George Zimmerman: Not Guilty of Murder in Trayvon Martin Death

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Those of you following the Trayvon Martin case. A verdict has come in. From CNN.

George Zimmerman is not guilty of the murder of Trayvon Martin, a Florida jury decided late Saturday.

The fact that Zimmerman fired the bullet that killed Martin was never in question, but the verdict means the six-person jury had reasonable doubt that the shooting amounted to a criminal act.

The verdict caps a case that has inflamed passions for well over a year, much of it focused on race and gun rights.

The six-person jury — all women — basically had three choices: to find Zimmerman guilty of second-degree murder; to find him guilty of the lesser charge of manslaughter; or to find him not guilty.

The jurors deliberated for 16½ hours total, including 13 on Saturday alone, before delivering its verdict.

I’m not surprised I knew the jury would not be able to convict him beyond a reasonable doubt with the instructions given and evidence presented to them.

The verdict still stinks, though.

 
  • Joob

    What a sad day…

  • MichaelG (MikhailXO)

    A teenager goes out to buy iced tea and skittles. Comes home dead. Nobody pays.
    Seems wrong…or is it just me? Sad…

  • MichaelG (MikhailXO)

    indeed.

  • esther macha

    So sad.

  • weareallinnocent

    Yes, the verdict stinks. As does the FL law that allows you to follow an unarmed teen, start a fight, and then use deadly force against the unarmed teen with a gun you brought to the fight you started in a situation you created and could easily have avoided.

  • Connie

    Not just you. It is wrong. RIP Trayvon.

  • Wfish88

    Prosecution put on a poor case, so doesn’t surprise me. Travon wasn’t an all great kid. He was described as a troubled kid in school, and had pictures of guns and weed on his phone. This case was over blown, too much politics- including Obama’s comments on the Zimmerman before they went to trial & the police officer who was FIRED for not arresting Zimmerman….. No winner in this case, it’s just I’m not surprised

  • Kesia Monteith

    I have never felt more confused, sad and angry about an American Trial verdict in my life. What can I say, life can be so unfair :(

  • Miles (Grumpy) (VI)

    Very sad case. Six people looked at the evidence with the entire country watching them to see what was decided, What would you all have had them do?

  • Niall

    The prosecution did more for Zimmerman than the defense. What a terrible case they presented. How horrendous that an armed adult can stalk an unarmed teenager, kill the teenager, and somehow be the victim. What a sad day.

  • Dianne

    Trayvon had pictures og guns on his phone? So what, he wasn’t carrying one, Zimmerman was. And weed? OMG, what has that got to do with being killed by a wanna be cop who incidentally had his own checkered past.

  • stef

    I really hate when a local issue becomes sensationalized and used as fodder for people pushing various agendas or for tv ratings as happened with this one.

    As far as the local case, they all have my sympathies but glad it at least reached a resolution through the legal process.

    I was put in a position last year to be a juror on a multi-week murder trial which resulted in a hung jury, and it was by far one of the most stressful situations I’ve ever had to deal with. Still gives me stress reactions thinking about it.

  • jan

    You shouldn’t get to kill someone because they are not a “great kid”. He was a kid – he was walking without a weapon – he was attacked – he defended himself. Florida as F’ed up laws.

  • Wfish88

    I’m just saying that its not like Travon had a great reputation. Nor does Zimmerman.

  • Sassycatz

    So … I guess this means Zimmerman goes right back out on the street, stalking unarmed people and killing them.

  • Wfish88

    Not what I’m saying.

  • Connie

    All kids have to have time to grow up. He needed a bit of direction and time, which he longer has. That age is confusing to everyone. He did not deserve to be dead.

  • HermeticallySealed

    Maybe he and Casey Anthony can start a club.

  • CB40

    I haven’t watched any of this case, but I will say this:

    With such a media frenzy, why even let them announce the verdict on a Saturday night?

  • Bugme Nomor

    The prosecution didn’t take it to a grand jury in the beginning because they were unlikely to return an indictment.

  • Miss Blue

    It also means you’re going to be seeing a whole lot more George Zimmermans, aka murderers.

    This country is so fucked.

  • Miss Blue

    Gee, how about not letting off a stalker who killed an unarmed kid? That would have been a start.

  • Miss Blue

    Don’t even go there. So Trayvon deserved to be shot in cold blood because he wasn’t a saint? Jesus H. Christ. So I guess we can now stalk and shoot any kid who isn’t the right color just because they aren’t “an all great kid”.

    My god. Let me out of this asylum.

  • usedtobelucy

    Not just you. Completely wrong.

    How could it possibly be within the rights of the guy carrying the gun and following somebody who was simply walking to a house he had a right to go to, to *kill*, when it supposedly wasn’t within the rights of the person who was being followed for no reason to make any attempt to defend himself unarmed (if he even *did* attempt to defend himself)? Oh, wait — the unarmed person being followed was a black kid. So of course the guy got off. Disgusting.

    Of course, juries, under the influence of too many tv shows, also want Perry Mason moments before they convict people. I’ve been on enough juries to have seen that in operation. It’s another very bad thing about our courts.

    But I’m still finding this an unbelievable outcome. All logic just seems to scream against it.

  • Amy Beth

    The prosecution put on a poor excuse of a case. I don’t blame the jury here.

    Wonder if the family will pursue a civil case for damages.

  • Tinawina

    I’m surprised you posted this MJ.

    I’m not surprised at the verdict. The prosecution was pretty bad.

    I’m afraid I will never be able to let my son out of my sight once he hits the age where people are scared of him. What am I supposed to say? Don’t buy skittles? Never mean mug in Facebook pictures? Be perfect at all times, or people will feel like you deserved it?

    Ugh.

  • flog gnaw

    I blame prosecution, they sucked. Now we have a murderer on the streets, f*cking great, right? I don’t predict him living long tho.

  • usedtobelucy

    ‘I’m just saying that its not like Travon had a great reputation.”

    So I can kill anyone, unprovoked, who doesn’t have a great reputation — and get off scot free? That should mean I can take out about half the population without risking jail time, if that’s the principle we’re using.

  • flog gnaw

    Ok, watch out everyone! If you have pictures of guns and weed on your phone, you’re getting shot!!!!111!1

  • Wfish88

    Once again. Like I said I the response below. I’m not saying he deserved to be shot because he wasn’t a perfect kid. I’m just saying, Travon, based on his reputation/past, COULD have done this. If he had a clean and good reputation, It would have been harder to believe Travon woulld have tried to kill/harm Zimmerman

  • ajr86

    Would you be sad if Trayvon was white and Zimmerman was black? I don’t think so. I trust the jury with their decision even if they would have found him guilty. I’m glad that I don’t have to hear about this case 24 7 anymore.

  • Sassycatz

    Could have done what?

  • ajr86

    Oh stop with the Trayvon was this innocent kid. Very tragic that the kid died but he started up. The jury felt that Zimmerman was acting in self defense against this hoodlum. Case close . Move on.

  • usedtobelucy

    Trayvon could have done what?

  • resunikcufecin

    Except for the fact that Trayvon started the fight.

  • Sassycatz

    Started up what? Started up defending himself against an armed stalker? And *he* was the hoodlum?

  • Niall

    In a scenario where an adult black male with a gun stalked and killed an unarmed white
    teenager, there’s a strong likelihood the black adult male would be convicted.

  • marmom07

    No one saw who started the physical violence. The witnesses only saw the end of it. It’s zimmerman’s word against a dead teenager about who attacked who.

    Regardless Zimmerman provoked the incident by following and harassing the Trayvon to begin with. If zimmerman had waited for the police instead of persuing Trayvon then zimmerman would not have had to “defend” himself. He could have sat in his car with the doors locked.

  • usedtobelucy

    I’m sorry. I have quite a good reputation. And if somebody armed were stalking me for no good reason, I might very well be moved to try to confront that person, depending on the circumstances. And it appears that you’re saying that turning around and confronting some jerk who’s stalking you when you’re walking home minding your own business makes *you* the criminal? On what possible logic is that the case?

    And how come the stalker gets to say he’s “standing his ground” but the stalked does *not* get to say that? Seems to me that, if anything, the truth is completely the other way around.

    Sick.

    And very hard to imagine not influenced by who was which race, in this situation.

  • LeahKittyS

    I would like this comment if I wasn’t furious at the American legal system right now. (I refuse to call it a justice system, as there is sadly no justice to be found.)

  • Niall

    If I’m being followed by some strange guy on a dark street who has a gun and is telling me to stop, when do I have the right to stand MY ground and defend myself? That seems to be the scenario here, and yet somehow Zimmerman was in the right?

  • marmom07

    There is no evidence that Trayvon started the physical fight. Only Zimmerman’s word. The eye witnesses only saw the end.

  • Miss Blue

    Ding! Ding! Ding! And we have a winner!

    If George Zimmerman was black he’d be sitting his ass down in Seminole County Jail as we speak, waiting for his ride to the big house. Where he would spend the next 30 years or more.

  • MichaelG (MikhailXO)

    Eh…some people feel justice wasn’t served when an unarmed kid is shot down on his way home from a convenience store. Hard to simply “move on” for many. Good for you that you’re able to “move on” so effortlessly.

  • No Thanks

    According to Reverend Al Sharpton the family has already filed a civil case. So Zimmerman has that coming.

  • resunikcufecin

    I guess you missed the part where Trayvon ATTACKED Zimmerman. He broke his nose, smashed his head in the pavement, and threatened to kill him. I don’t want to live in a country where I don’t have the right to defend myself against that kind of attack.

  • LeahKittyS

    Thank you MJ for posting about the biggest issues in the nation in addition to the music show and reality show coverage. Words cannot express how furious I am at the Florida court right now, especially since many other states probably aren’t much better. A boy goes on trial for his own murder and his killer walks away without a sentence. I feel sick.

  • Miss Blue

    Even if that was correct, which is far from provable, he was stalked. I would have done far more than Trayvon did. But then again, I’m white so it’s allowed.

  • marmom07

    nvm

  • Joob

    Yes. I would have. How dare you make that assumption about me…

  • Miles (Grumpy) (VI)

    Apparently you have evidence they didn’t have. Not excusing him… but I wasn’t there. Have to trust somebody in this mess.

  • Miss Blue

    Florida called – they miss you.

  • Miss Blue

    You poor thing. I’m sure this has been very tough on you.

  • No Thanks

    I guess you missed the part where Zimmerman profiled and cased the boy and went after him even after the 911 operator told him NOT to follow the boy.

    Zimmerman created the situation he found himself in. He stalked an innocent boy based on a pre-conceived notion of all black men.

  • resunikcufecin

    The prosecutors can’t make up facts that don’t exist. The FACTS overwhelmingly show that Martin attacked Zimmerman in a way that justified deadly force.

  • supersonic

    I’m not even shocked. I knew from the get go that he was going to get off. This happened in Florida. That is a messed up state down there.

  • resunikcufecin

    Bullshit. Zimmerman did nothing wrong.

  • usedtobelucy

    I would be sad if anybody stalked and shot to death an unarmed person who was minding his/her own business and then managed to get off by arguing that the unarmed stalkee had actually been the aggressor. That’s pure crap, no matter what the nature of the people involved.

  • No Thanks

    You couldn’t pay me to live in Florida. The most fucked up state in the nation.

  • MichaelG (MikhailXO)

    Asinine comment. But I’ll turn it back on you anyway: Do you think Zimmerman would have been acquitted had he been black and Trayvon white?

  • iluvai

    I know this isn’t pressing for most posters, but why were there only 6 jurors? Is that normal?

  • Miss Blue

    Fact: Trayvon was stalked by Zimmerman, per 911 calls Zimmerman made which were recorded.

    Fact: Zimmerman was armed, Trayvon was not.

    Fact: One person is dead – the one without a weapon.

    And yep, the jury had that evidence. That’s what I put my trust in, not the vagaries of human thought processes.

  • Sassycatz

    And how was it justified that Zimmerman was stalking Trayvon with a gun, esp when the police told him to back off. This has been a pattern w/Zimmerman, profiling black men/boys around his neighborhood. We shouldn’t be living in a vigilante nation with wannabe cops shooting someone and getting away with it because that someone apparently doesn’t want to get shot!

  • Miss Blue

    That brilliant response has totally convinced me I am wrong.

  • marmom07

    There is no proof that Trayvon started the physical fight. If zimmerman got all up in Trayvon face and started pushing him around or trying to detain him for the police then Trayvon had every right to physically defend himself. It’?s only zimmermans word (unreliable, story changed multiple times) Trayvon attacked him out of the blue. Why would Tryavon give two rats asses about Zimmerman when he’s walking home with his tea and candy chatting on the phone with his girlfriend? I’m not saying it’s impossible but logic does not support Trayvon attacking Zimmerman unprovoked. In fact there is evidence that zimmerman was following and harassing Trayon FIRST.

  • Niall

    If Zimmerman doesn’t get out of his car wiith a gun and start stalking a teenager boy whose only crime was walking home and eating a bag of candy, there’s no fight. Wouldn’t you be scared if a stranger with a gun was following you. Again, tell me: where is Trayvon’s right to stand his ground if he felt threatened? And why does the person who created the situation, with his gun and unnecessary following/stalking of Trayvon, get to play victim? He instigated a situation, Trayvon defended himself, and it’s OK to shoot him?

  • Volveras

    Sorry I wasn’t following this case; So this kid get shot and dies…. they know the shooter that did it… the shooter goes on trial…shooter gets off scott free??
    Thats f’d up! Where is the justice?

  • Miss Blue

    Better check the Google along with Faux News, as Zimmerman had very superficial injuries, per the ER and police. NO broken nose. And threatened to kill him with what? a bag of skittles?

  • marmom07

    I was wondering the same thing

  • marmom07

    uhmm Texas? Very close!!

  • Amy Beth

    You can’t make up facts, but you can present them in a coherent way that strengthens your theory of the case. I’ll say it again, the prosecution did a crappy job.

  • weareallinnocent

    You can’t start a fight when you’re alone with no one else around, which is the situation in which found himself walking home minding his own business.

    Zimmerman also was alone, armed, and safely in his vehicle where all he needed to do to protect himself from the kid with the skittles and tea was to stay where he was, which is exactly what the police dispatcher told him to do.

    Zimmerman created the situation that he now relies upon to mount his defense. That’s why I blame the law the jurors had to grapple with. If interpreted to allow this sort of behavior and deadly force in this situation, it stinks and should be changed.

  • Amy Beth

    The other six got cut by the sequester. J/k

  • Frederick

    Very upset with this news :( No doubt in my mind that Zimmerman was guilty. I remember signing the petition for this to go to trial :(

  • marmom07

    very well said. That’s exactly how I see it. Zimmerman created the problem. My bet is Zimmerman tried to detain Trayvon and Trayvon defended himself from a stranger. Zimmerman got frightened and shot him. But with out any eye witnesses that saw they whole thing start to finish it’s zimmermans word against a dead boy.

  • chessguy99

    In the mid-60′s Florida reduced the number of jurors in non-capital cases to six. That was challenged, and upheld by the SCOTUS in the early 70′s.

  • Ronnie D

    I agree with the verdict. I also find it disgusting how some people already had him convicted and ready to be hung before he was even put on trial. I’ve been following this case closely and think the evidence shows what transpired that night.

  • Wfish88

    Chicago?

  • ajr86

    I apologize. I just can’t stand when people defend someone just because of the color of their skin. Black leaders like that dangerous man Al Sharpton are inciting race riots. If he was so concerned about blacks getting killed he should go to Chicago or Detroit.

  • iluvai

    Don’t get it.

  • Frederick

    Ignorance at it’s finest.

  • Ronnie D

    It’s f’d up to convict someone without “following the case.”

  • Ronnie D

    I agree, many ignorant people are quick to pass judgement and not use their critical thinking caps.

  • marmom07

    LOL yup. Furloughs!!

  • iluvai

    It sounds simple but it’s not so. It’s the law and the law isn’t always “fair”. It’s hard to understand, imo.

  • Tinawina

    I honestly don’t have the energy for this tonight. Think what you want to think. I’m going to go strategize about how to keep my kid or my husband from being shot by people who take one look and get scared. They can be aggressive, but he can’t. Lesson learned. Have a nice evening.

  • MB

    If George did not shot Trayvon, Trayvon will be the murderer walking in the streets. That’s just the way it is. I’m sad life was lost here but I’m not surprise with the verdict.

  • Ronnie D

    6 female jurors disagreed.

  • marmom07

    This case unfortunately hinged on whether or not you believe Zimmermans version of how the fight started. I don’t. As others have pointed out Neighborhood watch volunteers are simply supposed to watch and call the police. Zimmerman didn’t do that he went after the kid because in his words “They always get away”

  • ajr86

    I didn’t follow every step of this case but the fact is that Treyvon attacked Zimmerman and the jury felt that Zimmerman was acting in self defense. I would have been okay as well if the jury felt he was guilty. That is the court of law. I just find it tragic that people were hoping for a guilty verdict because of Trayvons race and are sad by this verdict because deep down they feel the jury must have been racist.

  • Amy Beth

    With hindsight, Zimmerman should have been charged with something like “interference with police activities” or whatever they call it in FL for his refusal to follow the direction of the 911 operator.

  • Sassycatz

    Yeah, Zimmerman tracked down and killed an unarmed black teen for no reason and esp after calling the police and being told to back off. He’s a dangerous vigilante who sees a criminal everytime he seems someone of color in his neighborhood.

  • Joob

    We do. Thanks.

  • marmom07

    how are you so sure that Trayvon would or could have killed zimmerman with his bare hands (plus tea and candy) in the few minutes before the police got there. Very unlikely.

  • Guest

    ..and don’t forget the iced tea he had.

  • flog gnaw

    I live in FL and I love it and hate it lol.

  • Sassycatz

    No, I was hoping for a guilty verdict because he shot an unarmed kid for no reason whatsoever!

  • Miles (Grumpy) (VI)

    This brings back to mind the O.J. Simpson trial when many thought the majority of the evidence pointed to him being guilty. He also was found innocent but in the end…. he was never free of it..

  • flog gnaw

    True. Can’t pay me enough to live in Englewood.

  • Ronnie D

    Yeah, there were previously reported break ins in the area. Zimmerman wasn’t on patrol that night either. Zimmerman did watch and was going to meet the police, whom he called before he “murdered” TM. I don’t know of any cold blooded killers that call the police before they kill someone. TM put his hands on GZ and started the altercation.

  • ajr86

    Zimmerman will likely never be able to enjoy a day in his life until he gets killed by a bloodthirsty black mob. When that happens, race baiters like Sharpton will have blood on their arms.

  • marmom07

    The key piece is who started the fight. We only have zimmermans word about who started the physical altercation. If zimmerman was trying to phyiscally restrain or intimidate Trayvon then Trayvon was actually defending himself not randomly attacking zimmerman.

  • thirdtime

    Every person in this country who is convicted of a crime has the right to a trial where the outcome is decided by a jury of their peers…even George Zimmerman. A jury of all women deliberated for over 16 hours before they decided they couldn’t find Zimmerman guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt. I respect their verdict, since I know it must have been a very difficult one for them to come by knowing the whole country was waiting for the outcome.

  • Stooch

    I feel terrible for Trevin’s family. My issues is with the “stand your ground Law” it’s self. There should be something in the law that if you are the cause of the altercation and a conflict ensues, you can’t hide behind the “fear for my life” defense. You pick a fight and when thing don’t go your way you shot the guy………that’s manslaughter at the very least

  • resunikcufecin

    Except the evidence (and the law) doesn’t support anything you said. Trayvon attacked a man who did nothing more than what thousands of “neighborhood watch” people do every day. Zimmerman had every right to follow a suspicious person in his neighborhood. If Trayvon wasn’t such an impulsive nitwit, he would still be alive.

  • marmom07

    There is only Zimmermans word that that’s what happened. No one saw Trayvon jump out and attack zimmerman unprovoked.

  • Ronnie D

    How can he be accused of “seeing a criminal every time he sees someone of color” when he didn’t even know what color he was when he first saw him? I think people who use this as a race issue should be ashamed of themselves. Especially since it ferments even more racism, which none of us need.

  • resunikcufecin

    What makes you think a grown man can’t commit murder with his fists? It happens every sngle day.

  • iluvai

    This is a horrible, sad, devastating case.

  • marmom07

    I don’t believe that Zimmerman planned or intended to actually kill Trayvon. But his behavior threatened Trayvon and when Trayvon fought back zimmerman panicked and used his gun. But that’s the problem with guns it’s too easy to actually kill someone.

  • Sassycatz

    It was reported that Zimmerman had been calling the police numerous times about suspicious people of color in his neighborhood. It was a pattern with him. He said, in pursuing Trayvon, that “they always get away.”

  • usedtobelucy

    Oh, my lord.

    Just because he’s a black kid, you’re assuming that he would *kill* in this situation. Because there can be only one reason,that I can figure out — and that’s Martin’s race — why you would assume that a person armed with iced tea and skittles would turn into a murderer in a minute, when he — unlike Zimmerman — clearly started out the evening *not* looking for trouble but merely looking for a snack.

    Zimmerman exhibited tons of signs of aggression that night. Martin none that are apparent until *after* somebody else started and escalated a dangerous situation. To me, that makes Z darned likely to end up killing somebody and M pretty unlikely to do so.

  • Ronnie D

    Advocating murder is despicable for anyone to do. If someone came out of the darkness at me and started using MMA style fighting on my face and bashing my head on the concrete, I would blow them away if I could too, to save my own life! I don’t see how people don’t get that.

  • resunikcufecin

    LOL. How did he get the broken nose and the head injuries?

  • Sassycatz

    Huh? I don’t know why the defense didn’t call you as a witness since you appear to have seen how it started.

  • Miss Blue

    “A bloodthirsty “black” mob”

    Well, you tipped your hand pretty clearly there.

  • marmom07

    yeah way more often the killing with a gun happens.

  • Ronnie D

    Go to WorldStarHipHop and look at all the fight videos there and see how horrible vicious they are. Now a days if you get into a fight you get stomped on the head, punched after your knocked out. TM also referred to GZ as a “creepy ass cracka. ” GZ didn’t use any racial epithets at all.

  • resunikcufecin

    Somebody “paid” alright. Trayvon attacked an innocent man on the street and (rightly) paid with his life.

  • Joob

    That’s simple. You can easily give those to yourself. Just saying.

  • marmom07

    No there was not enough evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that zimmerman was guilty.

  • Miss Blue

    I just can’t stand when people convict someone just because of the color of their skin.

  • iluvai

    I’m glad MJ posted this. It’s an important verdict. I’ll stop shy of lecturing, but everyone’s point of view is interesting. Hope that’s not over stepping.

  • marmom07

    No neighborhood watch people are told to NOT follow, or attempt to engage anyone.

  • Ronnie D

    Telling him to keep his hands to himself is a good start.

  • usedtobelucy

    This. 10,000 times.

  • iluvai

    What’s Scotus? Thanks for the reply.

  • Ronnie D

    During the trial I wondered why TM didn’t just go home instead of circling back to confront GZ. If he did then he would still be alive.

  • usedtobelucy

    You shouldn’t be able to claim self defense when you are the one following another person, who is unarmed, while you are carrying a loaded gun.

    Period.

  • Pippygirl

    Supreme Court of the United States

  • usedtobelucy

    If I confront somebody who’s been following me, with a gun, when I’m walking down the street with my Skittles, then I am *not* randomly attacking that person. I’m trying to defend myself against someone who is menacing me with a deadly weapon. …

    .”randomly attacking” v. “defending myself against deadly force.” Those seem quite different to me.

  • marmom07

    They are the result of a physical altercation but they do NOT prove who pushed, shove, restrained , shouted or what ever first. Besides those injuries were not life threatening. His nose was no broken.

    zimmerman got out of car and followed Trayvon behind the houses. what do you do when strangers are following you in the dark? Do you stand there and let them push you around. we can argue for ever about whether or not Trayvon over reacted to a stranger following him in the dark. But no one saw the begining. Zimmerman was told NOT to follow.

  • weareallinnocent

    But can’t the same be said of Zimmerman? Why did he get out of his car to follow Trayvon? Why didn’t he follow police direction to not do so? If he needed to follow for some reason, why not do so in his car? If he did, Trayvon would still be alive and Zimmerman could have avoided all of this turmoil.

  • Ronnie D

    TM had no other injuries besides the gunshot wound. If TM “fought back” against GZ’s attack then there would have been some sort of defensive injuries.

  • resunikcufecin

    That’s not how the legal system works. It isn’t up to the accused to prove his innocence. The state has to prove guilt and they failed spectacularly.

    You would’ve done more than Trayvon did? Against a man who never laid a finger on you? I hope you’re some kind of super woman, because you’ll be lucky to survive that encounter in one piece.

  • Stooch

    Bro Sean Hannity isn’t your friend, Trevin couldn’t tell us what he did and even he did ask GZ why he was following him, it doesn’t change the point of my OP. GZ engaged the issue from the start

  • marmom07

    that was the point I was trying to make.

  • marmom07

    just because there were no marks on Trayvon does not mean zimmerman didn’t “lay a finger on him”. Besides you don’t have to touch someone to assault them.

  • Ronnie D

    Even so, GZ didn’t know what race TM was when he was following him. It was dark and rainy plus TM had a hoodie on. TM however, did know what GZ race was, a “creepy ass cracka.” That’s racism to me, and even possibly a motive to attack GZ.

  • No Thanks

    You’re making assumptions. Assumptions based on preconceived notions. The fact is Zimmerman instigated the situation despite being told by the police NOT TO.

    He played vigilante. And unfortunately in Florida, that’s legal.

  • Ronnie D

    I’m going on the evidence presented in the case. It would be hard to see the evidence objectively if someone already has preconceived ideas of guilt. It comes down to reasonable doubt. And there was plenty IMO.

  • marmom07

    Oh you didn’t just say that!!! zimmerman was caught on tape saying derogatory things.

    Doesn’t matter what you see on fight videos they are immaterial in this case. Why was zimmerman following Trayon behind the houses? he was not by his vehicle or on the street.

    It’s clear you are predisposed to be afraid of the young man walking home. So you believe Zimmermans version of the events. It’s too bad Trayvon didn’t get the opportunity to present his version.

  • iluvai

    6 jurors seems like too few, imo.

  • No Thanks

    So you’re assuming because you’ve seen videos of other black men fighting, that must mean Trayvon must be the same way. You have a pre-conceived notion of all black men. THAT’S. RACISM.

  • Willis White

    IMO, the Prosecution did more harm than good on this case. Angela Corey should get tossed.

    The Prosecution never presented “their version” of what went down, and probably never had one. There was no alternate story for the jury to consider. They just tried to poke holes in GZ’s story, while at the same time calling witnesses that supported the Defense. Weird. It was almost like the State was throwing the case.

  • Ronnie D

    Some people think it’s ok to beat the crap out of someone and not have to deal with the ramifications.

  • marmom07

    I don’t believe for a minute that Trayvon circled back to do anything. That’s the part of the story there are no witnesses to. So that isn’t a fact it’s simply zimmermans version of events.

  • ajr86

    I’ll just add one more thing. The media was so invested in this case to spark racial tensions that they portrayed Zimmerman as a ruthless killer of an innocent kid. I say turn off MSNBC and CNN and turn on more centrist news organizations to get real facts.

  • marmom07

    I agree the prosecution did a very poor job.

  • resunikcufecin

    911 operators are not allowed to give direct orders for legal reasons. They can only give very general advice, and nobody is legally obliged to follow their advice because they aren’t law enforcement officers. The 911 operator in question testified as such at trial.

    Zimmerman didn’t “stalk” or follow Trayvon, and he had every right to do so even if he did. Following someone isn’t a crime. Had Trayvon handled the situation like an adult instead of an impulsive punk, he would still be alive.

  • Joob

    Stop.

  • Ronnie D

    I actually can’t stand Hannity.lol I just refused to have my judgment clouded by race or agendas. GZ was asked by the 911 operator if he saw the suspect. GZ was trying to find a street name to give to the police, whom he was on the phone with. Thats where there is a 4 minute window that TM had to make a decision. Go home since he felt threatened by this “Stalker” or turn around and confront him. I would have went home to my dad’s house if I felt someone was following me. I suspect that TM was angry he was being followed and attacked GZ.

  • marmom07

    You can be charged with assault with out actually touching someone. All you have to do is be threatening and make someone fear for their safety. Who knows what zimmerman said or how he acted towards Trayvon initially. Why? Because there are NO witnesses to how it started. Sure it’s possible that Trayvon over reacted to the threat he perceived from zimmerman. And zimmerman shot him out of fear. No one saw Trayvon jump out and attack zimmerman.

  • Miles (Grumpy) (VI)

    That brilliant response has totally convinced me I am wrong. Oh wait… you already said that to someone else.

  • Joob

    But you’ve already proved through your comments that you have preconceived ideas about black people…

  • Ronnie D

    Where?

  • marmom07

    how exactly did zimmerman get behind the houses away from his vehicle if he wasn’t following Trayvon? zimmerman would have no legitimate reason to be there. Trayvon did his was going home.

  • jan

    Nothing can bring back their dead child – but I hope the Martins file a civil suit. Don’t let Zimmerman profit from taking the life of their child. I think he would have to testify in a civil suit too. Let’s hear what the creep has to say.

  • Bugme Nomor

    The evidence mostly supported Zimmerman’s version of events, which he
    gave early on with no lawyer present. An investigator told GZ the fight had been videotaped. It was a bluff to gauge his reaction. GZ replied, “Thank God, I was hoping somebody would videotape it.”

  • Ronnie D

    It comes down to if GZ was defending himself. I find it hard to consider that GZ just walked up to TM and shot him in cold blood and without feeling threatened.

  • resunikcufecin

    You are hilariously misinformed. He never “profiled” or “stalked” anyone. It’s hardly surprising that most of the people he reported to the cops were black, since blacks commit such a disproportionate amount of crime. The FBI’s own statistics prove it.

  • No Thanks

    With almost every post you’ve made. Every statement you’ve made is based on the assumption that Trayvon was dangerous even though the only word we have to go on is Zimmerman’s.

  • marmom07

    Word!!!

  • Joob

    Thank you.

  • Stooch

    Well my issue had nothing to do with race, it had to do with the law itself. If the jury believed that GZ felt his life was endanger than they had to acquit. I think if you put yourself in the situation for a fight you shouldn’t be able to use stand your ground as a defense. I think the details of the law are what got GZ off. He lucky cause many State have that you can’t be the aggressor and use stand your ground. Florida is just ass backwards

  • No Thanks

    Yes, Zimmerman would have to testify in a civil suit.

  • jpfan2

    I know the facts of the case are shocking but I did watch some of the trial and the prosecutors overcharged Zimmerman. If they’d gone with lesser charges not murder they would have had a better case. Anyone watching saw the prosecution had no chance of a murder conviction especially when 10 people said the voice screaming on tapes was Zimmerman.

  • Ronnie D

    It doesn’t make sense that GZ would call the police, “stalk” TM, then shoot him. The evidence shows that TM was on top of GZ. It’s isn’t illegal to follow someone. However, it is illegal to initiate a physical confrontation. Therefore I am not making assumptions, I am analyzing the evidence.

  • No Thanks

    Yeah, I would have gone for manslaughter. It’s clear to me Zimmerman instigated the situation by profiling Treyvon and acting upon preconceived notions.

  • No Thanks

    No, the evidence did not show that. No one could see well enough to know who was on top of who. No one could even tell who was screaming. And no one saw what lead up to that moment except Treyvon and Zimmerman. One is dead and can’t speak for himself.

  • marmom07

    zimmerman felt threatened after he scared Trayvon and Trayvon felt he needed to protect himself.

    That scenario is equally if not more plausible by the fact that zimmerman made it a habit to follow and confront people.

  • Bugme Nomor

    “Jurors in the George Zimmerman second-degree murder trial will be
    allowed to consider at least one lesser charge — manslaughter — when
    they get the case after closing arguments, Judge Debra Nelson ruled
    Thursday.”

  • resunikcufecin

    There is ample evidence of Trayvon starting the fight. It’s pretty overwhelming, actually.

  • standtotheright

    It does if, as the prosecution credibly suggested, one has a personality that leads to one seeking out authority positions like cop or private investigator because one believes absolutely in the rightness of one’s judgment and discretion.

    He believed that it was “God’s plan” for him to get out of that car and that he shouldn’t question or regret what happened. That alone suggests that his thought processes aren’t completely rational to me.

  • Ronnie D

    Where did I say black men? There are white people fighting on WSHH as well, so I don’t see where you are getting the idea that I’m referring to just black people. So I don’t think I’m the one with preconceived notions.

  • No Thanks

    I’m listening to CNN right now, they all say the instructions on the manslaughter charge was very confusing. It was a poorly tried case.

  • marmom07

    again you have no evidence as to what transpired BEFORE witnesses saw someone on top of someone.

  • Bugme Nomor

    CNN, May 1: “Zimmerman to argue self-defense, will not seek ‘stand your ground’ hearing”

  • Ronnie D

    And a bag of weed and a pipe.

  • Ronnie D

    I think some people just want their pound of flesh regardless of the evidence.

  • resunikcufecin

    You don’t understand what “Stand Your Ground” means. You don’t even realize that “Stand Your Ground” never applied to this case. In other words, you’re totally clueless and misnformed. LOL.

  • standtotheright
  • Stooch

    yeah oK, watch the trial, it was based on the stand your ground law.

  • Ronnie D

    Show me a clip of whites saying they will riot if the verdict doesn’t go there way. There are clips of SOME. not ALL, black people threatening to riot.

  • resunikcufecin

    Trayvon saw Zimmerman’s gun and said that Zimmerman was going to die. It’s not too hard to figure out what he meant by that.

  • resunikcufecin

    Piers Morgan is getting completely owned by Zimmerman’s brother. This is brutal stuff.

  • Ronnie D

    What’s good for the goose isn’t good for the gander?

  • standtotheright

    There is no evidence of that than Zimmerman’s own statements. Zimmerman also claimed that Martin said “you got me” after he shot him, which….what?

  • resunikcufecin

    Nah, it wasn’t confusing at all. Manslaughter doesn’t apply if it’s self defense. The jury knew what they were doing.

  • Ronnie D

    There was evidence showing the proximity of the gunshot wound.

  • standtotheright

    Which were confiscated weeks before the altercation, which makes them rather inconvenient as weapons.

    As does the fact that a bag of weed…is not a weapon.

  • No Thanks

    You know, I’m more upset with the Florida law that basically emboldened someone like Zimmerman to do what he did. This is a man who believed in taking the law into his own hands, made a deadly decision to follow a boy based on personal prejudices and thus placed himself in a situation where he found himself in over his head and over reacted.

    I don’t believe Zimmerman intended to kill Treyvon that evening. But I believe he was completely irresponsible in his actions and started a chain of events that resulted in an innocent boys death.

  • LA944

    I know this case has been all over the media. I know there is a lot of media bias on both sides.I don’t know what happened during the altercation. Nobody really does except for Zimmerman. It’s tragic that a human being is dead.

    However, there are a lot of other killings happening every day. I live in Baltimore. Yesterday there were four murders in the city. I think that brings the total up to 12 or more this month. Last month about 28 murders. This is not being discussed in the media.

    Why?

  • Ronnie D

    I think the state was forced to take it to trial because of opportunists like Rev. Al Sharpton. The cops would have arrested GZ instead of letting him go if they thought he was this blood thirsty killer.

  • Ronnie D

    I believe Zimmeran made poor choices as well. However, TM also made poor decisions.

  • weareallinnocent

    My comment above mirrored yours asking why didn’t Trayvon just go home, and if he had he’d be alive. That’s why I formulated my response essentially to mirror yours.

    I’ve expressed my views of the FL law and it’s application in this situation, so I won’t repeat myself here. Suffice it to say, my issue is with the fact that Zimmerman “walked” at all.

  • flog gnaw

    Michael Vick holds dog fighting: 2 years in jail + house arrest
    George Zimmerman shoots a kid: Innocent.
    Hah.

  • Sassycatz

    I happen to think Michael Vick deserved what he got and more, but I also think Zimmerman deserved some jail time too. Vigilantism should not be tolerated, We are a country under the rule of law; not wild west, every man for himself.

  • resunikcufecin

    That’s why you have to look at the totality of evidence. The physical evidence is broadly consistent with Zimmerman’s story. It isn’t consistent with the fairy tale that Zimmerman was a racist murderer who hunted down an innocent little boy.

  • resunikcufecin

    Zimmerman didn’t have a legitimate reason to be in his own neighborhood? Wow.

  • standtotheright

    I would argue that instead of “broadly consistent” it was “not inconsistent enough” for “beyond a reasonable doubt.” I do think the civil trial may end up very different.

  • Kariann Hart

    Yet if George Zimmerman stayed in his car, how can “stand your ground law” apply? Isn’t there a charge like involuntary manslaughter? I know nothing about the law.

  • Kariann Hart

    I find it even more difficult to believe TM presented any kind of threat to GZ. George…stay in the car like you were told to do. My bet is that TM would have gone straight home. This trial left a bad taste in my mouth. It just never should have happened.

  • Stooch

    No cause the Florida’s law is so vague, once they started fighting GZ was able to say he felt his life was in danger and thus deadly force was justified (under that law). Other states have provision that you can’t use stand your ground if you’re the aggressor or go looking for conflict

  • tierbee

    I have many thoughts about this, but it’s probably all been argued elsewhere. My one thing I do want to say is that as a mother, my heart breaks for Trayvon’s family.

  • Kariann Hart

    GZ was wrong. He showed no real regret. Think of how that made TM’s parents feel. No real, “I’m truly sorry.” This disgusts me.

  • J3$$!C@

    I AGREE WITH THE VERDICT. Its all about proving. The prosecution failed to prove without a reasonable doubt that Zimmerman did not feel threatened.

  • Q_3

    And to top off this whole mess with another indignity, according to CNN, Zimmerman got his gun back and gets to keep his concealed weapons license.

  • teacup

    I was very upset by the verdict but I knew it would happen. American justice is a lie.

    ETA – It does make me feel a little better to see how many people know it was an injustice as well.

  • BonnieDee

    Yes if you watched the trial, the defense made a much better case. And I’m confused why the media keeps characterizing Zimmerman as this white Republican with a gun. He had a gun, but he’s a Hispanic registered Democrat. I wish the media would stop creating bias and let justice run its course.

  • rnlang

    As he should because he has been exonerated.

  • rnlang

    One case was proven. One wasn’t.

  • rnlang

    They didn’t have a case. Charges were only filed because of political pressure, itself caused by lies in the media. This case had nothing to do with race and yet got singled out as the civil rights issue of the day. Completely crazy.

  • rnlang

    “Stand your ground” wasn’t even used in this case. Self defense when you’re being beaten on the ground and can’t possibly retreat = not an abnormal law, from what I can tell.

  • rnlang

    He was already out of his car looking for an address, said “OK” to not following Trayvon, and had lost him in any case. Also, it’s at best inadvisable to follow someone you suspect to be a criminal…it’s not illegal.

  • rnlang

    No, he used “normal” self defense.

  • rnlang

    Also the physical evidence of Zimmerman’s wounds, eyewitness testimony from John Good, and the screams. At the very least, you can’t prove beyond a reasonable doubt that GZ wasn’t in fear for his life (or just great bodily harm is OK too).

  • rnlang

    Oddly, a lot of the anti-GZ people out there seem to think that the proper response to someone following you in your neighborhood is to confront them, then attack them viciously. TM could have called 911 himself…or just gone home.

  • rnlang

    Agreed. I’m sure Zimmerman does feel very awful about what happened, yet also relieved that he did it and wasn’t harmed any further. He probably would have been messed up even without the circus trial.

  • rnlang

    It wasn’t a 911 call. And it was testified to in court that it’s not a requirement to follow the direction of the police operator.

  • rnlang

    Yeah, it would be better if GZ had mace or something, but all he had was a gun…

  • rnlang

    He said he was sorry before. And at some point, his attorneys most likely stopped him from saying anything. He already said a lot (voluntarily, with no sense of deception) to the police well before he hired an attorney: a sign of innocence to me, but also opening him up to attacks on slight discrepancies in his stories!

  • rnlang

    I think “God’s plan” is a coping mechanism. “Holy crap, I was just trying to keep the neighborhood safe, then I almost died, then I killed a kid. How do I deal with this?”

  • Happyhexer

    In some states there is. But it varies from state to state.

  • rnlang

    Right, but the more credible witnesses supported George’s story: John Good, the closest eyewitness, and the Zimmerman voice supporters (cf. Trayvon’s dad, who may have lied about what he had said). In any case, the anti-GZ people may be right about what happened, but it couldn’t be proven by the prosecution. So in that case, it would be a tragedy, but still a success for the legal system as it’s supposed to work.

  • rnlang

    I think of “playing vigilante” as, say, going out to shoot GZ because you didn’t like the verdict. Checking out a suspicious individual and calling the cops about it is not vigilantism.

  • rnlang

    Apparently GZ is an Agatha Christie-written mastermind who plotted a murder (on the spot, mind you) in which he would do everything right to claim self defense, including calling the cops first.

  • rnlang

    The policy of a local neighborhood watch has no legal bearing on the case.

  • rnlang

    He did actually know, because he told the police operator–of course, after she asked him, not the way the media portrayed it.

  • rnlang

    Yes, because there was a series of break-ins by young black males.

  • rnlang

    He probably didn’t think that of the black neighbor who testified on his behalf or the black kids he used to mentor.

  • rnlang

    Thanks for being one of the only sane ones here who is using logic and the law.

  • rnlang

    Justice is giving the defendant a fair trial and the jury voting (appropriately) not guilty. There was never a question of who did it; the question was whether it was justified due to self defense. This isn’t an unusual defense.

  • rnlang

    GZ started out going to Target, not looking for trouble. TM probably didn’t want to kill GZ, but he did overreact a bit to being watched by a stranger. (I’m sure it would creep me out or offend me if I knew why, but I wouldn’t beat up the guy.) Also, TM’s text messages clearly showed a predilection for getting in fights. It’s not a racial issue.

  • rnlang

    I don’t the prosecution had much to present.

  • rnlang

    There is evidence of a broken nose. And as the pathology expert testified, the injuries were consistent with hard beating which could easily cause severe injury or death on the next blow. At the very least, GZ thought so.

  • rnlang

    So if someone is following you, you can beat the crap out of them?

  • rnlang

    It wasn’t even a 911 call–it was non-emergency. But the myth of the “police order” won’t go away!

  • rnlang

    That does sound horrendous. Is there a case where that happened?

  • rnlang

    Being serious here, you should read more about the witnesses, evidence, and expert opinions on the verdict. Then it should make more sense.

  • rnlang

    If you assault them, you’re the criminal. And no one claimed “stand your ground” in this case.

  • rnlang

    No, he didn’t deserve to be shot because of that. But his past helps us understand how likely GZ’s story is.

  • rnlang

    Irrelevant: Local neighborhood watch policies have no bearing on the case.

  • rnlang

    No, you can kill anyone when PROVOKED by an assault which you believe will cause you death or great bodily harm.

  • rnlang

    Right, but they saw the critical part: where TM was beating GZ and he was in fear for his life. That’s ALL that matters.

  • rnlang

    Except there are forensic experts who evaluate the injuries. Also, there were witnesses on the scene immediately after the incident.

  • abbysee

    Why does that matter, because Hispanics can’t profile, or be vigilantes? Most of us know the media thinks were stupid and only see things in black and white, but when v you hear the crap Zimmerman’s family had been saying, I can’t say I blame folks for believing it.

    For the record, the prosecution sucked, did a lousy job. Verdict still pisses me off!

  • rnlang

    If he were brandishing a gun at you, you can defend yourself (but be careful). There’s no evidence that Zimmerman threatened Martin with his gun.

  • Happyhexer

    I agree with you completely. Assuming that Trayvon confronted Zimmerman and caused him injury (and I don’t know; I wasn’t there and did not follow the trial super-closely), why wasn’t that considered Trayvon “standing his ground?” Trayvon knew he was being followed and he didn’t know Zimmerman’s intentions. He may have been creeped out or frightened. And thought that a good offense was a good defense (or whatever that saying is) — if he confronted Zimmerman. But Zimmerman created the situation in the first place by not heeding police advice to stay put. And this tragedy was the result. I do think the case was overcharged, as second-degree murder was a stretch to prove, given the mens rea requirement. But how in the world was this not manslaughter? That I don’t get.

    I know emotions are running high right now (and thank you a measured and reasoned response), but I do think there was some value in having the trial, even with an unsatisfactory verdict. There was no guarantee of the outcome, and maybe people will learn a lesson about how quickly a situation can escalate out-of-control.

  • rnlang

    Except the logic of the facts and the law. Unless you are accusing those 6 women of being racists who spent a very long time talking about nothing but TM’s race.

  • rnlang

    I would hope so, and if he weren’t, THAT would be a legitimate racial issue. (Of course, you could never investigate such a hypothetical.) This case really wasn’t one.

  • Happyhexer

    “Because there are NO witnesses to how it started.”

    And that may be why the jury acquitted. If the jury felt that knowing how the altercation began was crucial to understanding the sequence of events, the jury may have concluded that there was reasonable doubt. Of course, the absence of witnesses doesn’t necessarily equal the absence of evidence . . .

  • Happyhexer

    Sometimes. Depends on the state and the crime charged. In my state, six jurors can be used for lesser crimes, but twelve are required for murder (“straight” murder/felony murder) or aggravated murder.

  • Happyhexer

    Why are you furious at the court? The decision was the jury’s to make, based on the evidence and the court’s legal instructions.

  • Happyhexer

    I thought the judge ruled that the text messages couldn’t be shown to the jury? Or did I miss something? (Didn’t pay super-close attention.)

  • fuzzywuzzy

    Yes, the witnesses for the state were poorly prepared and often ended up supporting the defense’s case.

  • WestiesRule

    I don’t usually get involved in threads like this but, the whole trial was an injustice. Perhaps if involuntary manslaughter was a choice, there would have been a different outcome. I personally, do not believe, this man went out that night looking to shoot someone. The whole thing was mishandled like so many other instances within our lovely judicial system. Our system is the one that’s guilty (IMHO).

  • ladymctech

    I don’t like the verdict, but I am sure glad I don’t have to see George Zimmerman’s neighbor trying extend his 15 minutes of fame anymore.

  • chillj

    Florida needs to fix its law. I’m not surprised by the verdict, because I have heard so many prosecutors and defense lawyers say there was no case and he was overcharged. I suspect in a different state the charge and the case might have been different.
    I do know that much I originally thought was fact turned out not to be – and I think the media behaves irresponsibly in sensational stories.

  • chillj

    I think the problem is that is not exactly what Zimmerman was told, although it was widely reported as being what Zimmerman was told. The police said something more like “You don’t need to do that.” There is a big difference.

  • Valarie

    The state vastly overcharged. There was no evidence to back up a second degree murder charge. If they had charged a lesser crime, the verdict may have been different.

  • usedtobelucy

    This is the problem with America. We deny that things are racial when they clearly are racial. I can’t believe you’re saying that racism would inevitably be involved if a black man was acquitted and a white man the victim but that when a white man is acquitted and a black man the victim is “really* has no racial aspects. And yet you’re coming right out and saying that. Wow. Just wow.

  • usedtobelucy

    I’m accusing them of buying the “Martin was a thug and thus clearly must have done the things for which we have no evidence but Zimmerman’s word” argument. And the reason people buy that is that unconsciously most of America has become convinced that a black teen is inevitably dangerous, the taking of a black person’s life is less important than the taking of a white person’s life, and any white guy who claims that he was a vigilante for justice being cruelly attacked by a black guy is telling the truth.

  • usedtobelucy

    Yeah, I know. Sorry if I looked to be contradicting you. I was trying to expand on that argument!

  • usedtobelucy

    If you are a black teenager, and thus obviously a “thug,” then never, apparently.

  • usedtobelucy

    Yeah. I have a loaded gun and *maybe* somebody knocks me to the sidewalk — as I *follow* him, with a gun, for no reason — and I get a couple of cuts on my head …. That guy is unarmed, by the way. And I do *not* get a broken nose. I get a couple of cuts on the back of my head. And they couldn’t have been very serious cuts because he didn’t have much blood according to accounts — and even tiny head cuts bleed like nobody’s business…. AND the guy was *provoked* by me first, since I stalked him relentlessly for no reason whatsoever. So, yeah, he’s a deadly threat to me. Not.

  • usedtobelucy

    “TM probably didn’t want to kill GZ, but he did overreact a bit to being watched by a stranger”

    He wasn’t being “watched.” He was being *followed.* Big difference.

  • usedtobelucy

    “I find it hard to consider that GZ just walked up to TM and shot him in cold blood and without feeling threatened.”

    Seems to me he likely felt threatened by the entire existence of Martin, based on the fact that he was following him, with a loaded gun, up streets and down, for no other reason than that he was on the street in Zimmerman’s neighborhood. Don’t know why you follow people with guns if you aren’t quite threatened by what they’re doing — and in this case, what he was doing was merely being there.

  • usedtobelucy

    Yeah, I agree. Overcharging is a big problem in a lot of cases, including this one.

  • MichaelG (MikhailXO)

    Wow…I don’t think Faux news even tried arguing this angle. You sound pretty sure of this. Didn’t hear any evidence completely supporting your assertion. Oh, btw…you probably didn’t hear, but the murdered boy was unarmed and was being followed/staked. Those are facts even the defense team didn’t reject. But if, in your world, it makes you feel better to paint your own version to suit your inner hostilities…go ahead.

  • Not fit to print

    You “bet” but you don’t “know”. And what about TM having the right to stand his ground?

    IMHO, the jury had to rule the way they did but positing what might have happened on either side of this case is not proving a fact.

    I wonder how people will feel about the “Stand Your Ground” law once it becomes a defense for organized criminals who will argue that they had a reasonable expectation of attack by their rivals or women who proactively attack abusive husbands.
    It will be an interesting few years in Florida law.

  • Not fit to print

    There’s a big difference between understanding the law/ agreeing with the jury decision and going on ad infinitum in support of only one side of this case.

    Bottom line: the jury ruling was the only one possible under law but the only logical view of this case is that we will never know what happened and “benefit of the doubt” is the operative consideration.

  • Joystickenvy

    The main factor in a civil suit would not be so much whether Z has to testify, but that the burden of proof is much lower. Much easier to prove “more likely than not” than “beyond a reasonable doubt.”

  • Joystickenvy

    They didn’t really have a “their version.” Their key witness was dead, all they could do was try and poke holes in GZ story and IMO there were plenty of holes to poke, but not enough evidence to prove the case “beyond a reasonable doubt.” I firmly believe that GZ was guilty of a crime, based on his negligent actions and his own account that made nearly zero sense, but I think the jury probably made the right call given the evidence. I don’t think GZ set out to kill anyone, but I don’t believe he was simply defending himself against an unprovoked attack either.

  • Lala3

    Actually Zimmerman is also part black, and he is a Latino.

  • Lala3

    uh, the kid was beating the guys head into the ground and broke his nose.

  • Lala3

    Trayvon had no marks on him except the one single bullet wound, meanwhile Zimmerman had a broken nose and back head injuries.

  • Lala3

    Not only that but a witness who saw Martin on top of Zimmerman pounding him.

  • Lala3

    It is not a crime to follow someone, but it is a crime to punch and attack someone.

  • Lala3

    According to court testimony by Trayvon’s girlfriend Trayvon was already in his dad’s backyard…he had to go BACK to Zimmerman…Trayvon could’ve just gone int the house instead of GOING BACK to confront Zimmerman

  • Lala3

    Zimmerman IS part black.

  • Lala3

    You are aware that Zimmerman is part black.

  • Ronnie D

    TM did have the right to stand his ground, and unfortunately he was on the losing end.

  • Lala3

    People seem to forgot that Zimmerman is black also.

  • HermeticallySealed

    Um, no, he’s not. White/hispanic, not black.

  • HermeticallySealed

    Yeah, like being out alone in the dark, apparently.

  • Ronnie D

    TV didn’t know he had a gun. If TV knew he had a gun, I doubt he would have turned back to confront him.

  • Ronnie D

    No, like turning back and confronting GZ. It is already established that TV liked to fight.

  • Pippygirl

    The prosecution overcharged Zimmerman due to pressure from the media. They should have originally gone with a lesser charge instead of waiting for the last minute to do so, which showed how desperate they were.
    It’s obvious TM would still be alive it Zimmerman had listened to the police dispatcher and stayed in his damn car. However I guess that is not against the law.

    A civil suit would probably turn out differently because the burden of proof is much less, but that will be small comfort to TM’s family.

  • nncw

    I am anti-gun. My daughter was at Dawson College when there was the killing rampage and I as head of one of the programs at the College had to deal with the aftermath of the tragedy. It is bad enough to deal with criminals but if you have to start worrying about citizens who pretend to be “law enforcers” and law enforcers who sometimes go cross the line – then it is a pretty scary place to try to lead a simple and decent life. I am not sure I would want to visit Florida – with the laws they have. The justice system seems dependent on being able to have decent lawyers either prosecuting or defending you. And the media just meddles and muddles instead of reporting. Next they will be crying for the likelihood of violence as a result of the verdict – anything to create a newsworthy day.

  • Incipit

    Thanks for that, Pippygirl. Wrapped it up in three sentences – and if there is a civil suit, I hope that brings some closure for the loss of a life, if that’s even possible. This whole situation reflected badly on everyone involved. IMO.

  • weareallinnocent

    Likewise, it’s not illegal to walk to a neighborhood store for candy and tea, and then walk home again.

    What exactly gave rise to the suspicion that he was a criminal?

  • weareallinnocent

    Maybe, but I think it’s a problem either way.

  • AndyB11

    So true–all of these wannabe Joe Fridays who have absolutely no training or monitoring are scary.

  • thirdtime

    Guess it’s all in your own experiences that shapes your perspective on guns. A few years ago my 92 year old neighbor who lives alone had a man walk right into his house in broad daylight, hit him and demand money from him. This is in a quiet, suburban neighborhood with people out in their yards at the time, but unfortunately his back door was not in view of the neighbors. My neighbor told him he had money in his dresser drawer and the man followed him to the bedroom, but he really had a gun in the drawer, pulled it out and aimed it at the guy, and the guy fled. That’s all it took, just knowing he was able to defend himself chased the guy away. My neighbor had a black eye and was badly shaken up, but he was fine. At that time we were having a string of robberies in our neighborhood – 12 people had break-ins within a 2 month period – and if you saw the area I live in you would be totally shocked because as I said, it’s a quiet, suburban area – and these guys were not afraid to break in to houses where people were home. I am terrified of the day that we are no longer allowed to defend ourselves or our families from people who want to harm us. I wish it was like it was back in the 50′s and 60′s when my parents didn’t even have to lock their doors, and young kids weren’t kidnapped right off the street or out of the own homes, but unfortunately it’s just not that way anymore. But I guess if you have never had your neighborhood terrorized by a couple of criminals for months like we did, you really have no idea how it feels. Thankfully they were finally caught.

  • chloe18

    This is so sad. I think I’m going to stop by the rally at Union Sq. today to show support. I hope his parents are able to find a way to make peace with verdict. I can’t imagine how painful this is for them.

  • resunikcufecin

    Being “unarmed” doesn’t somehow absolve Trayvon of responsibility. He attacked a man whom he thought was unarmed and continued the attack until Zimmerman felt threatened for his life. There are plenty of 17 year olds who are capable of killing with their fists. There isn’t some rule that you can only use deadly force against an armed person.

  • nncw

    Well my daughter was robbed and pepper sprayed so I am not immune to these things – I just think it doesn’t help to have a whole society armed with guns. To me the Zimmerman case is an example of that.

  • resunikcufecin

    Um, no. You start a fight by throwing your fists at the other person. Whether you’re alone or unarmed is ultmately irrelevant. Trayvon was still required to react to the situation like a civilized human being. He decided to take some cheap shots at the “cracker” instead. Really dumb decision on his part.

  • Stooch

    If you didn’t watch the trial I can’t help you, that’s why the defense put on the retired army guy who taught GZ and spent much of his testimony talking about the law itself. SYG is a self-defense argument

  • dangrey

    Manslaughter would have been acceptable, but nothing? Zimmerman followed Martin in his car, was told by police not to, still did so, got out of his car, ended up shooting the kid and somehow Martin was portrayed as the aggressor.

  • resunikcufecin

    What makes you so convinced that Zimmerman is some evil racist who hunted this boy down? There is really no evidence of that at all.

  • chili1000

    Zimmerman’s injuries don’t prove that Martin started the fight, only that there was a fight. I think it’s safe to say that Zimmerman was emboldened to approach Martin and get in his face because he had a gun. He was clearly the instigator.

  • Tinawina

    Actually Zimmerman is the one who had been arrested for violence in the past, not Trayvon. But the fact that one gets labeled the thug who had it coming and not the other, even though one actually had more documented proof of being a hothead, is part of the problem here. Think of the weed smoking and bad attitude of a 17 year old Obama, and the drinking problems and troublemaking of a young George W Bush. Were they super thugs? But it’s really easy to believe the worst of the dead kid with the skittles, the one enrolled in honor classes and from a good family, when given the opportunity. Apparently he must have attacked a peaceful Zimmerman from behind for no reason.

  • chili1000

    If your life is in danger, yes.

  • chili1000

    Where did you hear that?

  • chili1000

    If Martin attacked Zimmerman as you say, what was his motive?

  • chili1000

    What makes you think that Martin intended to kill Zimmerman? What was his motive?

  • Miz

    MJ, I’m with you on your observation that with the way the case was handled and presented, the jury had no choice in their verdict. I watched the entire trial (including jury selection) online. I put myself in everyone’s shoes and tried to keep an open mind.

    My opinion is that Zimmerman was over charged and the prosecution did not present the lesser manslaughter option in their arguments for the jury to properly consider. There was also such mishandling of this case and evidence from the start.

    It is just sad. There is no doubt in my mind that this was a wrongful death and there is no doubt in my mind that Zimmerman had and still has no remorse over taking the life of this young man.

    My reaction on twitter was simply ‘Saying a prayer for peace’ I will leave it at that.

  • Miz

    But your neighbor didn’t pull the trigger. Just presenting the gun was enough in this case.

  • chili1000

    Nobody is saying that.

  • chili1000

    And imagine how Martin feels right now.

  • MichaelG (MikhailXO)

    Maybe I’m weird, but I have ZERO sympathy for the killer here. The more I read about the trial, the more upset I get. If I had black sons…I’d fear the worst every time they left the house.

  • thirdtime

    You are right, he didn’t have to. Just having the gun was enough to scare the guy off.

  • MichaelG (MikhailXO)

    AND the 3 eyewitnesses ALL stated Zimmerman was ON TOP of Martin when they heard the screaming. He was double his size. IF anyone was going to kill “with their hands”, Zimmerman had the advantage. No stitches, never admitted to the hospital, he left the ER within an hour. But of course, he feared for his life. Lol…

    The lesson here kids: Don’t take skittles to a gun fight.

  • chili1000

    Yep. TM made a bad choice and he is dead. GZ made a bad choice and he killed someone.

  • elliegrll

    That’s because he’s not.

  • resunikcufecin

    For all intents and purposes they do. You have absolutely zero evidence that Zimmerman did anything more than follow Trayvon a very short distance, something which he had every right to do.

  • Ronnie D

    I don’t believe either GZ or TM are/were angels, by any means. It just irritates me to an extent that people are painting this picture that GZ stalked down TM, walked up to him, and shot him in the chest (just inches away mind you), all after calling the police. GZ may have been a wanna be cop ect.., but that doesn’t make him a cold blooded killer.

  • resunikcufecin

    Nuff said. LOL.

  • tucker davis

    He didn’t use the ‘stand your ground’ law. He used ‘self-defense.’

  • resunikcufecin

    Martin’s motive in attacking Zimmerman isn’t particularly relevant. He isn’t the one on trial here. Had he been put on trial for attacking Zimmerman, his racist comments over the phone (calling Zimmerman a “cracker”) would’ve shed some light on his motive.

  • tucker davis

    The ‘stand your ground’ law was never the issue at trial. It was tried as a ‘self-defense’ incident. The defense dropped the ‘stand your ground’ defense months ago. But the media would not quit talking about it. Much of what the media reported,at least in the beginning, was in error but stuck.

  • tucker davis

    I’ve served as a juror in a murder trial, and I have to say it’s one of the most stressful things I’ve ever done. It’s very different inside the jury room than it is outside the courthouse. You have to put emotion & opinions aside and look at just the FACTS presented in court. I have empathy for those 6 women.

  • resunikcufecin

    Correction: Don’t attack an innocent man with your fists if you value your health and/or freedom. :)

  • tucker davis

    Thank you. It wasn’t a ‘stand your ground’ case. Because the media made such a big deal about that Florida law, a lot of the public still thinks that was the defense.

  • standtotheright

    For normal people, it might be. I can’t read his words (or hear them) and interpret them as someone who even feels the need to cope with what he did. It’s all justified in his mind. The lack of regret is really disturbing to me.

  • Jordana33

    I agree with MJ too. This whole situation makes me very sad, but the injustice didn’t happen in the court. It happened before that. Personally, I don’t think that the prosecutor did the best job, but without any witnesses at the scene and without Zimmerman taking the stand, I think that proving guilt beyond a reasonable doubt would have been a challenge for anyone. Had Zimmerman taken the stand, I think it would have been very easy for the prosecutor to punch holes in his inconsistent story and get a guilty verdict.

    Do I think that Zimmerman following Trayvon was racially motivated? Absolutely. Do I think this was a wrongful death? Absolutely. Do I think that the state handled the case poorly from the beginning? Yes. I think that issues with how the police interpreted the “stand your ground” law, should be re-addressed, but I also worry that the police were quick to accept Zimmerman’s initial story because Trayvon was black.

    It really bothers me that anyone should see this case as a victory. An unarmed kid was confronted and killed because of the color of his skin. Regardless of how one feels about the verdict, it’s clear that justice was not served and I’m disappointed in anyone who would be happy with the outcome. I’m hoping that the family decides to pursue a civil suit.

  • deshae78

    I think he does have some black ancestry, from Peru.

  • Jordana33

    Does Zimmerman consider himself black?

  • deshae78

    I really thought he would be found guilty of manslaughter but I didn’t follow the trial that closely. The basic facts are that he stalked a black teenager & the black teenager ends up dead. The rest is just his word against someone who can’t speak up. I am very curious as to why they didn’t find him guilty of manslaughter when all the known facts points to Zimmerman as the aggressor.

  • Jordana33

    The next logical step for this family would be to pursue a civil suit, because the burden of proof is a little more lenient, so I doubt this is the last you’ll see of the neighbor!

  • Jordana33

    I think there is a big difference between agreeing with the jury’s decision and thinking that justice was served. I think that based on the way that the evidence was presented and the fact that Zimmerman did not take the stand, probably left the jury with no choice. However, justice is never served when a guilty person gets away with a crime. The verdict wasn’t racially motivated but the crime certainly was. My heart goes out to Trayvon and his family.

  • Jordana33

    Why does it matter? Racial profiling is racial profiling, regardless of who does it.

  • Jordana33

    Probably because those murderers (if identified) were charged right away. This case became a media issue because the state failed to charge the person who committed the crime, and police failed to collect the necessary evidence from the start. Had this case not become a media issue, the state might never have charged Zimmerman. And regardless of the not guilty outcome, he needed to be charged.

  • Jordana33

    True, but it was the justification used by the police and the state for not initially charging Zimmerman.

  • Jordana33

    I agree. The judicial system is in place to make sure that innocent people are not unfairly convicted. But we all know that the resulting outcome is that a lot of guilty people go free, which is what happened in this case. However, a “not guilty” verdict does not imply that the person shouldn’t have been charged in the first place!

  • wayne strong
  • Jordana33

    It was also established that Zimmerman had a history of unfairly profiling dark-skinned people and because of this, an innocent kid is dead. Given that we only have Zimmerman’s inconsistent account of the encounter, we really don’t know what Zimmerman did to make Trayvon feel so threatened. We will never know how aggressive Zimmerman’s confrontration really was, so saying that Trayvon shouldn’t have fought back is an unfair assumption. There’s a reason Zimmerman didn’t take the stand. His statement is full of holes.

  • DaisyMagnolia

    So good-bye Trayvon, death is what he deserved, based on your analogy?
    I can only hope no one close to you falls to the same fate. Or would your stance be the same?

  • ProPlayersCelebs

    Twitter is exploding with tweets from black fast food workers that they are spitting or putting special sauce in white people’s food – be aware this is how they are rioting. Coordinating through twitter. . Be safe. Please warn your family, friends, and co-workers.

  • DaisyMagnolia

    If nothing else, Zimmerman is f***ing stupid. He was told to stay in his car, that the police were coming to investigate. But no, he had to get out, had to follow Trayvon, had to pump lead in the guy’s chest. For what? Because Trayvon had on a hoodie and was walking home?
    Zimmerman may have been found not guilty, but he’s not innocent. He wanted to be Dirty Harry–some vigilante cop–only he was too dumb to get admitted into the police academy. The neighborhood watch team didn’t even like the guy. He’s a loose cannon, just like Aaron Hernandez and Casey Anthony.
    Something in Zimmerman IS evil. No one who devalues someone else’s life that easily can have a good heart. He’s a terrible person for all sorts of reasons. So what if he isn’t racist? Is that supposed to win him a prize? He still killed someone based on flimsy reasons. He’s a scary man and no one who loves life should want to be around him.

  • DaisyMagnolia

    Has anyone rioted because of this? Sorry that you’re disappointed to that end.

  • DaisyMagnolia

    The fact that you would cite WorldStarHipHop as a legitimate news source invalidates your argument. That place goes out of its way to show the worst stuff possible. Like Maury and his paternity tests–do you think all single mothers act like that based on a TV talk show?

  • DaisyMagnolia

    I would say pumping a bullet into someone’s chest goes beyond overreacting a bit in the other direction.

  • Jordana33

    No one is saying that he just walked up to Trayvon and shot him in the chest. They are saying that GZ stalked TM and then aggressively confronted TM in a way that made TM feel threatened enough to defend himself. What we don’t understand is WHY he aggressively confronted this kid in the first place? Are you satisfied with his explanation?

    There are a lot of things that disturb me about this case, but how GZ is being portrayed by the media takes a distant last. An innocent kid is dead because of the actions of an overzealous vigilante, who now walks free. THAT irritates me.

  • Happyhexer

    Many people here are looking at what what was reported about the trial and reaching opposite conclusions. Many emphasize that no one knows who the initial aggressor was at the point of confrontation. And therein lay the problem. There is no PERFECT JUSTICE in a world made of fallible, non-omniscient human beings. It is easy to do Monday-morning quarterbacking. But none of us heard and saw exactly what the jury did (including the instructions). If the physical facts and other evidence were not inconsistent with GZ’s version of events (doesn’t matter that there was also evidence that could go the other way), then it is not surprising that a jury would acquit, when to do otherwise required them to find that the prosecution’s case had been PROVEN “beyond a reasonable doubt.” If GZ is guilty, he wouldn’t be the first guilty person to be acquitted, because that’s the trade-off in our system of justice. It is better to let 10 guilty persons go free than to convict one innocent one.

    And yes, I know that plenty of innocent people have been convicted, as DNA evidence is proving. But some things are improving, as New Jersey and Oregon (and hopefully other state courts and the Supreme Court) have changed the way eyewitness testimony (which has scientifically been proven to be inherently unreliable) is handled. The justice system is far from perfect, but it’s the best we’ve got, and we all should be working to improve it, rather than vilify it.

    For me, I thought the case was overcharged, but I would have liked to see GZ convicted of something. This tragedy did not have to happen, but for GZ’s actions. (I thought he’d get manslaughter, but I also can understand how a jury might have acquitted.)

    Unless something surfaces to show jury impropriety, I am willing to accept the jury’s verdict. But we as a nation still need to have a conversation about this.

  • MV007

    On one hand you say you didn’t follow the trial closely and on the other you talk about all the known facts. These sentences are inconsistent because clearly you don’t know all of the facts. There was evidence from an eye witness that Trayvon was on top of Zimmerman and pummeling him and trying to slam GZ’s head into the ground. I think most people would say GZ shouldn’t have been following Trayvon but ultimately those actions were not illegal and the only evidence about the physical confrontation pointed to Trayvon having the upper hand. The next question was whether GZ was reasonable in fearing for his life. Maybe people can disagree on that but these 6 people weren’t necessarily unreasonable in thinking GZ acted reasonably given the evidence that was given.

  • Tinawina

    Sure. But you realize there is a world between what you described and what actually happened. We know there was a fight, but we don’t know how it started. Since neither were unfamiliar with fighing, why is it easier to believe GZ was sucker punched from behind? does that really make sense? And how did we end up with the dead kid having to prove his character and not the guy who actually killed him? I don’t think GM set out to kill anyone that night either, but he behaved recklessly and caused the whole thing. There should be a price for that, but the only punishment seems to be for the person who died and HIS name.

  • breakdown

    Where’s your proof of this?

  • Jordana33

    So not only is it OK for a person to be over-suspicious of a young black kid walking alone at night, you’re now saying that whites should be suspicious of any black person serving food to them? What next?

  • breakdown

    Trayvon was racially profiled, stalked, confronted and shot thru the heart by a wannabe cop for simply walking along carrying the weapons of Skittles and a soft drink.

  • Miz

    I believe that there was already a settlement with the Homeowners Association. I do not think the Trayvon Martin family will pursue this any further. THey have suffered enough.

    I heard one pundit last night say that actually 2 verdicts were handed down last night. A not guilty for George Zimmerman and a guilty for Treyvon Martin. So sad.

  • Jordana33

    True, but I think the case against Zimmerman would be much easier to prove if he had to take the stand, which wasn’t done in the criminal case (they only looked at his statement, I think). I think it would be much easier for a lawyer to bring out the inconsistencies in his testimony if he took the stand. I also think that other issues of his character and past would be more subject to questioning in a civil case, but I’m not 100% sure. Maybe someone with more legal experience knows the answer?

  • Jordana33

    Then maybe you can explain why Zimmerman was suspicious of Trayvon in the first place. If it had nothing to do with his race, then I’m still trying to understand why Trayvon seemed so suspicious to Zimmerman.

  • rnlang

    The following was only racially motivated because the people victimizing the neighborhood had been black. It has been demonstrated that GZ was not a racist. In fact, he didn’t even bring up race as a cause of his suspicions. The dispatcher asked him directly about the race of the suspect.

    The case is a victory if you believe that Zimmerman was innocent by the laws of the state of Florida. Just because one bad thing happened (TM’s death) doesn’t mean we should cheer for another bad thing (an innocent man going to prison). Justice was served because the defendant got a fair trial (mostly) and was judged by a jury of his peers. Justice does not mean punishment.

  • rnlang

    Many of your facts are wrong. He was not told by police not to follow. It was a suggestion, i.e. “It is nice that you are providing us with information on this suspect, but we *don’t need you* to put yourself in danger.” He then complied. He was also already out of his car at this point. And Martin is the aggressor because it was shown he attacked Zimmerman violently. The prosecution tried to disprove this theory but failed to do so.

  • rnlang

    It sure helped Zimmerman.

  • rnlang

    Because it served the financial interests of Al Sharpton?

  • rnlang

    Why is it OK for TM to “defend himself” against a vague threat we have no proof of but not OK for GZ to defend himself against an actual threat that was proven by evidence? I suppose you can make up all sorts of scenarios in which Zimmerman is a crazy racist attacker, but they are not supported by much of anything.

  • Ronnie D

    With all due respect, I don’t see how one can bring up GZ’s past and use it in their argument, and not do the same about TM’s. Ultimately none us will truly know what happened on that night. The jury had to make a decision based on reasonable doubt, and there was some.

  • rnlang

    He was allegedly wandering around slowly, not making his way quickly to a destination like you’d expect in the rain. With a record of home break-ins, it’s logical to be suspicious of someone lurking near others’ houses. In reality, he was probably taking his time because he was talking on the phone.

    And there may have been a racial component, given that the earlier crimes had been committed by black males. It’s silly to not look out for people matching the description, whether they are white, black, male, female, whatever.

  • rnlang

    Can you clarify which witness you mean? The defense did not use SYG. The prosecution brought up that GZ learned about it in class but denied knowing it on Hannity, to support the crazy theory that Zimmerman planned the “perfect crime” around a flawless theory of self defense.

  • Beaugard Stevens

    Florida overcharged Casey Anthony as well- they seem to have a habit of charging people without the evidence to back it up.

  • rnlang

    Nope, just standard self defense. The defense didn’t argue GZ didn’t need to retreat. They argued he had no chance to retreat because he was being pummeled on the cement.

  • ProPlayersCelebs

    From my police officer friend. He has seen tweets from blacks planning to do such thing. Also, many Cops avoid eating at places where they can’t see their food being made, while they are on duty with their uniforms and driving a patrol a marked patrol car. You just don’t know who hates you. Yes, there was a police officer who noticed spit / saliva in his drink. Yikes!

  • rnlang

    Yeah, but at least there is his account and some evidence to prove it. If you want to convict him, you need to be able to prove some other story, not just make one up.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    An eye witness saw Martin on top of Zimmerman punching down on him. Your definition of “defended himself” is interesting. Defended from what? Zimmerman called the cops 40 times in the past without “detaining” anyone.

  • rnlang

    I love how I get two down votes for a post that is completely made of facts. It just shows how people don’t want to think critically about the case. They just want to fit it into their own preconceived narrative.

  • rnlang

    It’s not like he went home to get the gun because he was specifically afraid of TM.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Zimmerman is just as white as Obama.

  • rnlang

    Why don’t we kill every doctor who loses a patient. Because I’m sure they don’t feel as bad about it as the dead person.

  • rnlang

    The prosecution basically tried to say that, especially when they questioned his former instructor.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Martin defended himself from what, exactly? And how did he defend himself? With a block of concrete?

  • chili1000

    Feel free to be paranoid if you wish – knock yourself out. But please don’t attempt to spread your paranoia.

  • elliegrll

    Simply walking along while being a black male. Those last two things were the things that Zimmerman and the police found to be offensive.

  • rnlang

    And if it’s your only option in a fight for your life?

  • Ronnie D

    Overreacting is punching someone in the face and bashing their head on the pavement while they are screaming for help.

  • rnlang

    True, and maybe TM should have called 911. Then the police could have sorted out the misunderstanding. Instead, he decided to play tough guy and attack GZ.

  • rnlang

    You’re right! I’m just saying they give more context to Zimmerman’s story. For that reason, I think they should have been admitted…at least the ones about fighting.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Hilarious you didn’t follow the trial but claim to know the “basic facts”.

    If you would have followed the trial you’d know why he wasn’t guilty of manslaughter either.

  • elliegrll

    Who is they? I don’t that most people deal in generalizations, so they aren’t going to blame every white person for the actions of Zimmerman or the police. Frankly, it’s the same type of thing that you just did.

    Those tweets, if they exist are isolated. They could be real, or maybe they are from the ignorant people who immediately jumped to the conclusion that there would be riots last night, and now these people are ticked off that that didn’t happen.

    Most people who I know are hurt today, because they realize that what happened to Trayvon could happen to their sons or daughters. They know that rioting will not solve anything, but they are also angry and hurt that once again the message has been delivered that a black life is worth less than a white one.

  • Ronnie D

    Instead he was on the phone with his wonderfully articulate GF. Remember, she took the stand and explained the enlightening conversation she was having with Trayvon.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    You can’t say he was killed because he was profiled. Profiling doesn’t kill people, nor is it illegal for a citizen to profile people. Yet.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Your facts are wrong.

  • elliegrll

    So you didn’t even see these tweets yourself, but have no problem as stating this as a fact. I’ve seen plenty of police officers in fast food places, but I think that just like everyone else, there are officers who are very afraid of what goes on in the back. It’s not a black or white thing.

  • Beaugard Stevens

    I have followed the trial, it’s a complete tragedy but I don’t see the evidence was there to convict George Zimmerman. Surely there are other cases where racial profiling caused the death of someone and the evidence is more clear-cut and that can be used for a national campaign to draw attention to it more than this- the evidence is not there- and people saying things like he “stalked” or he “hunted” him, to me, that is just ridiculous.

  • Ronnie D

    AP – Footage from a television helicopter showed
    people spray painting anti-police graffiti. Protesters also burned an
    American and a California state flag and spray painted Alameda County’s
    Davidson courthouse, according to the Oakland Tribune

    http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NEIGHBORHOOD_WATCH_CALIFORNIA_PROTESTS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-07-14-06-36-06

  • elliegrll

    My take for what the witnesses said, Zimmerman started the confrontation, and yes, it did start when he started to follow Trayvon. Trayvon got the upper hand and started to win the fight, and then Zimmerman responded to losing the fight by shooting Trayvon.

    I’m sorry, but a person can’t start a fight, and then plead self defense. The person who could have plead self defense is now dead, but somehow I doubt that if Trayvon had been the one stalking Zimmerman, Zimmerman defended himself, and Trayvon responded by shooting him, that Trayvon would be a free man right now. At the very least the police would have gathered all of the evidence in the case.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Pressure from OBAMA and the politicians, you mean.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    He’s as white as Obama.

  • elliegrll

    he “stalked” or he “hunted” him, to me, that is just ridiculous.

    If someone was following you for no reason, what words would you use to describe it? Would you be afraid? Would you have the feeling that the person could potentially do harm to you? Would your response be that’s okay, it’s perfectly normal for someone to be following you at that time of night?

  • GTFOBigGovt

    The Florida stand your ground law did not enter into it at all. And no, self defense is not specific to Florida.

  • ProPlayersCelebs

    Many, including some high profile NFL players with revenge type tweets.

    This is the tip I got from my police officer friend. He has seen tweets from blacks planning to do such thing. Also, many Cops avoid eating at places where they can’t see their food being made, while they are on duty with their uniforms and driving a marked patrol car. You just don’t know who hates you. Yes, there was a police officer who noticed spit / saliva in his drink. Yikes!

  • GTFOBigGovt

    No, we are a country built on the 2nd Amendment right to bear arms. And the stand your ground law did not enter into the case at all.

  • ProPlayersCelebs

    Not paranoid here, just reality. I’m not in Brady Bunch land like you.

  • Ronnie D

    It’s all good, we all have our own opinions here. Some are based on the facts of the case, others are based emotion. This is why there is jury selection! lol We got a just verdict though, so it’s all water under the bridge at this point.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Because it’s not on Obama’s radar it does him no good like speaking against Zimmerman and FUNDING the DOJ to hold rallies against him, a man presumed innocent until PROVEN guilty. It’s hilarious how NOBODY remembers Obama butting into this state’s affairs just like he has before. And was WRONG before.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    What law? The stand your ground law never came into it.

  • elliegrll

    IMO, he wasn’t innocent. The way that the police mishandled the situation wouldn’t have happened Travyvon was the stalker and the one who murdered Zimmerman. This situation has a racial tinge to it because this is not the first time that something like this has happened.

  • Ronnie D

    After George Zimmerman was found not guilty of all charges on Saturday evening, New York Giants wide receiver Victor Cruz sent a threatening tweet that has since been deleted from his account.

    He tweeted, “Thoroughly confused. Zimmerman doesn’t last a year before the hood catches up to him.”

    http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-Sports/2013/07/13/Victor-Cruz-Zimmerman-Tweet

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Not true at all. In fact, it’s documented that Zimmerman was ANYTHING BUT racist such as mentoring black youth in the past.

    “Fought back” against what? Having a Hispanic watching him? Confronting? OH so it’s ok to beat up someone who “confronts you”?

    Testimony states Martin was on TOP of Zimmerman pummeling. Zimmerman is the one with the cuts on the back of his head and broken nose.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Preconceived notions like house robberies in the development? Yeah.

  • elliegrll

    Yet, the same link points out that the majority of the demonstrations have been peaceful. It’s amazing that we can take the case of someone stalking and murdering a kid and turn into a story about angry black mobs. That’s pretty much what the defense did in painting Trayvon as the criminal.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    So the jury was stupid? Even though most legal analysts said there was no case for the past many months and especially during the trial. OK. The OJ jury was stupid, too.

  • chloe18

    To add some positivity to this thread I just back from a rally at union square nyc and it was an incredible experience. There was a circle where anyone who wanted to could speak. The whole aura around it was so positive, respectful of everyone’s voice, and a unified desire for justice. Idk I know I’m not wording this well but I expected the feeling there to be more sorrowful and instead it was really of togetherness and a desire and motivation to make positive change. It was just an amazing experience and kudos to the organizers of it.

  • elliegrll

    First you said it was people working in fast food restaurants, and now it’s NFL players. Are the NFL players going to riot by spitting in people’s food? I’m not saying that they don’t exist, but you realize that even if they do, these players are speaking for themselves.

    Given all that they stand to lose, I have a feeling that you may be misinterpreting some tweets where people are just saying that they are angry, hurt or upset about the verdict, which is not the same thing as saying that they are going to go out and harm the first white person who they see.

    For example, one NBA player tweeted that he didn’t know how he was going to explain this to his son, and unfortunately he received many racist and disgusting tweets in return. Common sense would tell us that the idiots who tweeted those things don’t speak for all white people.

  • Ronnie D

    There was a reason GM was following him, not stalked like a hunter through a jungle, FOLLOWED. If TM was so “afraid” he would have ran home. After all, he was on the football team, towered over GZ, so he could have easily just went home. Using words like stalked and hunted just pulls on peoples emotional reactions to those words. I don’t know of any “stalker” who has called ahead of time to let everyone know what he was doing.

  • elliegrll

    Nope it’s not Brady bunch land, it’s a country where the victims of the majority of the hate crimes are race based, and where the majority of these victims are minorities.

  • elliegrll

    Actually, there was no reason for the stalking. Trayvon Martin didn’t do anything to Zimmerman. And Zimmerman could have stopped the stalking, which is what it is when you are following someone, he could have gone home too, and he didn’t have to confront Trayvon.

    Trayvon wasn’t in the wrong, so I’m not sure what he could have done differently to stop Zimmerman from following him, or to feel safe. He was not the one who ignited the situation, so words of what he should have done are incredibly hollow.

  • Tinawina

    That was the whole point. One was being brought up as “proof” of what happened by you and some others, when the others past could be used in the same way. I was pointing out the hypocrisy and asking why it is so easy for one’s past to count and not the other’s. you are making my exact point.

  • MV007

    Starting a confrontation isn’t illegal unless it becomes physical or in this case trayvon was in fear of an imminent offensive contact. The problem is the prosecution didn’t put any evidence on that proved beyond a reasonable doubt that GZ started the physical aspect of the confrontation and thus wouldn’t have self defense available. And to the contrary, the defense counsel did put on a highly respected expert that detailed trayvon being in a position of power.

    I’m not going to argue with anyone over racial inconsistencies in our criminal justice system. I look at this case in a vacuum and whether or not the prosecution proved their case and I don’t believe they did.

  • Jordana33

    As evidenced by all his black relatives in the court room?

  • ProPlayersCelebs

    It’s not a black or white thing. It’s a hate thing. Just like hate crimes. But there’s a few pro players are hate filled. Groups of people can be influenced by tweets you know.

    Like this one.

    Roddy White ? @roddywhiteTV

    All them jurors should go home tonight and kill themselves for letting a grown man get away with killing a kid

    James Harrison ? @jharrison9292

    Think I’ll go pick a fight and get my ass kicked then pull my gun and kill somebody and see if I can get away.

  • deshae78

    So the basic facts aren’t that Zimmerman followed a black teenager & at the end of it the black teenager is dead?? In my mind, Zimmerman started the aggression by following Trayvon for no reason.
    And btw, you don’t need to get rude to express another opinion.

  • Linda Foltz

    It wasn’t for no reason. If he had for no reason, he would have been convicted. According to the evidence, Trayvon was on top of him, physically attacking him, and smashing his head into the concrete. If someone was doing that to you, don’t you think you’d want to defend yourself? Or would you just let them smash away?

    IF Zimmerman had not had the injuries he did, I believe the jury would have at least convicted him of manslaughter. But those injuries are what made a claim of self defense plausible. And they have to decide beyond ALL reasonable doubt.

  • Jordana33

    The media sensationalizes everything for ratings. That’s what they do. Nevertheless, one doesn’t need be manipulated by the media to realize that something is really screwed up about this entire case. Unfortunately, whenever people label these incidents as “fodder” for someone’s political agendas, they just end up trivializing the gravity of an issue that hits so close to many blacks, regardless of socioeconomic status. To you, ithis case is a means to push someone’s agenda. To me, it’s a tragedy that should force an agenda. This is not an opportunity for blacks to play that elusive “race card”. This is a sad reminder that racial inequalities still exist in this country. I can assure you that there isn’t a single black parent in this country who doesn’t worry that something like this could happen to one of their kids. It is not an empty concern.

    This case may have reached a resolution, but at the end of the day, an innocent kid is still dead and the perpetrator is free. If we don’t figure out better ways to discourage this over-the-top vigilante behavior, then tragedies like this will continue to happen. As for the jurors…..I don’t blame them. I truly believe that Zimmerman should be behind bars, but I also understand that limitations in the judicial system, combined with the poor handling of this case by the state, would have made it very difficult for these jurors to render a guilty verdict. The real injustice happened way before this case even went to court.

  • tucker davis

    I have to say that I’ve read comments about the trial verdict on several sites today, and this site has the most civil discussion of the verdict of any I’ve read! Even though people thoroughly disagree with each other, I applaud the respect given in expressing their views. Perhaps the people who regularly post on this site are experienced in dealing with a diversity of opinions.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Zimmerman called the cops not Martin. He called a girl.

    The autopsy showed NO bodily injury or bruising of any sort on Martin. The only injuries other than the gunshot wound were on his knuckles.

    If Zimmerman attacked first shouldn’t he at least got 1 hit off on Martin? Something to show that there was a mutual scuffle? Instead it was only Zimmerman who had a broken nose and cuts on the back of his head that were bleeding.

    A witness testified to seeing Martin on top pummeling Zimmerman.

    Every fight I have ever seen the person who attacks first almost always had the upper hand. In this instance we have a second witness and that witness is the autopsy.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Good question. I’d call the cops not my girlfriend. And I’d go home, not hang around for an unaccounted for 4 minutes. AND I’d have more than knuckle bruises if I were going to claim someone attacked ME. Which nobody said Zimmerman DID.

    So why was Martin on TOP of Zimmerman pummeling him again??

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Where in the testimony was it stated he confronted Martin?

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Well, that and pounding Zimmerman’s head against the concrete.

  • Ronnie D

    That is plain rubbish. Any statistics can be easily skewed depending on what demographic they are taken from. Ive seen many instances where a black person was killed by a white person, and everyone pulls out the race card. I have yet to see fat mouth Al Sharpton, or opportunist Jesse Jackson, stand up and link arms over a white person being killed by a black person. I can think of just recently where a black man broke into a mothers home, ,while she was there with her BABY, and he beat the living daylights out of her. Why isn’t that on the front page?? Where is the outrage??

  • Jordana33

    I doubt it.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    It’s not rude to point out how it makes no sense to say you didn’t follow the trial then put forth hypotheticals.

    Besides the gunshot wound, Martin had NO injuries on his autopsy except his knuckles. Zimmerman had a broken nose and banged up back of the head and a witness who saw Martin on top of Zimmerman pummeling. There are two witnesses as to who had the upper hand, the guy and the autopsy.

    So by your theory, just following someone gets your head cracked on the sidewalk, oh well.

    Martin called his girlfriend. Zimmerman called the COPS. Believe what you want but you are incorrect that “nobody knows what happened” as to prevent a verdict.

  • GTFOBigGovt

    Sooooo just let your head get busted open on concrete because someone doesn’t like you looking at them.

    It is NOT self defense to attack someone for walking behind you. In ANY state. And YES, you can start a VERBAL fight and claim self defense when your adversary beats you in response. What law and trial are YOU following?

    Martin had ZERO injuries except his knuckles besides the gunshot wound. Zimmerman had the broken nose and back of the head injuries. I assume you’ve never been in a fight but the person who starts it always has the upper hand.

  • Ronnie D

    We are kept on a tight leash. It gets really exciting when American Idol starts lol.

  • HermeticallySealed

    Or you know, he could have done the common sense thing (as well as the proper Neighborhood Watch proceedure) and not decided to pursue and confront. He could have just called the police and let them do their job. Instead, like the self important moron he is, he CHOSE to do the stupid thing. Imagine what might have happened had he just kept his fat ass at home and let the proper people do their job. One less dead kid, that’s for sure. But let’s ignore Zimmerman’s major mistakes to push some victim blaming idiocy.

  • Nostradamos

    “Don’t confuse me with the facts son, I done got my mind made up” / Foghorn Leghorn

  • resunikcufecin

    LOL. You act like Zimmerman was walking around with a couple of six shooters strapped to his hip.

  • elliegrll

    Zimmerman’s head wouldn’t have gotten pounded against the concrete if he didn’t follow/stalk Trayvon and then confront him.

  • elliegrll

    James Harrison’s tweet is about knowing that he wouldn’t get away with it if he decided to go out and start a fight with someone and then killed them just because he found himself on the losing end of the fight. It relates directly to what happened.

  • resunikcufecin

    Nothing in your post rises above the level of a simplistic slogan. I’m not even gonna bother debunking it, because every point you made has been debunked elsewhere.

    If nothing else, this case has shown that a good portion of the US population is utterly irrational and detached from reality. What a scary future this country is facing.

  • resunikcufecin

    I’m not going to cry over some common thug who attacked an innocent man. I’m more concerned with the innocent man. Sorry.

  • J3$$!C@

    To me Zimmerman was getting his butt whooped, so he killed the guy. Did he deserve life in prison??, absolutely not. 15-30 years in prison???–nope. But, where is the law that gives Zimmerman a 5-10 year sentence?? I would vote guilty on that. But since none exists, it was the correct call to set him free.

  • elliegrll

    How did Trayvon become a thug? What did he do to earn that label?

  • elliegrll

    Zimmerman called the cops not Martin. He called a girl.

    The cops handcuffed Trayvon Martin even though he was dead, and then they didn’t even bother to try and identify him. I’m not saying that to imply that Trayvon shouldn’t have called the police, but these types of things are going to play a role in how other young black kids view the police, and whether or not they think that calling the police will help them when they feel threatened.

  • elliegrll

    If someone is stalking me, my initial thought isn’t going to be that they are an innocent, or that they don’t mean to do me any harm.

  • elliegrll

    How do you know that Trayvon attacked Zimmerman? Zimmerman was not the one being stalked.

  • HermeticallySealed

    Common sense is not allowed here.

  • elliegrll

    How do you know that he started the fight?

  • elliegrll

    Calling someone a thug for no reason is irrational, and pretty much invalidates your argument.

  • dangrey

    Many of the claims by Zimmerman as far as injuries have been argued against and many experts find the injuries he claims to have gotten as questionable. My point being that regardless of Martin’s actions Zimmerman’s actions were the ones that led to this all happening. And the idea that police didn’t tell him to, but it was a suggestion is pointless considering the events that unfolded. Its pretty clear to me that Zimmerman was looking for trouble.

  • elliegrll

    Its called manslaughter.

  • dangrey

    I wasn’t giving a timeline, I was simply pointing out that many things Zimmerman did do would in my opinion imply that he was looking for a fight.

  • elliegrll

    Sooooo just let your head get busted open on concrete because someone doesn’t like you looking at them.

    This first sentence is based on something that didn’t happen. It’s almost you re-wrote what actually happened, in order to lessen Zimmerman’s role in what happened. Maybe I’d understand your position if you correctly stated what happened at the beginning.

  • elliegrll

    First, Trayvon could have been in fear of his life even if the first part of the confrontation wasn’t physical. Who wouldn’t be afraid if someone is following them, and then that person confronts them? That would put anyone in a defensive position.

  • Reflects On Life

    Zimmerman should have at least been tried for assault.
    Maybe assault w/ a deadly weapon.

    It’s easy to see how a jury has difficulty ferreting murder vs self-defense once a scuffle is well underway.

  • J3$$!C@

    Manslaughter would be if Zimmerman did not feel threatened. We can’t prove that. He was getting his butt whooped, and shot.

  • Tinawina

    That doesn’t prove who started the fight. That is conjecture.

    What if he swung and missed? What if he berated Trayvon verbally? What if he threatened the kid, so the kid swung first. You don’t know and neither do I, so don’t act like any of us have definitive proof.

    The prosecution overcharged him. That has more to do with his freedom than anything.

  • chillj

    You can not second guess a trial by jury by either watching television or mentioning salient facts in a case. The jury had more information. If the case was a simple as you have indicated, doubtless Zimmerman would have been convicted.

  • chillj

    The law allowing George Zimmerman to carry a gun needs to be fixed.

  • chillj

    Me too. I was on jury in a criminal case a year ago and I was profoundly impressed with the jurors and the system. In my case I suspected the defendant guilty, but, as in this one, the case was not proven. He was unanimously found innocent, but so thought he would be found guilty he fled the state the morning the decision was read.

  • chillj

    Zimmerman should not have been doing neighborhood watch carrying a gun; it is implicit approval of vigilanteism. In my state, I know developmentally disabled people with IQs less than fifty who do neighborhood watch. You can bet they do not carry guns.

  • chillj

    Allowing that man out there with a gun set up the circumstances for this killing. Had he not had a gun, this would merely have been a street fight and the two of them could have shaken hands later.

  • Ronnie D

    “What if he berated Trayvon verbally?” Even if it was just verbal, that doesn’t give someone the right to assault the other person. I think there is a big problem in this country where people think they can resort to physical violence just because someone says something they don’t like.

  • standtotheright

    FL laws are apparently very specific about the mindset for voluntary manslaughter. And there is no charge in the state for involuntary manslaughter, IIRC. More’s the pity.

  • standtotheright

    If his “just verbal” statements led an already suspicious kid to believe he was going for a gun, then yes, that kid would have the right to assault him, because that would be, wait for it….self-defense.

  • standtotheright

    There’s no evidence for that. Even the eyewitness who claimed the “darker shirt” person was on top didn’t claim to see him pounding his head against the concrete. And the medical examiner said his injuries were not that significant, which is borne out by the fact that he was treated at the scene for five minutes before being released to the police.

  • Ronnie D

    According to your theory GZ told (verbal) TV he was going for his gun. There isn’t one shred of evidence for that. Take time to look at the evidence.

  • Tinawina

    No, that’s not the point. The OP was trying to “prove” Zimmerman’s version of the story was true by using the details above, and my only point was that doesn’t “prove” anything. There is not proof Zimmerman was an peaceful man walking back to his car that go jumped from behind. There is only proof there was a scuffle, and that Trayvon ended up on top. We don’t know how the fight started and we never will. All you are doing is starting an argument about another unprovable theory.

    If you want to believe GZ then believe him, because all anyone has to go on with that particular point is their own gut opinion. But don’t act like it’s been proven, because it hasn’t.

  • standtotheright

    There’s the exact amount of evidence for that that there is that Martin told GZ that he was “going to die” that night. That’s my point. Either of them could be the aggressor but the fact remains that one had a gun and one didn’t, and so the one that did is more likely to be perceived as threatening the other person.

  • resunikcufecin

    There is no evidence that Zimmerman followed or “stalked” Martin. There is no evidence that Zimmerman provoked or initiated the physical struggle. The evidence we do have is overwhelmingly consistent with Zimmerman’s story. That’s why the six jurors voted not guilty. I don’t know why so many people have trouble with this.

  • SteelWauhterz

    The rule of law is a wonderful thing,but people need to exercise their common sense, too. Zimmerman was told repeatedly to stay in his vehicle, and to not confront the victim by police. Zimmerman chose to disregard the police (as he has done before). He followed (stalked) the victim, and put himself in a confrontational situation-all documented. Simply put, Zimmerman had the upper hand and chose to profile, follow & later kill an unarmed teenager. Later to be found not guilty by a jury of his “mother’s” peers…Of course, this is the same part of Florida that let Casey Anthony walk.

  • resunikcufecin

    Deadly force can only be used in response to a credible physical threat. It cannot be used in response to a purely verbal threat or because you think someone is following you. Martin really had no legal basis at ALL to attack Zimmerman. It’s not like Zimmerman was running around shouting “nigger!” and waving his gun around. The weapon was concealed until the very end of their altercation. There isn’t even any evidence that he followed Martin, and even if he did that’s not a crme.

    “Stand Your Ground” laws are designed to protect people who make a lawful decision to use lethal force. Without SYG, you would be legally required to retreat before using deadly force. You could also be sued by the criminal or his relatives even if it was determined that you acted lawfully.

  • SteelWauhterz

    Two facts. No one witnessed what happened. George Zimmerman ignored the directive from the police, and stalked his prey….What happened next is between Zimmerman and his God.

  • resunikcufecin

    Zimmerman didn’t “stalk” anyone. He actually said that he lost track of Trayvon after leavng his truck and that he was ambushed a short distance later. There is absolutely NO evidence to contradict his story and plenty of evidence that supports it.

  • SteelWauhterz

    Florida’s a hell of a state. In one of the closest contests in U.S. history, the 2000 presidential election between Democratic Vice-President Al Gore and Republican governor of Texas George W. Bush stole the election with a grand assist by his brother,Florida Governor Jeb Bush. Then there was Casey Anthony, and finally the lynching of a murdered teenager, Trayvon Martin.

  • SteelWauhterz

    …and Mother Goose and Dr. Seuss aint no nursery rhymes…

  • resunikcufecin

    Zimmerman was on trial, not Trayvon. Zimmerman says that Trayvon started the fight. You don’t have a single shred of evidence that he’s lying.

  • resunikcufecin

    “no reason”…LOL

  • resunikcufecin

    1. The police never told him to stay in his vehicle.
    2. He didn’t follow or “stalk” Trayvon.
    3. He didn’t have the upper hand, as evidenced by the injuries to his face and head (and the fact that Trayvon was on top of him).
    4. He didn’t racially profile Trayvon. The dispatcher asked about the person’s race, and he said that the person looks black. The FBI investigated and found no evidence of racial bias.
    5. Casey Anthony is completely irrelevant to this case.
    Thanks for playing.

  • resunikcufecin

    What’s your point exactly? Very few self defense cases in the real world have ironclad witnesses. By that standard, you could cast doubt on almost anyone who uses lethal force in self defense. How do we know that mugger threatened to kill you if you didn’t give him your wallet? How do we know that guy threatened to rape you if you killed him before he could commit the rape? I don’t think you understand how these cases play out in the real world.

  • Rogue1717

    this was not a lynching. http://youtu.be/bF-Ax5E8EJc

  • Rogue1717

    on what grounds though? Martin threw the first punch & initiated assault. Not Zimmerman. He didn’t even draw his gun until AFTER he had Martin on top of him, slamming his head against a sidewalk.

  • Rogue1717

    this actually talks about your points & covers a lot of information people were not aware of http://youtu.be/bF-Ax5E8EJc

  • Rogue1717

    here are actual facts brought up in the trial & what it means. http://youtu.be/bF-Ax5E8EJc

  • Rogue1717

    so you have a right to beat the crap out of anyone walking down a street that appears to be following you regardless of whether they actually are or not? good to know. I’ll make a point of beating up all the old ladies behind me on the way to my mailbox from now on.

    like it or not Martin started the fight by punching Zimmerman in the face. Martin had multiple options in his situation. A) go in the house he lived in which wasn’t far. B) call the police C) ask Zimmerman if & why he was following him or D) double back after arriving at his house and throwing punches. Obviously D is NOT the right answer and that is what led to the unfortunate outcome.

    http://youtu.be/bF-Ax5E8EJc

  • Rogue1717
  • Rogue1717

    not if Zimmerman was in the hospital from having his head slammed against a sidewalk repeatedly.

  • resunikcufecin
  • elliegrll

    Are you talking about the same case? Everything started with Zimmerman following/stalking Trayvon.

  • Ronnie D

    A lynching? That is a slap in the face to all African Americans who actually WERE lynched. Just because it was a white man involved doesn’t make it a race issue. Shame on on those people that make it otherwise. Shame on them!

  • dangrey

    This is largely biased and borrows an incredible amount from Zimmerman’s testimony, thus I don’t feel like its all that true and while Zimmerman did not break any crimes by pursuing Trayvon Martin they largely leave out that his motive for pursuing Trayvon and the act of his death could technically be a crime. Point is, Molyneux has good points, but many of them rely too much on whether or not Mr. Zimmerman was lying or not…and as I’ve said, sadly we’ll never hear the other side of this story.

  • http://kristentheyellowlab.blogspot.com/ ZsusK

    What exactly was the reason GM was following him, Ronnie D? I’m curious.

  • Ronnie D

    Listen to the 911 tapes. GZ explains why he was following him.

  • SteelWauhterz

    I feel absolutely justified for using the “lynching” of this child metaphorically. To marginalize America’s lynch mob mentality as an African American phenomena is also a slap in the face to the Hispanic Americans that were lynched in the United States between 1848 and 1928—and this number may well be conservative.

    In fact, once vociferously targeted groups such as Mexican-Americans, Chinese laborers, Italians, anti-Capitalist and “unpatriotic” union activists, homosexuals, Jews, and Mormons were also lynched. The metaphor could also be used for American-Arabs, Moslems and Sikhs attacked by self-styled “patriots” in misplaced retribution for 2001′s 9-11 tragedy.

    Just saying……

  • SteelWauhterz

    Since lynchings were usually meant to be remembered as examples of white supremacy, bigotry and intolerance, I will stand by use of said metaphor in describing how Trayvon was treated before his death and after. Would you prefer if I said he was EVISCERATED?

  • Rogue1717

    I prefer you call it what it actually is. An unfortunate outcome to a series of bad decisions from all parties.

  • SteelWauhterz

    Sorry my friend, you are very, very wrong. Not only do I live in and work in said “real” world, but so do my sons and clients….

  • Rogue1717

    it actually isn’t biased. These are the facts as presented in the courts and on local tv. I watched the entire trial myself as it’s in my backyard. The jury had to rule based ONLY ON THE EVIDENCE PROVIDED. Being as how Martin was unable to share his side of the story, they only had so much to work with. His reason for pursuing was to notify authorities on his location. He got out of the car to allegedly check street signs. He reported to the 911 operator that he had lost track of Martin. Martin had the option of going into his home which he was practically in front of but chose to double back & confront Zimmerman physically. Most people if being followed would get in their damn house and call the cops. NOT go back and punch the follower in the face, climb on top of them once they’re on the ground, tell them they are going to murder them and proceed to slam their head repeatedly into the sidewalk.
    If that is considered normal behaviour I don’t think anyone is safe going outside ever again.

  • SteelWauhterz

    Absolutely wrong!! A jury of women inclined to empathize with Zimmerman said, it was still deemed legal in the US to chase and then shoot dead an unarmed young black man on his way home from the store because you didn’t like the look of him.

    Martin was on his way home, minding his own business armed only with a can of iced tea and a bag of Skittles. Zimmerman pursued him, armed with a 9mm handgun, believing him to be a criminal. Martin resisted. They fought. Zimmerman shot him dead.

  • Rogue1717

    there was no chasing. He followed in a car to keep a location on him while on the phone with a dispatcher, got out to check street signs while telling dispatcher that Martin had left, he NEVER confronted Martin. Martin doublebacked instead of going home, confronted Martin & then punched him in the face, climbed on top of him, told him he was going to kill him and proceeded to slam his head into the concrete repeatedly.

    You can try to spin intent either direction but it does not refute the facts of what happened. Either party could have prevented this at any time. But if someone jumps on top of me & tells me they are going to kill me while slamming my head into a side walk, I’d have shot too. Survival instinct.

  • Ronnie D

    Trying to turn this into a race issue isn’t going to get you anywhere. You will always be right where you are now, holding an empty sack.

  • Stop_Blaming_Start_Helping

    Please explain to me how there was absolutely no DNA and no blood on neither the gun nor Zimmerman’s clothes if the gun supposedly went off “during” the physical fight? To me that would seem to be proof that TM had to be at least arms length away from zimmerman when he shot him…all evidence seems to lean towards the fact that TM just wanted to get away from zimmerman….. i guarantee you like OJ, he will do it again….justice system is screwed up ..a daughter can put a man behind bars for 20 years just on her word saying “my father’s molested me” even if there is no proof and and she is lying…but a clear murderer gets nothing but his gun back in his hand and a tainted reputation….. he will do it again…they all do

  • Stop_Blaming_Start_Helping

    and by “they” i mean all those people who think they are better than society, above the police, and believe their hate filled actions are justified in their own minds

  • Stop_Blaming_Start_Helping

    so do gays, the underpaid, and Hispanics…it’s call being a minority and fighting for human equality. The only way to get change is to fight for change. Not promoting violence, but I certainly support all of the marches that have been going on

  • Stop_Blaming_Start_Helping

    exactly….the media is the #1 culprit for the negative stereotypes of the black race. Imagine if every lil wayne was a maxwell and every justin timberlake was an eminem ..and if every newscaster was black and every intereview of a white person was in the pig town of your local trash city ….imagine is reality tv show exploited hostility of white people and all of the “family shows” (if there are even any left) were black families…. i think the world would be substantially different in their mindset towards blacks..

  • Stop_Blaming_Start_Helping

    yea but apparently a sidewalk is…when i heard that I literally laughed out loud and thought they were seriously joking…. wait you’re serious?… you’re seriously arguing that the sidewalk is a weapon?…dumb …just dumb… you don’t bring a gun to a fist fight and use it because you’re loosing at your own game that you instigated…if that’s acceptable than pretty much every gang shooting is justified and all those people should be running the streets free with their guns in the air….dumb

  • SteelWauhterz

    You don’t have to be a student of history to answer your question, but try reading a newspaper. You may be shocked, by what you discover.

  • resunikcufecin

    Your post is nothing but prejudicial drivel, devoid of facts or rational thought.

  • resunikcufecin

    You’re right. We should lock Zimmerman up because a bunch of ill-informed morons like you demand it. Fucking idiot.

  • Stop_Blaming_Start_Helping

    Oh did I touch a sensitive area for you? Yeah I’m sure you are one those people…but please explain how my point regarding the lack of DNA or blood on Zimmerman and his gun is irrational? Actually I think it’s pretty irrational to believe a man can get shot during a physical fight where you believe he was over top of Zimmerman… Please explain if he was on top of him when he shot him outnof ‘defense’ how is it possible that tm didn’t land on him and no blood got on the gun or zimmerman? You know why you can’t explain that? Because its not possible…Zimmerman shot the boy at at least arms length at which point he was no longer defending his life …not hard to figure that one out smart guy

  • Sandy

    A Non-Guilty verdict does not mean he is innocent. It just means there was not enough evidence to convict.

    In my opinion, George instigated the entire situation and when things were
    getting out of hand he shot Trayvon. And I also think Trayvon was the one
    screaming for his life once George drew his gun, it definitely sounded like a boy. Why would George scream, he was armed and ready to defend himself. George was a coward, he didn’t have to kill him, he could have just injured him or something, he just wanted to be a hero and kill the “bad man”. Instead he murdered a teenager.

    With Florida’s wacky laws, those taxpayers will be paying out the wazoo in order to continue to provide hiding for all their murderers. Casey Anthony and now Georgie Porgey. Sickening!!

  • Chrissy Jones

    Horrible. I agree the verdict stinks!

  • dangrey

    Its completely biased and as you just pointed out borrows way to heavily on Zimmerman’s testimony and HIS timeline of the events. Of course if you take Zimmerman’s word for everything you’re going to think that he didn’t do anything wrong, but I assume that he probably wasn’t telling the whole truth and you’re right…Martin wasn’t able to share his side of the story.

  • Rogue1717

    you seem to be missing the point that the jury had to work with the info provided. Not only that, but Zimmerman’s account matched HIS wounds as found in medical exam, Martin’s wounds or lack thereof, an eyewitness account of who was beating who and what was heard on the dispatch call. Based off all of that, the jury could not have honestly come back with any other verdict. Now if Martin had been able to testify, things may have turned out differently.

  • SteelWauhterz