing “Raining on Sunday”! If that is “clinical” then that is a clinic I want to check in to;)

    I definitely hope his new album has romantic songs like that one…when sung with Danny’s soulful voice I feel it takes them to another level.

  • Allison

    I’ll answer this question posed in this thread: “Which of the male runners-up didn’t appear on the show the next season? I suspect Justin Guarini didn’t (he didn’t have anything out by Season 2, Kelly did), don’t know about the rest.”

    Justin did appear on Season 2. He sang “Unchained Melody” on the Top 3 results show. This was his de-facto first single.

  • Trina

    Oh god the season 5 fanwar *shudder*

    I don’t know whether to feel sad or amused all but one male winner got outsold. On one hand I would say the music they put out might make a difference a few months after the show is over and but at the same time the voting system IMO really does need to change.

    I’ll gladly take a Cook EP. But hells after all this waiting I want that PLUS a 30 track album LMAO. BTW did y’all see VH1 tweeted him on his B’day and said they couldn’t wait for new music in 2011? One of the DJ’s on WPLJ also said something similar a couple of months ago right before playing CBTM. Gives me some hope that when he does get something out there he’ll have support from them.

  • steph6449

    Though as a fan I want my 13 new songs damnit!! LOL

    Lol. By that standard, the Danny fans have a big IOU out then. His album only had 10 songs, with one bonus song that was on the iTunes presale and never seen again. (The bonus song is the only song on Danny’s CD that I’ve heard a significant number of his fans say they don’t like. Me included, haha.)

    So perhaps with that in mind, Danny needs to have 13 songs on the new album, and three make-up songs to pay back the shortage on album #1? Works for me :)

  • JosieX

    The video of Danny singing “Raining On Sunday” that Steph posted is one of my very favorite performance videos of his. I love that. I think Danny very successfully creates a mood with his performance of that song. The texture of his voice and the way he varies it with tenderness and intensity, and the way he looks when he performs it, it all works as far as I’m concerned. I like Keith very much too but I prefer Danny’s version of Raining On Sunday.

  • smeggingnuts

    steph6449:
    12/22/2010 at 7:08 pm
    Though as a fan I want my 13 new songs damnit!! LOL

    Lol. By that standard, the Danny fans have a big IOU out then. His album only had 10 songs, with one bonus song that was on the iTunes presale and never seen again. (The bonus song is the only song on Danny’s CD that I’ve heard a significant number of his fans say they don’t like. Me included, haha.)

    Ugh thats definatly intitles you to a few extra songs on #2. With all the international version of FYE plus the iTunes only songs I think it totaled 17 songs. 13 for regular edition, 2 iTunes, and 2 international tracks (1 Australia and 1 UK). I am not counting the Japan edition which included NoBo since it wasn’t a new song.

    I’ll gladly take a Cook EP. But hells after all this waiting I want that PLUS a 30 track album LMAO.

    I have seen alot of artists put out double albums because they had so much material. Maybe you’ll get lucky *fingers crossed for you*

  • larc

    jpfan:
    I think that means the higher the number, the fewer actual fans someone has.

    Doesn’t mean that at all. What it does mean is that every 10 purchasers combined bought an average of 16 EPs. There’s no guarantee or even implication that every purchaser was a fan or that every fan purchased.

  • jpfan

    I thought the physical EP was only for sale on a fan site? Although I guess it could mean that 9 people bought 9 EPs and one super fan bought 7. It’s no big deal. Buying multiple copies is par for fans especially around the holidays.

  • http://emuisemo.com eilonwy

    I was not an idol watcher. But I had heard of Taylor, Daughtry and Kat. What I remember most was seeing Kat everywhere and asking myself, has she made any music? Never heard anything about a song or album. I’m sure there was one just never heard anything about it.

    Not merely one album, but three! (Wikipedia scoots up and gives me a nuzzle)

    There was a January 2007 post-Idol debut with RCA that had meh sales by the expectations of the time (and 37% of its sales in the first week, so no legs), with a single that went gold but also did just awright on radio.

    She was dropped by RCA and eventually picked up by Verve (a Universal imprint that does AC-ish artists) and put out another album in January 2010 with unimpressive numbers, plus the recent holiday album.

    McPhee also seemingly has a genius for getting herself onto random singles projects — there’s a continuous flow between albums — but none of them sell well. So I tend to concur with whoever it was who said the only explanation for her excellent publicity was that her management had sacrificed a goat.

  • Buffynut

    Poor Elliot, always the forgotten S5 finalist!

    But Taylor was outsold 1st week and overall by 3rd runner up Chris and he was outsold overall but not 1st week by 5th runner up Kellie.

    Chris was #4 and Elliott was #3. :)

  • jpfan

    So I tend to concur with whoever it was who said the only explanation for her excellent publicity was that her management had sacrificed a goat.

    Brian never gives Kat’s single or album sales so I assume she has yet to make the BB200 or the Hot 100 with her Xmas music. But she gets first rate promo. If she gets a third album from Verve I’m going to assume she’s blackmailing the President of the label. No other possible explanation.

    Kellie was the 6th place finisher on S5. Paris went out 5th. That was one crazy season of Idol.

  • lorismile

    What I don’t get, is the “He’s going all the way to the bank” remarks, I mean (just to be clear, I mean that for ANY IDOL FANS

    My comment was more for the fans who buy 10 copies of the CDs. I don’t get it. But Adam’s bank account, or his manager’s bank account, or whoever’s, is happy.

  • CanadianFan

    Well, I only ordered one single Acoustic Live! from AO, and I have yet to receive it. I guess it takes a long, long time to get to Canada.

  • steph6449

    So I tend to concur with whoever it was who said the only explanation for her excellent publicity was that her management had sacrificed a goat

    I didn’t watch any of that season but have certainly admired how much PR, tv exposure she gets. Glad I’m not the only one confused as to why, though, lol.

    Feel bad for the goat :(

  • PerfectStorm

    Danny deserves credit for hanging on to enough of those fans by making the exact kind of album he was expected to make coming off AI: inspirational pop/soul marketed to the only mainstream genre that makes room for inspirational music: country. But his album didn’t help him overcome his credibility issues in the country world. Now since he’s trying again in country he has the dilemma of changing his style to try to be more believable in the country world or sticking to who he really is and what his AI fans have come to expect

    Well, obviously Danny’s label, RCA Nashville doesn’t feel this way. If they did, they would have cut him loose – instead of investing in him to write for his sophmore album. Danny was signed by Joe Galante, the CEO of Sony Nashville. He had retired earlier this year. And Gary Overton take over as CEO and he certainly had no obligation to Danny. So, the change over would have been the time to break ties.

  • Tess

    But Taylor was outsold 1st week and overall by 3rd runner up Chris and he was outsold overall but not 1st week by 5th runner up Kellie.

    Not to be pedantic but this quote is correct: winner, Taylor; first runner-up, Kat; second runner-up, Elliott; third runner-up, Chris.

  • Keel

    nvm — Tess and I were both making the same point. Heh.

  • pineappletree

    Tess:
    12/22/2010 at 8:22 pm
    But Taylor was outsold 1st week and overall by 3rd runner up Chris and he was outsold overall but not 1st week by 5th runner up Kellie.

    Not to be pedantic but this quote is correct: winner, Taylor; first runner-up, Kat; second runner-up, Elliott; third runner-up, Chris.

    LOL when it is put this way all I think of is pageants. Cue Miss America theme song..lol :)

  • jpfan

    Its not really ok to call them runner up as in beauty pageants. The third place finisher, the second place finisher, and the winner is how is works for Idol. Calling someone the 2nd runner up when they finished third is just confusing. Especially because the 2nd place finisher gets signed by 19R while the 2nd runner up usually gets nada. ;)

  • JosieX

    who he really is

    I watch Danny pretty closely and he has a set of core values that are very consistent (and consistent with the values that I see as associated with country music), but it looks to me as if he is constantly in the process of discovering and refining many things about who he is. He’s really open about that too and I think that’s charming. For example it has been so fun to listen to him talk about songwriting. He had said in interviews that he was nervous about starting it and you could tell that he was. Now he’s so excited and happy that he can really do this and it’s going well. There is no doubt in my mind that whatever music Danny produces will be true to how he sees himself, I think anyone who has observed him closely would know that it would be uncharacteristic of him to pretend to be something he’s not. And I am unsurprised that he is still in the process of discovering who he is, because I am too. He’s not the same person he was two years ago, and I’m not either. He will continue to develop and grow, and it’s just a matter of there being a good match up to what the market wants at any particular time. He’s extremely talented and I’ve been pleased with how well he’s done so far. I really wish him the best of luck in taking his career to the next level, I would love to see that happen for him and he certainly is going for it.

  • Elliegrll

    So I tend to concur with whoever it was who said the only explanation for her excellent publicity was that her management had sacrificed a goat

    Her parents have done publcity/public relations work in the industry for a long time, so they have the connections to get her on television and a lot of the other things that she gets.

  • Tess

    (and consistent with the values that I see as associated with country music)

    JosieX, I understand your point but I really don’t think country music is as goodie two shoes as is sometimes thought. There have been lots of country entertainers that weren’t real nice human beings…drugs is as prevalant in the country scene as anywhere else, and many songs have been pretty risque and darn-right nasty. Sure country doesn’t have the interesting rep that some other genre’s have, but it isn’t all inspirational, nice-guy, love your country and honor your parents music that many associate with it…it has it’s dark side, too.

  • lucysfave

    help him overcome his credibility issues in the country world.

    I sat next to a guy and his wife that were into Country music at a summer fair concert where Danny was the opener. This guy didn’t really know Danny but was on his feet cheering (and his wife was dancing, as I was, by the front of the stage) by the time Danny finished his set. He told me that Danny put on a great live show. The country concert crowds don’t seem to have a problem enjoying Danny’s performances. He just needs to win over those Program Directors….

  • girlygirl

    It is so frustrating that Brian M can get numbers for pretty much anyone except Kris. Even if the numbers aren’t real good, I’d rather know that than be left in the dark. Why doesn’t SoundScan simply release ALL the sales numbers? How hard would that be?

  • steph6449

    sat next to a guy and his wife that were into Country music at a summer fair concert where Danny was the opener. This guy didn’t really know Danny but was on his feet cheering (and his wife was dancing, as I was, by the front of the stage) by the time Danny finished his set. He told me that Danny put on a great live show. The country concert crowds don’t seem to have a problem enjoying Danny’s performances.

    I think that’s true. I used to worry about how Danny might be received, but after seeing him open for people as different from he is as Blake Shelton and Gretchen Wilson, I’ve stopped having any concern about it. The audiences seem to take Danny as he is, and have a great time.
    I think that’s one reason he has been invited back so often to the Opry. I saw him in late August, I think, on a roster with three other younger country artists, two of whom (Chris Young, Lee Brice) were pretty “typical” in their style as country artists, much more so than Danny. One was somewhere in between (Jimmy Wayne), Danny of course least traditional. They all went over really well though, with similar levels of audience response; it was kindaf nice to see. And more than likely, they are friendly which is nice also. Danny referred to Lee in an interview as someone he had become friendly with on some joint tour dates, and Chris Young and Danny have done a few things together as RCA Nashville label-mates.
    Anyway, I hope Danny keeps it up with the touring, and builds even more on that in 2011 to help boost his upcoming music, and eke out some more sales for MBD. Week by week, those 1000-2000 units sold have been adding up and kept MBD continuously active on the BBD country chart since the week it first came out.

  • girlygirl

    Do we know if any of the more recent Idols have made any money on their actual albums/singles — what I mean by that is just through the sales of this music (so not including any advances they got from the label, endorsements, touring, etc)?

  • jpfan

    Why doesn’t SoundScan simply release ALL the sales numbers? How hard would that be?

    Access to the BB200 has to be paid for and it’s supposedly quite expensive. That seems to be double for albums off the BB200. Bottom line, the info costs $.

  • HR

    It wouldn’t be hard to release the numbers, they’d just lose the money they make by servicing these numbers at high rates to subscribers. This is a business and they are providing a service in return for financial gain.

    JMO, but we’re lucky to ever have any numbers released. If this show ends or is judged to no longer be of sufficient interest to maintain Idol Chatter, any chance of even infrequent updates on sales could disappear altogether.

  • GreatAdamFan

    Yay to the increase in FYE sales last week and some great follow up to AL! :)

    Well, I only ordered one Acoustic Live! from AO, and I have yet to receive it. I guess it takes a long, long time to get to Canada.

    Yeah, I ordered only 1 as well. Oh, I just received notification from my local Post office that it has arrived yesterday. Guess it took almost 2 weeks to get to an international destination. Can’t wait to get my hands on the CD! :)

  • certain1

    Tess

    I think it the same in any of the genres, that the bad gets more publicity. Although it seems and is expected that those in the Country genre will lead lives more “clean”. The church going aspect plays a very big part of the appeal that these artists have, with love, God, and family being a recurrent theme. You will very rarely se a overt sexual theme being played up in fact Julianna Hough had a video pulled from CMT for what she says -for being to sexy.

    The country concerts seem to liken themselves to family affairs, although the almost always have beer sponsors :)

  • Indigobunting

    (The bonus song is the only song on Danny’s CD that I’ve heard a significant number of his fans say they don’t like. Me included, haha.)

    I love the bonus song and know a lot of fans who do too, and want him to sing it live, but Danny must not like it either, because he never does!

    JosieX, I understand your point but I really don’t think country music is as goodie two shoes as is sometimes thought.

    I agree Tess, but I think that is due to behavior of artists; not the “values” of country music. Country music values are God, family, country. It is why you see the “alcoholic country star redeemed” story glorified so much! Crazy Heart last year and now the female version “Country Strong” this year. The values have always been there; country artists just don’t always follow them. And “Goody Two shoes” isn’t really the word- Blake Shelton has a party boy, lewd persona, but he is a nice guy and also follows the “redemption” story- he just likes to pretend he is a big bad a** for fun.

    I agree with the sacrificial goat thing for Kat! She is everywhere and I don’t get why :shock:

  • sr4mjc

    Didn’t Kat marry someone very wealthy? Maybe he’s funding a lot of her promo, idk. She seems to be doing okay with small movie roles, those pay fairly well. Maybe she should give up music and concentrate on acting and modeling. Pretty girl, but musically not very interesting.

  • steph6449
    (The bonus song is the only song on Danny’s CD that I’ve heard a significant number of his fans say they don’t like. Me included, haha.)

    I love the bonus song and know a lot of fans who do too, and want him to sing it live, but Danny must not like it either, because he never does!

    Didn’t mean to suggest that it was widely disliked, just that you can easily find Danny fans who don’t like it. Where for the songs on the album proper, I have a hard time of thinking of one that any core Danny fans really actively dislike; more a question of which are their favorites.

    JosieX, I understand your point but I really don’t think country music is as goodie two shoes as is sometimes thought.

    I agree Tess, but I think that is due to behavior of artists; not the “values” of country music. Country music values are God, family, country.

    Well, also rural values/lifestyle, and beer, lol. And getting your woman out of her dress.

  • Canadian Girl

    CanadianFan:
    12/22/2010 at 7:54 pm
    Well, I only ordered one single Acoustic Live! from AO, and I have yet to receive it. I guess it takes a long, long time to get to Canada.

    I only ordered one and still haven’t received it either, I’m also still waiting for my calendar. Maybe I’ll have it by 2012.

  • JosieX

    I agree Tess, but I think that is due to behavior of artists; not the “values” of country music. Country music values are God, family, country.

    I agree Indigobunting. I don’t think country music artists or fans are immune to human weakness because of their values, but I do think there is a widely held belief system (I’m not talking about religion although that’s a factor in any belief system of course) that is generally assumed to be prevalent in the genre. Of course each individual is unique but on average, I think the God/family/country theme resonates pretty strongly.

    Well, also rural values/lifestyle, and beer, lol. And getting your woman out of her dress.

    Steph, yes, those are some recurring themes there too, lol!

  • CanadianFan

    GreatAdamFan and Canadian Girl: I guess misery likes company and we can commiserate in AO’s tardy international attention. I hope in compensation, there will be a Canadian tour in the near future. It doesn’t hurt to dream.

  • windmills

    Not surprisingly I feel like I listen to a different genre of music than the Danny fans who’ve commented :/ For once I agree with Tess. There’s a lot of songs about sinning that are a core part of country music. Too, country music is defined by so much more than its values. It has a sound. It’s not like you can make a R&B song and just because it’s about God and family you can call it country.

    certain1: in fact Julianna Hough had a video pulled from CMT for what she says -for being to sexy.

    That’s just an attempt to get attention in my opinion. Her single barely even charted and CMT was probably waiting to see if it would do anything before adding the video. CMT’s had no problem with other people’s risque videos.

    I don’t remember who said it but I wanted to correct a post from somebody who didn’t think any new country act from 2010 had sold more than 250k. Easton Corbin’s at 292k according to Roughstock and The Band Perry’s at 276k. Easton will get by 300k in 2 weeks and The Band Perry will either get there this week or next week. Also with one more sales week like this one Jerrod Niemann will probably also pass Danny’s sales so that’d be another new act from 2010 to sell more than him without the AI advantage.

    Also from Roughstock these are Play On’s numbers:

    Sales This Week: 24,954
    Total: 1,886,306

    PO should pass 1.9 million next week and then it’ll be a slow climb to get to 2 million. Probably won’t happen until after the ACMs in April.

  • kokko

    Now with Crystal’s debut numbers & BB200 position confirmed, AI music bloggers are doing the year end look back – I think the following might have been mentioned or linked and it’s worth repeating

    Danny Gokey wraps 2010 as AI’s Top Debuting Artist of the Year (Jimmy Carter in Nashville)

    Gokey’s MBD released Mar 2 scanned in excess of 65K copies in its first week…outpacing opening week sales on other 2010 debut releases including those from AI season 9 winner Lee DeWyze and runner up Crystal Bowersox (Idol Chatter Brian Mansfield)

    Season 9 may be the first Idol season to not spawn a top 10 artist. Season 8 yield 2 top 10 acts – Adam Lambert who debuted at #3 and Danny Gokey who peaked at #4 (Lyndsey Parker in Realty Rocks)

  • steph6449

    That’s just an attempt to get attention in my opinion. Her single barely even charted and CMT was probably waiting to see if it would do anything before adding the video.

    Just to show it can happen, completely agree with you…in this case. CMT and/or GAC did run Julianne’s video, as I can attest having had to watch her slink around in it to a song that wasn’t particularly interesting, by a performer I’ve seen live twice and both times found equally annoying :( To have such a fuss going around about a video that’s not been around for a while, and a song that didn’t do anything on radio, just smells to me of PR.

    Not surprisingly I feel like I listen to totally different genre of country music than the Danny fans :

    More than likely, as I usually like more traditional country artists than Carrie ;) Hopefully there is breadth enough in the country market, IMO, for anyone who likes the genre to be satisfied.

    I don’t remember who said it but I wanted to correct a post upthread from somebody who didn’t think any new country act from 2010 had sold more than 250k. Easton Corbin’s at 292k according to Roughstock and The Band Perry’s at 276k. Easton will get by 300k in 2 weeks and The Band Perry will either get there this week or next week. Also with one more sales week like this one Jerrod Niemann will probably also pass Danny’s sales so that’d be another new act from 2010 to sell more than him without the AI advantage.

    That would be me, I just hadn’t looked up the latest for Easton and TBP. Good for them. It should be noted, in Easton’s case it has taken him most of the year to get there, even with his radio success and other advantages in the country environment. TBP’s success has been much faster after their album release, possibly on their way to a gold debut CD? I like both of them.

    Don’t have much interest in Jerrod although it was quite a hoot watching the ACA pre-shows where Jerrod came on screen to do a quick interview and.never.ever.left.the.camera.view. Lol.

  • gangreen29

    nowing you guys as I do, I told my RCA and 19 colleagues we should probably expect an unusually high number of folks ordering 3, maybe 4 copies, but not even I expected some of you to order 10 or more!

    This is so interesting to me. This quote seems to go even beyond the EP. The mod seems to be implying that Adam fans buy everything at an unusually high rate of multiple purchases. I think this is something that has long been suspected by most. My gut tells me many of the male idols have an unusually high rate of multiple purchases per fan, a rate that intuition tells me is not shared by fans of female idols.

  • windmills

    steph6449: Hopefully there is breadth enough in the country market, IMO, for anyone who likes the genre to be satisfied.

    The country MARKET as you put it is a good way of looking at it. The country market is even broader than country music. Danny’s one of those acts who’s in the country market but he hasn’t made country music (my opinion but also what was expressed in the reviews of Danny’s album everywhere from Country Weekly to New York Times to Entertainment Weekly to People who all described his album as not being country). There’s always going to be all kind of acts in the country market (like it sounds like Crystal’s going to try) but as long as they’re not pretending to make country music or be country artists if they’re not, I can live with that.

  • Indigobunting

    There’s a lot of songs about sinning that are a core part of country music. Too, country music is defined by so much more than its values. It has a sound. It’s not like you can make a R&B song and just because it’s about God and family you can call it country.

    Well of course there are. No one said there aren’t songs about sinning. It is part of life. I said values and I’m pretty sure country music would not say its values are about sinning, lol! No one said values define country music either; they are just a well recognized feature of the music in general.

    You can’t deny the conservative values that permeate country music culture. See the Dixie Chicks. They are very familiar with it ;)

    And of course a genre is defined by more than values. Rock and Roll values individuality, freedom but it is about more than that too.

    And values are only one part of the picture. Yes, they are one reason Danny is happy in country music, but he is a good fit for many reasons. There is room for different types of country, just like there is room in Rock & Roll for different sounds. I’m glad there is room for the Toby Keith stuff (that Steph loves ;)) and room for the poppier stuff like Carrie and Lady A- that some purists even argue isn’t country.

    my opinion but also what was expressed in the reviews of Danny’s album everywhere

    Not true. Not everwhere. Plenty of reviews described his album as a good or decent country-pop album. I can certainly pull them all out; I have them bookmarked.

  • gangreen29

    The country MARKET as you put it is a good way of looking at it. The country market is even broader than country music. Danny’s one of those acts who’s in the country market but he hasn’t made country music (my opinion but also what was expressed in the reviews of Danny’s album everywhere from Country Weekly to New York Times to Entertainment Weekly to People who all described his album as not being country). There’s always going to be all kind of acts in the country market (like it sounds like Crystal’s going to try) but as long as they’re not pretending to make country music or be country artists if they’re not, I can live with that.

    This is an interesting distinction and I definitely agree with you. I may be stealing it to use on here lol!

  • CindyM

    This is so interesting to me. This quote seems to go even beyond the EP. The mod seems to be implying that Adam fans buy everything at an unusually high rate of multiple purchases. I think this is something that has long been suspected by most. My gut tells me many of the male idols have an unusually high rate of multiple purchases per fan, a rate that intuition tells me is not shared by fans of female idols.

    Based on info from fan sites of Kelly and Carrie, there are fans that buy multiple albums. I don’t think it’s limited to the guys. However, the rest of the comment by him was that the buy rate ended up being 1.6 per purchase, so obviously there were far more people who bought 1 CD than 10. I don’t know why he wouldn’t think that some people wouldn’t buy a $4.99 CD as a xmas gift. I bought 3. One for myself and 1 each for the two friends who went to the Denver show with me. They don’t follow him online and didn’t even know it was available and it was a nice surprise :)

  • Indigobunting

    The country MARKET as you put it is a good way of looking at it. The country market is even broader than country music.

    If it makes some happy to distinguish that way, I guess you can put plenty of artists in that category that appear on country award shows, get played on radio, are nominated for country awards (like Danny and Jaron both for Best Country Breakthrough Artist at the ACAs), etc. And there will be much arguing about who is truly country- not only Danny. And there always has been that same arguing, whether it is Keith, Carrie, Danny, Crystal, Kid Rock etc etc. Someone is always not country enough for someone, lol.

    At the end of the day, I guess I honestly don’t care if some say he is “in the country market” vs “country”. Danny is only marketed to the country market- not to pop or christian or rock. If people buy his album and attend his shows which so far they have been doing, and if he can make a living doing it, that is good enough for me.

  • CindyM

    But who defines who is pretending?? It seems from reading here that there are many country artists who have fully accepted Danny into the country fold. The Opry seems to have accepted him. Radio has been slower, but radio in all formats is often slow to Idols.

  • steph6449

    The country MARKET as you put it is a good way of looking at it. The country market is even broader than country music. Danny’s one of those acts who’s in the country market but he hasn’t made country music (my opinion but also what was expressed in the reviews of Danny’s album everywhere from Country Weekly to New York Times to Entertainment Weekly to People who all described his album as not being country). There’s always going to be all kind of acts in the country market (like it sounds like Crystal’s going to try) but as long as they’re not pretending to make country music or be country artists if they’re not, I can live with that.

    Other than a fringe site, I don’t recall reading reviews of Danny’s CD that explicitly said no-way, no-how this can’t remotely be considered anywhere within the outer boundaries of country music. But that sort of label-parsing / boundary protecting is more important to some reviewing audiences than others, I guess. Danny also has supporters in the Nashville / country music community, who encouraged him to go country and have reviewed his early efforts favorably.

    Danny is signed to a country label, doing country events, opening for major country acts, touring on his own to country venues, being played on country radio, performing and now writing songs with country songwriters, living in Nashville where he recently bought a home, etc. For some, he will never satisfy the requisite purity tests to be considered a country artist. Others will be more open to it, or they simply won’t care about those kinds of distinctions if they like the music.

    Anyway, I’m happy he is nearing the 200,000 level for his album sales and it continues active on the country BBD chart. Look forward to hearing his next single and album #2.

    You can’t deny the conservative values that permeate country music culture. See the Dixie Chicks. They are very familiar with it ;)

    heh.

    And of course a genre is defined by more than values. Rock and Roll values individuality, freedom but it is about more than that too.

    sex, drugs and ??

    And values are only one part of the picture. Yes, they are one reason Danny is happy in country music, but he is a good fit for many reasons. There is room for different types of country, just like there is room in Rock & Roll for different sounds. I’m glad there is room for the Toby Keith stuff (that Steph loves ) and room for the poppier stuff like Carrie and Lady A- that some purists even argue isn’t country.

    Aww. Yeah, Toby is awesome, lol.

  • gangreen29

    Based on info from fan sites of Kelly and Carrie, there are fans that buy multiple albums.

    Of course there are, every artist has some fans that buy multiple albums. I never said they didn’t. I just have a pretty good feeling it is not at an “unusually high” rate that the RCA Mod admits Adam fans buy at though.

  • steph6449

    But who defines who is pretending?? It seems from reading here that there are many country artists who have fully accepted Danny into the country fold. The Opry seems to have accepted him. Radio has been slower, but radio in all formats is often slow to Idols

    I’ve been very pleased with how Danny has been received at country events and by country artists and audiences.

    The pretending question is interesting. In the long run, the audiences and music/ticket buyers will decide hopefully, not would-be country gatekeepers. Danny is positioning and describes himself as a country recording artist, certainly. But he also is honest about being new to the genre coming out of a background singing gospel (church) music; and describes his sound as non-”cookie cutter” and very soulful in interpreting and singing country songs. I don’t see that as pretending, he is just taking his own approach, for which there are some past precedents by successful country artists (Wynonna for one).

    Personally, there are country artists I do find to be pretenders or at least pretentious. Jaron for one with the goofy name which annoys me no end, lol. And a certain other Wisconsinite who sings with a twang that I’ve read and been reliably told is not native to his home area; nor is much about the pretty raw backwoods type lifestyle he sings about. Is he a phony? I wouldn’t be that harsh. But I wouldn’t say he is being all that authentic to his real background, either, from what I understand.

  • car

    A sale is a sale and it all adds up. Idols and non-idols want people to buy their product. Nothing new about that. If they don’t buy your product then there is reason worry. It is not the other way around. Last Christmas I bought 5 Tokio Hotel CDs and I don’t like them. But the 13 and 14 year old relatives who received them as gifts were over the moon.

  • smeggingnuts

    Of course there are, every artist has some fans that buy multiple albums. I never said they didn’t. I just have a pretty good feeling it is not at an “unusually high” rate that the RCA Mod admits Adam fans buy at though.

    But then how is Adam any differant than them. Just because they are more vocal on social media? Hell I remember X-tina’s album started to tank and was getting horrible media attention some BSC fan bought almost 300 copies of it and made some sort of shrine in her house to show how awesome the album was.

    I don’t think Adam is any differant the every idol with a hardcore fan base. Or any differant from and artist with a hardcore fan base. You should see the stuff from Gaga and Beiber fans

  • gangreen29

    But then how is Adam any differant than them. Just because they are more vocal on social media?

    Yes? It stands to reason that the fan bases that post all day everyday about one person are the ones with the tendency for multiple purchases. Also, I’ve never seen any kind of mention from moderators at Kelly or Carrie or Fantasia or Jordin fansites that their fans buy in “unusually high” numbers. You don’t see people posting about seeing them 12 times in concert, and you don’t see many people who seem to have crafted online identities solely around Kelly, Carrie, Fantasia or whoever. It isn’t hard to see that male idols seem to attract these obsessive fans in much higher rates.

  • smeggingnuts

    Kelly Carrie and Fantasia all also arn’t at involved as some of the male idols in social media. The fans go where their favorite is. Archie, Cook, Kris, Adam all are very active in social media have various ways to interact with them through the internet.

    Twitter has become an instant way to access the artists, labels, managment, radio stations, and online media. If you went by online activity and fan poles one would think that Archie has a gigantic fan base but from his recent album sales we can see this isn’t so.

    Maybe if Kelly Carrie and Fantasia were more active in twitter or FB then you would see these kind of things too.

    There is also the fact that those 3 have been out of idol for quite awhile and have lost the fervency that comes the year or two after idol. *see Archie again

    Even in the last year I have noticed a cooldown on the online spamming of Adam fans. You may not see that if you don’t follow him but true no the less.

  • HR

    I would have to disagree with the idea Carrie and Kelly don’t attract obsessive fans at high rates. They do, I’ve seen them in action. The difference is that you won’t find many of them on Idol boards or the official SONY websites designated for their favorites. They’ve moved to different locations online. They can be found if you know where to look.

    All popular “Idol’s” have a high rate of fanatics regardless of gender. In time passions cool a little. They all have campaigns to move sales of their CD’s but over the years the number of people who engage in it becomes less and less.

  • certain1

    Easton Corbin’s at 292k according to Roughstock and The Band Perry’s at 276k. Easton will get by 300k in 2 weeks and The Band Perry will either get there this week or next week. Also with one more sales week like this one Jerrod Niemann will probably also pass Danny’s sales so that’d be another new act from 2010 to sell more than him without the AI advantage.

    Maybe not the AI advantage, but definitely the radio advantage. RCA does not seem be too concerned about the radio aspect as none of their artist are burning up the waves nor the sales charts with the exception of Chris Young, who start was not that great. They seem to be a label that is willing to work with the strength of there artist, the wind-shouters be damned.

    Thank you CMA, CMT, THe Grand Old Opry for being open enough to realize that good music is just that.

  • windmills

    steph6449: Personally, there are country artists I do find to be pretenders or at least pretentious. Jaron for one with the goofy name which annoys me no end, lol.

    But Jaron has never pretended to be country. He’s done interviews where he talked about how the music he does hasn’t really changed from his pop but country’s the only place that will play his kind of pop music. He said where he markets himself is fan-led. I don’t like his album but I respect him for being up front about who he is.

    CindyM: But who defines who is pretending?? It seems from reading here that there are many country artists who have fully accepted Danny into the country fold. The Opry seems to have accepted him. Radio has been slower, but radio in all formats is often slow to Idols.

    The Opry has invited plenty of non-country acts to play there and to an increased level in the past year. And there are plenty of non country acts who are friendly with and play alongside country acts – I don’t think it means they think you’re playing country music. Kid Rock is a good example and probably the most successful one.

    Country radio has welcomed Josh Gracin, Carrie, Kellie, and Bucky out of the gate with top 20 hits (top 10 for everybody except Kellie). Country radio’s always easier on new acts if they’re male. The AIs with major label support who didn’t get top 20 hits out of the gate are Phil Stacey who moved to Christian contemporary, Kristy Lee Cook, and Danny. By the way I’m counting Lyric Street as a major because Disney sure isn’t indie!

    As far as who decides who is pretending and who’s not, I think there’s a conventional wisdom out there that’s tough to define and that’s what Danny’s hit up against as he’s discussed. It’s not just the radio gatekeepers. There’s plenty of acts who don’t satisfy the purists but at the same time people know if you have a real country voice and/or if you’re making genuine country music versus if you’re really only in the country market for marketing purposes. It’s true that Carrie’s music doesn’t satisfy all purists but some of that is frustration that she’s a natural traditional country singer that you can hear in some of her music and live performances and people feel she should move more in that direction.

    It’s tougher for the people like Danny who are considered to fall into ‘marketing purposes’ group. He’s been up against that since the beginning when his hometown program director gave an interview saying he didn’t see Danny as a long term country act and that he fit the Christian contemporary genre better.

  • jpfan

    Females probably have obsessive fans as well. They just don’t seem to frequent Idol boards. I think if some 40 year old guy followed Carrie or Crystal around the country his wife would be looking for a divorce lawyer or a shrink. ;) For some reason, it’s more ok when women do it.

  • mmb

    Of course there are, every artist has some fans that buy multiple albums. I never said they didn’t. I just have a pretty good feeling it is not at an “unusually high” rate that the RCA Mod admits Adam fans buy at though.

    RCA mod was just referring to sales of the acoustic ep (there is no indication that there has been an unusually high rate of multiple buying for the regular cd or any of the other eps)….and it shouldn’t be that surprising that the rate of multiple sales was high in light of the fact that it was released smack in the middle of the holiday season and the one and only place a hard copy of the cd could be purchased was the website. I have no doubt that plenty of people walked into a best buy or wherever and bought 10 speak now cds for all of their nieces for christmas, or 5 subos for their grandmas and great aunts etc. In fact, i bought multiple copies of both beiber and swifty’s cds to give as gifts to various tween-relatives this holiday season (don’t judge me! i also gave them adams ep)

    ETA: there are definitely some obsessive Carrie and Kelly fans over on pulse

  • Katniss

    Just wondering when fans buying multiple copies of ANYTHING became an actual problem, especially during the holiday season.
    Also, not loving the comments here comparing male/female fan bases. Misogyny much?
    Bottom line is that Adam’s acoustic CD was marketed towards his hard-core fans and AO was the only place available to buy the hard copy CD. Not a fan of that place for many reasons, but to not have the CD’s ready to ship, then blaming the fans for buying TOO MANY is just ridiculous.

  • lorismile

    I just have a pretty good feeling it is not at an “unusually high” rate that the RCA Mod admits Adam fans buy at though.

    I think it’s a few fans buying the 10 CDs. I don’t think that’s the norm.

  • tinawina

    The man said “unusually high”. Meaning yes fans of other artists buy multiple copies, but this fanbase did it more than usual. They expected some holiday multiple copy buying. Adam’s fans bought MORE THAN OTHER FANS. What is there to argue about? LOL. Its not the same as everyone else, that’s what he said. Period.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if its not unusual for a handful of the other Idols though.

    Adam has a passionate fanbase. Big surprise. LOL

  • Indigobunting

    Country radio has welcomed Josh Gracin, Carrie, Kellie, and Bucky out of the gate with top 20 hits (top 10 for everybody except Kellie).

    And Kellie and Bucky’s last didn’t make it out of the 30′s-and? And Josh- not sure if his last even made the top 40. Yes, he’s on an indie label now, but where did his “country cred” get him. Affecting a twang isn’t pretending? It will get you farther on radio presumably (Gwyneth, Josh Thompson) but it is more “pretending” in my book than singing country topics in an untraditional voice.

    And Danny’s debut made it to #22, not #20-and?

    Of course he is going to have a rougher time on radio- he is less traditional than the rest. I don’t call that being a “pretender”.
    Jaron marketed his song to pop, Danny will not.

    It’s true that Carrie’s music doesn’t satisfy all purists but some of that is frustration that she’s a natural traditional country singer that you can hear in some of her music and live performances and people feel she should move more in that direction.

    That is your opinion. I read traditionalists who call her names and think she shouldn’t be there, so even Carrie undeniably has her “not country cred” critics.

    But Danny is giving it his best shot without being a “pretender”, IMO. It is more a matter of him saying “this is who I am, take me or leave me”. I don’t think he is “pretending” anything.

    Re multiple purchasers. I think all fan bases do it, although Adam’s are probably the biggest multiple purchasers from impressions I have.

    But I kind of admire them for that. They vote a lot and buy a lot. Good for Adam. Danny fans can be complacent, I wish they would be a little more proactive sometimes.

  • artemis

    I agree, Indigobunting; since when is having passionate fans who buy multiple copies of an artist’s CD and introduce his music to other people a problem? Especially in these days of declining sales for most artists.

  • car

    I’m still not understanding the Adam fans are the most multiple buyers. How in the world would anyone know that? Is it because he sold more that the last crop of idols so you hope that is the reason or beacuse you’ve heard someone somewhere say they bought a lot? Adam has sold 775,000 in the states. Who is keeping track of the #of the multiple buyers? And I am not talking about Ed and the EP.

    Wasn’t there a time early on that Shania and Faith Hill were also having a hard time as not really being country?

  • JazzRocks

    Adam has a passionate fanbase. Big surprise. LOL

    And most performers (if not all) who become very successful have passionate fan bases. A ho-hum fan base does not a star make.

  • windmills

    Indigobunting: And Kellie and Bucky’s last didn’t make it out of the 30’s-and? And Josh- not sure if his last even made the top 40. Yes, he’s on an indie label now, but where did his “country cred” get him.

    I was responding to CindyM‘s comment that radio is slower to embrace Idols across all formats by showing that a number of Idols have done great on country radio out of the box. The fact is Josh scored 3 top 5 hits off his debut album, Bucky scored 2 top 10 hits and a #11 hit off his debut, and Kellie scored 3 top 20 hits including 2 top 15 hits. Josh followed up with a top 10 hit while caught up in label issues, Bucky got caught up in label issues, and Kellie successfully followed her debut album with her first top 10 hit and 2 more top 20 hits.

    Indigobunting:
    That is your opinion. I read traditionalists who call her names and think she shouldn’t be there, so even Carrie undeniably has her “not country cred” critics.

    Never said she didn’t. However my point was about the conventional wisdom in country music. That has worked out in Carrie’s favor because most people recognize that she has a real country voice with a real appreciation of country music history. Too, she does include more traditional country music on her albums and in her live performances. Those things have undeniably helped her get where she is in country music today, just like Kellie Pickler’s natural country voice have helped her to establish herself in the genre, and just like Josh and Bucky’s genuine country voices helped them to gain initial acceptance as country artists.

    car: Wasn’t there a time early on that Shania and Faith Hill were also having a hard time as not really being country?

    Both of them started out with music that was country before branching out and remixing. The criticisms they faced for going pop didn’t come until after they were very well established.

  • tinawina

    I’m still not understanding the Adam fans are the most multiple buyers. How in the world would anyone know that?

    The guy said the EP was brought at an unusually high rate. We are only talking about the EP. No one said he had “the most” ever, period. He has more then usual, enough to be called “unusual”. I don’t get what the problem is.

    Is it because he sold more that the last crop of idols so you hope that is the reason or becase you’ve heard someone somewhere say they bought a lot?

    That is conjecture. No one said all of that. No one said all his records sales were from fans buying multiple copies. What you are doing is assuming that people who comment on what HIS GUY SAID are thinking that, when no one said that.

    What I said was he has a passionate fanbase, so I am not surprised that they may have a high multiple buying rate for this EP.

  • toonces1966

    While Danny may not have been a country artist on Idol (although he did sing three country songs), he never sold out of another genre–like a few other “country artists” have done (Jessica Simpson, lol). Sure, he sang gospel in church, but he was never even a Christian Contemporary artist–having never recorded an album in his life until My Best Days. I find nothing wrong with the fact he wanted to reach out to a broader market than CCM would have allowed him to do, and the country genre has proven to be right in his wheelhouse, even if it’s not traditional country. Danny loves the genre and has said so many times–and he’s well respected enough to have been invited back to sing at the Opry 5 times.

    While purists may find fault with his soulful, non-twangy singing style, at least he’s bringing something new to the genre. Darius Rucker also has a soulful, non-twangy voice, and he started out as a rocker. So how is Danny’s situation different from Darius’s? His album also got overwhelmingly good to great reviews from legitimate reviewers from Billboard and The New York Times (who called IWNSGB “devastating.”) MBD may not have spawned any huge hits, but seems to be still selling steadily and looks like it may hit 200,000 albums sold before the year is out. RCA even posted a press release today heralding Danny as the highest selling debut artist from Idol this year–obviously they believe in Danny and his potential and have as high hopes for him as his fans do.
    He’s come a very long way.

  • asics85

    I agree toonces…I had been trying to place who reminded me of Danny when I heard him on the radio, and I believe it is Darius Rucker.

    I am a new listener to Country music (brought to it as a fan of Danny), so I don’t really get the whole argument of who is “real” country and who isn’t….I will leave that debate to others. I just know what I like to listen to, and I have been pleasantly surprised by the diversity I have found within the country music genre. I am more drawn to artists that lean to the country-pop sound (Danny, Darius, Keith Urban, Carrie are a few) as opposed to the more traditional artists I have heard (maybe twang is an acquired taste?)

    I love the music Danny has put out, and it is obvious he is very happy with his decision to make country music, so as far as this fan is concerned it is all good. Without a doubt Danny’s fans are thrilled with the incredible year he has had and hoping for even bigger things in 2011!

  • windmills

    toonces1966: So how is Danny’s situation different from Darius’s?

    It’s actually very different. Darius famously wrote an album of VERY traditional country music that his Nashville label head told him he had to tone down a little. Darius also blew people away at the Opry with traditional country covers that left no doubt about his knowledge and ability to do real country. His singles have been more contemporary but both his albums have at least a couple songs that lean more traditional. It’s a big part of why Darius has been accepted so quickly into country music.

    It’s also REALLY distorting things to call the reviews of Danny’s album “overwhelmingly good to great”. His album reviews were mediocre to decent and I say that based on the national publication reviews from Country Weekly, the NY Times, Entertainment Weekly (which, like it or not, is a respected publication), and People, all of which had variations of the statement that they did not think the music on the album was country. Billboard’s “reviews” aren’t usually reviews in the traditional sense and they accept the marketing tags for albums as their genres.

  • steph6449

    It’s also REALLY distorting things to call the reviews of Danny’s album “overwhelmingly good to great”. His album reviews were mediocre to decent and I say that based on the national publication reviews from Country Weekly, the NY Times, Entertainment Weekly (which, like it or not, is a respected publication), and People, all of which had variations of the statement that they did not think the music on the album was country.

    While I agree “overwhelmingly good to great” is a considerable overstatement, people will differ with respect to what they take away from reading reviews of any artist. Particularly their favorite, or, as the case may be, their anti-favorite. Distortions can arise from a number of perspectives.

    Danny did get some positive feedback in his reviews, and some more average; very little that was overall strongly negative except on one or two fringe sites that I recall.

    Not all the reviewers engaged in the labeling game over genre match; most of whom who did, struck me as reflecting their own biases more than anything else. The NYT guy, who for the NYT had a generally positive review including the “devastating” remark for IWNSG, did make some references about not seeing MBD as mainstream country. But he was coming from the view of seemingly wanting Danny to do Christian music, not as a guardian of country music purity. Seemed to go back to citing Danny’s background as a church music director, and to that reviewer’s apparent great love for Danny’s performance of JTTW. He’s entitled to have that viewpoint and put it in his review, but it didn’t make any sense to me based on either Danny’s AI performances or the songs on MBD. JTTW is the only song with overt Christian references that Danny even did on AI, and not a CCM song in any event, plus to me it wasn’t even among Danny’s best AI performances whether that NYT guy loved it so much or not ;)

    The EW review (B-) wasn’t awful, which I recall pretty clearly, haha — that was viewed as quite a victory at the time given the appalling history of how Danny had been treated at EW through Idolatry etc. He even describes MBD as country (“mall-country”, but hey, this is EW).

    Anyway, at this point I’m not all that concerned with reviews for MBD which has been out for 9 months and sold nearly 200,000 copies at this point. Will be much more interested to see what album #2 sounds like and how it does.

  • JosieX

    Country Weekly gave Danny 3.5 out of 5 stars, and that is between “Good” and “Outstanding” on their scale. On the same page, Steel Magnolia got 3 and Alan Jackson got 4.

    I can do some more later, have to run but will bbl.

  • Indigobunting

    However my point was about the conventional wisdom in country music.

    Again, your opinion. There is no “conventional wisdom”.

    I was responding to CindyM’s comment that radio is slower to embrace Idols across all formats by showing that a number of Idols have done great on country radio out of the box.

    I took Cindy’s comment to mean currently. Certainly radio appears less friendly in general, in some people’s opinion. Even with the media love for Adam and high profile songwriters, he hasn’t cracked the top 10 in pop. Maybe Casey will shoot right to the top 5, IDK.

    His singles have been more contemporary but both his albums have at least a couple songs that lean more traditional.

    Danny has never pretended to be a traditional artist.

    It’s also REALLY distorting things to call the reviews of Danny’s album “overwhelmingly good to great”. His album reviews were mediocre to decent

    Agreed on the “not good to great” part but they were definitely overall positive. I was actually surprised. Especially by the snarky NYT reviewer. I think his review of Danny’s album was actually much better than Adam’s. Calling IWNSGB devastating and CNT a “proper love song” is high praise from that guy, lol. And when I see Crystal and Lee’s reviews from some of the same people I think Danny’s were quite good!
    Yes, Josie the Country Weekly review was quite good. Being rated above Steel Magnolia and right below Alan Jackson is not a bad thing ;) .And yeah EW tried to be snarky, but actually came off positive I thought. Danny got a B-. Heck Blake Shelton only got a B, lol! And Easton, new artist of the Year, heralded, lol, only got a B+. Pretty decent for an AI gospel guy, IMO. And there were some major newspapers that were quite favorable. Even Howard Cohen (who hated Danny on the show and was an Adam stan) gave him a decent to good review, even as he admitted he’s not a Danny fan.

    and to that reviewer’s apparent great love for Danny’s performance of JTTW.

    Yes, lol, he said Danny “smashed Carrie’s rendition to smithereens” or some very colorful statement in the review article. He seemed kinda ticked Danny didn’t go CCM-must be a fan of the genre.

  • steph6449

    Yes, lol, he said Danny “smashed Carrie’s rendition to smithereens” or some very colorful statement in the review article. He seemed kinda ticked Danny didn’t go CCM-must be a fan of the genre.

    Yeah, he was quite the NYT fanboy for Danny over JTTW, lol. His quote from the MBD review I linked above:

    Last year Danny Gokey placed third on ”American Idol,” his transcendent moment coming early in the competition, when he covered Carrie Underwood’s ”Jesus, Take the Wheel” in a roaring, pained, audacious performance that almost shattered the original.

    Despite Danny and his music being ~oh-so-not-country-enough for some, it was fun today to see him included in articles at three separate country music sites :)

    I’ve been pretty pleased with how they’ve been keeping his name out there in a lull before his new music will be ready for release, and he’s ready to hit the tour circuit again. Hope that will help when his new single is ready to go.

  • toonces1966

    I remember that review over JTTW–and even as a Danny fan I had to scratch my head over that. It wasn’t one of his better performances IMO. I do seem to recall the Times reviewer lamenting that there weren’t more ballads on his album since he seemed to love those best. I also got a kick out of his comparison of Danny to a “melodic Henry Rollins” (yeah, I can kind of see it) on the Idols 8 tour.

    The most muscular vocalist “Idol” has seen in some years, Danny Gokey, came alive on the Rascal Flatts songs “What Hurts the Most” and “My Wish,” shouting the refrains like a melodic Henry Rollins.

    The writer’s clearly a fan of Danny’s voice but seemed underwhelmed by Kris. This is a huge compliment to Danny from a snooty New York newspaper that prides itself on being culturally savvy. Here is the entire review. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/11/arts/music/11idols.html

  • car

    So the answer to my question is that nobody knows how many fans buy multiple copies of anyting. But it is a good thing if someone does. I’m sure every artist would hope for that. Those who have passionate fanbases generally do better than those who do not.